Gatland to lead the Lions in 2021.......again!

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Post by TightHEAD on Fri May 10, 2019 9:21 am

Gatland to lead the Lions to SA in 2021

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/48224634?filter=none


I guess this rules him out of the England job post RWC, guess he is waiting for the All Blacks, still. thumbsup


Last edited by TightHEAD on Fri May 10, 2019 9:28 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by maestegmafia on Fri May 10, 2019 9:27 am

Not a huge surprise

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Post by maestegmafia on Fri May 10, 2019 9:27 am

Be interesting to see who his coaches will be

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Post by Rinsure on Fri May 10, 2019 9:28 am

Too early to start talking about who might get picked, and accusing him of Welsh bias yet?

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Post by TightHEAD on Fri May 10, 2019 9:32 am

Never.

Hogg or Williams at FB?
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Post by No 7&1/2 on Fri May 10, 2019 9:38 am

Urrghh. Good news and bad news as an England and Lions fan then.

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Post by tigertattie on Fri May 10, 2019 10:03 am

If he hadnt been given the previous two tours then I'd say he was the right pick.

The lions coach should be someone not currently coaching a home nations side but has a connection to the home nations.

With Gats getting the last two, I'd have given the job to Schmit (if he wanted it) or to Vern Cotter.
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Post by R!skysports on Fri May 10, 2019 10:07 am

Sigh!

While a very successful coach, just a style I can not get behind

I think against the SA team it could be effective though

Ah well - at least not need to get too excited now

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Post by RiscaGame on Fri May 10, 2019 10:10 am

Great news. Only man for the job. You can't argue with his record as a Lions coach really.

I would still expect him to pick a lot of Welsh players, as he will know that they are the ones that do as they're told (as he has said). But at least he can now make selections, without the accusations of being fearful of upsetting players, when he gets back to being Wales coach.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Fri May 10, 2019 10:18 am

SA tours are the best tours in my view. Look forward to this one quite a bit. If it was this year Id expect the Lions to whitewash SA so interesting to see how the lie of the land will be when it happens.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Fri May 10, 2019 10:22 am

I think you can argue with his record as a lions coach personally. Even if looking purely at results that Aus tour should have been a comfortable 3 0.

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Post by RiscaGame on Fri May 10, 2019 10:26 am

Maybe so, though he did achieve a series win. I don't really look back like that, otherwise you could probably find fault with any teams' wins. All that mattered was the series win, which he achieved.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Fri May 10, 2019 10:29 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:I think you can argue with his record as a lions coach personally. Even if looking purely at results that Aus tour should have been a comfortable 3 0.

I thought we made very hard work of a really poor Aus team on that tour. Especially when you consider that England, Ireland and Scotland have all gone down there and won their tests recently.

Like you say he has earned it though and I agree that this tour will probably suit him more than others. I would love to see them win in SA. The '09 and '97 are my favorite tours of all time.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Fri May 10, 2019 10:37 am

I do like the south africa tour. Similar times of the day helps as I'm fully awake!

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Post by Collapse2005 on Fri May 10, 2019 10:42 am

Yeah that's true 7.5 although its not bad getting up first thing and watching the games in OZ/NZ too. Good start to the day.

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Post by TightHEAD on Fri May 10, 2019 12:40 pm

Anyone up for going?

The NZ tour was a great memory maker.
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Post by Collapse2005 on Fri May 10, 2019 12:48 pm

Id love to

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Post by tigertattie on Fri May 10, 2019 12:53 pm

606v2 on tour?

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Post by Collapse2005 on Fri May 10, 2019 12:55 pm

sounds like good craic

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Post by mikey_dragon on Fri May 10, 2019 11:45 pm

I didn’t think anyone English or Scottish in here would go on tour seeing as they’re all anti-lions. If Gats helps them win 3-0 in SA it’ll still be in spite of him, and on top of that you’ll still find something to whinge about. If you are Scottish then don’t get your hopes up, Gatland doesn’t rate you that much...

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Post by Taylorman on Sat May 11, 2019 3:10 am

Nice one Gats, living the life, making buks off the backs of others. Laugh

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Post by nth on Sat May 11, 2019 5:26 am

I hope that we see a more entertaining style of rugby this tour. Too many matches have been pretty laborious in recent times. There are some very exciting B&I players around at the moment, it would be great to see a gameplan picked to fit and showcase them, something they can get excited about and play with real enjoyment.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat May 11, 2019 9:35 am

Yeah it would be good to see the Lions rip SA apart with some nice back play.

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Post by maestegmafia on Sat May 11, 2019 10:27 am

nth wrote:I hope that we see a more entertaining style of rugby this tour.  Too many matches have been pretty laborious in recent times.  There are some very exciting B&I players around at the moment, it would be great to see a gameplan picked to fit and showcase them, something they can get excited about and play with real enjoyment.

This is a common argument these days, so few people believe that coaches work towards the style of rugby to suit the players available rather than trying to impose a stringent game on the players.

The Scots certainly have some very exciting backs to pick that haven’t been on tour before

The four way battle for the 13 shirt is going to be very exciting, Huw Jones, Garry Ringrose, Henry Slade and JD2.

Selection is going to be very hard, the four home nations teams are currently the most equal I have seen them in decades

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat May 11, 2019 10:35 am

Some 13s there alright.

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Post by BamBam on Sat May 11, 2019 10:53 am

Tuilagi too!

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Post by Rugby Fan on Sat May 11, 2019 6:07 pm

Don't think anyone can deny Gatland's credentials for the job. However, variety being the spice of life, and all that, I'd prefer to see someone else given the job. Graham Henry ran a poor tour in 2001 but said he learned a lot fom the experience, which helped him take New Zealand to a World Cup title. I wouldn't mind seeing a home nations coach given the chance just to see what they could do. Still, the Lions committee wants to protect and build the brand, and Gatland has proved he can do that.

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Post by Taylorman on Sat May 11, 2019 11:44 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:I thinking’s you can argue with his record as a lions coach personally. Even if looking purely at results that Aus tour should have been a comfortable 3 0.

Ha ha, they could have been 2-0 down. ‘Comfortable’ Laugh

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Post by Rugby Fan on Sun May 12, 2019 1:45 am

Taylorman wrote:Ha ha, they could have been 2-0 down. ‘Comfortable’ Laugh
That's the point, though. The Lions could have been 2-0 down but should have been comfortably the better side. I'm sure I wasn't alone in thinking we might see a repeat of 2001, which is a series the Lions definitely should have won. It's to Gatland's credit that we did get a victory, since he kept the squad together in a way the 1983, 1993, 2001 and 2005 tours notably failed to do. The only real controversy was over the dropping of BOD. It was poor management on his part - having wheeled BOD out for pre-match interviews - but the actual selection decision was vindicated by the result, and looked even better over time, as the quality of JD2 became more evident.

It works the other way too. Only a vey debatable penalty handed the All Blacks victort in the first Test in 1993. Had the Lions won that game, they might have taken the series, even though most players believe New Zealand were the better side. In 1997, the Lions did beat what was probably the better team, helped in part by Springbok overconfidence.

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Post by Taylorman on Sun May 12, 2019 4:08 am

Aha, so a side that shoulda won, didnt, and a side that won a decider should have won comfortably, where just about every other side, lost.

Ok then thumbsup

And yes it does work the other way. A very debatable penalty or non penalty looks to have decided the 2017 series as well. Though the 93 Lions were thrashed in one test, the 2017 Lions well beaten in the first as well.

Seems the Lions win with a lot of difficulty, ‘comfort’ rarely seen since 74.

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Post by Taylorman on Sun May 12, 2019 4:19 am

Rugby Fan wrote:Don't think anyone can deny Gatland's credentials for the job. However, variety being the spice of life, and all that, I'd prefer to see someone else given the job. Graham Henry ran a poor tour in 2001 but said he learned a lot fom the experience, which helped him take New Zealand to a World Cup title. I wouldn't mind seeing a home nations coach given the chance just to see what they could do. Still, the Lions committee wants to protect and build the brand, and Gatland has proved he can do that.

Could have helped him to a losing world cup as well, but that doesnt fit the narrative? Think he learnt far more from the 2007 world cup than anything else, as did NZ rugby overall.

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Post by Taylorman on Sun May 12, 2019 4:21 am

nth wrote:I hope that we see a more entertaining style of rugby this tour.  Too many matches have been pretty laborious in recent times.  There are some very exciting B&I players around at the moment, it would be great to see a gameplan picked to fit and showcase them, something they can get excited about and play with real enjoyment.

Yes, now that would be something! thumbsup

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Sun May 12, 2019 7:04 am

Yeah that was my point. We huffed against Australia we should have strolled past them.

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Post by Taylorman on Sun May 12, 2019 7:40 am

Well there should be a stroll this time based on the current rankings or it will be a complete farce, three of the four sides that make up the Lions ranked above SA. If he cant get a team to win a series with that the tours may as well stop.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Sun May 12, 2019 9:01 am

Hopefully he actually realises there are 4 teams to pick from.

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Post by yappysnap on Sun May 12, 2019 10:13 am

Scotland dont always do themselvea any favoura by being pretty poor quite often. Except against England anyway.

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Post by WELL-PAST-IT on Sun May 12, 2019 11:04 am

SA up in the thin air at Joburg are very different from at Cape Town or playing away. I bet the schedule shows at least two games at altitude where they hold a distinct advantage.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Mon May 13, 2019 8:18 am

Taylorman wrote:Well there should be a stroll this time based on the current rankings or it will be a complete farce, three of the four sides that make up the Lions ranked above SA. If he cant get a team to win a series with that the tours may as well stop.

So NZ should give up too having lost at home to SA?

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon May 13, 2019 9:28 am

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:SA up in the thin air at Joburg are very different from at Cape Town or playing away. I bet the schedule shows at least two games at altitude where they hold a distinct advantage.

I always wondered how the Cape Town players managed at altitude? I guess they play enough away games to be conditioned to it

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Post by TightHEAD on Mon May 13, 2019 9:30 am

mikey_dragon wrote:I didn’t think anyone English or Scottish in here would go on tour seeing as they’re all anti-lions.

Not anti-Lions as such, just anti-Welsh negative tactics.
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Post by maestegmafia on Mon May 13, 2019 12:42 pm

TightHEAD wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:I didn’t think anyone English or Scottish in here would go on tour seeing as they’re all anti-lions.

Not anti-Lions as such, just anti-Welsh negative tactics.

What welsh tactics are you talking about and what has that got to do with the way the lions will play?




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Post by TightHEAD on Mon May 13, 2019 4:52 pm

Everyone knows.
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Post by maestegmafia on Mon May 13, 2019 5:44 pm

TightHEAD wrote:Everyone knows.

Everyone knows wales are the top team in the home nations, that could well change as the teams are all pretty close.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Mon May 13, 2019 5:50 pm

You wish.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon May 13, 2019 5:55 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:You wish.
Isn’t beating all the opposition conclusive enough for you? It seems to be when your team win...!

As I said all the home nations are closely matched, it will be a competitive selection. I imagine all the nations will have very even amounts of players in the lions squad.

I also would imagine that the brand of rugby is to be designed with the abilities of the players and opposition in mind rather than some predetermined game plan.

Let’s see how the game develops over the RWC, before making crass assumptions.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Mon May 13, 2019 5:57 pm

Clearly not maes. England and Ireland are currently better than Wales. Just the way it is. Everyone knows that surely.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon May 13, 2019 6:40 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Clearly not maes. England and Ireland are currently better than Wales. Just the way it is. Everyone knows that surely.
surely if they were better they would have the ability to beat Wales?

Even when you compare England and Wales to Scotland there is a disparency. England drew at Twickenham against a Scots team that both Ireland and Wales beat in Edinburgh?

And just before England drew at home with Scotland Wales comfortably beat Ireland

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Post by BigGee on Mon May 13, 2019 6:59 pm

There will be a WC between now and the next Lions tour and after that there will surely be a changing of the guard. Some of Gatland's go to guys from the last two tours will surely not be going on the next one.

Sean O'Brien
Johnny Sexton
Alan Wyn Jones
Sam Warbutton

are four that spring to mind an there will be others whom age, form and injury will prevent going.

I will be curious as to how Gats selects now that he is not tied to Wales, it certainly puts a new dynamic into the situation. I hope he really does pick across the 4 nations this time though but he does have a lot of work to do to restore faith in the process up in Scotland. Rightly or wrongly a lot of us have been turned off the concept by our lack of inclusion.


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Post by maestegmafia on Mon May 13, 2019 7:01 pm

BigGee wrote:There will be a WC between now and the next Lions tour and after that there will surely be a changing of the guard. Some of Gatland's go to guys from the last two tours will surely not be going on the next one.

Sean O'Brien
Johnny Sexton
Alan Wyn Jones
Sam Warbutton

are four that spring to mind an there will be others whom age, form and injury will prevent going.

I will be curious as to how Gats selects now that he is not tied to Wales, it certainly puts a new dynamic into the situation. I hope he really does pick across the 4 nations this time though but he does have a lot of work to do to restore faith in the process up in Scotland. Rightly or wrongly a lot of us have been turned off the concept by our lack of inclusion.


As I mentioned above BG the four home unions are very close at the moment and I think the selection will reflect that for sure.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Mon May 13, 2019 7:03 pm

Lol right you are maes. Dear me.

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