England - the winter tours thread

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 27 Feb 2019, 8:50 pm

First topic message reminder :

We can breathe a little bit easier now!

However, Morgan has to find another 4 overs of spin. I assume he'll wait until he can put an extra man out at 40. Hopefully eek out another one before then to give us a bit more breathing space.

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Post by Duty281 on Thu 07 Mar 2019, 12:17 pm

guildfordbat wrote:
Duty281 wrote:I don't see the point of international T20s and I'd be perfectly happy for T20 to be a domestic/franchise only thing.

International T20s are often tacked on at the end of long tours when everyone wants to go home, and no one seems to care about them until a few weeks before the 'World T20' event - an event which, in itself, is often forgotten about pretty quickly.

As a side note, it'll be interesting to see what impact the 'The Hundred' competition will have on T20s and 50-over cricket in England + Wales.

Hi Duty - it's hard to see how The Hundred won't have a detrimental effect on both.

The Hundred is planned to be played in the same period of the season as the county 50 over tournament. With leading county players drafted into the new teams set up for The Hundred, that'll mean the county sides will have to call up fringe players from the seconds and academies. Factor in as well that most of the major grounds will be be taken over solely for The Hundred throughout the whole period of that new tournament and so the 50 over games will have to be played at smaller outgrounds. All this points to a decline in quality and attendance at 50 over county games which is likely to feed through and ultimately be harmful to the England ODI side. That's totally at odds with the priority the ECB have given in recent years to improving our ODI side and winning this year's World Cup.

Very few in the game consider The Hundred and the county t20 competition to both be sustainable. If The Hundred wins out, it's likely to only be because of cheap prices as a result of being heavily subsidised by the ECB.

Thank you for that detailed answer. thumbsup

Concerning times and something has to give.

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Post by VTR on Thu 07 Mar 2019, 8:27 pm

"I suspect Chris Gayle might even hang around for it post world cup if theres enough female journalists on offer, an hour of hitting sixes, and an hour of signing autographs on the boundary while someone hits them over him, then off to the bar is right up his street."

Very nicely put Gooseberry, one of the highlights in an excellent post in general. I'd say though re Hameed and such players, it will be as much a problem for other countries as well. We're already seeing hardly any draws in Tests as run rates go up, and batting collapses aren't just an English specialty anymore (though we do like to assert our dominance with a timely 77 ao here and there). Look at some of the average players in other lineups, they wouldn't have been dropped for good quite quickly even ten years ago. Handscomb for Australia, Bavuma for South Africa (the wonderful talent who averages 35 with one hundred after 33 Tests). There's loads of others and of course some in the England team.

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Post by king_carlos on Fri 08 Mar 2019, 9:46 pm

Sam Billings displaying how explosive he can be and saving England's innings there.

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Post by Duty281 on Fri 08 Mar 2019, 10:14 pm

England about to win. That's nice. But this is nicer.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/mar/08/graham-thorpe-mark-ramprakash-batting-coach

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Post by VTR on Fri 08 Mar 2019, 10:28 pm

Laughably inept from the Windies. Jordan making a late bid for a World Cup slot, actually beating batsmen for pace. Plunkett isn't as quick as he was so might be worried

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Post by VTR on Fri 08 Mar 2019, 10:42 pm

England no longer have the worst collapse of the tour. 45 all out, what a rubbish match

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Post by king_carlos on Fri 08 Mar 2019, 10:50 pm

The second that Gayle chipped to mid-on the chase seemed to lack any belief.

Jordan bowled well. Whether his back holds up to hitting the pitch that hard in the longer forms is a question though.

If England want extra pace for the world cup then Archer is the best bet in my opinion.

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Post by Gooseberry on Sun 10 Mar 2019, 8:29 pm

Where was this windies in the test and ODI series? Much more like what weve come to expect from them

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Post by Duty281 on Sun 10 Mar 2019, 8:51 pm

Blimey, didn't realise there was a third T20. England going to win a series.

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Post by Gooseberry on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 9:24 am

I don't think the west Indies did either.
At least Gayle had the decency to literally not turn up unlike the rest of the batsmen.

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Post by alfie on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 10:00 am

Results of this tour counter-intuitive , no ? Who would have predicated West Indies to win the Tests - and draw the fifty over - and then get blown away in the format that generally suits them best ? (By an England t20 outfit missing several of their regulars )

So : does this cement Willey in the WC squad ? Certainly hints at the idea that he is the most likely to take early wickets with a new ball...and if Stokes allows six bowlers in the side does it matter if he generally won't bowl his quota later on ? Suppose Jordan has put in a claim too...

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Post by VTR on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 10:00 am

Forget the Tests and ODIs, whitewash in the main event! Joking aside, that was two of the most insipid T20 performances of all time. There's literally no point in T20s if one side is going to be bowled out in ten overs

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:02 am

alfie wrote:Results of this tour counter-intuitive , no ? Who would have predicated West Indies to win the Tests - and draw the fifty over - and then get blown away in the format that generally suits them best ? (By an England t20 outfit missing several of their regulars )

So : does this cement Willey in the WC squad ? Certainly hints at the idea that he is the most likely to take early wickets with a new ball...and if Stokes allows six bowlers in the side does it matter if he generally won't bowl his quota later on ? Suppose Jordan has put in a claim too...

I think Bayliss and co want to take a look at a lot of the fringe players during the Pakistan series to decide who fills out those final few remaining spots/also giving guys a rest ahead of what is a long long summer!

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Post by Gooseberry on Mon 11 Mar 2019, 11:40 am

Think VTR just made a case for the 100 there

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Post by guildfordbat on Fri 12 Apr 2019, 9:10 pm

Duty281 wrote:
guildfordbat wrote:
Duty281 wrote:I don't see the point of international T20s and I'd be perfectly happy for T20 to be a domestic/franchise only thing.

International T20s are often tacked on at the end of long tours when everyone wants to go home, and no one seems to care about them until a few weeks before the 'World T20' event - an event which, in itself, is often forgotten about pretty quickly.

As a side note, it'll be interesting to see what impact the 'The Hundred' competition will have on T20s and 50-over cricket in England + Wales.

Hi Duty - it's hard to see how The Hundred won't have a detrimental effect on both.

The Hundred is planned to be played in the same period of the season as the county 50 over tournament. With leading county players drafted into the new teams set up for The Hundred, that'll mean the county sides will have to call up fringe players from the seconds and academies. Factor in as well that most of the major grounds will be be taken over solely for The Hundred throughout the whole period of that new tournament and so the 50 over games will have to be played at smaller outgrounds. All this points to a decline in quality and attendance at 50 over county games which is likely to feed through and ultimately be harmful to the England ODI side. That's totally at odds with the priority the ECB have given in recent years to improving our ODI side and winning this year's World Cup.

Very few in the game consider The Hundred and the county t20 competition to both be sustainable. If The Hundred wins out, it's likely to only be because of cheap prices as a result of being heavily subsidised by the ECB.

Thank you for that detailed answer. thumbsup

Concerning times and something has to give.

An update.

It was reported in The Times this week that the county 50 over tournament - currently known as the RL 50 - will next year primarily be for young players. The ECB claim this initiative of theirs is aimed at ''youth development''. However, cynics like myself see it as a deliberate attempt to lessen interest in this format by making county teams select ''unknowns'' at the same time as The Hundred is being launched and played. I don't know who will (want to) sponsor this 50 over tournament but doubt that Royal London will want to continue their involvement. I also struggle to see how having such a restrictive approach to the selection of county 50 over sides will aid us in winning future World Cups.

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