The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Page 2 of 10 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next

Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Wed 13 Feb 2019, 11:25 am

First topic message reminder :

It’s a little early for separate World Cup and Ashes threads, but with the Windies giving England less wins than they might have liked, what confidence had been gained from Sri Lanka has been drained.

If anything, it feels like there were less questions in summer than there are now, with the top three even less secure, Curran’s away showings looking unconvincing so far and some questions around  places for Bairstow, Foakes and pace of Wood or similar. 

There’s also a World Cup coming, a home World Cup, something England have been building towards for quite some time. They’re a very good team, maybe better than any England World Cup team, but there’s a few issues.

It’s also worth noting opponents, although I can’t see anyone getting more discussion than the Aussies. They’ve recovered from defeat to win a home series against a very weak Sri Lanka. Their tails are up, and they could welcome back their two bets batsmen. Could, as morals might well make that a little difficult. They don’t have many here, though, so it will depend just how much of a tit Warner is in the meantime.

Dolphin Ziggler
Dolphin
Dolphin

Posts : 21924
Join date : 2012-03-01
Age : 30
Location : Wollongong

Back to top Go down


The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Tue 26 Mar 2019, 8:33 am

guildfordbat wrote:A score of 251 for Ollie Pope in Surrey's match against a MCC side led by Stuart Broad in Dubai. That should keep the selectors interested.

Yeah also just mentioning I picked him as the top run scorer in the CC thread BEFORE THIS Very Happy

Its good to see hes got his confidence back, but a shame Burns (and Stoneman) failed. I cant see how he easily slots into the test team right now unless he starts showing he can do that at 3 (any chance Surrey would play him there? unlikely I would've thought) but it certainly is a good sign for the future. Even just showing he has the mentality to score big on those UAE type wickets where English batsmen have tended to get themselves out too easily is a good thing.

I just dont see England shifting from their current model enough to accommodate a recall for Pope at this point. Poor returns for the Lions are more likely to hold weight even if the upper middle batting was considered an area of concern. Even Burns couldnt get in till they ran out of alternatives on county runs alone, and Popes chance only came because of Stokes' issues and Moeen unselectability at that time.

A sign hes continuing in the right direction, but I dont see him getting much of a sniff beyond reserves this summer.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by guildfordbat on Tue 26 Mar 2019, 9:59 pm

Hi Goose - I don't disagree with any of that about Pope. Tbf, I did say his double-ton would keep the selectors interested rather getting him a recall now.

Meanwhile, a century for Sibley today who continues in the morning alongside Westley. Both will also have hopes of attracting the selectors' eyes this summer ....

guildfordbat

Posts : 12786
Join date : 2011-04-07

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by sirfredperry on Wed 27 Mar 2019, 9:24 am

I see Bancroft has been made Durham captain. Just what kind of message does this send out? That it's OK to cheat? In fact, if you do you'll not only - eventually - be able to play again, you'll be given a responsible position?

Also think that Warner should never have been allowed to play for Australia again after what happened. I do hope English crowds give him the reception he deserves this summer.

sirfredperry

Posts : 3922
Join date : 2011-02-14
Age : 68
Location : London

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 27 Mar 2019, 1:03 pm

Im sure the "crowd" of 10 at Chester Le Street will make them selves as vocal as is possible at their age

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 29 Mar 2019, 9:12 am

More "Im not saying it couldnt happen" noises regarding Cook from Essex this morning.

Still seems more a press story than one from him or England, but if he gets off to a good start in the CC its not beyond possible. The Vince nonsense shows the dearth of options England have in the top 3, and a short termist pick makes more sense right now than some of the ones that have been made in recent years.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 29 Mar 2019, 11:12 am

I hope they let Cook enjoy his semi-retirement. While he may be the best opener available to us, I would hate to see his reputation tarnished.

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 19865
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 29 Mar 2019, 11:41 am

LondonTiger wrote:I hope they let Cook enjoy his semi-retirement. While he may be the best opener available to us, I would hate to see his reputation tarnished.

Which is essentially what he himself has said.
Theres zero indication that England have actively approached him or would, but at the same time theyve always made it clear they didnt exactly push him and that it was his choice to retire. So the door is open if he wants to go through it.
His own statement was that he wouldnt rule it out, but as with his decision to retire it would be contingent on him feeling he could do the job justice to his former standards and could actually be bothered with all the hard focus that entails. He wasnt sure he had it in him, if he was he wouldnt have retired.
The same is evident from ten Deoschetes comments, if Cook wants to play for England Essex would be happy to support him. But it has to come form him, and England wouldnt select him if he wasnt showing some kind of form to justify it.

It again largely is the press just asking questions to people to make a story, but they are consistently getting the same script. Cooks retirement is not assumed to be 100% permanent, but he would only put himself forward for selection if he felt he could do the job justice.

Kind of the opposite of Vince whos putting himself forward as an opener because the competition is even worse than he might be Rolling Eyes

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Nathaniel Jacobs on Fri 29 Mar 2019, 12:12 pm

Cook should look at what happened to Tendulkar before making any decision on a potential return. It’s always better to retire with the fans wanting more than staying around and becoming a burden on the side.

Tendulkar literally hung around for 18-24 months too long and was a shell of his previous self. Obviously Cook’s not in the same class as Tendulkar as batsman or skill wise. That’s why a return could be made to look worst.

Stay retired. Enjoy the family life.

Nathaniel Jacobs

Posts : 1363
Join date : 2016-12-17

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Apr 2019, 8:52 am

Roy and Foakes ( Shocked ) are the latest to "come out" in the press as players targeting the top 3 for the Ashes. Roy we kinda knew about, but Foakes whilst weve discussed at length how many of us see him as a potential England player down the order is a bit of a stretch at 3. Mind with Pope too perhaps England could just pick the entire Surrey batting order at 3 and hope noone notices (lets face it they will get out so fast it will seem like one wicket) and also give someone else a hope of winning the CC.

Cook has responded to being chucked under the media bandwagon by his captain by categorically denying that hes ever going to play for England again......unless he does. Its like hes trying to negotiate a Brexit deadline.

Most of the core England contingent in the IPL are showing some decent returns so far, notably Curran with 6 wickets for 63 so far and being used as an opening batsman in one game, and Bairstow currently second in the "smart stats" batting rankings. Moeen though is continuing to do little with the bat and is hasnt produced wickets or economy with the ball. Cant really read too much into 4 silly league T20 games but should be raising more questions about him and his pretty awful ODI record.
Archer too has been decent and continues to make a case for the world cup squad.
Billings, Denly, Willey, yet to play so its increasingly hard to see where they can make a case for the squad. The surprise IPL picks of Livingstone and Gurney have unsurprisingly not played either but wouldn't be troubling the England selectors either way.
Curran is probably the one player whos really got a chance of lifting his stock noticeably here, Ive always been a bit of a sceptic but he clearly can trouble the best batsmen in the world in limited overs cricket, and is would be even more dangerous with the Dukes ball at home. (Also going back to earlier comment maybe he could bat at 3 for England in tests with the rest of Surrey? )

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 03 Apr 2019, 9:36 am

Mark Wood to miss Durham’s opening game of the season with injury

(Imagine my surprise)
Good Golly I'm Olly
Good Golly I'm Olly

Posts : 45806
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 23
Location : Chris Woakes's wardrobe

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by LondonTiger on Wed 03 Apr 2019, 10:00 am

Gooseberry wrote:Willey, yet to play 

He has forfeited his IPL place to be close to home as his wife has a difficult pregnancy.

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 19865
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Jetty on Thu 04 Apr 2019, 4:16 pm

Gooseberry wrote:Roy and Foakes ( Shocked ) are the latest to "come out" in the press as players targeting the top 3 for the Ashes. Roy we kinda knew about, but Foakes whilst weve discussed at length how many of us see him as a potential England player down the order is a bit of a stretch at 3. Mind with Pope too perhaps England could just pick the entire Surrey batting order at 3 and hope noone notices (lets face it they will get out so fast it will seem like one wicket) and also give someone else a hope of winning the CC.

Cook has responded to being chucked under the media bandwagon by his captain by categorically denying that hes ever going to play for England again......unless he does. Its like hes trying to negotiate a Brexit deadline.

Most of the core England contingent in the IPL are showing some decent returns so far, notably Curran with 6 wickets for 63 so far and being used as an opening batsman in one game, and Bairstow currently second in the "smart stats" batting rankings. Moeen though is continuing to do little with the bat and is hasnt produced wickets or economy with the ball. Cant really read too much into 4 silly league T20 games but should be raising more questions about him and his pretty awful ODI record.
Archer too has been decent and continues to make a case for the world cup squad.
Billings, Denly, Willey, yet to play so its increasingly hard to see where they can make a case for the squad. The surprise IPL picks of Livingstone and Gurney have unsurprisingly not played either but wouldn't be troubling the England selectors either way.
Curran is probably the one player whos really got a chance of lifting his stock noticeably here, Ive always been a bit of a sceptic but he clearly can trouble the best batsmen in the world in limited overs cricket, and is would be even more dangerous with the Dukes ball at home. (Also going back to earlier comment maybe he could bat at 3 for England in tests with the rest of Surrey? )

I'd love Curran to try the no 3 spot. He learns pretty fast and is only 20. He opened against MCCU once and in another game v Gloucs in 2015 where he batted at 3, second top scorer. In that game Foakes batted at 4 and scored 140*

Jetty

Posts : 209
Join date : 2011-06-01

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 05 Apr 2019, 9:25 am

Curran at 3 in any format for England is a hell of a stretch for the short to medium term. Limited overs they already have one too many top order specialists demanding a place and plenty of others (Denly included) who would be pressing in most sides.
test wise they do have an awful problem, but Currans very much a bowler who bats a bit and to my knowledge hasnt played any red ball cricket in the top 5 at a high level. Nor is he likely to get the opportunity at Surrey who have stacks of batting talent, even Foakes who does bat top 6 isnt likely to get the opportunity to show what he could do there. Or develope. Batting at 2 as a pinch hitter in IPL doesnt make Narine a test number 3, it wont make Curran one either. Im assuming you meant this, but hes not likely to get that chance to bat up the order in red ball cricket and several years away from getting the opportunity for England even if he does have the ability to learn and is up for it. He hasnt ever scored a century in any professional cricket, and scores the vast majority of his red ball runs in boundaries...pretty much the exact opposite of what England need from a top 3 batsman right now. Which isnt to say it wont ever happen, but not something Id expect is on anyones radar for this summer even at county level (Usual caveat about Bayliss and off the wall selections)
Looks like Pope will be batting 4 for Surrey this season, which is good for him and exactly what he needs top kick on. He was picked way too soon for England and chucked under a bus which had fallen in the deep end of a swimming pool at 3, it really exposed the difference between the level of pressure and what you can get away with batting down the order in county cricket (even more so when backed up by a strong batting line up and at a home ground that yielded more runs than any other last season) and being in at the top of the order in a fragile scared batting lineup in a high profile test series against a top class bowling attack. If he continues this summer the way he did last and doesnt let his England experiences dent him (they were super supportive and almost apologetic about dropping him) then batting up the order should be another step on his development as a possible future 3/4 for the test team but I do think this summer is still too early for him to slot into the side whilst the only slots available are 1-3.
The way England are talking they, rightly, are purely focused on finding players who could hack it as openers at test level. They do seem very open minded on who that could be, as they need to be given the dearth of talent. But if a players not playing there for their county and/or doesnt havent significant past pedigree there they really shouldnt be just trying to force random bowlers in there or young batsmen who scored runs at 6.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by VTR on Fri 05 Apr 2019, 4:58 pm

Where the hell has Curran at 3 come from as an idea? The guy is a counterattacking lower order batsman, which is valuable, but as far off being a Test number 3 as Jimmy Anderson is. Blimey, even Darren Gough could smack a few lower order runs at one time, but I don't remember him being touted as a 3, though there were no Internet message boards back then so you never know

VTR

Posts : 3408
Join date : 2012-03-23
Location : Fine Leg

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 05 Apr 2019, 5:17 pm

VTR wrote:Where the hell has Curran at 3 come from as an idea? The guy is a counterattacking lower order batsman, which is valuable, but as far off being a Test number 3 as Jimmy Anderson is. Blimey, even Darren Gough could smack a few lower order runs at one time, but I don't remember him being touted as a 3, though there were no Internet message boards back then so you never know

I was about to say it was Jetty but then I realised Id made a joke at the end of my post above his regarding Foakes' claim he wants to play 3 for england.

TBF at least one person did semi seriously suggest something along those lines during the India and SL series.

But yes its silly. But no more silly than those who keep backing Vince as the new Ian Bell Whistle

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by VTR on Fri 05 Apr 2019, 7:42 pm

Yes I was addressing Jetty of course. What's the obsession with trying to put anyone who can vaguely score a few runs up the order. Even Bayliss now realises it doesn't work. Middle/lower order players are just that and we have some very good ones, who aren't about to be become good number 3s.

VTR

Posts : 3408
Join date : 2012-03-23
Location : Fine Leg

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 05 Apr 2019, 8:44 pm

Joe Clarke, at 22, now has 14 first class hundreds. Surely on the radar come the summer
Good Golly I'm Olly
Good Golly I'm Olly

Posts : 45806
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 23
Location : Chris Woakes's wardrobe

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by JDizzle on Fri 05 Apr 2019, 9:24 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Joe Clarke, at 22, now has 14 first class hundreds. Surely on the radar come the summer

All depends on how dimly he is viewed in the corridors of power for his WhatsApp antics that emerged over the winter I guess. On talent and weight of runs, he is right in the mix.

JDizzle

Posts : 4779
Join date : 2011-03-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Jetty on Sun 07 Apr 2019, 12:16 am

VTR wrote:Yes I was addressing Jetty of course. What's the obsession with trying to put anyone who can vaguely score a few runs up the order. Even Bayliss now realises it doesn't work. Middle/lower order players are just that and we have some very good ones, who aren't about to be become good number 3s.

I guess I just want him in the team.
I think Wood will be the 3rd seamer for the Ashes. Don't how many overs his body will last for. Maybe Curran will get some Tests and if a nightwatchman is needed we can see...

Jetty

Posts : 209
Join date : 2011-06-01

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Duty281 on Sun 07 Apr 2019, 7:32 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Joe Clarke, at 22, now has 14 first class hundreds. Surely on the radar come the summer

Heading for another ton in Notts' second knock.

Also Root and Broad finding some form. Hildreth not doing likewise.

Duty281

Posts : 19127
Join date : 2011-06-06
Age : 23
Location : Not having Chance on here

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Mat on Sun 07 Apr 2019, 11:30 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Joe Clarke, at 22, now has 14 first class hundreds. Surely on the radar come the summer

Should have been on it before this summer tbf. But like JDizzle, depends on the whatsapp stuff with Hepburn, re-trial is this month I think.

Mat
6CW Creative

Posts : 4730
Join date : 2011-01-27
Age : 25
Location : Malvern

http://twitter.com/#!/DiMattEvansWBA

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Mon 08 Apr 2019, 8:03 am

Close to another century in the second innings but honestly the biggest issue he's going to have is batting at 4, England are likely to tinker with their 4-7 in the short term. He didn't make the most of his chances with the Lions previously either.
Duckett also made a decent number of runs ...as an opener. But another one who managed to bin his own career just when he was getting going.
Northeast possibly in the same bracket ...big score from him but again it's going to be hard for mid order players to force their way in.

Then again the CC is showing its "quality" with aging "giants" of the game like Bopara looking like Don Bradman and a 37 year old Fidel Edwards being the new Darren Stevens.

Gubbins and Malan who were both close to call ups for the winter have struggled in their D2 game.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Apr 2019, 3:11 pm

HAMEED
Good Golly I'm Olly
Good Golly I'm Olly

Posts : 45806
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 23
Location : Chris Woakes's wardrobe

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Fri 12 Apr 2019, 3:37 pm

Don't get too excited yet Olly ...even Jennings managed over 50.
It's division 2.

But another step for him, he's at least back in existence and worth picking for his county.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 12 Apr 2019, 5:23 pm

Let one dream Goose, let one dream
Good Golly I'm Olly
Good Golly I'm Olly

Posts : 45806
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 23
Location : Chris Woakes's wardrobe

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Nathaniel Jacobs on Fri 12 Apr 2019, 5:45 pm

Somewhat surreal to think this was Hameed’s first 1st class hundred since 2016 and all of 66 innings ago. On that occasion he scored a hundred in each innings against Yorkshire.

Nathaniel Jacobs

Posts : 1363
Join date : 2016-12-17

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by robbo277 on Sun 14 Apr 2019, 9:59 pm

Good hundred for Hameed to put himself in contention. Runs for Burns and Root and decent returns for Anderson, Broad and Leach on the bowling side as well.

robbo277

Posts : 3863
Join date : 2011-06-06
Age : 30
Location : Brighton, England

https://twitter.com/#!/robbo277

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by guildfordbat on Mon 15 Apr 2019, 8:31 am

robbo277 wrote:Good hundred for Hameed to put himself in contention. Runs for Burns and Root and decent returns for Anderson, Broad and Leach on the bowling side as well.

Another opener I've mentioned before and still pushing to get himself in the frame is Warks' Dom Sibley. He's now scored a century in each of his last five first-class matches going back to three in September last season.

That said, I'm not his greatest fan - I didn't like the circumstances in which he left Surrey and, more importantly, I feel his slow footwork against the pace of Test bowlers will expose his tendency to be dismissed struck on the pads in front. However, weight of runs at the top of the order is his best argument.

guildfordbat

Posts : 12786
Join date : 2011-04-07

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Mon 15 Apr 2019, 9:06 am

Openers seem to be making a much better start to this season than they did last which is encouraging.
But I'm still going to be sceptical about the quality of the CC as a proving ground.
The warks pair played for the Lions this winter didn't they? I don't know too much about the ins and outs of sibleys departure but you can hardly blame him as he'd be so far down the pecking order and it's surely better for England he's playing.
I would've thought this summer is still too soon, but all this will be putting the "Cooks never said never" stories to bed

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by jimbohammers on Tue 16 Apr 2019, 2:08 pm

1 player I'd like to throw into the mix for the world cup squad is Lewis Gregory. Disappointed he doesn't even seem to be on the radar of the selectors.

jimbohammers

Posts : 2381
Join date : 2011-05-04

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by guildfordbat on Tue 16 Apr 2019, 2:54 pm

jimbohammers wrote:1 player I'd like to throw into the mix for the world cup squad is Lewis Gregory. Disappointed he doesn't even seem to be on the radar of the selectors.

Hi Jimbo - I do know that Gregory was very highly thought of by the England camp (including by your new coach at Hants, Adrian Birrell) when he was playing for the under 19s a few years back. His lack of pace has probably since counted against him but, as you say, it does seem strange that he now appears to be totally off the radar.

guildfordbat

Posts : 12786
Join date : 2011-04-07

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Duty281 on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 11:30 am

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/apr/17/jofra-archer-left-out-england-world-cup-squad-cricket

Archer doesn't make the prelim World Cup squad, but is in the squad to face Pakistan and Ireland.

Duty281

Posts : 19127
Join date : 2011-06-06
Age : 23
Location : Not having Chance on here

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by JDizzle on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 11:34 am

They are just managing the Archer situation I think, not parachuting him straight in with no caps. I fully expect him to be in the final squad for the WC.

Gregory did go on the Lions tour to India over the winter, so he is there or thereabouts. Would like to see him get a T20 game over the summer.

JDizzle

Posts : 4779
Join date : 2011-03-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 11:39 am

Yep makes sense for me - gives Archer a chance to impress in the early ODIs and we can decide from there.

I wouldn't rule out Jordan displacing someone too - can we honestly say David Willey is better? Not based on recent international performances I wouldn't
Good Golly I'm Olly
Good Golly I'm Olly

Posts : 45806
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 23
Location : Chris Woakes's wardrobe

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 1:06 pm

I see Willeys competition as Sam Curran. Both got their cvhances because they are left armers and the variety that offers. Jordan doesnt give that, notr can he bat (despite people still insiting he can) hes only passed 50 once in List A / 20 over cricket.
Its hard to see where Jordan fits into the side when everyones fit unless you genuinely consider him one of the best 3 bowlers. Archer at least had some genuine pace as a point of difference and will be competing with Wood, Plunkett and Tom Curran. I accept that Plunkett hasd lost some of his zip but still
Id argue hes getting his chances in these games as a reserve and because so many of the squad will be off doing other things, not because they are genuinely looking at him as a potential first choice squad member. Same goes for Billings and Vince.

Im also interested to see that England, in thew absence of Moeen, are taking Denly as the second spinner. These games in Paksitan the middle East will give him a good chance to show off his bowling skills. Going full Nathaniel lets not forget how awful Moeens ODI record is, and how rank his form with the bat in all formats has been since his recall. Denly has the opportunity to show if hes an international class spinner and pressure for a starting spot, theres certainly no question hes the better of the two with the bat. (Worth noting that Moeens finally had a good game in the IPL though) The three spinners are pretty much garunteed to be in the final 15 though.

The make up of these squads does somewhat temper Woakes' and Woods' remarks yesterday, presumably the team were aware of the plan when these were made. Archer is being made to earn his place, and not just being chucked straight on the plane. The pressure is there for everyone to be on their a game and justify being in the final 15 whilst still showing loyalty to the squad thats been so successful over the past few years.


Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by king_carlos on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 1:07 pm

Jordan's value in T20 tends to come from building pressure by keeping things tight in the powerplay and then of course his consistent death bowling.

The issue I've always had with Jordan in 50 over cricket is where you fit his 10 overs in? He's still good at the death in 50 over cricket but do you want to give him the new ball where wickets are early wickets are vital if there's any swing? Then whenever he bowled in the middle overs he tended to be pretty average.

He's a very useful cricketer given when adding in his often breathtaking fielding but I do feel that England have better in ODIs.

king_carlos

Posts : 3967
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Work toilet

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by king_carlos on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 1:11 pm

Interesting squad for the Pakistan and Ireland game:

Eoin Morgan (captain), Jofra Archer, Sam Billings, Tom Curran, Joe Denly, Chris Jordan, Alex Hales, Liam Plunkett, Adil Rashid, Joe Root, Jason Roy, James Vince, David Willey, Mark Wood

No Buttler or Bairstow means that Billings will keep. Archer will surely play to get experience which leaves a possible side off....

1.Roy
2.Hales
3.Root
4.Vince
5.Morgan
6.Billings (wk)
7.Denly
8.Archer
9.Curran/Willey
10.Rashid
11.Wood

king_carlos

Posts : 3967
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Work toilet

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 1:23 pm

king_carlos wrote:Jordan's value in T20 tends to come from building pressure by keeping things tight in the powerplay and then of course his consistent death bowling.

The issue I've always had with Jordan in 50 over cricket is where you fit his 10 overs in? He's still good at the death in 50 over cricket but do you want to give him the new ball where wickets are early wickets are vital if there's any swing? Then whenever he bowled in the middle overs he tended to be pretty average.

He's a very useful cricketer given when adding in his often breathtaking fielding but I do feel that England have better in ODIs.

Onboard with that, but for the trip to the UAE is there anyone being left out youd have ahead of him (bearing in mind Woakes, Stokes and other Curran are playing IPL)? And if theres a couple of injuries anyone else youd see pushing to be in the frame for the squad? Hes doen a very good job in the T20 opportunities he was given recently, I was dissapointed to see him ( and Billings) selected again for pointless games but he has done enough to prove me wrong on that.

I genuinely dont see him, Billings or Vince as anything other than injury squad reserves for the world cup, but its not bad that they are in this squad IMO.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by king_carlos on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 4:21 pm

Gooseberry wrote:
king_carlos wrote:Jordan's value in T20 tends to come from building pressure by keeping things tight in the powerplay and then of course his consistent death bowling.

The issue I've always had with Jordan in 50 over cricket is where you fit his 10 overs in? He's still good at the death in 50 over cricket but do you want to give him the new ball where wickets are early wickets are vital if there's any swing? Then whenever he bowled in the middle overs he tended to be pretty average.

He's a very useful cricketer given when adding in his often breathtaking fielding but I do feel that England have better in ODIs.

Onboard with that, but for the trip to the UAE is there anyone being left out youd have ahead of him (bearing in mind Woakes, Stokes and other Curran are playing IPL)? And if theres a couple of injuries anyone else youd see pushing to be in the frame for the squad? Hes doen a very good job in the T20 opportunities he was given recently, I was dissapointed to see him ( and Billings) selected again for pointless games but he has done enough to prove me wrong on that.

I genuinely dont see him, Billings or Vince as anything other than injury squad reserves for the world cup, but its not bad that they are in this squad IMO.
I'd agree with that, Goose. I was more talking about Jordan pushing the World Cup squad than those two games.

The majority of young seamers that have been around the Lions and England squads over the last couple of seasons are better in first class than one day. Jamie Porter, Olly Stone, Craig Overton, Jamie Overton, Josh Tongue and Tom Bailey all fall into that bracket.

Lewis Gregory could have been an option but hasn't blown the door down in domestic one day games.

Toby Roland-Jones has a good one day record but he's better off with Middlesex getting overs under his belt following injury. He's also yet to show real form since returning, which is unsurprising after a serious injury.

If I wanted to be a real pedant, I could argue that England could have selected one fewer seamer in the squad and given another spinner some overs. If Rashid were to get injured then a key cog in that England side is difficult to replace. Danny Briggs and Stephen Parry are very consistent domestic performers. Even then it seems England have settled on bits-n-pieces spinners as there back-ups hence Denly in the squad.

To sum up that babble, I agree that Jordan is a solid option against Pakistan and Ireland.

king_carlos

Posts : 3967
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Work toilet

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 4:50 pm

Interesting point regarding the spinners. But Denly is another leggie and in recent years domestically has been a good attacking option. Hes shown in the T20s he could be a force internationally too. Also worth noting that Rashid started life as a batsman bowler.
To me Denly is an ideal squad option, he could cover the spinner allrounder role for Moeen and cover Rashids attacking legspin role. Yes a Rashid Denly combination would lose the variety of Moeen, but Root also provides and orthodox option. Also acts as a reserve top 5 batsman.
It will be interesting to see how hes used in these games and hopefully will get a chance to bowl a fair bit.

Ultimately if the third choice spinner is englands biggest worry that means they are in a good place.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by king_carlos on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 5:32 pm

Rashid is a key man for me. The batting has abundant power and depth, the seam attack is solid with different options. The seam attack is by no means stellar as it's missing a real wicket taker such as Starc but it should fare well in home conditions.

Rashid has become England's go to man in the middle overs though which are so important. He keeps things tight and takes key wickets, breaking partnerships.

I'm not sure that Denly and Root turning their arms over would replace that. Likewise I think Moeen would struggle without the partnership he has with Rashid. English conditions, especially under floodlights, when the ball will turn less but skid on does suit Moeen well though to be fair.

king_carlos

Posts : 3967
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Work toilet

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 9:47 pm

Its a fair point but as a back up Denlys credentials, based on last years domestic limited overs performances anyway, are the equal of any specialist for a back up attacking spinner. I guess what Im driving at is that its not so much a case of a bits and pieces back up as a potential genuine all rounder attacking spinner. Its not like they are leaving Shane Warne out anyway.
That doesnt mean that an injury to Rashid wouldnt hurt England, but you could say that for lead wicket taker for any side. England are in the process of managing out Plunket who for a couple of years was the main wicket taking seamer, he appears to be declining quickly ...todays performance in the RLC another sign hes lost it. I guess this just raises the stock for the likes of Archer if he can show he can bowl 10 accurate pacey overs.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by king_carlos on Wed 17 Apr 2019, 10:57 pm

Agree that it isn't a huge point without a standout option. Had Parkinson not been untimely injured he may well have been that back up leggie anyhow.

Plunkett has had a sudden drop in pace which was what he added to the England side. It is a worrying decline in performance currently. Especially worry for him with both Wood and Archer circling as pace bowlers.

king_carlos

Posts : 3967
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Work toilet

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 18 Apr 2019, 8:48 am

...but equally Woods resurgance (actually showing he can bowl fast rather than just being labelled a pace bowler then chucking it down in th high 80s) and Archer coming into the fold help mitigate for that decline. Tom Curran is also being groomed into that role, so pace bowling at leats has more depth than it perhaps has for some years. Stone was the other one who wouldve had chances in teh West Indies had he not got injured late. Sure none of them are quite a Pat Cummins but at least theres options.

I do feel both Willey and Plunkett are vulnerable for spots in that 15. Anyone who has been allowed to stay in IPL is clealry 100% for a spot on the plane bus. Woakes and Wood of course have ongoign injury concerns, so I guess there is a chance for everyone including Jordan. The lack of stand out stars in the seam bowling unit means England can ride out that uncertainty to some extent, and at least have a decent stable of experience to call on.

For me the three players who would be missed most from a starting 11 are Stokes, Root and Rashid. And I guess Morgan for his leadership. Ther rest have replacements who would be on some peoples starting team to begin with.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Thu 18 Apr 2019, 9:56 am

Gooseberry wrote:I see Willeys competition as Sam Curran.


....and its only just dawned on me hes actually not in any of the sqauds is he censored  
So they do have all the left arm eggs in the Willey basket still, which is perhaps surprising. It leaves them in the odd situation where Sams arguably first reserve for the test team but is off playing in the IPL instead of being around for early season first class games and RLC. Hes also doing terribly out there.

All in its hard to see how he forces a way into the squad when he was a bit part player in the Winter ODIs and didnt do well with the limited chance he got.
So I was talking nonsesne, the biggest challenge to Willey is England being happy to not have a left arm seamer in the squad. Checking his record altrhough he didnt get an ODI over the winter and was dropped half way through the India series he actually had a pretty good summer last year with the ball (and decent with the bat too), and was devastating in the 2nd and 3rd T20s in the Windies. Maybe a spare part but perahps less of a surprise to see named in the 15 than his recent exclussions would suggest. Being around for the warm ups gives him a chance to prove the decision to leave Sam Curran out of consideration was correct even if he ends up bench warming for the cup.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by LondonTiger on Thu 18 Apr 2019, 11:10 am

king_carlos wrote:Interesting squad for the Pakistan and Ireland game:

Eoin Morgan (captain), Jofra Archer, Sam Billings, Tom Curran, Joe Denly, Chris Jordan, Alex Hales, Liam Plunkett, Adil Rashid, Joe Root, Jason Roy, James Vince, David Willey, Mark Wood

No Buttler or Bairstow means that Billings will keep. Archer will surely play to get experience which leaves a possible side off....

1.Roy
2.Hales
3.Root
4.Vince
5.Morgan
6.Billings (wk)
7.Denly
8.Archer
9.Curran/Willey
10.Rashid
11.Wood


It should be noted that this squad only covers the T20 game out of those with Pakistan. The IPL mob of Ali, Bairstow, Buttler, Stokes and Woakes return for the ODIs.

Most press commentators seem to be taking it as read that there will be a change to the provisional 15 named for marketing reasons. Plunkett seems the most vulnerable to me.

I am currently scheduled to see the 5th ODI at Headingley. Will be my first ODI for over a decade, and also first since I stopped drinking! Being surrounded by a pile of drunken Tykes will be "interesting"

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 19865
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Gooseberry on Sat 20 Apr 2019, 7:31 am

Big news that Hales is sitting out the RLC for "personal reasons" with no set return date. Hes struggled a bit for form over the winter and been on the road a lot as a T20 mercenary.

Worrying ahead of the world cup.

Gooseberry

Posts : 4263
Join date : 2015-02-11

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Duty281 on Sat 20 Apr 2019, 1:48 pm

No timetable for his return either. Worrying times.

Duty281

Posts : 19127
Join date : 2011-06-06
Age : 23
Location : Not having Chance on here

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 20 Apr 2019, 5:19 pm

That is a shame - hopefully he can get himself right, because he’ll be a big miss as our reserve batsman, especially if Roy/Bairstow are out of form
Good Golly I'm Olly
Good Golly I'm Olly

Posts : 45806
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 23
Location : Chris Woakes's wardrobe

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 20 Apr 2019, 6:05 pm

Meanwhile, I've seen Plunkett a couple of times this season and he seems well down on pace. Been carted for sure.

In contrast, Tom Curran has been on the money and amongst the wickets.

guildfordbat

Posts : 12786
Join date : 2011-04-07

Back to top Go down

The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket - Page 2 Empty Re: The Build to England’s Summer of Cricket

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 2 of 10 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum