PGA Tour: AT&T Pebble Beach: Notes from the Ballwasher

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Post by kwinigolfer on Wed 06 Feb 2019, 7:14 pm

First topic message reminder :

1).The Tour moves from desert showers in Phoenix to distinctly unpleasant weather on the (normally) gorgeous Monterey Peninsula for the "AT&T Pebble Bach Pro-Am".
Daily forecast from the Weather Channel suggests this might not be a 72-hole tournament:
Approx 4 inches of rain already this month, temps not likely to reach much more than 55F (13C?) all week.
Thursday: Dry,
Friday: Rain (about 3/4 inch), windy - up to 25 mph
Saturday: Morning showers,
Sunday: More rain, cooler, breezy.
Monday: Looks fine! Still cool, but dry and if they're going to play 72 holes you'd think there'll be Monday TV golf to enjoy.

2).Dustin Johnson and Phil Mickelson are the Tour's leading exponent of 54-hole finishes; they have 3 x 54-hole wins apiece. Can't find anyone else with more than one. And Dustin & Phil each have one of those 54-hole jobs at Pebble Beach.

3).Last week was all about Rickie Fowler losing the Phoenix Open and recovering just in time to take advantage of Branden Grace's vertigo to pull himself together, birdieing two of the final four holes, and win a hugely popular two-shot victory. Dismal final rounds from Kuchar & Justin Thomas who looked at the start of play to be the likeliest challengers. Surprising.

4).Good results also for Knox (T10) and Hatton (T15).
Apropos of comments in last week's notes, Hatton's putting together a sensible double-dipping schedule and seems to be making sure he's ready to compete when he plays. Quite impressed, but he still has to win over the US Network commentators!

5).Talking of which, it was bye bye Johnny Miller last week and welcome to the NBC booth to Paul Azinger. And Zinger kicked off his tenure with a perceptive comment when Grace was closing in on the hapless Fowler, words to the effect of:
"Just wait until Grace sees the leaderboard and realises he's not the posse anymore but the leader. It's a whole different mindset from playing aggressively as the chaser."
Lo and behold, Grace missed his last four fairways, including a water ball on #17 and played the final five holes +1.
I was surprised because Grace won handsomely when taking the lead at Harbour Town three years ago, but Azinger got this one spot on.

6).We start to see the first changes to the revamped Tour schedule in a fortnight when the caravan takes a detour into Mexico on its way to Florida rather than the Los Angeles/Honda/Mexico itinerary last year.
So:
Feb 7th: Pebble Beach
Feb 14th: Riviera
Feb 21st: WGC: Mexico . . . . . . and Puerto Rico (hadn't realised that was back on the calendar).
Feb 28th: Honda
March 7th: Bay Hill
March 14th: The Players
etc, etc.

7).So I'm interested in views as to how ready TPC Sawgrass is going to be for The Players in mid-March when one of the reasons for shifting it to May was weather and course conditioning in late March, which is when Sawgrass used to entertain us. Bay Hill is also earlier.
It looks as if the Tour is rolling the meteorological dice a little.

8).So, crappy weather for Pebble Beach. Tommy Fleetwood seems to be embracing it, reminiscing about some miserable Dunhill weather and remarking that golf is an outdoors sport.
The ball will not fly as far as the pros are used to and one imagines the courses will be somewhat saturated. Eleven golfers have already withdrawn - hopefully the conditions will be better than they anticipated.
One of those withdrawals is Schwartzel, as mentioned last week. His form has been awful for the past nine months, no top 30's since a purple patch of Top Tens last May. I'm struggling to imagine what safety net he has for his Tour card if this doesn't improve sometime soon. Anyone know what's going on?

9).Last week we suggested Mickelson, Matsuyama & Fowler against the field, so one out of three came through.
This week, you'd think the horses for courses would be DJ, Phil and Jason Day, but the weather can put the mockers on the form book in a hurry. Plus: With dodgy conditions the luck of the draw caused by playing eighteen holes each at three different courses can also be a factor.
But some guys seem to play well here, Senedeker & Spieth for instance, Walker & Watney. Shane Lowry's playing and we know he has form in the rain!

10).No doubt one or two of the better players are competing in order to see the course before June's US Open, a dress rehearsal if you like. But the best laid plans could become undone. Just hoping we can see some decent golf amongst the pandering to faux celebrities.
And there is also qualifying for the WGC: Mexico on the line:
Top 50 in the owgr as at next Monday (or Tuesday if it comes to that).
Top 10 in Race 2 Dubai.
(There is another owgr cut off, plus a FedEx qualification, after Riviera.)

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Post by kwinigolfer on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 2:13 am

Well!
What drama.
Phil and Casey dawdle at least one hole behind the group in front and then Phil is p1ssed off that he can't go and finish in the dark.
Sorry Phil, actions have consequences.
But you're the odds-on winner anyway, and great to see that. You had it today, and Paul Casey didn't quite. Hope he finishes 2nd alone when they resume at 8.00 a.m. Monday.

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Post by GPB on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 3:18 am

If Casey does finish 2nd, it will be an Arizona State University Sun Devil quiniela.

Not sure of the last time that happened, but I know that Jeff Quinney (also a Sun Devil) finished 2nd to Mickelson in the 2008 Northern Trust (LA Open).

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Post by super_realist on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 7:52 am

Diggers wrote:The results been on their website for a few hours, they’ll probably put a brief report up at some point today, for the 8 people who are vaguely interested. What more is actually needed? Headline can read, “Unknown golfer beats other bang average golfers to win crap tournament.”

They're supposed to be a 24 hour news outlet. If they hand over acres to commenting on meaningless cricket friendlies in the West Indies or this (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/47172849) they could at least have a paragraph about a golf tournament.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 12:13 pm

GPB wrote:If Casey does finish 2nd, it will be an Arizona State University Sun Devil quiniela.

Not sure of the last time that happened, but I know that Jeff Quinney (also a Sun Devil) finished 2nd to Mickelson in the 2008 Northern Trust  (LA Open).


Not being pedantic, but what's a quiniela, first two? So, Would that be first two ASU or first two from the same place? Probably true, but difficult to believe!

Forecast good for this morning, no hail anticipated.

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Post by McLaren on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 2:38 pm

super_realist wrote:
Diggers wrote:The results been on their website for a few hours, they’ll probably put a brief report up at some point today, for the 8 people who are vaguely interested. What more is actually needed? Headline can read, “Unknown golfer beats other bang average golfers to win crap tournament.”

They're supposed to be a 24 hour news outlet. If they hand over acres to commenting on meaningless cricket friendlies in the West Indies or this (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/47172849) they could at least have a paragraph about a golf tournament.

Why?

Unfortunately the European tour is dead in terms of being a mainstream sporting interest. I guess hiding yourself on Sky for 20 odd years has finally reduced the general sporting fans interest to zero. I predict the same fate for F1 in the coming years. Football seems to be getting away without the casual fans viewership but it doesn't seem to be a model that works for other sports.
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Post by GPB on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 3:43 pm

In Horse (and Dog) Racing a quiniella bet is bet where you pick two horses to come in first and second. A little more easier to hit than an Exacta where you pick Horse A to win and Horse B to place.

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Post by GPB on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 3:51 pm

Sam Snead had a 30 year winning span that covered 1936-1965
Phil Mickelson has 28 year winning span that covers 1991-2018 (29 yrs and 2019?)

Ray Floyd's 30 yr winning span overlaps each of these golfers (1963-1992)

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Post by kwinigolfer on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 3:58 pm

GPB wrote:In Horse (and Dog) Racing a quiniella bet is bet where you pick two horses to come in first and second.  A little more easier to hit than an Exacta where you pick Horse A to win and Horse B to place.

OK, Wasn't aware - the "quin" made me think there was five of something going on.
So, what's the criteria for Phil & Paul?

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Post by McLaren on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 4:04 pm

GPB wrote:Sam Snead had a 30 year winning span that covered 1936-1965
Phil Mickelson has 28 year winning span that covers 1991-2018  (29 yrs and 2019?)

Ray Floyd's 30 yr winning span overlaps each of these golfers (1963-1992)

That is an unreal achievement from Phil, whether he continues the run or not. Almost as impressive as Tigers made cut streak.
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Post by kwinigolfer on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 4:13 pm

PB looking absolutely gorgeous. Picture perfect.
Casey's miss on #17 probably clinches it for Phil.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 4:32 pm

Another runner up for Paul.
Yet another win for Phil. 65.

Apparently his first win in the USA for six years!

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Post by Shotrock on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 4:40 pm

-7 for the 18 for FIGJAM, that's well done!

Don't think we'll be seeing a lot of -7 rounds come National Open time.

Smart for Casey to play today and earn solo 2nd (and not try to finish last night).

Meanwhile, Kwin, Wayne Levi WD this weekend after a snowman. I'm hoping he paid the caddy.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 6:48 pm

Shotrock wrote:-7 for the 18 for FIGJAM, that's well done!

Don't think we'll be seeing a lot of -7 rounds come National Open time.

Smart for Casey to play today and earn solo 2nd (and not try to finish last night).

Meanwhile, Kwin, Wayne Levi WD this weekend after a snowman. I'm hoping he paid the caddy.

Assume WL gets his son Brian (or Judy) to carry the bag.
He should stay home. Which is exactly where they're playing this week - he should organise a cook out and devote his attentions to that, skip taking the place of someone more deserving.

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Post by super_realist on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 7:19 pm

McLaren wrote:
super_realist wrote:
Diggers wrote:The results been on their website for a few hours, they’ll probably put a brief report up at some point today, for the 8 people who are vaguely interested. What more is actually needed? Headline can read, “Unknown golfer beats other bang average golfers to win crap tournament.”

They're supposed to be a 24 hour news outlet. If they hand over acres to commenting on meaningless cricket friendlies in the West Indies or this (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/47172849) they could at least have a paragraph about a golf tournament.

Why?

Unfortunately the European tour is dead in terms of  being a mainstream sporting interest.  I guess hiding yourself on Sky for 20 odd years has finally reduced the general sporting fans interest to zero.  I predict the same fate for F1 in the coming years.  Football seems to be getting away without the casual fans viewership but it doesn't seem to be a model that works for other sports.

Does anyone still watch that toss?

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Post by McLaren on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 9:31 pm

Whether it is toss or not the viewing figures are dire on the sky races. I think they scrape just over 500k UK viewers for a race. Which I believe used to be in the millions during the free to air days.
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Post by GPB on Mon 11 Feb 2019, 11:47 pm

As a postscript to the overlapping winning spans, Walter Hagen's last PGATournament win was in 1936, just a couple weeks before Sam Sneads first win.

Hagen's first win predates the PGA (formed 1916) as Hagen won the 1914 US Open so essentially four players winning careers encompasses the entire history of the PGATour.

Hagen 1914-1936
Snead 1936-1965
Floyd 1963-1992
Phil 1991-2019

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Post by GPB on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 1:30 am

After missing the cut at Pebble, Matty Fitz tried to Monday Qualify for the Genesis. Four spots available. He finished 10th.

https://scpga.bluegolf.com/bluegolf/scpga19/event/scpga1923/contest/1/leaderboard.htm

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Post by kwinigolfer on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 2:01 am

Pretty good field.
A bit bogus Badds having to MQ; it seems only yesterday he won the damn thing!

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Post by super_realist on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 7:39 am

GPB wrote:After missing the cut at Pebble, Matty Fitz tried to Monday Qualify for the Genesis.  Four spots available.  He finished 10th.

https://scpga.bluegolf.com/bluegolf/scpga19/event/scpga1923/contest/1/leaderboard.htm

Seems harsh that the world number 42 should have to qualify for anything.

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Post by super_realist on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 7:45 am

McLaren wrote:Whether it is toss or not the viewing figures are dire on the sky races. I think they scrape just over 500k UK viewers for a race. Which I believe used to be in the millions during the free to air days.

To be fair Mac, it's a dire event. Only one of 4 drivers can ever win a race pretty much, then team orders take over once each of the two competitive teams has someone who might win the championship, then there's so many dud venues where any overtaking is ruled out by and large. I've never seen how anyone could be interested in something which lacks any real competition. It's like getting excited about a Boat Race every weekend. 90% of the field are just there to make up the numbers.

F1 is a coin toss between two drivers at the end of the day. It's effectively an engineering competition. Such coin toss events are great as a one off, but seeing 2 people battle is out over a dozen or so races is just incredibly boring.

Out of interest, what is it that you find interesting about it?

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Post by JAS on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 10:00 am

GPB wrote:As a postscript to the overlapping winning spans, Walter Hagen's last PGATournament win was in 1936, just a couple weeks before Sam Sneads first win.

Hagen's first win predates the PGA (formed 1916) as Hagen won the 1914 US Open so essentially four players winning careers encompasses the entire history of the PGATour.

Hagen 1914-1936
Snead 1936-1965
Floyd  1963-1992
Phil    1991-2019

Interesting stat GBP, whatever anyone thinks of Phil, he does seem to have some longevity. Winning tournaments at 48 can’t be that common. Wouldn’t bet on a repeat in June but I wouldn’t write him off entirely either, clearly knows how to win round there although PB in Feb, set up for a Pro am will be vastly different to PB in June set up for a U.S. Open.

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Post by LadyPutt on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 12:55 pm

McLaren wrote:Whether it is toss or not the viewing figures are dire on the sky races. I think they scrape just over 500k UK viewers for a race. Which I believe used to be in the millions during the free to air days.
Well my husband and I are two of them Very Happy  We also watch the European Tour golf every week which is far superior to the dross which is the PGA. Even recording it and trying to fast-forward through the idiots in the studio and the ad breaks, to say nothing of repeated shots of the sky, trees, sea (if on the coast), the galleries - anything but someone playing golf (unless its Woods) - makes it tedious to watch and even worse to listen to.
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Post by GPB on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 6:22 pm

super_realist wrote:Seems harsh that the world number 42 should have to qualify for anything.

Membership has its privileges.  And Matty Fitz is not a member of the PGATour. and his Busman's holidays on the PGATour does not indicate that he is entitled to a sponsors exemption  

In the last 24 months, Matty Fitz has played 8 PGATour non-co-sanctioned events, and earned 8.25 OWGR points.  1.03 pts/event

In the last 24 months, Matty Fitz has played 29 EuroTour events that were not co-sanctioned (w/PGAT) events and earned 179.65 pts.  6.19 pts/event.


Last edited by GPB on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 8:09 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : bad math.)

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Post by kwinigolfer on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 7:39 pm

GPB wrote:
super_realist wrote:Seems harsh that the world number 42 should have to qualify for anything.

Membership has its privileges.  And Matty Fitz is not a member of the PGATour. and his Busman's holidays on the PGATour does not indicate that he is entitled to a sponsors exemption  

In the last 24 months, Matty Fitz has played 8 PGATour non-co-sanctioned events, and earned 8.25 OWGR points.  1.18 pts/event

In the last 24 months, Matty Fitz has played 29 EuroTour events that were not co-sanctioned (w/PGAT) events and earned 179.65 pts.  6.19 pts/event.


For the record, Fitz's efforts in Majors/WGC's is also not very good, at least recently, but a darn site better (3.2 pts per tournament I think) in the past two years than in PGA Tour fare.
A continuing theme that, for most "international" golfers who play in premium events, their performance is better in Majors & WGC's than run of the mill PGA Tour events.

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Post by McLaren on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 7:42 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:
A continuing theme that, for most "international" golfers who play in premium events, their performance is better in Majors & WGC's than run of the mill PGA Tour events.

Quick thought. Is that because run of the mill pgat events aren't clogged up with ET players who have artificially high OWGR positions?
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Post by kwinigolfer on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 7:48 pm

Such as?

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Post by McLaren on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 7:58 pm

All of them. Whistle
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Post by kwinigolfer on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 8:08 pm

Mac,
You're an ucking fidiot. GPB's done analysis to debate his point, I've done the same. Your turn. Or are you still on your way back from El Paso?

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Post by McLaren on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 8:25 pm

WTF I was clearly just messing.
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Post by GPB on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 8:33 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:
GPB wrote:
super_realist wrote:Seems harsh that the world number 42 should have to qualify for anything.

Membership has its privileges.  And Matty Fitz is not a member of the PGATour. and his Busman's holidays on the PGATour does not indicate that he is entitled to a sponsors exemption  

In the last 24 months, Matty Fitz has played 8 PGATour non-co-sanctioned events, and earned 8.25 OWGR points.  1.03 pts/event

In the last 24 months, Matty Fitz has played 29 EuroTour events that were not co-sanctioned (w/PGAT) events and earned 179.65 pts.  6.19 pts/event.


For the record, Fitz's efforts in Majors/WGC's is also not very good, at least recently, but a darn site better (3.2 pts per tournament I think) in the past two years than in PGA Tour fare.
A continuing theme that, for most "international" golfers who play in premium events, their performance is better in Majors & WGC's than run of the mill PGA Tour events.

WGCs participants are nearly guaranteed OWGR points as there is no cut. And IMO, there is a valid argument that many regular PGATour events have a stronger fields (or as strong) from TOP to BOTTOM than the majors. Each of the majors have problems with their fields,

The Masters: Short field Approximately 95 players, which is diluted with past champions.
The USOpen: Approximately half the field are qualifiers, many of which are amateurs, club pros, and mini tour players
The Open: Qualifiers from International Tours which are weaker than the PGATour and may not even be the best players from those tours.
The PGA: Best Major field, but it still is diluted with 25 Club Pros.

FTR, I think the Majors have far better fields than any of the WGC's. The Masters being the weakest, then the US Open, then the Open, and then the PGA.

The Riviera field has 125+ PGATour Members which I think is better than any of the WGC fields even though the OWGR rates all the WGCs higher than Genesis (estimate OWGR 64 at this time). Just because the OWGR SoF formulas are top heavy and don't value anyone ranked lower than OWGR 200. If GPB were given at sponsors invite, he would add as much value to the field as Jim Furyk and Ernie Els combined. I can assure you that Jim Furyk and Ernie Els can EASILY beat GPB in golf.


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Post by kwinigolfer on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 8:40 pm

GPB,
But the fact remains that in each of these "major" events, the strength of field from 1 to (at least) 50 is stronger than any regular tour stop.

None of which excuses the problem that Fitz has underperformed these past two years.

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Post by GPB on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 9:08 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:GPB,
But the fact remains that in each of these "major" events, the strength of field from 1 to (at least) 50 is stronger than any regular tour stop.

None of which excuses the problem that Fitz has underperformed these past two years.

I agree with that.

But I don't agree they are stronger fields. Because the SoF in regular PGATour events are not valuing the Jim Furyk's and Bill Haas's and Martin Lairds who are playing tournaments on the PGATour. Their names might as well be kwinigolfer or GPB. The
SOF formulas do not measure depthness of a PGATour field.

The Saudi tournament that was played two weeks ago was OWGR 48. Rose, Koepka, DJ and BDC by themselves would have been OWGR 32 by themselves. The SoF formulas are extremely Top Heavy. too top heavy IMO.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 10:31 pm

When all else fails, who does the Tour get to make news but Tiger Woods.
And here are his three choices as Vice Captains for his Presidents Cup match vs the Internationals in Melbourne this December:
Zach Johnson, Steve Stricker, Fred Couples, with a tba to go.

Strange that Woods says about Couples: "We get to return there (Melbourne) as two leaders of this team. We're going to have some fun."
Just like you were a leader and having fun in Paris, Tiger. #delusional.


PS: GPB: Has rotoworld's site changed or is my computer running out of juice? (Both are a possibility of course.)

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Post by robopz on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 11:22 pm

GPB wrote:As a postscript to the overlapping winning spans, Walter Hagen's last PGATournament win was in 1936, just a couple weeks before Sam Sneads first win.

Hagen's first win predates the PGA (formed 1916) as Hagen won the 1914 US Open so essentially four players winning careers encompasses the entire history of the PGATour.

Hagen 1914-1936
Snead 1936-1965
Floyd  1963-1992
Phil    1991-2019
that's just ridiculous to think that just 4 guys have 100+ years covered. ✓✓✓

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Post by kwinigolfer on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 12:35 am

Agreed, a magnificent stat. And could have featured DLIII a couple of years ago. #thoroughbreds!

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Post by super_realist on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 7:50 am

kwinigolfer wrote:When all else fails, who does the Tour get to make news but Tiger Woods.
And here are his three choices as Vice Captains for his Presidents Cup match vs the Internationals in Melbourne this December:
Zach Johnson, Steve Stricker, Fred Couples, with a tba to go.

Strange that Woods says about Couples: "We get to return there (Melbourne) as two leaders of this team. We're going to have some fun."
Just like you were a leader and having fun in Paris, Tiger. #delusional.


PS: GPB: Has rotoworld's site changed or is my computer running out of juice? (Both are a possibility of course.)

I hadn't realised that the USA's worst ever Ryder Cup player was the Captain of the tinniest of tinpot competitions in the Presidents Cup. Is there anyone less well suited to being a leader? I'm sure he'll probably still win, as it's a truly horrendous competition which hardly anyone cares about especially the ROW, but for goodness sake, whoever thought a self centred, self indulgent egomaniac like 9C could be a good Captain? You couldn't find a player more of an individual than him. America make some truly laughable choices when it comes to team events. No wonder they aren't very good at international team sports.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 10:59 am

super,
Careful now,
I get into trouble when I talk about Republican Presidents on here . . . . . . .

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Post by pedro on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 12:08 pm

super, they are good at international team sports indeed! As you know they have the world champions in NFL American football, NBA basketball and MLB baseball!!

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Post by McLaren on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 1:00 pm

super_realist wrote:whoever thought a self centred, self indulgent egomaniac like 9C could be a good Captain?

And yet we now have a generation of pretty good American players who would absolutely love playing for Tiger. They will be playing for the guy that inspired them to focus on golf and the guy who comes with so many memories of the most influential moments in golf over the last 20 odd years. You would be a fool to think he won't motivate them.
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Post by kwinigolfer on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 1:36 pm

Absolutely Mac, Just look at the example he set en Paris.

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Post by robopz on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 2:00 pm

Sounds like the Geneses Open is being converted to a "super-invitational" next year, like the Arnold Palmer and Memorial. Big raise to the purse... 3-year exemption for the winner... This also solves the "Fitz" problem of not getting in.  I expect OWGR top-50 will be an exemption in the future like the API/Memorial.

On another note... Top heavyness of fields over affecting OWGR field strengths... it IS a real thing, and despite sometimes equal OWGR winners points, IMO many of those fields are far from equal, and I'm talking at the mid to upper end (lower end is another discussion).   Here's 3 approaches of looking at field strengths using OWGR data...  

The center column ranks all PGAT, ET and select other 2018 Calendar year events by OWGR winners points used.   The far right column ranks them only by WORLD OWGR values.

But the LEFT column is a ranking based on the sum of the OWGR ranking averages (SOA) of EVERY player in the field.  The net effect is events with smaller fields and only a few top level players tend to go down, fuller fields with more depth go up.  Really small field events like ToC's or Tour Championships get hit really hard... WGC's not as much... but truly strong events like the FEX playoffs and a few of the strong regular events get elevated.  

PGA Tour: AT&T Pebble Beach: Notes from the Ballwasher - Page 2 2018-c10

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Post by Shotrock on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 2:23 pm

Pedro -

I guess basketball is not popular in England. But, it sure is in many other parts of the world. (I'll have to run down the numbers.) US dominant in world play, but not for long me thinks.

Baseball obviously never went beyond Central America and Japan (or so I believe).

American Football ... here comes the big decline. Our local high school has trouble getting players given all the concussion awareness. A story I hear from other parents at other high schools. Professional ice hockey not far behind, IMO.

Soccer ... well it looks like we're adopting the English route. Get foreign managers. (Never really understood this logic in England since every Englishman I converse with seems to know plenty about the sport.)

But the big story for US Sports is Mikaela Shiffrin. What a year and start to her career!


Last edited by Shotrock on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 7:05 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by kwinigolfer on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 3:43 pm

robopz wrote:Sounds like the Geneses Open is being converted to a "super-invitational" next year, like the Arnold Palmer and Memorial. Big raise to the purse... 3-year exemption for the winner... This also solves the "Fitz" problem of not getting in.  I expect OWGR top-50 will be an exemption in the future like the API/Memorial.

On another note... Top heavyness of fields over affecting OWGR field strengths... it IS a real thing, and despite sometimes equal OWGR winners points, IMO many of those fields are far from equal, and I'm talking at the mid to upper end (lower end is another discussion).   Here's 3 approaches of looking at field strengths using OWGR data...  

The center column ranks all PGAT, ET and select other 2018 Calendar year events by OWGR winners points used.   The far right column ranks them only by WORLD OWGR values.

But the LEFT column is a ranking based on the sum of the OWGR ranking averages (SOA) of EVERY player in the field.  The net effect is events with smaller fields and only a few top level players tend to go down, fuller fields with more depth go up.  Really small field events like ToC's or Tour Championships get hit really hard... WGC's not as much... but truly strong events like the FEX playoffs and a few of the strong regular events get elevated.  

PGA Tour: AT&T Pebble Beach: Notes from the Ballwasher - Page 2 2018-c10


That's a great series of charts, robo. It'll take a while to wrap my brain around the significance of it all, but a comparison between 2018 and whenever we can say the revised Tour(s) calendars unravel will be interesting.

Somewhat along those lines, The Travelers is trying to make sure it doesn't get left behind with Koepka, Thomas, BDeC, Finau & Molinari already signed up and, presumably, just a matter of time before Bubba joins them. They have a very vulnerable date so hopefully they're doing a good job of buttressing the field - but probably at the expense of Detroit & MSP.

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Post by robopz on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 6:42 pm

Kwini... I think the key thing on the chart is to look at the LEFT (SOF-Sum of Averages) column and see how some of the especially smaller field events are so much lower... IMO that demonstrates the "field strength" deficiency of smaller fields...

BUT... that doesn't mean that events should be OWGR rated via the SOF thing I've shown, cuz it's not perfect either... because if you go by winners of Majors/Players since the advent of the OWGR, less than 16% of them have been won by players outside the top-50, even though on average #51 and higher represent about 2/3rds of the fields.  So if field strength is making sure "probable winners" are in the field... then having as many top-50 players as possible is the KEY...   Bottom line:  OWGR has it's flaws, but in the end, IMO it "mostly" does what it's supposed to do.  I'm not sure any changes I've seen suggested (or I would suggest) would make it fundamentally better.

And as for the Travelers... IMO it actually has the catbird's seat of PGAT events between the Open's since the Rolex Series thing got going.  I suspect that to continue, and Canadian Open to get stronger than Memphis was before the U.S. Open as well...

But on another note... it appears as though my guess on WGC Mexico strength falling might be off base... It's been reported 47 of 50 current top-50 are committed. If that holds (I still have my doubts it will)... that's better than I would  have guessed... (Rose, Day & Scott supposedly only ones not on the commitment list, but others could remove themselves by Friday 5PM.) Now the WGC Match Play... that may be another story... lots of reports of likely fallouts from that one.

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Post by super_realist on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 6:51 pm

McLaren wrote:
super_realist wrote:whoever thought a self centred, self indulgent egomaniac like 9C could be a good Captain?

And yet we now have a generation of pretty good American players who would absolutely love playing for Tiger.  They will be playing for the guy that inspired them to focus on golf and the guy who comes with so many memories of the most influential moments in golf over the last 20 odd years.  You would be a fool to think he won't motivate them.

Doesn't sound any different from all the people who would have loved to have played for Faldo. He was the player the Europeans were looking up to as an influential and massively successful player of their era. Would I be a fool to think he couldn't motivate them?

As usual Mac, myopic as usual and only ever seeing things from one side.

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Post by GPB on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 7:22 pm

As usual Mac, myopic as usual and only ever seeing things from one side.

Rich, very Rich

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Post by kwinigolfer on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 7:30 pm

Shotrock wrote:Pedro -



But the big story for US Sports is Mikaela Shiffrin. What a year and start to her career!

Agree with that. Quite brilliant.
Trained in VT as well!

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