The English Back Three Conundrum

Go down

Which three players should be England’s back three

7% 7% 
[ 4 ]
7% 7% 
[ 4 ]
11% 11% 
[ 6 ]
17% 17% 
[ 9 ]
30% 30% 
[ 16 ]
9% 9% 
[ 5 ]
4% 4% 
[ 2 ]
11% 11% 
[ 6 ]
4% 4% 
[ 2 ]
 
Total Votes : 54

The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by maestegmafia on Sun 10 Feb 2019, 10:28 am

Eddie Jones is starting form a very solid consistent selection, he has his men but an area where there is still some debate is definitely the outside backs. There are various permutations that could develope over this six nations and I think the fans will want to see a final combination nailed ready for the Japan RWC.

Over the last twenty matches, since the tour of Argentina in 2017 England have used 9 wingers and 2 fullbacks. Won 12 lost 8. Denny Solomana also came off the bench a few times.

Fullbacks

Mike Brown 9
Anthony Watson 3
Elliot Daly 7


Wingers

Chris Ashton 3
Mike Brown 3
Joe Cokanasiga 2
Elliot Daly 11
Jonny May 11
Jack Nowell 3
Semesa Rokoduguni 2
Anthony Watson 2
Marlon Yarde 3

maestegmafia
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 21013
Join date : 2011-03-05
Location : Glyncorrwg

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by Scottrf on Sun 10 Feb 2019, 10:32 am

IJWT

Scottrf

Posts : 13860
Join date : 2011-01-26

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by LondonTiger on Sun 10 Feb 2019, 11:14 am

Not sure on the reliability of your stats mm.

Since the tour to Argentina in 2017 England have played 16 tests:

http://stats.espnscrum.com/statsguru/rugby/stats/index.html?class=1;orderby=date;spanmax2=10+Feb+2019;spanmin2=10+Oct+2017;spanval2=span;team=1;template=results;type=team;view=match

Jonny May started in 14 of those 16.

If we include the Barbarians fixtures where half the team is unavailable, then the last 20 games includes 2 of these and both in Argentina.

Whichever way you cut it, I would start with May and Daly with the third member dependent on certain things. If Watson gets fit in time to show his past form, and has not lost anything following two surgeries he would be in my lineup. Otherwise it would depend on the opposition and how big Joe progresses. Nowell, Ashton and Joe would all be in my thoughts.

I would take Brown to the WC as a reliable cover player

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 18982
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by lostinwales on Sun 10 Feb 2019, 11:29 am

I am with LT on this. We have one winger who is, right now, amongst the best on the planet. We have a pool of players around him who are all very good but offer different skill sets.

We don't have to have a fixed 3, and back 3 is, probably, the easiest set of players to mix and match anyway.

lostinwales

Posts : 8064
Join date : 2011-06-09
Location : Out of Wales :)

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by EnglishReign on Sun 10 Feb 2019, 2:25 pm

May a definite. Daly too good to leave out.

I would probably go with Daly and May on the wings, with Watson at fullback. Nowell/Ashton are very good options coming off the bench though.

EnglishReign

Posts : 1901
Join date : 2011-06-12
Location : London

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by Presuming Ed on Sun 10 Feb 2019, 2:41 pm

The way Thorley's being playing at Gloucester I'd love to see him get a run.

Presuming Ed

Posts : 81
Join date : 2016-01-15

Back to top Go down

England's back three

Post by Omeprazole on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 2:52 pm

I am currently involved in an argument about who England’s best back three are. I am arguing that our Ireland set up of Nowell, May and Daly is the best we can do. However, with Ashton being favoured for France and Watson and Cokanasiga hopefully back for the World Cup, it might not be as simple as that. I just think that my favoured back three has balance (albeit perhaps lacking in aerial skills).

Interested to get another perspective on this – whether it helps me win the argument or not – as I can see merit in pretty much any combination. Additionally, what do you think Eddie Jones thinks is England's best back three?

Omeprazole

Posts : 3
Join date : 2019-02-12

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by LondonTiger on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 2:55 pm

Omeprazole wrote:I am currently involved in an argument about who England’s best back three are. I am arguing that our Ireland set up of Nowell, May and Daly is the best we can do. However, with Ashton being favoured for France and Watson and Cokanasiga hopefully back for the World Cup, it might not be as simple as that. I just think that my favoured back three has balance (albeit perhaps lacking in aerial skills).

Interested to get another perspective on this – whether it helps me win the argument or not – as I can see merit in pretty much any combination. Additionally, what do you think Eddie Jones thinks is England's best back three?
 Merged this thread.

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 18982
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by Omeprazole on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 2:59 pm

Thanks

Can see the merit in leaving Nowell out for Watson with Daly shifting to the wing, but Nowell does something that the others don't. That being said, we didn't seem to miss him too much on Sunday.

Omeprazole

Posts : 3
Join date : 2019-02-12

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by BamBam on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 3:07 pm

Fit and firing, I think Daly, May and Watson are the three best players we can put out in the back 3, but Nowell, Cokanasiga, Ashton and Brown all have particular skill sets that can be very useful

I would love to see Watson take the FB shirt and allow Daly to go back on the wing, that would give us 3 guys who are all capable in the air, excellent counter attackers and Daly has the boot. They're all lightning quick too which helps!

Then I'd want to see 2 of the other 4 in the squad for the RWC, I think Nowell is too good to leave out and can fill in at FB in an emergency, while Cokanasiga offers the big winger game.

Its harsh on Brown and Ashton, but its such a competitive area for us. If Watson is out I think Brown may well be in, I would not want to be relying on Nowell as my back up full back

BamBam

Posts : 14777
Join date : 2011-03-17
Age : 29

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by GeordieFalcon on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 3:17 pm

it depends how Watson recovers.
Also, Cockasaniga is developing at a nice rate. The guy has some serious pace for a big guy aswell...and I actually thought he displayed some game intelligence in the Autumn game I saw...Ie good lines of running and support play.

Id go for..

11 May
14 Nowell
15 Daly

22 Cockasaniga

But Coka could well make a starting spot his own if he can show that he can play an intelligent, link and support running game,  as well as a hulk smash type.

Watson is a watch this space. See how he looks after he comes back...will these ops affect his game?

GeordieFalcon

Posts : 20686
Join date : 2011-03-31
Location : Newcastle

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by BamBam on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 3:19 pm

Think it was achilles injuries that Watson suffered? For a player who relies on explosive pace and aerial ability it could very well affect his game.

BamBam

Posts : 14777
Join date : 2011-03-17
Age : 29

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by Omeprazole on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 3:53 pm

What about Daly into 13 and having Nowell, May and Watson?

Omeprazole

Posts : 3
Join date : 2019-02-12

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by dummy_half on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 3:57 pm

Omeprazole wrote:What about Daly into 13 and having Nowell, May and Watson?

But that means leaving out Slade, who has really come into his own in the last couple of games as a secondary play maker. Also have JJ potentially coming back into contention at 13 and the possibility of a Ford-Farrell-Manu midfield.

If Daly can continue to develop as a full back, we have lots of options. So many tha tperhaps Nowell should consider converting to a number 7 Wink

dummy_half

Posts : 4765
Join date : 2011-03-11
Age : 47
Location : East Hertfordshire

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by GeordieFalcon on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 4:20 pm

I think even if he plays a lot at 13 for Saracnes, jones has him earmarked for 15.

Didn't someone on here show the stats that actually Daly has barely started a game for wasps at 15 anyway so hopefully not an issue.


GeordieFalcon

Posts : 20686
Join date : 2011-03-31
Location : Newcastle

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by LondonTiger on Tue 12 Feb 2019, 4:28 pm

He started 2 games early this season, then virtually nothing since his early days, when he did play there quite a lot. Pretty sure he played wing for England before ever doing it for Wasps (and his inexperience was highlighted when he was sent off against Argentina).

Not too sure how much Eddie cares about post WC.

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 18982
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by GeordieFalcon on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 8:06 am

Im not sure Eddie cares about club positions and a lot of other things LT.

GeordieFalcon

Posts : 20686
Join date : 2011-03-31
Location : Newcastle

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by Ricardo74 on Thu 14 Feb 2019, 8:46 am

When I've seen Big Joe play for Bath, some of the finishes he has conjured up leave me wondering if any of the other wingers / backfield players mentioned would be able to produce it. The level of athleticism and awareness of the line - particularly the one he scored against Harlequins earlier in the season - offer a serious point of difference from the other guys.

Would I pick him to start, though? Headscratch

May and Daly have to play. The third... sod it, yes, I would play him. Nowell on the bench (honestly, I've never rated Nowell, although he does keep proving me wrong) to cover wing, FB and centre at a push, although you could shift Daly in if needed. Watson? Proper quality, but depends on how he comes back from the operations and the layoff. Ashton? Runs brilliant support lines and showed a deft touch with the boot on Saturday; not enough of a point of difference to make the starting XV, nor enough versatility to make the bench.

So yes: May, Daly and Cokanasiga.

Ricardo74

Posts : 34
Join date : 2019-02-07

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 14 Feb 2019, 10:19 am

Watson coming back fit and on the sort of form he had 2-3 years ago would fundamentally change things, but May Daly Nowell is the obvious first choice combination right now.
Brown on the bench gives them a lot of flexibility.

There have been a number of changes made in the last couple of years, but many have been down to injury. Theres 5 core players who have largely been stuck by when available as part of the match day squad throughout Jones' tenure. Ashton and Cokanasiga could both make a case for world cup squad inclusion, but I dont see either as regular starters. Rodukini and Solomna are way out of the picture now short of an injury crisis, cant see the lad from Gloucester forcing his way in either really.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4021
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by Sharkey06 on Fri 15 Feb 2019, 1:23 pm

Daly still doesn't convince me under the high ball, but his run for the opening try against France and his siege gun boot do catch the eye. I would prefer to see him on the wing or at 13 to 15. I think the Welsh game could be a good measure for him, as I am sure they will target him with quite a few kicks with Davies/North/Biggar in his face. if he comes through that then hats off to him.

Nowell is Mr solid but doesn't score enough tries as a winger. Looks useful cover as 15 or 13.

May seems to have silenced most of the doubters - solid under the high ball, defensively solid and electric in attack. Is now first name on the team sheet?

If and of course it is a big if with the injury run he has had, Watson is good under the high ball and has electric pace going forward.

Ashton is the try poacher/finisher and that is about all he offers. Defensively ok (he has certainly improved) - not a great kicker, not a great carrier.

Cokanasiga is the great 'white' hope. He is the big, powerful winger we have been missing since Ben Cohen retired. This world cup may come a bit early, but he gives us something our other wingers don't and has finished off some half chances spectacularly.

So I would be pretty excited with a Watson, May & Cokanasiga back 3, with Daly competing for the 13 shirt and Nowell as cover. Chances of seeing a first choice back 3 with injuries, etc is unlikely though.

Sharkey06

Posts : 36
Join date : 2018-07-06

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by TightHEAD on Fri 15 Feb 2019, 1:52 pm

What a lovely headache to have if all are fit and in form.
TightHEAD
TightHEAD

Posts : 3858
Join date : 2014-09-25
Location : USK - TMO in training.

Back to top Go down

Re: The English Back Three Conundrum

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum