England v Scotland 6N Round 5 Saturday 16th March

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Post by BigGee on Sun 10 Mar 2019, 18:43

First topic message reminder :

England v Scotland
6N Round 5
Saturday 16th March
Twickenham Stadium
London

KO 17.00

Well here we are at the final round of matches and three teams can still come out on top following Ireland's demolition of France this afternoon.

England have the advantage of playing last and will know what they have to do, if Wales have not already wrapped it up with a Grand Slam earlier in the afternoon. That actually might be Scotland's best chance of getting anything out of this game if England get distracted about what is going on else where, particularly if they find playing for second spot a distraction, knowing Wales have already wrapped things up.

On paper, this is only going to be an English win, the only question being by how much.

Scotland have had an awful championship, where just about everything that could have gone wrong. They are only playing for pride, but history tells us that sides that are done at this stage in the competition, rarely have anything left in the tank for the final game.

It is not as if Scotland have any form at Twickenham either, we have not won there since 1983 (did I ever mention that I was there!). We had had a crap season and no-one gave us much of a chance that year either if I remember, then the following year we won the GS. Can I see that happening this time though?

Only in my dreams!

So what do both sides hope to get from the game?

England clearly want a BP victory, some revenge for last year and hopefully a championship. They would also like to show the continued emergence of such players as Cockanasiga, who could be pivotal to them doing well in the WC.

Scotland, despite whatever spin they put on the game, might just be happy with a decent performance and continued development of some of our young starlets. We took another pile of injuries this weekend and getting a half decent competitive side onto the pitch is going to be a challenge in itself. Still, this exposure might be the making of young Hastings, Bradbury, Graham, McDowell, Skinner, Ritchie and anyone else who gets to play, down the line.

Test rugby is a hard old place to earn your living and they will likely be finding that out next weekend.



England


Daly, Nowell, Slade, Tuilagi, May; Farrell, Youngs; Moon, George, Sinckler, Launchbury, Kruis, Wilson, Curry, B Vunipola.

Replacements: Cowan-Dickie, Genge, Cole, Shields, Hughes, Spencer, Ford, Te'o



Scotland:

Maitland; Graham, Grigg, Johnson, McGuigan; Russell, Price; Dell, McInally (capt), Nel; Toolis, Gilchrist; Skinner, Watson, Bradbury.

Replacements: Brown, Reid, Berghan, J Gray, Strauss, Laidlaw, Hastings, Harris


Last edited by BigGee on Thu 14 Mar 2019, 13:24; edited 1 time in total

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Post by RDW on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 10:52

miaow wrote:
Ricardo74 wrote:So hang on, Marcus Smith is called up? He was only brought on at half time in the Quins hammering by Glos yesterday.

A Quins hammering in which the Glos strings were pulled by... Danny Cipriani.

And Smith gets called up? EJ leaves me at a loss sometimes.


Face doesn't fit. Picked him to shut the critics up but too much history of problems. Didn't he hit the headlines recently as well, in a negative way? Even if he's unfairly treated having a player the press will hound/try to pin something on him at the RWC is the last thing England want to deal with...after dwarf tossing etc. Think he's tipped over into 'not worth the hassle' - doesn't suit the gameplan but also probably a coach's nightmare.

RDW wrote:
Eejit wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:
RDW wrote:Hogg, Seymour and Kinghorn ruled out.

Jackson and 2 pro appearance Steyn called up...
Whodafugizzat?
Kyle Steyn. Scotland Sevens winger recently signed by Glasgow. Used to play for the Griquas in the Currie Cup.

Obviously the level of experience you want heading to Twickenham!

Has a Matthew Tait scenario writter all over it. Also, if little Darcy is up against Coknasiga, or any Scottish centre v Tuilagi...eesh. This game is going to test some Scottish players to the full.

To be fair Darcy has come up against plenty beasts this season and has never shirked things in defence. He's caused all kinds of players trouble this season too. If all our players had his bravery and determination we'd be world beaters!

Cocknasiga does look terrifyingly good though - not looking forward to him playing whoever he's up against.

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Post by bsando on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 10:52

Eejit wrote:
RDW wrote:
Eejit wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:
RDW wrote:Hogg, Seymour and Kinghorn ruled out.

Jackson and 2 pro appearance Steyn called up...
 Whodafugizzat?
Kyle Steyn. Scotland Sevens winger recently signed by Glasgow. Used to play for the Griquas in the Currie Cup.

Obviously the level of experience you want heading to Twickenham!

Could be worse. Could be Dougie Fife!
Was waiting for a “at least he plays for Glasgow” jibe

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Post by Ricardo74 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 10:53

LondonTiger wrote:
Ricardo74 wrote:
Yoda wrote:Is it me or is Billy v just going through the motions and using this championship to slowly get back up to pace. Haven't seen him really gun it yet in attack or defence. Is this a ploy to keep him fit?

Was interesting seeing him line up in the 12 slot, with Big Joe packing down at 8....




Apparently there were two options at that scrum - alternative, if Italy were deemed to have left the blindside clear, was for big Joe to run it blind with Lenny in support. Instead they took route 1 being Vunipola smashing it up the middle to great affect.

I did think that Big Joe picking it up one handed and setting off down the blind side would be a terrifying prospect for the blindside flanker to deal with!

I like it though, it's innovative thinking.

As to BV, he's not looked as dominant taking the ball into contact yet, but he's still coming back to form, I think. He looked the best he has in this 6N on Saturday, I think, although you could look at the opposition for that a bit. You can only beat what's in front of you, though.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 10:54

This gives me the chance to yet again post one of my favourite Youtube clips. If Hornes plays, Manu may well be looking to emulate his big brother:


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Post by lostinwales on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 10:56

LondonTiger wrote:
Ricardo74 wrote:
Yoda wrote:Is it me or is Billy v just going through the motions and using this championship to slowly get back up to pace. Haven't seen him really gun it yet in attack or defence. Is this a ploy to keep him fit?

Was interesting seeing him line up in the 12 slot, with Big Joe packing down at 8....




Apparently there were two options at that scrum - alternative, if Italy were deemed to have left the blindside clear, was for big Joe to run it blind with Lenny in support. Instead they took route 1 being Vunipola smashing it up the middle to great affect.

Interesting. At least he made a better job of playing in the back row than our other winger.

As for Billy. He doesn't seem to be making the yards that he was, but he is looking better all the time.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 10:59

As Eddie said "We were playing against Italy though. Let's be frank"

It is hard to judge performances when at home against a team quite as poor as Italy are.

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Post by miaow on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:03

LondonTiger wrote:This gives me the chance to yet again post one of my favourite Youtube clips. If Hornes plays, Manu may well be looking to emulate his big brother:


Horne looks like an actual child here. Or maybe even a doll. Boom-fa.

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Post by lostinwales on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:04

LondonTiger wrote:As Eddie said "We were playing against Italy though. Let's be frank"

It is hard to judge performances when at home against a team quite as poor as Italy are.

It was basically saying that we can beat your 8 man scrum with 7 of our forwards. Not nice to be on the receiving end.

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Post by jimbopip on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:25

So, Ruaridh Jackson is in for full-back cover: may even start as his form has been excellent this season. Seaman Steyn is also called up, nominally to cover wing BUT he was mainly played at 13 for Griqas AND Jimmy Johnston has been sent back to the Luvvies so could Toonie be considering putting a big strapping Bokkie-type in to add some bulk?


The Toonie Tombola could just spin and spin until out pops;


9. Aldi Price
10. Haircut
11. Barry McGuigan (who did well when he came on)
12. Dancer
13. Seaman
14. Darcy
15. Ruaridh

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Post by GeordieFalcon on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:27

LondonTiger wrote:Kruis was my MotM.

Yeah he's back to his best. And when he is....hes our most complete lock.

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Post by miaow on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:27

RDW wrote:
miaow wrote:
Ricardo74 wrote:So hang on, Marcus Smith is called up? He was only brought on at half time in the Quins hammering by Glos yesterday.

A Quins hammering in which the Glos strings were pulled by... Danny Cipriani.

And Smith gets called up? EJ leaves me at a loss sometimes.


Face doesn't fit. Picked him to shut the critics up but too much history of problems. Didn't he hit the headlines recently as well, in a negative way? Even if he's unfairly treated having a player the press will hound/try to pin something on him at the RWC is the last thing England want to deal with...after dwarf tossing etc. Think he's tipped over into 'not worth the hassle' - doesn't suit the gameplan but also probably a coach's nightmare.

RDW wrote:
Eejit wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:
RDW wrote:Hogg, Seymour and Kinghorn ruled out.

Jackson and 2 pro appearance Steyn called up...
Whodafugizzat?
Kyle Steyn. Scotland Sevens winger recently signed by Glasgow. Used to play for the Griquas in the Currie Cup.

Obviously the level of experience you want heading to Twickenham!

Has a Matthew Tait scenario writter all over it. Also, if little Darcy is up against Coknasiga, or any Scottish centre v Tuilagi...eesh. This game is going to test some Scottish players to the full.

To be fair Darcy has come up against plenty beasts this season and has never shirked things in defence. He's caused all kinds of players trouble this season too. If all our players had his bravery and determination we'd be world beaters!

Cocknasiga does look terrifyingly good though - not looking forward to him playing whoever he's up against.

Yes, true, he was a handful against Wales and bounced a few players off. But he was also picked up by a ragdoll by Parkes who, although deceptively strong, doesn't come close to the explosive power England have throughout their side. Maybe harsh picking on him but Scotland v England looks very much like it'll be a Pictish pixies v Anglo Saxon-Samoan brawn fest.

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Post by Eejit on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:36

jimbopip wrote:So, Ruaridh Jackson is in for full-back cover: may even start as his form has been excellent this season. Seaman Steyn is also called up, nominally to cover wing BUT he was mainly played at 13 for Griqas AND Jimmy Johnston has been sent back to the Luvvies so could Toonie be considering putting a big strapping Bokkie-type in to add some bulk?


The Toonie Tombola could just spin and spin until out pops;


9. Aldi Price
10. Haircut
11. Barry McGuigan (who did well when he came on)
12. Dancer
13. Seaman
14. Darcy
15. Ruaridh

I think Sam Johnson will start at inside centre with Dancer at fly half and haircut at 15. Don’t think Grigg will play so you might be right about Seaman Steyn though I have no doubt that the Pocket Battleship fears no man and would bite Manu Tuilagi’s ankles off if he thought it would slow him down.

I hope Toony listens to the voices inside his head and goes full on batshit Tombola. I don’t mind us taking the L at HQ with this many injuries if we go and make EJ’s big heffers run around a bit and have them praying to whatever gods they pray to at the prospect about coming up to Murrayfield next year for an absolute pasting.

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Post by BamBam on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:59

Lost an hour last night watching highlights of Jason Robinson and Christian Cullen on youtube. Almost completely irrelevant to this thread, but I wish there were more players of that ilk playing today, as fun as it is watching Tuilagi/Cokanasiga ragdoll the opposition, the steppers and jinkers are just so exciting to watch

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Post by SecretFly on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 12:07

As long as the stepping doesn't start mimicking ballroom dancing, it's fine. But I do bloody hate steppers who do all their fancy stepping in the same spot and then get crunched by two big bored guys the minute they finally move actually forward. I deplore static stepping.

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Post by lostinwales on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 12:20

BamBam wrote:Lost an hour last night watching highlights of Jason Robinson and Christian Cullen on youtube. Almost completely irrelevant to this thread, but I wish there were more players of that ilk playing today, as fun as it is watching Tuilagi/Cokanasiga ragdoll the opposition, the steppers and jinkers are just so exciting to watch

You need both. Big guys make holes for little guys to exploit - see Keith Earls' try at the weekend for a sort of scaled up modern example - but I think one reason why, say, Shane Who scored so many was because of the holes left by the big guys and the way that the defense gets so tuned into just dealing with big lumps running at them.

From England's point of view having Daly come into the line against Italy added a great deal - you did not know what he was going to do. What is great about Big Joe is that he does have footwork. He also seems to be very aware of what is going on around him and works hard to keep the ball available. He was creative. That whole holding the ball in one hand does make the offloads easy, although I can see smart teams having a guy waiting for that offload out of the tackle.

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Post by Ricardo74 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 12:28

lostinwales wrote:
BamBam wrote:Lost an hour last night watching highlights of Jason Robinson and Christian Cullen on youtube. Almost completely irrelevant to this thread, but I wish there were more players of that ilk playing today, as fun as it is watching Tuilagi/Cokanasiga ragdoll the opposition, the steppers and jinkers are just so exciting to watch

You need both. Big guys make holes for little guys to exploit - see Keith Earls' try at the weekend for a sort of scaled up modern example - but I think one reason why, say, Shane Who scored so many was because of the holes left by the big guys and the way that the defense gets so tuned into just dealing with big lumps running at them.

From England's point of view having Daly come into the line against Italy added a great deal - you did not know what he was going to do. What is great about Big Joe is that he does have footwork. He also seems to be very aware of what is going on around him and works hard to keep the ball available. He was creative. That whole holding the ball in one hand does make the offloads easy, although I can see smart teams having a guy waiting for that offload out of the tackle.

Agree with virtually all of this. Jason Robinson and Cullen were special talents who lit up the game. I might have to spend a few minutes tonight reminding myself just how good they were, particularly Cullen.

I said on another thread that I think Daly has more of a "top two inches" threat to him than anyone else in the England side, in his ability to identify - and exploit - the field in front of him. It's why EJ has to find a spot for him, be in wing, centre or fb.

As for Cokanasiga, I thought the catch from the cross-kick and offload to Curry, in the second minute or so, was an electric example of Big Joe's awareness and athleticism. He's not just a big lump, and I think that offload amazed Curry to the extent he dropped it!


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Post by GeordieFalcon on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 12:28

lostinwales wrote:
BamBam wrote:Lost an hour last night watching highlights of Jason Robinson and Christian Cullen on youtube. Almost completely irrelevant to this thread, but I wish there were more players of that ilk playing today, as fun as it is watching Tuilagi/Cokanasiga ragdoll the opposition, the steppers and jinkers are just so exciting to watch

You need both. Big guys make holes for little guys to exploit - see Keith Earls' try at the weekend for a sort of scaled up modern example - but I think one reason why, say, Shane Who scored so many was because of the holes left by the big guys and the way that the defense gets so tuned into just dealing with big lumps running at them.

From England's point of view having Daly come into the line against Italy added a great deal - you did not know what he was going to do. What is great about Big Joe is that he does have footwork. He also seems to be very aware of what is going on around him and works hard to keep the ball available. He was creative. That whole holding the ball in one hand does make the offloads easy, although I can see smart teams having a guy waiting for that offload out of the tackle.

I can see teams trying to slap the ball out of his hand aswell.

But I said after the AI's Cockasaniga looks more than a battering ram. AND I think he showed that again on Saturday. He's very alert to whats happening, ran good lines and angles and was always looking to keep it alive.

Yes defence can be worked on, but sod it...let the opposition worry about him!

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 12:41

Joe definitely has footwork as well as pace and power. Obviously he is not as advanced defensively, but the thing I would like him to work on more than that is coming off his wing. Now this may have been a plan, with May being teh one who popped up all over the field, but Joe was staying very wide.

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Post by Barney McGrew did it on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 12:53

Yeah Joe C is a terror to any oppo going forward. Bit concerned about his defense tho - Italy were making good ground down his wing (in the few opportunities they had with decent attacking possession that is). And the 2nd Italy try was a tad disappointing - Italy camped 5-10m from our line, no real England commitment to the ruck, and yet we still left acres of space on the wing pretty much only covered by our worst defender. Any team would have strolled in.
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Post by TightHEAD on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 12:57

Where have the Brad Shields hate club gone?

Look the guy is hardly going to set the 6 nations on fire, make England world beaters or Wasps European champions, but he is a solid squad player, every team wants a player like Brad.
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Post by GeordieFalcon on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:02

TightHEAD wrote:Where have the Brad Shields hate club gone?

Look the guy is hardly going to set the 6 nations on fire, make England world beaters or Wasps European champions, but he is a solid squad player, every team wants a player like Brad.

He was not bad v Italy...but I wouldn't take him to the World CUp.

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Post by Ricardo74 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:03

TightHEAD wrote:Where have the Brad Shields hate club gone?

Look the guy is hardly going to set the 6 nations on fire, make England world beaters or Wasps European champions, but he is a solid squad player, every team wants a player like Brad.

I'm not a hater, but I thought he needed a massive game to lay down a marker and challenge Wilson for ownership of the 6 shirt. He scored one try on a good support line, was the beneficiary of some good Kruis work for his other, and was useful in general. It was a solid, decent shift. It wasn't a massive statement. He's there or thereabouts.

The question is, I guess, what's the first choice back row if people are fit? Billy, Curry and Underhill? Billy, one of Curry / Underhill, and one of Wilson / Shields? Robshaw? Dombrandt? Jack Willis? Nate Hughes? Courtney Lawes? Ben Morgan had a good game for Glaws yesterday too...


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Post by No 7&1/2 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:10

Vunipola is the only one you'd say is unchallenged as a starter.

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Post by lostinwales on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:16

Ricardo74 wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:Where have the Brad Shields hate club gone?

Look the guy is hardly going to set the 6 nations on fire, make England world beaters or Wasps European champions, but he is a solid squad player, every team wants a player like Brad.

I'm not a hater, but I thought he needed a massive game to lay down a marker and challenge Wilson for ownership of the 6 shirt. He scored one try on a good support line, was the beneficiary of some good Kruis work for his other, and was useful in general. It was a solid, decent shift. It wasn't a massive statement. He's there or thereabouts.

The question is, I guess, what's the first choice back row if people are fit? Billy, Curry and Underhill? Billy, one of Curry / Underhill, and one of Wilson / Shields? Robshaw? Dombrandt? Jack Willis? Nate Hughes? Courtney Lawes? Ben Morgan had a good game for Glaws yesterday too...


There are two separate answers to this question. The easier one to answer is who is going to be 1st choice (who as backup ) at the RWC. The second, and much harder, is post RWC.

I'd go with Curry/Wilson/Billy 1st choice at the RWC. Underhill should also be there if fit. Tricky about the others. The list of other possibles include Shields, Robshaw, Hughes, with Isekewe, Simmonds and Clifford as outsiders. We know Itoje and Lawes can cover 6 and should go to the RWC but neither are ideal.

I don't find Shields inspiring. He's solid and won't let anyone down but with Curry and Billy ripping up trees he's overshadowed and possibly underpowered in an area where there are some beasts coming through. I appreciate his role at rucks probably is to provide fringe defense but he did seem to spend a lot of time inspecting rather than doing.

Post RWC who knows. If Dombrandt dodges 2nd season syndrome he could make an interesting case for an impact player. If Curry can develop lineout skills we might end up with a Frodo/Curry/Billy backrow

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:17

GeordieFalcon wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:Where have the Brad Shields hate club gone?

Look the guy is hardly going to set the 6 nations on fire, make England world beaters or Wasps European champions, but he is a solid squad player, every team wants a player like Brad.

He was not bad v Italy...but I wouldn't take him to the World CUp.

He had his best game for England and if he had played like that against any other team might be worth 8/10 - which is pretty darn good. However against Italy it is worth 7/10 at best. He showed a good work rate but still for me did not impose himself on the game in the manner needed to make me buy in to the hype from before he joined England in SA. Jones likes him, so if it is a shoot out between him and Wilson that may be important. For me Wilson is at least as good as a 6 and offers more versatility. 

Purely a personal view based on my emotive link to the team, but Shields has to be clearly better for me to want him in the team. This is a reflection on my distaste for players parachuted in as he was with zero affiliation with English rugby until he pulled on the England shirt.

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Post by GeordieFalcon on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:25

LT,

I made the point through the game on Saturday that Shields wasn't that bad, when others were saying he was invisible. He was working hard, and scored a couple of good tries from support positions etc.

However Im very biased, so obviously he doesn't start.

However post world cup...Curry is nailing that 7 shirt so I see Underhill as a better 6 than Shields, I see Willis challenging and Dombrandt is a man mountain with huge potential.

All 3 of those are far more explosive / powerful than shields.

Wilson will still be in the picture post world cup, but I think those three in particular could push ahead considerably. And theres Ted Hill whos also worth keeping an eye on.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:28

So like I said then placeholders waiting for a couple to.come through. Given there is normally a proper bolter who comes through without a cap or much of a second thought I'd day willis has a good chance of being in the plane.

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Post by Ricardo74 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:36

So who to pick for this game against Scotland, then? I think it's pretty much consensus that BV & Curry are two, but do we give Shields another run out, or bring back Wilson for a more serious test match?

Plus, (and I think we all know the answer to this one), will Dan Robson get a start?

Genge, George, Sinkler, Kruis, Launch, Curry, Billy, Wilson; Robson*, Farrell; May, Te'o, Manu, Cokanasiga; Daly

* won't happen, will be Youngs

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Post by robbo277 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:51

Ricardo74 wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Wider squad here. Certainly looks like the group are looking for that next lock to start pushing. Stooke now involved as itoje doesn't look to have made it.

So EJ will be leaving out Ewels and Stooke, and picking Hughes / Wilson / Shields as lock cover...

Whistle

I feel some of the extended squad is nothing more than training fodder.

Last week Eddie was probably happy to go with Hughes and Ewels or Itoje and Ewels as his lock pairings in training to give his first choice something to scrum against and something to jump against in the lineout. With Itoje out and Stooke coming in, I wonder if Hughes is going to get more of a look in at 8 this week. I'd still expect to see him on the bench. He played well when he came on regardless.

I think the same may be true of Smith. Maybe he sees Smith as the 3rd choice, maybe he wants to give Smith more time around England, or maybe he sees Smith as the closest we have to a Russell or perhaps even Hastings, and wants him to run against England. If you're training to play against Scotland with Hastings at 15, then putting Smith at 15 makes more sense than putting Brown there.

I'd be very surprised if Ewels, Stooke or Smith made the Scotland squad, or even the World Cup squad.

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Post by robbo277 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 13:54

LondonTiger wrote:
Ricardo74 wrote:
Yoda wrote:Is it me or is Billy v just going through the motions and using this championship to slowly get back up to pace. Haven't seen him really gun it yet in attack or defence. Is this a ploy to keep him fit?

Was interesting seeing him line up in the 12 slot, with Big Joe packing down at 8....




Apparently there were two options at that scrum - alternative, if Italy were deemed to have left the blindside clear, was for big Joe to run it blind with Lenny in support. Instead they took route 1 being Vunipola smashing it up the middle to great affect.

I actually thought Billy set off early on this carry and had to check his run. If he'd timed it better I don't know how they would have stopped him!

I liked the set-up though, and I don't mind us showing it against Italy. It's a triple threat option. The opposition need to keep a blindside winger marking no-one for Cokanasiga and Youngs coming round the corner. We therefore have an overlap on the openside immediately, and you can either hit Billy up or use him to suck two defenders in at 10/12 and play Farrell and the centres out the back.

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Post by GeordieFalcon on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:03

No 7&1/2 wrote:So like I said then placeholders waiting for a couple to.come through. Given there is normally a proper bolter who comes through without a cap or much of a second thought I'd day willis has a good chance of being in the plane.

Well I haven't seen him since he's been back, but the reports ive heard is that he has started off pretty much in the form he was in before the injury, so yes he could well make the plane.

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Post by lostinwales on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:05

Ricardo74 wrote:So who to pick for this game against Scotland, then? I think it's pretty much consensus that BV & Curry are two, but do we give Shields another run out, or bring back Wilson for a more serious test match?

Plus, (and I think we all know the answer to this one), will Dan Robson get a start?

Genge, George, Sinkler, Kruis, Launch, Curry, Billy, Wilson; Robson*, Farrell; May, Te'o, Manu, Cokanasiga; Daly

* won't happen, will be Youngs

Which raises the question, Te'o/ Manu or Manu/Slade? I much prefer the latter although it does depend on Slade and Manu switching around more so that Manu gets the odd run at outside centre

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Post by jimbopip on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:13

Eejit wrote:
jimbopip wrote:So, Ruaridh Jackson is in for full-back cover: may even start as his form has been excellent this season. Seaman Steyn is also called up, nominally to cover wing BUT he was mainly played at 13 for Griqas AND Jimmy Johnston has been sent back to the Luvvies so could Toonie be considering putting a big strapping Bokkie-type in to add some bulk?


The Toonie Tombola could just spin and spin until out pops;


9. Aldi Price
10. Haircut
11. Barry McGuigan (who did well when he came on)
12. Dancer
13. Seaman
14. Darcy
15. Ruaridh

I think Sam Johnson will start at inside centre with Dancer at fly half and haircut at 15. Don’t think Grigg will play so you might be right about Seaman Steyn though I have no doubt that the Pocket Battleship fears no man and would bite Manu Tuilagi’s ankles off if he thought it would slow him down.

I hope Toony listens to the voices inside his head and goes full on batshit Tombola. I don’t mind us taking the L at HQ with this many injuries if we go and make EJ’s big heffers run around a bit and have them praying to whatever gods they pray to at the prospect about coming up to Murrayfield next year for an absolute pasting.

Eejit, picard I totally forgot Smiling Sam, who most likely will start at 12.

I do think MicroGraham and Barry are probably the only two wingers in contention.

Battleship Griggtempkin and the Seaman are likewise the only 13s still standing .


If NoMaits is fit then it's him or Rhubarb or Haircut. Only one of whom regularly plays fullback.


Toonie has talked about having a look at different players/combinations during this Six Nations but the injury pandemic has snafued that. So this week he will most likely, (but it's Toonie so you don't know) either go for a safe options or go full on 360 degree Tombola.


SAFE                                                                                              BATSHIT

Frodo                                                                                            Aldi Price

Dancer                                                                                          Haircut

NoMaits                                                                                        Barry McGuigan

Hornee Furra Linee                                                                        Dancer

Smiling Sam                                                                                 Seaman                                                                          

MicroGraham                                                                                MicroGraham

Rhuaridh                                                                                      NoMaits








Personally, I would be tempted to see what Seaman can do; he's used to big Boks running straight at him so defensively he should cope. Probably have Rhuaridh on the bench as 10/15 cover IF NoMaits is fit. Possibly even have Lord Stafford n the bench too.

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Post by Ricardo74 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:29

lostinwales wrote:
Ricardo74 wrote:So who to pick for this game against Scotland, then? I think it's pretty much consensus that BV & Curry are two, but do we give Shields another run out, or bring back Wilson for a more serious test match?

Plus, (and I think we all know the answer to this one), will Dan Robson get a start?

Genge, George, Sinkler, Kruis, Launch, Curry, Billy, Wilson; Robson*, Farrell; May, Te'o, Manu, Cokanasiga; Daly

* won't happen, will be Youngs

Which raises the question, Te'o/ Manu or Manu/Slade? I much prefer the latter although it does depend on Slade and Manu switching around more so that Manu gets the odd run at outside centre

If all three are fit, then I'd start with Te'o and Manu, with Slade to come on and offer a different option. Straight switch with Manu to 13, or Te'o off, Manu to the 12 slot, and Slade into outside centre.

But I'd probably stick with Te'o / Manu as starters.

For now...

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Post by jimbopip on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:38

Eddie The Erudite at it again:

Eddie Jones has warned a depleted Scotland to expect a hostile reception from an England side gunning for revenge after last year’s ill-tempered Calcutta Cup defeat at Murrayfield.

England will win the Guinness Six Nations title on Saturday if they can settle some scores against Scotland and Ireland end Wales’s grand-slam quest with a victory in Cardiff.

There has been bad blood between the teams since Ryan Wilson, the Scotland flanker, booed the England contingent at the 2017 World Rugby awards, where Jones was named world coach of the year.

There was a fracas in the narrow tunnel before kick-off last year when Owen Farrell stepped in to defend George Ford, who was the subject of verbal abuse from Wilson.

Scotland’s alcohol-fuelled celebrations after their first victory over England in ten years were revealed in a video of Greig Laidlaw, Stuart Hogg and Huw Jones singing Flower of Scotland in a bar.

The day after the game, Jones was subjected to intimidating verbal abuse as he took a train from Edinburgh to Manchester, with four men later fined for public order offences.

Jones criticised Gavin Hastings and Simon Berghan, the former Scotland players, for inflaming the situation with their pre-match comments, none of which the England head coach has forgotten.

Twickenham may not be renowned for its intimidating atmosphere but Jones said that Scotland can expect a “physical” reception on the field.

“Every game against Scotland has extra on it,” Jones said. “They have a healthy dislike of the English and we would certainly like to reciprocate the welcome we got up there last year.

“[Twickenham is] nice, isn’t it? It’s all leather patches, brogue shoes, it’s nice. You don’t get people telling you where to go, you don’t get people spitting on you, you don’t get people grabbing you round the head and telling you what you should do so it’s different. So we’ll make sure the hostility is on the field.

“We will be at our absolute best next week. We are going to have to be to beat Scotland, because we know that is their game of the year.

“We saw how they carried on last year after they beat us and we may have short memories sometimes but sometimes you have longer memories. I remember everything that was said. We’ll be ready for them.”

Scotland’s hopes have been severely dented by their injury absences, with Hogg, Tommy Seymour and Blair Kinghorn being ruled out this morning through injury. Hogg has been out since suffering a shoulder injury against Ireland in the opening round and has failed in his attempts to recover in time to face England. Adam Hastings also went off after coming on as a replacement against Wales on Saturday, while wing Darcy Graham was also forced off. Scotland have already lost back-rows John Barclay, Ryan Wilson and centre Huw Jones.

Jones will be without Maro Itoje, who injured his knee attempting to swerve past the England coach in training last week.

Ben Te’o, the inside centre, said that the four men who abused Jones last year were fortunate that there were no England players nearby when it happened because they would have piled in to the aid of their coach.

“It is not nice to see that type of stuff with little old Eddie and I am pretty sure if there had been some boys around there they would have been flying in. Lucky there wasn’t,” he said.

The England squad wanted to play against Aldershot-born Wilson this weekend but the Glasgow Warriors flanker is recovering from knee-ligament damage.

“It would have been nice if Ryan Wilson was playing this week,” Te’o said, with a wry smile. “But unfortunately he is not.”

Behind a paywall i think ...
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/spor ... -t33jxmrj6

I don't recall him being spat on or sworn at last year at Murrayfield, but that is what he's implying.
As for targeting Batman....when has he ever upset anyone?
Mind you prior to the Glasgow v Sarries match Jamie George had been telling anyone who cared to listen that he and the other England players in the Sarries were looking forward to getting their hands on Batman. When Danny Care asked after the game how things had gone Mr George had difficulty speaking clearly do to his having a broken nose. Apparently he ran into Batman.

Eddie The Erudite really is a charmless buffoon with his consistently puerile attempts to "wind up" opposition players and coaches.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:42

Don't worry Jimbo - they are currently warming up Jim Telfer's cryogenic chamber for his comeback Very Happy

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Post by EWT Spoons on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:52

jimbopip wrote:

Jones criticised Gavin Hastings and Simon Berghan, the former Scotland players, for inflaming the situation with their pre-match comments, none of which the England head coach has forgotten.


Does Jones know something we don't?

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Post by BigTrevsbigmac on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:54

‘I don't recall him being spat on or sworn at last year at Murrayfield’.

It was Will Carling according to his tweet last year who was spat on leaving Edinburgh 1990 after a Scotlandwin against England.

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Post by R!skysports on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 14:59

From Carling twitter - The 'Eddie' incident is nothing new. I was spat on etc when I left Edinburgh after 1990. BUT, they were a couple of idiots - did not represent vast, vast majority of Scottish fans, in the same way, that these idiots don't either! #perspective

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Post by BamBam on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 15:01

Jimbo article wrote:Scotland’s alcohol-fuelled celebrations after their first victory over England in ten years were revealed in a video of Greig Laidlaw, Stuart Hogg and Huw Jones singing Flower of Scotland in a bar.

How very dare they

Laugh I've heard some nonsense, but that is serious straw clutching by the journalist


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Post by RDW on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 15:08

I'm quite happy for Eddie to be mouthing off in the press and will be delighted if the players go out their way to try and rile up our players - we might not lose quite so badly with Sinckler sent off!

For once I really am quite sad Wilson isn't playing - he is a one man sh!t stirring machine on the pitch.

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Post by robbo277 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 15:09

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:‘I don't recall him being spat on or sworn at last year at Murrayfield’.

It was Will Carling according to his tweet last year who was spat on leaving Edinburgh 1990 after a Scotlandwin against England.

I would be surprised if he didn't get sworn at to be honest. Being spat at is a different level though, and completely unacceptable, but there were no reports Eddie was spat at that I read.

There's a mix of complaints in there:
*The Scotland players getting drunk and singing Flower of Scotland after the win is hardly the worst thing. It was Week 3 as well wasn't it? Plenty of time off in between games.
*Ryan Wilson being a nause on the pitch you should just park at full time. However it's pretty bad taste as a professional to boo other professionals at an awards dinner, so I guess whatever Wilson did on gameday just compounded those feelings?
*As for whatever was said in the press before the game, it's not like Eddie can take the moral high ground on any of that.

The main issues of annoyance for Eddie should be the performance and the people who accosted him in Manchester. The second one has been dealt with by the courts and it's up to him and his team to deal with the first.

This is part of Eddie's process though, and I don't mind it because on the whole it works. I can however see why some opposition fans would get turned off by his comments.

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Post by lostinwales on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 15:26

Eddie always seems to do this to draw attention on to him and away from the team. If there is a fuss about a player it is often one who won't be actually playing (i.e. Itoje and will he/ won't he be playing) which again draws attention away from the actual team.

In other words what he does and says are different things, and don't take the wind ups that seriously.

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Post by Eejit on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 16:14

Imagine Batman winding people up. Shocking.

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Post by majesticimperialman on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 16:29

I am  not one who believes in making changes for changes sake. But being the last game do you think EJ may play Robson 9, Ford 10, Farrell ,12 And Manu 13 for the Scotland game.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 16:33

majesticimperialman wrote:I am  not one who believes in making changes for changes sake. But being the last game do you think EJ may play Robson 9, Ford 10, Farrell ,12 And Manu 13 for the Scotland game.

No

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Post by Sgt_Pooly on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 18:03

Potential Jock side doesn't look too inspiring, bags of injuries. I'd expect us to win by at least 20....sorry boys.

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Post by RDW on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 18:04

Finn Russell didn't train today apparently. Knowing our luck he'll be out for 6 months and will have taken Mcinally and Ritchie out at the same time!

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Post by robbo277 on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 19:53

When it rains it pours for Scotland at the minute.

They looked better against Wales with Russell than against France without. Couldn't turn it around on his own, but if he doesn't make it it would be a huge blow for Scotland.

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Post by Yoda on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 20:09

Who would of thought it a Scottish player winding up other players then getting on the lash. What is the game coming to? That's why we play isn't it? Some of it does go beyond the mark off the pitch but come on letting gobshites get the better of you is unforgivable. Surely Austin Healey gave more verbal than any player ever known. I am a firm believer in making sure you win the match put a great legal hit on the offending player and give him a lovely smile. All this stuff in the press is unedifying.

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