6N 2019: Scotland v Ireland, 9 February

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Post by George Carlin on Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:42 am

First topic message reminder :

6N 2019: Scotland v Ireland, 9 February - Page 11 Scot_f10     6N 2019: Scotland v Ireland, 9 February - Page 11 Irelan10 
SCOTLAND IRELAND 
9 February 2019
KO: 14:15
BT Murrayfield, Edinburgh

Referee: Romain Poite (France)
Touch judges: Pascal Gaüzère (France) and Alexandre Ruiz (France)
Television match official: Rowan Kitt (England)

Live on [paddy TV and jock TV]

A. Head to Head

134 Played 134
67 Won 62
6 Drawn 6
62 Lost 67
1,415 Points 1,525

B. Recent Form

10 March 2018
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28–8 to Ireland

4 February 2017
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
27–22 to Scotland

19 March 2016
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
35 – 25 to Ireland

15 August 2015
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28 – 22 to Ireland

21 March 2015
BT Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
10 – 40 to Ireland

2 February 2014
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28 – 6 to Ireland

24 February 2013
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
12 – 8 to Scotland

10 March 2012
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
32 – 14 to Ireland

6 August 2011
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 6 to Scotland

27 February 2011
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
18 – 21 to Ireland

20 March 2010
Croke Park, Dublin
20 – 23 to Scotland

C. Teams

SCOTLAND
6N 2019: Scotland v Ireland, 9 February - Page 11 Scotla10

[TBC]

IRELAND 
6N 2019: Scotland v Ireland, 9 February - Page 11 Irelan10

[TBC]
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Post by Collapse2005 on Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:20 pm

Taylorman wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:Stop talking shoite Taylorman. All teams get injuries. Irelands player management is absolutely fine. Schmidt is very conservative re picking players who arent fully fit. Yet when we do get injuries our deputies generally do very well.

Marmion and VdF v NZ
Roux  and Carbery v Scotland
Jackson v SA a couple of years ago
Murphy v Australia in the summer
Madigan v France in the last RWC

There are way more examples of subs coming in and making a mark than the other way round.

Still not getting it huh? Its not about not playing players when theyre not fully fit. Thats commonnsense. Its about spreading the match load... all matches... across a wider group of players. Not playing players when they are fully fit. Why do you think ireland had so many injuries when they hit quarters time in 2015. Luck? All teams have injuries? Nah, they had far too many. So what was the learning from that? 6N is nothing compared to the WCup so Schmidt should ne backing the full scope of his depth for the remainder of the tournament.

we rested players like McCaw and carter for half to a full season before the world cup. Fit players cant play all year, they need to be managed so theyre not just fit, but at peak. Sexton didnt need to play vs Scotland, yet went off injured. What part of this six nations gives you evidence that this is world cup year? None? Yet we already have players that wont play super rugby at all for at least a couple of months, some more.

And how much would you, or Schmidt really know about preparing a side for a successful world cup campaign?  which should have started this time last year. Already Ireland look like theyre headed down the tired slippery rope england did last year and ireland did in 15.

Back your ideas up with some numbers. How often does Ireland rotate vs other sides? You dont get it because you havent a clue how Irelands rotation holds up v other sides you are just blurting out shoite you dont understand as usual.

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Post by Taylorman on Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:26 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Didn't mccaw play through at least a couple of world cup games with a broken foot?

Last three knockouts in 2011. Didnt train at all in between. Very much the exception... as expected. thumbsup

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Post by Taylorman on Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:30 pm

SecretFly wrote:Yeah but he's an exceptional player, innit.  He's just unlucky that he played for a very bad team..........

All teams are bad when it comes to McCaw. His perfect team of Lomu, Joost etc are all waiting for him Whistle

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Post by SecretFly on Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:32 pm

Is McCaw still doing the helicoptering career in NZ. What a life and what a country to do it in.... lucky blighter.

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Post by miaow on Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:44 pm

Taylorman wrote:
The Great Aukster wrote:
SecretFly wrote:You might always try to argue that Ireland struggle for consistency because of playing numbers when compared to England but then what is France's excuse?  What I won!t accept though is a notion that Ireland's style of play at International (the boring stuff as it were) is somehow informed by those same 'playing numbers'.  Scotland doesn't play a 'boring' game at International... neither does Wales.  We have easily the same numbers of naturally skilled athletes in Ireland as in those two Nations.  The difference is the coaching philosophy.  Now, who is to say Joe Schmidt's philosophy is wrong.  It has been proven to be effective for long enough.  But it just shows how quickly a coaching philosophy impacts on the image of the players themselves chosen to play it.
We have talent enough to play an open, expansive, offloading opportunistic game if such a game plan was given the green light.  But then, maybe we wouldn't have reached 2nd in the World a few times since Schmidt came onboard.  But it is frustrating at times to see talented individuals running directly into contact over and over and over again with only one or two little tricks per game.  It's painful because it impacts on the individual reputation of these players - boring.
Ireland have shown at the last RWC that they can't rely on calling the next cab on the rank if they've never travelled with them before.
Eddie O'S showed in 2007 that Ireland can't sustain an exciting game plan with only a few players who can play it. Ireland WON (next to) nothing playing the exciting gameplan, they simply didn't have a replacement for BOD who was increasingly injured.

Good point. Irelands gameplan of heavy contact, defence and reliance on defence, not getting behind on the scoreboard demands better player management in a world cup year than what they have at the moment, which looks to be none.

And already they have a slew of injuries. A september world cup needed a 45-50 wide squad for 2019 to rest key players and Ireland face going into japan flat and injured at the current rate of attrition. The other sides are similar but Irelands gameplan of high contact requirements demands it more.

So with the recent injuries theyre already starting to get behind. SH sides have a huge advantage from a timing perspective. Many wont even front Super rugby for a couple more months yet. So an April to sept run is ideal.

Do agree that the calendar favours the SH slightly in terms of giving players a run to the RWC. But it's not all one way - NH teams might be undercooked/not match ready come September as well. I feel like Ireland have probably suffered that way in the past. SANZAR teams can get it right with the Rugby Championship acting as a good warm up for the properevent.

In terms of player management, more specifically in relation to rotation, give this a watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kd5aQl1eyw0

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Post by majesticimperialman on Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:50 pm

Is hog out for the rest of the tournament?

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Post by SecretFly on Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:53 pm

Don't know but Laidlaw has definitely refused to play in any future game officiated by a ref that don't like him. I like a man who stands by his principles.

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Post by Pot Hale on Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:20 pm

majesticimperialman wrote:Is hog out for the rest of the tournament?

Hopefully yes but ideally not as Scotland need to get bonus point wins against England and Wales.
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Post by Taylorman on Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:52 pm

miaow wrote:
Taylorman wrote:
The Great Aukster wrote:
SecretFly wrote:You might always try to argue that Ireland struggle for consistency because of playing numbers when compared to England but then what is France's excuse?  What I won!t accept though is a notion that Ireland's style of play at International (the boring stuff as it were) is somehow informed by those same 'playing numbers'.  Scotland doesn't play a 'boring' game at International... neither does Wales.  We have easily the same numbers of naturally skilled athletes in Ireland as in those two Nations.  The difference is the coaching philosophy.  Now, who is to say Joe Schmidt's philosophy is wrong.  It has been proven to be effective for long enough.  But it just shows how quickly a coaching philosophy impacts on the image of the players themselves chosen to play it.
We have talent enough to play an open, expansive, offloading opportunistic game if such a game plan was given the green light.  But then, maybe we wouldn't have reached 2nd in the World a few times since Schmidt came onboard.  But it is frustrating at times to see talented individuals running directly into contact over and over and over again with only one or two little tricks per game.  It's painful because it impacts on the individual reputation of these players - boring.
Ireland have shown at the last RWC that they can't rely on calling the next cab on the rank if they've never travelled with them before.
Eddie O'S showed in 2007 that Ireland can't sustain an exciting game plan with only a few players who can play it. Ireland WON (next to) nothing playing the exciting gameplan, they simply didn't have a replacement for BOD who was increasingly injured.

Good point. Irelands gameplan of heavy contact, defence and reliance on defence, not getting behind on the scoreboard demands better player management in a world cup year than what they have at the moment, which looks to be none.

And already they have a slew of injuries. A september world cup needed a 45-50 wide squad for 2019 to rest key players and Ireland face going into japan flat and injured at the current rate of attrition. The other sides are similar but Irelands gameplan of high contact requirements demands it more.

So with the recent injuries theyre already starting to get behind. SH sides have a huge advantage from a timing perspective. Many wont even front Super rugby for a couple more months yet. So an April to sept run is ideal.

Do agree that the calendar favours the SH slightly in terms of giving players a run to the RWC. But it's not all one way - NH teams might be undercooked/not match ready come September as well. I feel like Ireland have probably suffered that way in the past. SANZAR teams can get it right with the Rugby Championship acting as a good warm up for the properevent.

In terms of player management, more specifically in relation to rotation, give this a watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kd5aQl1eyw0

Will do.
The period between feb and sept is a strange one for the NH where the tougher tests are played in feb, and twiddling thumb time exists between march and september when creativity is required to provide competition for the tournament proper.
For us its a natural increase in intensity... dec -jan generally rest/ pre season, feb- june S rugby, and a period if player management. Then the Finals, bledisloe and RC.
Oddly, our twiddle thumbs period is, especially this time around, the period after the boks match in pool play.
We’ll have a fully ready squad ready for knockouts playing three matches, the best if which is Italy from memory. Good thing Hansen has dealt with that before. Last time out the witholding strategy resulted in one of the most clinical tests ever vs france in the last 8.
Odd NH havent ever pushed for an April May tournament.
This timing seriously disadvantages prep.

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Post by miaow on Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:02 pm

Not sure it's twiddling thumbs for the NH after then 6Ns. For the Welsh boys, perhaps, but some of the English and usually the Irish are playing for domestic/European silverware. Throw both Scottish sides into that this year as well.

An April/May tournament would coincide with the end of the football season so, for that reason alone, I can see a reluctance for change. Also happening over Easter, not sure if that's important at all, perhaps not. The current timing is relatively ideal in that it's mostly clash-free with other major sports.

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Post by robbo277 on Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:13 pm

I don't think it's too much of an issue. Has any NH side gone out in the pool stage because they are undercooked? I wouldn't say that was England's problem in 2015 or Wales or Ireland's problem in 2007 (who let's not forget went out to Fiji and Argentina who didn't play the Tri Nations back then).

By the quarter-final, you can't say you're undercooked. Unless you've only played Scotland B, Italy, Romania and Portugal I guess.

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Post by Taylorman on Mon Feb 11, 2019 10:02 pm

Not just about being undercooked, but thats one factor, its more about having a squad thats fit and has had a good balance of lead in time. Test match competition at the right time. Itscalso about having no injuries. Playing matches increases injury chances so getting that balance right is critical. Sexton for example. In his twighlight years, is critical to an irish win so from about september onwards, every match he played should have been as a direct result of it being beneficial for him to do so for next years world cup. Nothing else matters. Not even the 6N if you are serious about winning the world cup.
I think it is this lack in forward thinking that is lacking in the NH, and may hit them again this year. SA for example, I believe will be much better prepared for the quarter final than Ireland, the expected matchup if rankings are correct.

If Ireland have key injuries for that match, the last two tests will have already pointed to why.

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Post by SecretFly on Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:11 pm

So what do you see in Ireland's lineup and ..... for want of a better word, 'form' that makes you think Schmidt is needlessly prioritising 6N over and beyond the WC? Apart from refusing to take part in it, I don't see how a coach can avoid turning out a side that at least might try to keep team confidence up. But nothing about Ireland's performances so far tell me Schmidt is over committing to 6N. We're well off the intensity required to do well and I think our coaching team are smart enough to realise that on the training ground even before the competition started.
Even Sexton. He's not been playing and if he's to be a cog at the World Cup... he needs to be playing. So even there, in long term thinking, Schmidt doesn't really have a choice but to play Sexton, and indeed Murray, when he can in tough enough tests. Don't get much tougher than the one against England.

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Post by Taylorman on Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:24 pm

SecretFly wrote:So what do you see in Ireland's lineup and ..... for want of a better word, 'form' that makes you think Schmidt is needlessly prioritising 6N over and beyond the WC?  Apart from refusing to take part in it, I don't see how a coach can avoid turning out a side that at least might try to keep team confidence up.  But nothing about Ireland's performances so far tell me Schmidt is over committing to 6N.  We're well off the intensity required to do well and I think our coaching team are smart enough to realise that on the training ground even before the competition started.
Even Sexton.  He's not been playing and if he's to be a cog at the World Cup... he needs to be playing.  So even there, in long term thinking, Schmidt doesn't really have a choice but to play Sexton, and indeed Murray, when he can in tough enough tests.  Don't get much tougher than the one against England.

Nothing specific, it just depends on what Schmidts idea of managing each players performances is.
For example, for me, I would have given Sexton England and Wales with Carberry, if he is indeed number 2...Italy, Scotland and France.

That way Sexton plays the most likely key matches for their 6N chances, and gets a goid break between the two. Meanwhile, Carberry gets three full tests in the heat of real test match atmosphere to gain the confidence he needs to either back up, or replace Sexton for some or all of the entirety of the world cup.
And they will have been told two months ago to expect those selections so they... particularly Carbery... could prepare mentallly for ‘his tests’, so he can run the show from the start and put pressure on sexton.
Coming on as sub isnt full preparation even if he may be asked to do that in Japan.

So whats Schmidts plan for managing Sexton and Carbery as a back up? I dont know. But he sure needs one. Winging it on the day isnt enough.


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Post by SecretFly on Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:37 pm

I guess Carbery was lined up for two games anyway. I'd say he was Going to be given the Italy game and perhaps France. I don't think Schmidt ever intended making Sexton play all five games as starter. You might question why he even played him against England when he was just back playing. Baptism of fire! But there too when you think about it, that's probably planning with Carbery in mind. Our coaching team knew what mood England were in and we need to keep Carbery's faith in himself rising. Perhaps Schmidt decided that first BIG game against England mightn't have been the best route to sustaining and growing the confidence. So the old dog was brought in... but he was way off the level required.
Schmidt has had to gamble quite a bit so far, and it hasn't paid off but without a doubt he and many of the players have 'form' thoughts shifted on this year to peak in the Autumn rather than 6N.

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Post by Cyril on Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:49 pm

Sexton has playing very, very flat (more than normal?) and got hit by a number of very hard (fair) tackles by Scotland. Was this a different tactic, as he isn’t normally right on the line, or was he just pressured more by Scotland/not protected enough? Was Murray’s passing not quite up to scratch?

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Post by Taylorman on Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:47 am

SecretFly wrote:I guess Carbery was lined up for two games anyway.  I'd say he was Going to be given the Italy game and perhaps France.  I don't think Schmidt ever intended making Sexton play all five games as starter.  You might question why he even played him against England when he was just back playing.  Baptism of fire!  But there too when you think about it, that's probably planning with Carbery in mind.  Our coaching team knew what mood England were in and we need to keep Carbery's faith in himself rising.  Perhaps Schmidt decided that first BIG game against England mightn't have been the best route to sustaining and growing the confidence.  So the old dog was brought in... but he was way off the level required.
Schmidt has had to gamble quite a bit so far, and it hasn't paid off but without a doubt he and many of the players have 'form' thoughts shifted on this year to peak in the Autumn rather than 6N.

Certainly a lot on their shoulders and I guess key to holding Ireland flat is if they can suffocate both Murray and Sexton half the jobs done. I think Murray will be ok Japan time but Sexton will need a Carter type run in those last three matches where everything he did turned to gold, and remained injury free.

And remember this is a different year. Sexton could be roughed up by others in club play. Scotland are in their pool and SA are likely last 8. it would be a big favour if Sexton was given a hard time playing for Leinster. Not that I'm advocating it but after seeing McCaw targeted by all and sundry most of his career this stuff happens. Which is why 'not playing' even when fit, can provide longevity that might not otherwise be there. Of all players in the NH, Sexton does appear to be singularly more influential than any other player of the NH sides, and slightly more brittle within that. Time for the cotton wool I say. He can work his form in in pool play. You just have to imagine Irelands chances without him at all...grim at best. Carbery might be good but you need seasoned, successful pros at 10 to win it. Every win has had that, bar possibly 2007 with SA but even then James was steady.

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Post by Cyril on Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:14 am

Taylorman, Murray looks more knackered and brittle than Sexton, if that’s possible. He looks shot mentally and, especially physically.

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Post by Taylorman on Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:39 am

Cyril wrote:Taylorman, Murray looks more knackered and brittle than Sexton, if that’s possible. He looks shot mentally and, especially physically.

What was his actual injury, cant remember seeing that. looked shrouded in secrecy for a while there...

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Post by Cyril on Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:42 am

No idea what his injury was (is?). The back-up is very limited though, so maybe he was rushed back.

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Post by Taylorman on Tue Feb 12, 2019 2:52 am

I see Nonu has declared interest in the AB's again in one of the more predictable stories at the moment. Its this sort of thing that can lead to the improvement in SH sides that dont happen in non WCup years, i.e last years AI's.

Nonu may not get in but at least he'll be 'available' at least in order that we can turn him down and go with someone 'better'. Same with AA Cooper for Oz.

NH sides dont get to have 50 plus test experienced players return to bolster their world cup sides which is what can make the pre Wcup form, rankings etc not a rue picture of what could happen come world cup time. So between that, which is fairly new, Oz had a few return in 2015, as did SA, the timing of the season, things start stacking up in the SH's favour.

Not in line with the OP but it does serve to be as sure as you can be to have at least your first liners available for Japan.

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Post by miaow on Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:49 am

If Wales are able to tempt Webb, one of their best players, back from overseas it would improve the team significantly. Not just a SH issue.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:55 am

Ireland are benefitting from Tadgh Beirne returning to Ireland. Simin Zebo, Donnacha Ryan or Ian Madigan could hypothetically be called on.

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Post by rodders on Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:15 am

Taylorman wrote:
Cyril wrote:Taylorman, Murray looks more knackered and brittle than Sexton, if that’s possible. He looks shot mentally and, especially physically.

What was his actual injury, cant remember seeing that. looked shrouded in secrecy for a while there...

I think it was a neck injury? I agree actually he is definitely out of sorts, he looks to be slow getting the ball away from the ruck and not keen to go into contact.

Sexton is another who hasn't played a lot recently - it's definitely contributed to our underwhelming start to the 6N. Both need game time rather than a rest in my opinion.

Ryan, O'Mahoney, Healy and Furlong do look like they have played a lot of big games though and could be doing with a break against Italy .
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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:28 am

Yeah not much to be gained from playimg some of those guys. Remarkably Rory Best has been as consistently good as always. What a player.

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Post by geoff999rugby on Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:33 am

Collapse2005 wrote:Ireland are benefitting from Tadgh Beirne returning to Ireland. Simin Zebo, Donnacha Ryan or Ian Madigan could hypothetically be called on.

Zebo, Ryan and Madigan will be nowhere near the Irish set up

You have to be very special to be selected from outside Ireland, and a guaranteed 1st XV player
None of them fit the bill

Somebody mentioned Murray rushed back - part of the problem was both Marmion and McGrath were injured as well
Marmion is now fit - I'd go with him and Cooney against Italy and give Murray a further 3 week break

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Post by robbo277 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:39 am

Taylorman wrote:
SecretFly wrote:I guess Carbery was lined up for two games anyway.  I'd say he was Going to be given the Italy game and perhaps France.  I don't think Schmidt ever intended making Sexton play all five games as starter.  You might question why he even played him against England when he was just back playing.  Baptism of fire!  But there too when you think about it, that's probably planning with Carbery in mind.  Our coaching team knew what mood England were in and we need to keep Carbery's faith in himself rising.  Perhaps Schmidt decided that first BIG game against England mightn't have been the best route to sustaining and growing the confidence.  So the old dog was brought in... but he was way off the level required.
Schmidt has had to gamble quite a bit so far, and it hasn't paid off but without a doubt he and many of the players have 'form' thoughts shifted on this year to peak in the Autumn rather than 6N.

Certainly a lot on their shoulders and I guess key to holding Ireland flat is if they can suffocate both Murray and Sexton half the jobs done. I think Murray will be ok Japan time but Sexton will need a Carter type run in those last three matches where everything he did turned to gold, and remained injury free.

And remember this is a different year. Sexton could be roughed up by others in club play. Scotland are in their pool and SA are likely last 8. it would be a big favour if Sexton was given a hard time playing for Leinster. Not that I'm advocating it but after seeing McCaw targeted by all and sundry most of his career this stuff happens. Which is why 'not playing' even when fit, can provide longevity that might not otherwise be there. Of all players in the NH, Sexton does appear to be singularly more influential than any other player of the NH sides, and slightly more brittle within that. Time for the cotton wool I say. He can work his form in in pool play. You just have to imagine Irelands chances without him at all...grim at best. Carbery might be good but you need seasoned, successful pros at 10 to win it. Every win has had that, bar possibly 2007 with SA but even then James was steady.

If you "rough someone up" in a club game in April with the intention of impacting his ability to play in September and he is out of the World Cup in September, you haven't roughed him up, you have assaulted him.

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Post by rodders on Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:32 am

Collapse2005 wrote:Yeah not much to be gained from playimg some of those guys. Remarkably Rory Best has been as consistently good as always. What a player.

Glad someone noticed, so many just seem to dismiss him as average or even poor. He did have a slow start to the season but he's been in good form over the past few months, at his age I think he needs to get a run of games to get sharp.

He probably doesn't stand out as much in the loose these days, the interpretations at the ruck make it harder for players to steal the ball and he is probably slowing up a bit to get many yards but his basics are very good and gets through a lot of work in defense.
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Post by SecretFly on Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:03 pm

So many? I've never seen too many protest his selection either as Captain or starter. There's a lot of affection and respect for Rory who never leaves the field from lack of effort.
Maybe some of these more senior guys are starting the downward trip to eventual retirement (Sexton, Kearney. - maybe even O'Brien despite his new signing - we know what happened Pauline). But inevitably, Rory is in that league too.
Best has never been a player I'd have highlighted as a weak point, and not in position I often think about in term of weak points - but as others rightly question now quality time for Sexton and Kearney understudies.... it's also reached that point for Rory's position. The understudies need to be fed in to experience bigger games with more minutes. It's just inevitable that it has to happen increasingly to give these players the time to bed down and show or disprove their future value.

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Post by SecretFly on Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:05 pm

Pauline? Damn iPad spell check!

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:09 pm

rodders wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:Yeah not much to be gained from playimg some of those guys. Remarkably Rory Best has been as consistently good as always. What a player.

Glad someone noticed, so many just seem to dismiss him as average or even poor. He did have a slow start to the season but he's been in good form over the past few months, at his age I think he needs to get a run of games to get sharp.

He probably doesn't stand out as much in the loose these days, the interpretations at the ruck make it harder for players to steal the ball and he is probably slowing up a bit to get many yards but his basics are very good and gets through a lot of work in defense.

Its bizarre how some players get all the plaudits even when they have average games and others like Best who are consistently good seem immune from any sort of universal credit. Best is massively under rated even in Ireland. He has been one of our best captains of all time in my view and at the age of 36 just keeps ticking along.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 12:30 pm

Taylorman wrote:
SecretFly wrote:So what do you see in Ireland's lineup and ..... for want of a better word, 'form' that makes you think Schmidt is needlessly prioritising 6N over and beyond the WC?  Apart from refusing to take part in it, I don't see how a coach can avoid turning out a side that at least might try to keep team confidence up.  But nothing about Ireland's performances so far tell me Schmidt is over committing to 6N.  We're well off the intensity required to do well and I think our coaching team are smart enough to realise that on the training ground even before the competition started.
Even Sexton.  He's not been playing and if he's to be a cog at the World Cup... he needs to be playing.  So even there, in long term thinking, Schmidt doesn't really have a choice but to play Sexton, and indeed Murray, when he can in tough enough tests.  Don't get much tougher than the one against England.

Nothing specific, it just depends on what Schmidts idea of managing each players performances is.
For example, for me, I would have given Sexton England and Wales with Carberry, if he is indeed number 2...Italy, Scotland and France.

That way Sexton plays the most likely key matches for their 6N chances, and gets a goid break between the two. Meanwhile, Carberry gets three full tests in the heat of real test match atmosphere to gain the confidence he needs to either back up, or replace Sexton for some or all of the entirety of the world cup.
And they will have been told two months ago to expect those selections so they... particularly Carbery... could prepare mentallly for ‘his tests’, so he can run the show from the start and put pressure on sexton.
Coming on as sub isnt full preparation even if he may be asked to do that in Japan.

So whats Schmidts plan for managing Sexton and Carbery as a back up? I dont know. But he sure needs one. Winging it on the day isnt enough.


Who is New Zealand's back up to Barrett? 9 cap Mounga?

Carbery has 18 caps now.

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Post by The Great Aukster on Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:52 pm

Taylorman wrote:I see Nonu has declared interest in the AB's again in one of the more predictable stories at the moment. Its this sort of thing that can lead to the improvement in SH sides that dont happen in non WCup years, i.e last years AI's.

Nonu may not get in but at least he'll be 'available' at least in order that we can turn him down and go with someone 'better'. Same with AA Cooper for Oz.

How hypocritical are these guys? They take the money and the lifestyle when it suits them and then threaten to leave their club floundering when they are most needed. Further than that, they threaten the existing incumbents in their national teams, upsetting that spirit for their own self-glorification.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 2:31 pm

Shussssssh. That doesnt fit the narrative.

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Post by miaow on Tue Feb 12, 2019 2:47 pm

Just briefly on Best: do no Irish posters have an issue with his lineout throwing?

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:15 pm

miaow wrote:Just briefly on Best: do no Irish posters have an issue with his lineout throwing?

No, because there isnt really an issue with it. Compare it to the accuracy of other sides and it seems obvious enough.

Marx coundnt hit a barn door last year and yet picked up a WPOTU nomination. Perceptions can be funny.

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Post by rodders on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:38 pm

miaow wrote:Just briefly on Best: do no Irish posters have an issue with his lineout throwing?

Honestly I'd like it to be better, especially on the big pressure throws but I do think it gets overblown, statistically his accuracy is actually pretty good and often does go long periods were he is consistently hitting his man.

I do think apart from Guirado, George and Owens he's the best hooker in the championship, and not that far of those 3.
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Post by miaow on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:40 pm

He definitely does have a problem though. Particularly under pressure. The better/best (no pun intended...) open play hookers are often average throwers - they're in there because they offer something in the loose. Hibbard, for instance, scrummaging and tackling. Marx, rucking and running. So maybe, generally speaking, throwing as a whole isn't as good as it was (something to look into but cba) but Best does bottle it on the big pressure throws. It's happened for far too many years to be incidental. Happened against England this 6Ns.

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Post by miaow on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:41 pm

[quote="rodders"]
miaow wrote:I do think apart from Guirado, George and Owens he's the best hooker in the championship, and not that far of those 3.

Guirado? Good. Ken? Better. Rory?

Erm...

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:41 pm

miaow wrote:He definitely does have a problem though. Particularly under pressure. The better/best (no pun intended...) open play hookers are often average throwers - they're in there because they offer something in the loose. Hibbard, for instance, scrummaging and tackling. Marx, rucking and running. So maybe, generally speaking, throwing as a whole isn't as good as it was (something to look into but cba) but Best does bottle it on the big pressure throws. It's happened for far too many years to be incidental. Happened against England this 6Ns.

I dont see it. Any numbers to back that up?

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Post by rodders on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:42 pm

miaow wrote:
rodders wrote:
miaow wrote:I do think apart from Guirado, George and Owens he's the best hooker in the championship, and not that far of those 3.

Guirado? Good. Ken? Better. Rory?

Erm...

Best?
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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:43 pm

miaow wrote:
rodders wrote:
miaow wrote:I do think apart from Guirado, George and Owens he's the best hooker in the championship, and not that far of those 3.

Guirado? Good. Ken? Better. Rory?

Erm...

Did you do it again Rodders?

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Post by rodders on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:44 pm

Nope miows fault this time, he's missing an end quote... I'm innocent for once....
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Post by miaow on Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:57 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:
miaow wrote:He definitely does have a problem though. Particularly under pressure. The better/best (no pun intended...) open play hookers are often average throwers - they're in there because they offer something in the loose. Hibbard, for instance, scrummaging and tackling. Marx, rucking and running. So maybe, generally speaking, throwing as a whole isn't as good as it was (something to look into but cba) but Best does bottle it on the big pressure throws. It's happened for far too many years to be incidental. Happened against England this 6Ns.

I dont see it. Any numbers to back that up?

Probably could, but cba. More the concerned face scrunch he gets when you can tell he's really not looking forward to putting the ball in having already missed a key throw...and then he misses it.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:01 pm

So in other words fake news?

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Post by miaow on Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:03 pm

Haha, no, just an opinion...

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Post by Taylorman on Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:59 pm

robbo277 wrote:
Taylorman wrote:
SecretFly wrote:I guess Carbery was lined up for two games anyway.  I'd say he was Going to be given the Italy game and perhaps France.  I don't think Schmidt ever intended making Sexton play all five games as starter.  You might question why he even played him against England when he was just back playing.  Baptism of fire!  But there too when you think about it, that's probably planning with Carbery in mind.  Our coaching team knew what mood England were in and we need to keep Carbery's faith in himself rising.  Perhaps Schmidt decided that first BIG game against England mightn't have been the best route to sustaining and growing the confidence.  So the old dog was brought in... but he was way off the level required.
Schmidt has had to gamble quite a bit so far, and it hasn't paid off but without a doubt he and many of the players have 'form' thoughts shifted on this year to peak in the Autumn rather than 6N.

Certainly a lot on their shoulders and I guess key to holding Ireland flat is if they can suffocate both Murray and Sexton half the jobs done. I think Murray will be ok Japan time but Sexton will need a Carter type run in those last three matches where everything he did turned to gold, and remained injury free.

And remember this is a different year. Sexton could be roughed up by others in club play. Scotland are in their pool and SA are likely last 8. it would be a big favour if Sexton was given a hard time playing for Leinster. Not that I'm advocating it but after seeing McCaw targeted by all and sundry most of his career this stuff happens. Which is why 'not playing' even when fit, can provide longevity that might not otherwise be there. Of all players in the NH, Sexton does appear to be singularly more influential than any other player of the NH sides, and slightly more brittle within that. Time for the cotton wool I say. He can work his form in in pool play. You just have to imagine Irelands chances without him at all...grim at best. Carbery might be good but you need seasoned, successful pros at 10 to win it. Every win has had that, bar possibly 2007 with SA but even then James was steady.

If you "rough someone up" in a club game in April with the intention of impacting his ability to play in September and he is out of the World Cup in September, you haven't roughed him up, you have assaulted him.

Not sure who doesnt know that but try telling McCaws fave players that. Doesnt matter how it happens, the point being player management is real for a variety of reasons. Sexton is fairly brittle anyway and any side playing his knows if you manage to get him in a good tackle, you make sure you hit hom hard. No secret there.

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Post by Taylorman on Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:01 pm

miaow wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:
miaow wrote:He definitely does have a problem though. Particularly under pressure. The better/best (no pun intended...) open play hookers are often average throwers - they're in there because they offer something in the loose. Hibbard, for instance, scrummaging and tackling. Marx, rucking and running. So maybe, generally speaking, throwing as a whole isn't as good as it was (something to look into but cba) but Best does bottle it on the big pressure throws. It's happened for far too many years to be incidental. Happened against England this 6Ns.

I dont see it. Any numbers to back that up?

Probably could, but cba. More the concerned face scrunch he gets when you can tell he's really not looking forward to putting the ball in having already missed a key throw...and then he misses it.

Marx has serious lineout throw issues. Coukdnt hit a barn door in one or two AB tests. When hes off, hes reeeeeally off.

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Post by Taylorman on Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:03 pm

The Great Aukster wrote:
Taylorman wrote:I see Nonu has declared interest in the AB's again in one of the more predictable stories at the moment. Its this sort of thing that can lead to the improvement in SH sides that dont happen in non WCup years, i.e last years AI's.

Nonu may not get in but at least he'll be 'available' at least in order that we can turn him down and go with someone 'better'. Same with AA Cooper for Oz.

How hypocritical are these guys? They take the money and the lifestyle when it suits them and then threaten to leave their club floundering when they are most needed. Further than that, they threaten the existing incumbents in their national teams, upsetting that spirit for their own self-glorification.

Aaaah, music to my ears. Thanks aukster, made my day. About time the irony hit home for a change. Take the money and run boys. Good to see loyalty come through in the end thumbsup

Hey, heres a tip, if you wanna keep them, pay them what theyre worth. Otherwise, stop moaning. Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh

Oh, and try watching dozens leave your beleagured franchises every year after you've built their professional careers up from babies.

Aah, what a lovely day it is too. Hug


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Post by Taylorman on Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:15 pm

SecretFly wrote:Is McCaw still doing the helicoptering career in NZ.  What a life and what a country to do it in.... lucky blighter.

Hes doing the coast to coast marathon at the moment. One side of the South Island to the other. Hike, bike, kayak. Its a toughy.

Entrues for 2020 now open fly:

http://www.coasttocoast.co.nz

Great way to see the south island(so Im told Laugh )

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