Ireland v France, 10th March 2018 15:00

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Ireland v France, 10th March 2018 15:00 Empty Ireland v France, 10th March 2018 15:00

Post by Collapse2005 on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 11:13 am

Ireland v France

Lansdowne Road
15:00 10th March 2019
Referee: Ben O’Keeffe (New Zealand)
Assistant 1: Angus Gardner (Australia)
Assistant 2: Karl Dickson (England)
TMO: Ben Skeen (New Zealand)

France Side, unchanged:
15. Thomas Ramos
14. Damien Penaud
13. Mathieu Bastareaud
12. Gael Fickou
11. Yoann Huget
10. Romain Ntamack
9. Antoine Dupont

1. Jefferson Poirot
2. Guilhem Guirado (captain)
3. Demba Bamba
4. Felix Lambey
5. Sebastien Vahaamahina
6. Wenceslas Lauret
7. Arthur Iturria
8. Louis Picamoles

Replacements:

16. Camille Chat
17. Etienne Falgoux
18. Dorian Aldegheri
19. Paul Willemse
20. Gregory Alldritt
21. Baptiste Serin
22. Anthony Belleau
23. Maxime Medard

Ireland side announced on Thursday at lunch time.

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Post by Pete330v2 on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 11:40 am

It's very early to announce a squad which'll give Joe plenty of time to decide which plan he'll pull out of his bag of tricks. Perhaps he's lost his bag, maybe that's been the problem Smile
No excuses, time to regain some mojo, Joe's got a brand new bag.....

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Post by majesticimperialman on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 12:32 pm

Well the last time France played they played some fine rugby. it was almost like watching the France teams of old...maybe it is the French who have got their mojo back.

I do expect Ireland to be fully prepared for this game. but i also think that France will fancy their chances against Ireland and will make it a close game.,,maybe closer than most of us think it could/should be.

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Post by rodders on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 12:42 pm

France actually looked good against Wales for 40 min, then just seemed to fall apart.

I think how Ireland play will be key, if they perform as they have in the opening 3 games they could be in trouble, as if France get sufficient ball they have the players to hurt Ireland.

However if they can cut out the errors and get a be quicker ruck ball I can see France eventually giving up the ghost away from home.

Ireland need a bonus point win to stay in the title race but more so need a dominant performance to get their season back on track.
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Post by bsando on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 12:54 pm

Really looking forward to this one but fully expect an Irish win. Think it may be a really entertaining game for the neutral though.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 12:55 pm

Yeah france did look decent in the first 40 v Wales then implosion.

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Post by maestegmafia on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 12:59 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:Yeah france did look decent in the first 40 v Wales then implosion.

Implosion isn’t what I would describe, more like Wales figures out how to nullify the french. Conditions were very poor that night. Howling wind torrential sleety rain and minus 4 temperatures. France Looked even better against the Scots last week. The french certainly have the ability to play well.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 1:00 pm

Ah would you stop. France scored Wales' tries for them. Yoy are right about the conditions though.

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Post by maestegmafia on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 1:05 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:Ah would you stop. France scored Wales' tries for them. Yoy are right about the conditions though.

That’s pretty harsh, Tomos Williams try we brilliant, Parkes kick putting pressure on Huget worked so well the following week England based their entire game plan on the same thing, as for George north, that was a seriously skilful interception that took a lot of bravery.

Home advantage is a factor but man for man this french team are not far off being a good side

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Post by Collapse2005 on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 1:07 pm

Pressure is for sure a factor but there were two total howlers from France. Wales are a much better team though so not contesting the result.

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Post by yappysnap on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 11:06 pm

Couple of articles in the Kiwi press about Sextons anger issues as a captain. Anything in this? He does come across angry and shouty, but I always thought it was a general thing rather then him shouting at his own players, but that seems to be what they're trying to imply. If he is shouting at his own team mates on the pitch then that's not cool imo, and can't be helping team moral at the moment.

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Post by theslosty on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 11:22 pm

There is something in it yappy. I don't mind Sexton's bit of edge but he completely lost it captaining Leinster down in Thomond around Christmas. Weirdly seemed to really have it in for Carbery that night, wasn't classy.
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Post by yappysnap on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 1:13 am

Yea the papers mentioned how he spoke to one of the wings on his debut against Italy? Perhaps it's just pressure of captaincy, some great players don't make good captains likewise some average players can be very good leaders.

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Post by rodders on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 9:52 am

Sexton is getting a bit of a rough time at the minute, I suppose when you are world player of the year people will want to knock you if you don't live up to the expected level.

Clearly he has very high expectations on himself and others that when things are going well keeps players from being complacent and to keep striving to get better, so that is a good thing in my opinion.

There are signs though recently and when at Racing that when the performances/results aren't going as well as expected he maybe isn't the best person to be around. As a senior player and vice captain I think he needs to keep a lid on his frustrations a bit more to set a better example to the younger players. He also needs to focus on his own performances, which are obviously below par and not be lashing out at others around him.

This is massive game that could define our season. A good win will give us a boost heading into super Saturday, a loss and we are looking down the barrel of a bottom half finish and a bit of crisis.

The 6 day turn around until the Wales game is a significant challenge too, Schmidt needs to win this but hold something in reserve for next week. The entire pack can't be expected to play Wales within a week of facing this massive French pack so we will have to use some level of rotation I think.
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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 10:38 am

Sexton hasn't just appeared. He's been around now a long time and so has that personality. He shouts at anything that moves. Mostly, I'd assume he shouts at himself in the mirror of his mind. The rages are mostly at himself but he projects quite a bit...and let's be honest, a lot of us do in our lives. We blame the externals when we know the problem is internal.
I don't have a problem with Sexton's personality or that he shouts at players around him. Most players that play with him will be used to it...it's how he is. Like I say, he didn't arrive yesterday and a lot of players have managed to play with him and thrive next to him.
His form is off.... understandably. He and the team are allegedly trying to find that form again. That kind of mood probably does need some yelps and screams both in games and training. But my issue with Sexton now is that he has to realise that now is not the right time for projecting his inner demons onto a team full of players with their own problems. Lots of players look under the weather. They have their own issues. Sexton should sense that he's one of the senior players needed now to MOTIVATE others back to better form. He should be back slapping and praising good stuff now, vocally and physically. He has to look at the needs of the team now and right now they need him to be less self critical and to aid the repairs as a team player.

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 10:42 am

Will Gats rotate between now and Ireland? He'll have his own hands full physically. That could develop into a beast of a game between them and Scotland.
This is the pressure cooker training that WC preparation probably requires - this next two weeks. Most of our rotation has been forced on us. If Joe find something that works against France (let's hope that it looks convincing) then I don't see him too willing to tinker with it too much against Wales.

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Post by rodders on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 10:49 am

SecretFly wrote:Will Gats rotate between now and Ireland?  

They have a 7 day turn around whereas we have 6. That put us at a significant disadvantage. Schmidt will need to keep some fresh legs for Wales particularly in the pack.

Personally I'd start Roux against France with Henderson on bench. The bring Henderson and Beirne in for Wales. Similarly he needs to rotate in the back row. I just don't think we can go with the same XV for both games.
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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 10:54 am

On Sexton again just for another bit.... Jury is out right now but this has the potential to be another micro managing master plan by Schmidt. He knows Sexton more than most, and he certainly knows all about those demons. So what better time to draw them out than now in a high pressure contest but one that Sexton now himself has gone past in his thoughts. "One last goal" he said.
So what happens when a temperamental player breaks down? All belief in self disappears, the rivals (Carbery) look way too close for comfort, you end up trying too hard... everything becomes a cloud of depression. And with the kind of character Sexton is, he has to go all the way to the bottom before the glimpses of light show. Bi-polar.
Schmidt has thrown an ill prepared Sexton to the lions - tough games, bloodthirsty and critical fans and media. It's getting as low as it can get for Sexton with the name Carbery mentioned as perhaps quicker than expected new number 1 choice. Drag him down so that he can see those lights early enough to be on the bounce back by November?

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:05 am

Ah I don't know about that old six day/seven day rugby lore. One of them will be spent playing bingo anyway! Wink.
But, yeah, I know players might feel they are getting a bum deal having one less day to do the two fat ladies stuff...but maybe one of our stats people here could do the numbers that finally proves a six day team always gets bamboozled and beat by a well rested seven day team. The theory might be proven a well versed fact but I tend to think it might be all balanced out and perhaps even the surprise finding that less time off is better! You know how you feel about going back to work after a longer lunch than usual? It's tougher to get the mind at it than if the break is shorter.

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Post by rodders on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:07 am

Sexton hasn't been that bad. I think he has in his mind the way he wants to play and isn't adapting to the fact he's getting slow ball.

Rather than drop deep and use a kicking game when the ball is bad, he's stubbornly taking the ball to the line and getting smashed, then getting frustrated.

Ireland aren't being helped by the fact the referees are not policing the breakdown and defences creeping offside but Sexton, and Murray, need to keep cooler heads than they have been.
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Post by rodders on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:12 am

SecretFly wrote:Ah I don't know about that old six day/seven day rugby lore.  

No I think its valid, it means using Monday rather than Sunday for recovery so preparation for the following game is one day behind. I think with a game of this importance it is pretty significant. Wales may get 2 full training sessions in to Ireland's one.
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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:17 am

It mucks up the training patterns... I still question whether it verifiably mucks up player readiness and team effectiveness on game day.

Anyway... I think if he gets a team to click physically and in a domineering way, then I think he will be unwilling to change much. BUT, I could be wrong of course. Future will tell.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:19 am

Yeah I agree they need to be a bit calmer. I think both Murray and Sexton can get a bit riled up although they are still good enough players that it doesn't impact that much. Part of that might be that targeting half backs for late hits isn't really a tactic in Ireland as much as it is in other countries.

England tend to look for late hits on the out half a lot when they pass the ball. NZ often blitz the scrum half at the base of a ruck early in games and concede a penalty in exchange for a free hit on a key player. Scotland have in the past tackled the scrum half after box kicks to rough them up. These are things I don't think Ireland have in their game plan and consistently low penalty counts reflect that.


Last edited by Collapse2005 on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:27 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:24 am

Murray has impressed me. He's way below his best, has always been a degree too slow for me with backs waiting to catch out broken up defensive lines...but he's certainly looked calmer than Sexton in knowing that he has to keep his mind on processes a he rebuilds his relationship with the oval ball in high pressure games. He's doing well for a player coming back into the heat and quality of this 6N. We still need a more biting 9 to take up more game time I feel but Murray is handling himself as best he can under the circumstances.

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Post by rodders on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:37 am

Yeah I don't agree fly, he's constantly looking at the referee to get penalties - the obvious example was getting stripped against Italy but at the base of the ruck he's very slow at digging the ball out, almost playing for penalties at times and needs to cut it out and get the ball away.
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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 11:49 am

Yeah, he's a Munster player, rodders...never denied it Wink.... i.e., cute hoor. It was a bonus point win away from home.

In other news, Brunel is saying nice enough things that might be pinned to an Irish dressing room wall. We're good but we were beaten well by England and he's watched the tapes to see where our weaknesses are. We're still 2nd in the world but things are changing fast... example Wales who now look invincible.
So that's Ireland's work.... to show France that England's game against them was only a taster of things to come and then go on and beat away yet another invincible team, and yet again disrupt another GS run of another 6N rival.
We have to show something in these next two games that proves we're still a contender at the top.

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Post by majesticimperialman on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 12:04 pm

rodders.

Ireland are not being helped by the referees. Seriously, are you say that the referees are discriminating against Ireland at the break down? Come on.

Ireland have not become a bad team this 6ns, they have not had the run of the ball, with the wrap around plays. because other teams have worked them ou

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 12:08 pm

They've not had Dev who can run around the run arounds when needed where air traffic control officiates the game.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 12:22 pm

majesticimperialman wrote:rodders.

Ireland are not being helped by the referees. Seriously, are you say that the referees are discriminating against Ireland at the break down? Come on.

Ireland have not become a bad team this 6ns, they have not had the run of the ball, with the wrap around plays. because other teams have worked them ou

I don't think "not being helped by referees" is the same thing as discrimination. The refs interpretation of the breakdown being a bit loose this year doesn't lend itself to Ireland's strengths. Likewise leniency re offside line etc.

In my view Ireland are a fraction off the pace across the board because of a good 2018. In particular our pack simply hasn't been physical enough and our ball carries have not been effective enough at getting over the gain line.

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Post by rodders on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 12:57 pm

majesticimperialman wrote:rodders.

Ireland are not being helped by the referees. Seriously, are you say that the referees are discriminating against Ireland at the break down? Come on.

Ireland have not become a bad team this 6ns, they have not had the run of the ball, with the wrap around plays. because other teams have worked them ou

Nope not being descriminated against but we have a particular style of play that depends on quick ball so the way the referees are letting player lie over the break down and defences steal a yard at the ruck is hurting us more than others.

The Welsh fly halves stand a lot deeper and England have kicked a lot more. We just haven't adapted well.
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Post by LondonTiger on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 2:38 pm

Ireland squad

Forwards: Rory Best (capt), Tadhg Beirne, Jack Conan, Ultan Dillane, Tadhg Furlong, Cian Healy, Iain Henderson, Rob Herring, Dave Kilcoyne, Jack McGrath, Jordi Murphy, Sean O'Brien, Peter O'Mahony, Andrew Porter, Quinn Roux, Rhys Ruddock, James Ryan, John Ryan, Niall Scannell, CJ Stander, Josh van der Flier

Backs: Bundee Aki, Ross Byrne, Joey Carbery, Jack Carty, Andrew Conway, John Cooney, Keith Earls, Chris Farrell, Tom Farrell, Rob Kearney, Jordan Larmour, Kieran Marmion, Conor Murray, Garry Ringrose, Jonathan Sexton, Jacob Stockdale


Ireland coach Joe Schmidt will name his match day squad on Friday.



Cronin left out I see.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 3:02 pm

Yeah Cronin doesn't seem to be a Schmidt favorite unless its as sub in the last 10 minutes.

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Post by rodders on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 4:47 pm

I fairness he didn't take his chance against Italy.

I actually think his RWC place is in jeopardy if Schmidt doesn't trust him to start games.
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Post by Collapse2005 on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 5:16 pm

According to Easterby today Cronin wasnt dropped they just want to give other guys time at the helm given that hooker is a specialist position and you therefore cant have players from other positions covering the 2 shirt.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 7:35 pm

Referee: Ben O’Keeffe (New Zealand)
Assistant 1: Angus Gardner (Australia)

You can expect controversy and some basic, incorrect decisions to go on in this match clap - too bad Glen Jackson isn't around to balance it out for you.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 7:38 pm

maestegmafia wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:Yeah france did look decent in the first 40 v Wales then implosion.

Implosion isn’t what I would describe, more like Wales figures out how to nullify the french. Conditions were very poor that night. Howling wind torrential sleety rain and minus 4 temperatures. France Looked even better against the Scots last week. The french certainly have the ability to play well.


Didn't you know maes? Each of our opposition in the last 12 games imploded, and some were unlucky enough to have the ref gift Wales 20 points.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 8:24 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:Yeah france did look decent in the first 40 v Wales then implosion.

Implosion isn’t what I would describe, more like Wales figures out how to nullify the french. Conditions were very poor that night. Howling wind torrential sleety rain and minus 4 temperatures. France Looked even better against the Scots last week. The french certainly have the ability to play well.


Didn't you know maes? Each of our opposition in the last 12 games imploded, and some were unlucky enough to have the ref gift Wales 20 points.

Some of them actually have to be fair. Do you remember the game v SA last year. Total brain sharp from SA to lose that one.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 8:32 pm

We played them twice last year, which are you referring to? Our 2nd/3rd team beat their 2nd/3rd team, then our 1st team also beat theirs. I remember all the ref-blaming from bitter fans here at the time too.

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Post by SecretFly on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 8:40 pm

At least the game is against France. So all our friends in Wales will be rooting for us coz we is their Pro14 pals........

ah the bliss of brotherly love. It brings a tear to the eye Wink

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 8:55 pm

Personally don't care who wins this one as both have suffered losses already, but always more inclined to support England and Ireland over anyone else.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 9:08 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:We played them twice last year, which are you referring to? Our 2nd/3rd team beat their 2nd/3rd team, then our 1st team also beat theirs. I remember all the ref-blaming from bitter fans here at the time too.

Yes when the second string teams played. There was a last minute charge from memory. It was really unnecessary from SA.

From 5:20. Absolute bonkers from SA.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5rYzBd0pu0

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Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 9:16 pm

A charge down is usually the result of the opposition defence, and a good bit of skill from the charger-downer and try-scorer; yet if it's Wales it's all luck and refs.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 9:28 pm

The charge down rebounded off someones head. Id say thats lucky. Charge downs are also down to bad exit strategy.

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Ireland v France, 10th March 2018 15:00 Empty Re: Ireland v France, 10th March 2018 15:00

Post by mikey_dragon on Wed 06 Mar 2019, 10:32 pm

Yeah I get it, if something goes in Wales' favour it's luck. If it goes in Ireland's or anyone else's favour it was amazing.

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Ireland v France, 10th March 2018 15:00 Empty Re: Ireland v France, 10th March 2018 15:00

Post by eirebilly on Thu 07 Mar 2019, 7:19 am

For me, charge downs are down too extreme pressure from an attacking defensive line which is why they do not happen at every exit play, where the ball bounces can be seen as an element of luck but you accept that luck as part of the complete play.

Try's from charge downs are simply not luck to me.
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Post by Pete330v2 on Thu 07 Mar 2019, 9:43 am

If you consider how many times Pienaar charged down exit kicks, many of which he or a team mate scored from I think it's pretty clear that luck plays less of a part than some are suggesting. It's definitely a skill that can be honed but the bounce of a rugby ball always includes luck, either good or bad.

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Post by LondonTiger on Thu 07 Mar 2019, 9:48 am

Charge downs are a practiced skill from the charger, often allied to poor play from the team kicking. What happens after depends in large part to luck. At Welford Road we have such a small in-goal area that 9 times out of 10 a charge down will go harmlessly out of play.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Thu 07 Mar 2019, 9:54 am

I get the sense some people havent watched the video. The ball bounced back in goal of a SA players head. It was also fairly weak play from SA in general. The had no forwards on each side of the ruck to block the charge down.

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Post by The Great Aukster on Thu 07 Mar 2019, 5:07 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:According to Easterby today Cronin wasnt dropped they just want to give other guys time at the helm given that hooker is a specialist position and you therefore cant have players from other positions covering the 2 shirt.

A fair enough position given three hookers will go to the RWC and a fourth will be on standby.

Will Scannell and Herring each get a bench spot for the last two games or will one only be there for the training squad?

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Post by Collapse2005 on Thu 07 Mar 2019, 5:14 pm

Easterby stated that Cronin may yet be involved for the last game v Wales.

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