Edwards to leave Welsh Rugby post-RWC

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Post by LondonTiger on Thu 02 May 2019, 10:54 am

https://www.wru.wales/2019/05/02/edwards-to-leave-welsh-rugby-post-rwc/


Wales defence coach Shaun Edwards will leave Welsh Rugby later this year, after the conclusion of the 2019 Rugby World Cup.

Edwards, who has been part of the Wales coaching team since 2008, has decided not to sign a new deal with the WRU. He will continue to be an integral part of Warren Gatland’s coaching team through until the end of the RWC.

Incoming Wales head coach Wayne Pivac said:

“Shaun has a great history with Wales and has been part of a coaching team that has been very successful.
“When Shaun’s availability post RWC recently became apparent we worked with him to offer him a new contract which he was happy with and for him to be part of the new look coaching team going forward.
“Shaun has decided not to take that contract, which we must respect and we wish Shaun he very best in what lies ahead for him post Wales.”

Shaun Edwards said:
“After more than ten years with Wales this has been an incredibly difficult decision to reach but I won’t be renewing my contract. I would like to thank Warren and the WRU for the opportunity I have had working with the national team.”
“We have won four Six Nations titles during my time with Wales, but I sincerely hope and believe that the best days are yet to come and I am fully focused on seeing what we can achieve in Japan.”

Current Wales head coach Warren Gatland said:
“Shaun has been an important part of the Wales set up over the past 11 years for what has been a hugely rewarding time for Welsh rugby.
“It is pleasing that we can draw a line under the speculation regarding Shaun’s future with this announcement and we can look forward to preparing the squad for the RWC and the tournament itself in Japan later this year.”​

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Post by maestegmafia on Thu 02 May 2019, 11:12 am

That is a shame, even if he had only stayed for a transition period I would have been overjoyed. He has been an immense help to wales at national and ego all level.

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Post by miaow on Thu 02 May 2019, 11:48 am

Wonder how we'll be feeling about this in 12 months' time.

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Post by LondonTiger on Thu 02 May 2019, 12:40 pm

I wonder where he will be going. While this will stop the speculation about whether he is staying, speculation as to his future will continue.

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Post by LordDowlais on Thu 02 May 2019, 1:19 pm

He will end up in France I reckon, there are a lot of rich owners after his services.

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Post by The Oracle on Thu 02 May 2019, 2:21 pm

A difficult position for the WRU.  Edwards indicated he was  joining with Wigan, Pivac apparently spoke with him anyway and Edwards made it clear he was joining Wigan.  Pivac/WRU then turns to and offers Hayward a role.  Edwards turns around and says he's not off to Wigan and that he'd be interested in staying, but WRU have now got a defence coach (Hayward) so they can't back track on that and can probably only offer Edwards the job share.  Plus Edwards wanted more than a 2 year contract, which is fair enough for his service to Wales so far, but it would have been more than Pivac and the other coaches were on so probably not fair to treat Edwards differently.  Ultimately Edwards'  indecision with the Wigan thing has cost him (and Wales), that's if he wanted to stay and was not just playing off various parties against each other for the best contract!
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Post by miaow on Thu 02 May 2019, 3:14 pm

It doesn't look good all round. He was meant to be leaving in 2011 after headbutting a member of the Welsh backroom staff. Now Wigan, and now Wales as well - not sure what his issue is but if he doesn't have an agent he should probably get one. Doesn't seem very good at career planning.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Thu 02 May 2019, 6:22 pm

I don't care if he was demanding his own castle, we should have given it to him on the condition he stayed and didn't let Byron Hayward infect the players with his poor coaching. Shocking decision. If Hayward is in the role then we'll be very easy to score tries against. I can only hope out attack improves so we score more than the opposition.

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Post by whocares on Thu 02 May 2019, 8:58 pm

LordDowlais wrote:He will end up in France I reckon, there are a lot of rich owners after his services.

He has been confirmed as French defense coach after the WC. Shame they didn’t nick Garland as well. Great addition in any case , just hope he won’t get turned off by the mediocrity of the rest of coaches .

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Post by Pie on Fri 03 May 2019, 1:02 am

France will drive Edwards mad...he wont stay long. The guy is taciturn, charmless, serious highly strung and a micro manager and French rugby will chew him up and spit him out

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Post by maestegmafia on Fri 03 May 2019, 7:10 am

whocares wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:He will end up in France I reckon, there are a lot of rich owners after his services.

He has been confirmed as French defense coach after the WC. Shame they didn’t nick Garland as well. Great addition in any case , just hope he won’t get turned off by the mediocrity of the rest of coaches .

I read that too, with Fabien Gaulthie taking over as head coach...! Apparently FG might have a minor role in Japan too alongside Brunel?

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Post by SecretFly on Fri 03 May 2019, 10:23 am

Oh go easy. If his signature isn't on any form yet (and even if it is) then I'd be very careful in hailing him as next French defence coach until he actually shows up in that position next year.. Those topsy turvy pangs of mid-life crisis might hit him again over a weekend and he might be coaxed by Farrell to join Ireland! Yeah....for about three weeks he might have even joined Ireland (lotsa head butting practice there)...... oh no I haven't! - I'm going back to Wales...again - again.

BTW...why won't selfish and ungrateful Gats take him to wherever he ends up? Why don't Gats just say his services come as a unit, with Edwards and nothing else? Because I think that might be the reason why Edwards has seemed to be a little astray in his decision making lately - marriage ending blues.

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Post by miaow on Fri 03 May 2019, 11:52 am

Gats is after the All Blacks job. He's playing it cool/by ear to try and get a Super Rugby job, and probably the Lions as well. No need for Edwards in NZ, he'll be adapting his gameplan to a less structured, less defence-oriented way of playing the game. He might look at Edwards for the Lions but no chance he'd take him to NZ.

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Post by SecretFly on Fri 03 May 2019, 12:30 pm

That's interesting too though.  I'm not a big fan of Lions so don't hold much in my memory banks about the details of each tour...but has Gatland ever used Edwards in his Lions jaunts?
My frail memory tends to believe the answer is 'No'?

Which, if true, is quite pointed and suggests a very complex relationship between the two... good enough for Wales but not the Lions?

Now I might be all wrong there but it just seems that Edwards and the Lions is just something I don't even have a rusty memory of.

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Post by miaow on Fri 03 May 2019, 1:30 pm

No, I think to avoid accusations of bias (maybe) he went for Farrell in 2013 and 2017. Tbh I think Edwards is probably on par with Farrell, if not better. Edwards did go in 09 with Geech but you sense that Gatland was as much, if not moreso, the real leader of that tour, with Geech the more huamanistic foil. Farrell probably adds more as a 'man' than Shaun does, and Gatland obviously likes his continuity, but considering where Farrell will be in 2021, I can't see him taking the Lions defensive coach role. Which means if Shaun Edwards doesn't go to France, he's surely front-runner.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Fri 03 May 2019, 2:19 pm

miaow wrote:Farrell probably adds more as a 'man' than Shaun does

What does that mean?

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Post by miaow on Fri 03 May 2019, 2:36 pm

Around the camp stuff. Shaun Edwards has been involved in his fair share of scraps with staff. Dont think Andy Farrells ever been involved in something like that at this level.

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Post by SecretFly on Fri 03 May 2019, 2:44 pm

If that's the kind of raw, uncompromising, in your face Rugby that's played when a wild boy coach runs around having scraps with folk singering staff...then I'm all for it.

Would I like Edwards as a man? Hmmm, would he like me? It makes no difference. I've always liked him as a coach, because I think it's him that gets the Welsh boys into that passion (controlled) that gives them the drive to keep driving right to the end.

Rage is good (in rugby) as long as you can contain and control it a bit. Rage is what has been missing in Schmidt's Ireland. Maybe it will make a comeback post WC.

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Post by Pie on Sat 04 May 2019, 2:45 am

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
miaow wrote:Farrell probably adds more as a 'man' than Shaun does

What does that mean?

Isn't it clear?

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Post by Rugby Fan on Sat 04 May 2019, 5:51 am

Bit peculiar by Edwards. I've seen some claims that he was always just using Wigan as a bargaining chip but I don't think he needed a public job offer to convince other potential employers he was in demand. Wales, Wasps and Leicester were interested in him too, by all acounts.

It sounds like he just couldn't make up his mind, or perhaps was hoping to string out a decision until other pieces fell into place (perhaps including an England offer, or Gatland taking a job, and wanting Edwards on board)

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Tue 07 May 2019, 11:03 am

Pie wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
miaow wrote:Farrell probably adds more as a 'man' than Shaun does

What does that mean?

Isn't it clear?

I didn't think it was clear at all, which is why I asked the question.

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Post by Irish Londoner on Tue 07 May 2019, 11:08 am

Leeds Rhinos have just sacked their head coach and by RL standards have money to burn, might be worth a small wager on Edwards.

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Post by Pie on Thu 09 May 2019, 3:04 am

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
Pie wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
miaow wrote:Farrell probably adds more as a 'man' than Shaun does

What does that mean?

Isn't it clear?

I didn't think it was clear at all, which is why I asked the question.

Clearly

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Post by The Oracle on Thu 09 May 2019, 10:52 am

I'm still not sure what he meant.  Is he saying that Farrell is more of a man?  In what sense?  And why 'man' in inverted commas?  What is the insinuation?  That Edwards should not be deemed worthy of the title of 'man' because he has been in some scraps?  Is that less manly?  

That's why it's not clear.


Last edited by The Oracle on Thu 09 May 2019, 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Thu 09 May 2019, 11:01 am

Putting 'man' in inverted commas made it even less clear.

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Post by SecretFly on Thu 09 May 2019, 11:04 am

I think he might mean that it takes a man to walk away from guys goading you to fight. It seems that at least anecdotally, Edwards is not such a man. If the proverbial little lady trying to cross the road refuses his assistance........?

Is that what he meant? Obviously, it's all just opinions - and we all know how dangerous them things are in this PC storm trooper era.

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Post by LordDowlais on Thu 09 May 2019, 1:09 pm

Anyway back to the topic.

Sean Edwards is the one "man" I am upset at losing. He will leave a massive void to be filled, his personality alone will be missed. You could see he demanded respect of everyone.

Howler and McBryde, meh, best of luck to both of them in all their endeavours , but I will not miss them from coaching Wales.

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Post by SecretFly on Thu 09 May 2019, 7:01 pm

LordDowlais wrote:

Howler and McBryde, meh, best of luck to both of them in all their endeavours , but I will not miss them from coaching Wales.

Just a word of warning in that presumption, Lord. We here in Ireland got rid of a coach some years ago and whilst some felt he was a good one and hard done by, I know that many of us felt we wouldn't miss him.

You probably know who he is and he's been haunting us ever since! Cool

One other point. There seems to be a big 'top player' involvement in many coaching decisions in Ireland. Influential players at Provincial level or International tend to get their thoughts into the mix...and over all, they seem to be good at choosing coaches - some duds over the decades, but many good ones.

If Howler is in line to go to Munster...it's more than the choice of Van Graan.

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Post by LordDowlais on Fri 10 May 2019, 8:25 am

SecretFly wrote:If Howler is in line to go to Munster...it's more than the choice of Van Graan.

I suppose he is good at what he does, but Munster can kiss goodbye to any imagination with their backs.

It will be structured and turgid. Slow build up, and capitalise on any mistakes.

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Post by SecretFly on Fri 10 May 2019, 10:01 am

Funny, but that's never how I'd read Wales in the backs department. I'd say over the years they've played a lot of hot seat-of-the-pants, instinctive play-what-you-see effective counter-attacking rugby.

Yes, maybe that overall package lacked something at times (that long stretch of nearly-there games against Australia for example) but I think those were all only game management issues that implicated all facets of play and all areas - forwards, backs, coaches.

You don't get Welsh crowds screaming for blood (a stage they get to plenty times) by playing back water turgid stuff.

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Post by LordDowlais on Fri 10 May 2019, 10:57 am

SecretFly wrote:Funny, but that's never how I'd read Wales in the backs department.  I'd say over the years they've played a lot of hot seat-of-the-pants, instinctive play-what-you-see effective counter-attacking rugby.

Yes, maybe that overall package lacked something at times (that long stretch of nearly-there games against Australia for example) but I think those were all only game management issues that implicated all facets of play and all areas - forwards, backs, coaches.

You don't get Welsh crowds screaming for blood (a stage they get to plenty times) by playing back water turgid stuff.

Seriously ? You have never seen it ? We have all been on about it on here ?

Also, Gatlandball ? It was not all down to Gatland.


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Post by SecretFly on Fri 10 May 2019, 11:17 am

Well it was for Gatlandball that Gatland was sacked by Ireland. He either didn't see the value of or wasn't persuaded by the talent of back play. Or maybe he just didn't like EOS brwthing down his neck and getting any backslaps for effective back play.
Well whatever if was, Gatlandball didn't exactly start in Wales and there was no Howley in Ireland.

Still say you don't nearly appreciate the back play ability and displays often shown over the years by Welsh players under Howley as much as outside observers.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Fri 10 May 2019, 11:17 am

I think a few years ago there was real dissatisfaction with the way Wales played - they called it typewriter rugby, going blind until there was no blindside left, then working across field again - and it was really boring rugby to watch, even when it was successful. Phase-obsessed stuff. (Naturally there were exceptions to the rule when we played some attractive stuff.) But this is a long time ago, back when Mike Phillips was scrum half.

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Post by RiscaGame on Fri 10 May 2019, 12:06 pm

Our try scoring record still isn't great, to be fair. Whether you could pin that purely on Howley is debatable (given that Gatland is fairly pragmatic), but I suppose most of the flack is going to come your way when you're the attack coach. Be interesting to see what he can do, without being overseen by Gats for once.

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Post by SecretFly on Fri 10 May 2019, 12:19 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Our try scoring record still isn't great, to be fair. Whether you could pin that purely on Howley is debatable (given that Gatland is fairly pragmatic), but I suppose most of the flack is going to come your way when you're the attack coach. Be interesting to see what he can do, without being overseen by Gats for once.

I suppose that's the nuts and bolts of the argument.  Backs coach does his bit of the equation in the training field but he's not responsible for how often of when that work gets used through 80 minutes.  If the Head Coach wants a tight game controlled through the forwards then I'd dare any player or sub coach arrive with the idea that they're going to play it all their way and not abide by overall game tactics.

The bit that has most impressed me about Wales over the years is that mood they get into when they have to chase a game.  Now some might argue that they've been in that kind of a game too often but others might say that's how Gats coaches it and largely he's had a successful coaching career.
But back to the bit that impresses me - it IS when the are forced to chase.  And if anybody tries to tell me that those Welsh players loosening up and going for broke in open field attack play don't often look very slick and dangerous then I'll suggest spec savers to the observer.  Now, how big a role does/did Howley have in preparing that kind of gameplan for the going for broke game?

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