ICC Cricket World Cup - Part 3

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Post by LondonTiger on Fri 21 Jun 2019, 2:26 pm

First topic message reminder :

Table

Australia8141.00
India7110.85
New Zealand8110.57
England8101.00
Pakistan89-0.80
Sri Lanka88-0.93
Bangladesh77-0.13
South Africa85-0.08
West Indies83-0.36
Afghanistan80-1.42
Remaining Pool Fixtures

Tue, Jul 2 
10:30 Bangladesh vs India (Edgbaston)

Wed, Jul 3 
10:30 England vs New Zealand (Riverside Ground)

Thu, Jul 4 
10:30 Afghanistan vs West Indies (Headingley)

Fri, Jul 5 
10:30 Bangladesh vs Pakistan (Lord’s)

Sat, Jul 6 
10:30 India vs Sri Lanka (Headingley)
13:30 Australia vs South Africa (Old Trafford)




Knock Out Fixtures


To Follow


Last edited by LondonTiger on Tue 02 Jul 2019, 9:32 am; edited 2 times in total

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Post by eirebilly on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:12 am

guildfordbat wrote:
eirebilly wrote:If not Hales then who Guildford? England simply cannot keep opening with Vince, he is a walking wicket and at least Hales has a proven track record. I see your point re the amount of games Hales has played but do not agree with it being a desperate act, I feel Vince was the desperate act.

Well done, Billy! You were just meant to marvel at my point about Hales and not ask what I would do instead! Wink

As you rightly push me, I would be tempted to adopt a softer approach with the first power play and push Root up to open with Bairstow. Try to have Root bat 30+ overs and then him and/or others properly go for it. Unless Vince bats lower down the order (and I'm not keen on even that given his current record), someone still needs to come in for him. I would seriously consider Dawson coming off the bench for the number 6/7 spot - he's a reliable performer in the county game and had a very good RL 50 just gone. Far from ideal, I grant you, but I can't think of anyone outside the current squad demanding a batting place. Phil Salt at Sussex is a young opener I've mentioned before but I don't think it's his time yet.


I would not be a huge fan of Root opening (although he does tend to come in early when Vince opens) and would prefer him at 3. If Root is to open and lets face it, its the best option right now, I would not be convinced with Woakes at 3. I would boost Stokes as he has the mental strength to see off the Indian attack. For me, Curran and Plunket have to come in for Ali/Rashid and Archer. There is Always Root for the extra spin option.
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Post by KP_fan on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:13 am

Gooseberry wrote:Looks like Bairstow has been following kpf on here
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/48794213

I heard Bairstow, Morgan, Root & Stokes speak(on TMS and post match) in the aftermath of Australian defeat & the disturbingly common content:

-We were unlucky against Aus & denied having any problems with their game. All of them avoided /circumvented any reference to Lanka games. Anderson although not in the ODI team but part of current set-up echoed similar views

-We are under siege because commentators & experts are criticizing us for our losses
And the implied part " Judge us nor talk about our failures in the world cup but judge us only on the 2 or 3 years of ODI games before that and even when doing so please exclude the CT semi-final loss, we were unlucky there too"
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Post by Gooseberry on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:14 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:As much as we’d like to see Hales come back, he isn’t. He was skating on thin ice after Bristol, and then coming upto the biggest tournament of his career he literally blew it (yes that’s a drug pun) and ultimately has ended up costing the team in more ways than we could have ever seen.


Absolutely agree. Its on a par with the idea England were gonna recall Pietersen.

It must stick in his throat a bit to see the likes of Amir, Warner and Smith bossing it at the world cup mind. He just timed his screw ups very badly. But he needs to own his drug use and deal with that, the petulant way he try to make out like he was the victim after failing drug tests that in many sports wouldve seen him with a 2 year plus ban sums up the entitled attitude thats no doubt led him down this path in the first place.

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Post by eirebilly on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:14 am

There is now way I want England to fail, I want them to do well but the mental frailties are clear in this side. Frailties that sides like India and Australia do not have as mentioned before.
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Post by Gooseberry on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:15 am

KP_fan wrote:

-We are under siege because commentators & experts are criticizing us for our losses



They didn't mean you

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Post by Pal Joey on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:32 am

Bairstow seems to be losing it. "We're still in the World Cup and we're playing a great brand of cricket."  

I can agree with the first part of that sentence but the second?  They are not playing a great brand of cricket at all... losing 3 matches.
Who's he kidding? And someone on here called the Australians "arrogant".

I rest my case, Your Honour.
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Post by KP_fan on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:37 am

Nothing to play for & Nothing to Lose game for SA
vs Do or Die for Lanka today
Dunno who is under more pressure and which side more motivated to win.

Among the outside chance teams.....Inspite of the open situation for Lanka....they neither make me confident nor excite me.....like Pak does
Pak has potential to go all the way, Lank will crumble sooner than later.....possibly today.
They have neither a batting-line up in form, nor fast bowling nor high quality spinners......
I would back SA today to win
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Post by Pal Joey on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:47 am

Oh I dunno KP_f... you may be right.

I feel as though I've made an error tipping SA in the competition. Not properly thinking it over given SL's recently improving form and fighting qualities and SA's propensity to self-destruct in these types of pressure situations. Now I've probably jinxed them too by tipping them to win.

OK... I'll go join Bairstow, Vaughan, the real KP in the naughty queue now. Smile
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Post by KP_fan on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:49 am

Pal Joey wrote:Bairstow seems to be losing it. "We're still in the World Cup and we're playing a great brand of cricket."  

Swann, Vaughan, Agnew, Conney are all disturbed at this delusional mentality emanating from Eng's dressing room.
If you don't acknowledge the problem......how are you gonna fix it Shocked
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Post by eirebilly on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 9:21 am

I think that the Aussies do get accused or arrogance but I feel that is miss-placed. The Aussies have a very strong belief in themselves and to some, more reserved types, that comes across as arrogance.

Strength of character and determination does not equal arrogance for me.

Most individuals or teams that have those traits are the ones you often see picking up winners medals.
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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 9:26 am

Pal Joey wrote:Bairstow seems to be losing it. "We're still in the World Cup and we're playing a great brand of cricket."  

I can agree with the first part of that sentence but the second?  They are not playing a great brand of cricket at all... losing 3 matches.
Who's he kidding? And someone on here called the Australians "arrogant".

I rest my case, Your Honour.

Bairstow is certainly whinging like an Aussie... Whistle boxing Run
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Post by Duty281 on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 9:30 am

Wouldn't be surprised if Sri Lanka upset South Africa, to be honest. The Saffers attitude throughout the tournament has been pretty poor, while the Sri Lankans are scrapping for every two-point opportunity and punching above their weight.

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Post by guildfordbat on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 9:43 am

eirebilly wrote:There is now way I want England to fail, I want them to do well but the mental frailties are clear in this side. Frailties that sides like India and Australia do not have as mentioned before.

Hi Billy - a cricketer you would like is Tom Curran. Mentally and physically strong, regularly putting in the hard yards and the overs in the 4 day game and never ducking responsibility for the powerplays in the white ball game.

Not to say this should necessarily get him in the England eleven but I thought worth flagging given the discussion.

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Post by Pal Joey on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 9:43 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Pal Joey wrote:Bairstow seems to be losing it. "We're still in the World Cup and we're playing a great brand of cricket."  

I can agree with the first part of that sentence but the second?  They are not playing a great brand of cricket at all... losing 3 matches.
Who's he kidding? And someone on here called the Australians "arrogant".

I rest my case, Your Honour.

Bairstow is certainly whinging like an Aussie... Whistle boxing Run

ha ha. well not really. You'd never hear an Aussie who's losing say things are all going well and we're playing great cricket.

Remember them 12 months ago... tears streaming down their faces. Crying or Very sad laughing
If we lose though - I bet Justin Langer will crank up the whingy-whiney meter. Something about the guy... he's not a good loser. He's a cranky pants.
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Post by Nathaniel Jacobs on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 10:38 am

Bairstow comes across as massively immature. I recall when he lost his Test play and he was moaning like a child.

His interview yesterday was massively embarrassing. So the pitches aren’t as flat as before, so is he not able to adapt his game?

Maybe Bairstow should look in the mirror before engaging his mouth.

His stupidity at blaming everyone has added more pressure heading into the most crucial game of the tournament

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Post by wisden on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 12:42 pm

SL 111-5, really let South Africa off here, after some poor bowling

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Post by alfie on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 1:00 pm

I didn't actually see the Bairstow interview (was it on TV) but I rather doubt he actively sought out the media to have a whinge...

"BBC played him a tape of Vaughan saying England were headed for their worst World Cup" ...hmm. Looking for a bite ?

Of course he should have said nothing more than "he's entitled to his opinion" but you can see why he instead had a go back. Don't think he meant the fans aren't behind them ; just fed up of the armchair pundits who love a headline (looking at you , KP) and to be honest it does sometimes look as if they do prefer disasters over success. What he should have learned in media school (think they all get it now ?) is that you can never win having a go at the press : whatever your real motivation you will always be portrayed as a moaner...

I'd be concerned about all these "we are playing a great brand of cricket , best in the world , etc ," comments if they are just a case of self delusion. Which they may be , I guess. But hopefully it is more of a team attitude of "everyone is against us , let's go out and prove them wrong" : a mind set that , whether justified or not , can actually serve to produce a outstanding performance when it's really needed.

Talk is cheap anyway. Proof will be what they do on the field.

I do have little time for Vaughan though. His detailed summary of England's problems and best solutions which I read this morning made a lot of sense. He can analyze very well. It is his often mischievous headline loving put downs that annoy me (and the likes of Bairstow , no doubt.) He's been in the hot seat ; he knows the pressure they are under . He doesn't need to stick pins in them just to get Internet hits.
I don't expect Vaughan - or any "journalist" - to be 100% England fan boy. But I think he could refrain from stirring trouble. Would have been a start if he'd just ignored Bairstow's comments instead of having another go , helping to distract everyone from the business of trying to win the last two games.

If I were an International cricketer I think I'd simply refuse any request for an interview unless it were on the end of a series or cup win : anything you say when you're losing is going to get you trashed.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 1:10 pm

Jeevan Mendis currently playing one of the worst innings of this world cup so far
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Post by Gooseberry on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 1:17 pm

Excellent post Alfie. Its worth noting too that Vaughn was one of the chief drum beaters for the over hyping of England when things were going well. Hes very much become a barometer of fan opinion and become a human tabloid headline in many of his interviews. But hes also been quite astute at times in his analysis when not playing the likes game. 

As for Nathaniel saying someone seems childish ...hmm. 

Having Roy back is a huge boost for England. Its looking increasingly certain he will play now.

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Post by Nathaniel Jacobs on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 1:27 pm

Gooseberry wrote:Excellent post Alfie. Its worth noting too that Vaughn was one of the chief drum beaters for the over hyping of England when things were going well. Hes very much become a barometer of fan opinion and become a human tabloid headline in many of his interviews. But hes also been quite astute at times in his analysis when not playing the likes game. 

As for Nathaniel saying someone seems childish ...hmm

Having Roy back is a huge boost for England. Its looking increasingly certain he will play now.
Don’t worry about me dear fellow. Unlike Bairstow I’m not getting paid £850,000 per year...

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Post by alfie on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 1:30 pm

That's good news about Roy , Goose ! Think he makes a huge difference at the top of the order when he's in form (which he was before the injury) even when he doesn't get a big score his rattling start tends to put the bowlers on the back foot...hope you are correct about his fitness.

Meanwhile : Sri Lanka in heaps of trouble : 163/7 . Ten to go.

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Post by Pal Joey on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 2:21 pm

SL 203 all out. Well that wasn't worth staying up for. Go Saffers! Good night all.
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Post by VTR on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 3:46 pm

How the effing eff did England lose to Sri Lanka. If England go out, as does look likely, that result should be remembered as an all time sporting shocker alongside embarrassments like losing to Iceland at Euro 2016

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Post by KP_fan on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 3:47 pm

Lanka had only one mission on this trip.....to punish hosts for giving them crap itinerary, bad hotels & no swimming pools.....by delivering a knock-out blow to them....and lose everything before & after that. Very Happy
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Post by sirfredperry on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 3:49 pm

Forgive me if this has been raised before. But Malinga's action. Yes, his arm is straight but he brings it round so low that, to me, EVERY ball looks like a throw.

Thommo, among others, had a slingy action, but he brought his arm above his head so at least he was still BOWLING rather than spear-chucking.

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Post by KP_fan on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 4:14 pm

Vaughan hit back on Friday, saying the team had huge backing.

"How wrong can @jbairstow21 be," Vaughan posted on his Instagram account.

"Never has England team had so much support but it's you and your team that has disappointed Jonny..

"WIN 2 games and you are in the semis .. With this negative, pathetic mindset I am concerned though.. it's not the media's fault you have lost 3 games .. !!!"
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Post by Gooseberry on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 4:19 pm

This is plain embarrassing! (And yes I do mean my tipping competition pick for this game) 

SA look like the second best team at the world cup eh KPF  Whistle

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Post by sirfredperry on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 4:26 pm

Amazing how thin-skinned sportsmen can be and also how quickly guys who found it hard to handle criticism as a player become very critical when they become journalists/pundits.

But England players, whether it be footballers, cricketers, rugby players or what, should pretty much ALWAYS reckon that English journalists are very anxious for them to do well.

It's crazy for players to think the Press is "against them". The journalists are hoping for an England win.

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Post by Gooseberry on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 4:49 pm

sirfredperry wrote:Amazing how thin-skinned sportsmen can be and also how quickly guys who found it hard to handle criticism as a player become very critical when they become journalists/pundits.

But England players, whether it be footballers, cricketers, rugby players or what, should pretty much ALWAYS reckon that English journalists are very anxious for them to do well.

It's crazy for players to think the Press is "against them". The journalists are hoping for an England win.


But equally folk like Vaughn make their money through their hits. He says this stuff to generate controversy and traffic his way. Im sure he does really want England to win, especially after banging on about how great they are, but it doesnt stop him from being an absolute arse in a way he himself complained about the likes of Boycott doing to his team. 
He mirrors the fans, we love to rubbish them when their down and overhype them when they are up. 

He had a go at Rashid and then Broad over the summer, yet has been hyping up Rashid as Englands greatest ever limited overs spinner up till now. 

Yet when he was Captain he got into a row with the retired Flintoff over twitter comments. The guys a massive hypocrite if he actually genuinely believes his words. 

To be honest this stuff with the team now is pretty tame. Hes also been trying out extreme right wing politics in Katie Hopkins style, including bigging up Donald Trump and other things. Its all straight out of the Murdoch/Sky playbook and really sad to see. Obviously folk like KPF and the charming Nathaniel lap it up because it plays straight into that kind of hyperbolic taunting mindset, but its sad to see so many right minded fans baited by it as well. Im guessing KPF didnt read his comments about Indian roads. Again using racially insensitive language to stir up hits to his accounts by deliberately creating anger. Or him kicking off about the ICC celebrating Kholis achievements

Its not that the point is entirely without merit don't get me wrong, but the exaggerated language, lack of balance, name calling, petty jibes, sensationalism and purposeful misrepresentation is ...well pathetic. 

When he sticks to the cricket he can have stuff of merit to say. But when you also add in him trying to sell players he has a stake in the management of over those he doesnt it all adds up to him being a pretty odious individual. Everyone loves him when they are onside with his comments, and boo him when they arent. Hes just shifting tack and picking easy targets to go with the popular opinion. Criticise England by all means, but dont try and big up the professional troll (and yes he did learn this from Australians)

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Post by LondonTiger on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 7:43 pm

So, my ex-wife is currently in Manchester for work and staying in the same hotel that WI used. Apparently a large contingent were up all night partying.


No not after the thrashing from India - the night before the game!!!!!

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Post by KP_fan on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 7:51 pm

there are all kinda journalists....from jingoistic to hyper-critical
And UK has a Tabloid culture that thrives on sensationalizing things.

The players should be thick skinned and as a conscious strategy shut themselves from reading media or social media (like Kohli and many Indian cricketers do) ......during high profile series at-least.

And certainly refrain from responding / reacting......you only build more pressure on yourself doing so.
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Post by robbo277 on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:44 pm

Gooseberry wrote:
sirfredperry wrote:Amazing how thin-skinned sportsmen can be and also how quickly guys who found it hard to handle criticism as a player become very critical when they become journalists/pundits.

But England players, whether it be footballers, cricketers, rugby players or what, should pretty much ALWAYS reckon that English journalists are very anxious for them to do well.

It's crazy for players to think the Press is "against them". The journalists are hoping for an England win.


But equally folk like Vaughn make their money through their hits. He says this stuff to generate controversy and traffic his way. Im sure he does really want England to win, especially after banging on about how great they are, but it doesnt stop him from being an absolute arse in a way he himself complained about the likes of Boycott doing to his team. 
He mirrors the fans, we love to rubbish them when their down and overhype them when they are up. 

He had a go at Rashid and then Broad over the summer, yet has been hyping up Rashid as Englands greatest ever limited overs spinner up till now. 

Yet when he was Captain he got into a row with the retired Flintoff over twitter comments. The guys a massive hypocrite if he actually genuinely believes his words. 

To be honest this stuff with the team now is pretty tame. Hes also been trying out extreme right wing politics in Katie Hopkins style, including bigging up Donald Trump and other things. Its all straight out of the Murdoch/Sky playbook and really sad to see. Obviously folk like KPF and the charming Nathaniel lap it up because it plays straight into that kind of hyperbolic taunting mindset, but its sad to see so many right minded fans baited by it as well. Im guessing KPF didnt read his comments about Indian roads. Again using racially insensitive language to stir up hits to his accounts by deliberately creating anger. Or him kicking off about the ICC celebrating Kholis achievements

Its not that the point is entirely without merit don't get me wrong, but the exaggerated language, lack of balance, name calling, petty jibes, sensationalism and purposeful misrepresentation is ...well pathetic. 

When he sticks to the cricket he can have stuff of merit to say. But when you also add in him trying to sell players he has a stake in the management of over those he doesnt it all adds up to him being a pretty odious individual. Everyone loves him when they are onside with his comments, and boo him when they arent. Hes just shifting tack and picking easy targets to go with the popular opinion. Criticise England by all means, but dont try and big up the professional troll (and yes he did learn this from Australians)

Nailed it.

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Post by msp83 on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 8:58 pm

could not coe here often from the Australia-England game. Sri Lanka, who had yet another substandard pathetic game today, really helped open up the tournament with that shocker administered to England. England team feeling the heat a bit and not taking it well it seems. Bairstow was really poor... Pakistan's win against New Zealand means they will be pretty switched on for the Bangladesh game and it will be demanding for Bangladesh to make it through. England will have a couple of tough games, New Zealand need a win to secure themselves particularly if they lose to Australia. India, despite their batting weaknesses, is the side to beat in this WC. So the hosts have it tough, but I wouldn't rule them out. Again, like the Australia game, the pitches will be key, if they are going to be lively, England's chances get reduced significantly... But if they are batting friendly tracks, England will still be the most fearsome ODI side in the world. Thankfully, the ICC has done a pretty decent job not to deply too many highways for the WC. So England will have to get over the negative attitude or channelize it in the right direction to motivate themselves and be adaptable enough if they want to progress.

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Post by msp83 on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 9:04 pm

As for India, if they play England on a similar or same track as the one used for the Pak-NZ game, think they should seriously consider Sir Ravi Jadeja. Is there a better bowler who can maximize natural variation on the pitch? He'll be deadlier than Kuldeep and Chahal too.. But keep the rist spinner combination in tact, drop Vijay Shankar, not good enough with bat or ball, bring in Jadeja, let MS bat 4, Kedar 5 and Jadeja/Pandya at 6 and 7 depending on the match situation. Jadeja will further improve the Indian fielding too.
And Shami, what a statement from the man. He was the better bowler going into the tournament a head of Bhuvneshwar. Now he has progressed even further. He can't do anything but wildely slog with the bat in comparison to Kumar, but Shami is the in in-form bowler who has earned his place. Let the batting take more responsibility, and let the team play its best bowlers.

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Post by msp83 on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 9:09 pm

If they are not going for the 3rd spinner option in Jadeja, they should defenitly play Rishabh Pant and bat him 5 or 6 depending on the match situation. Vijay Shankar, 3 dimenssional and all that, is not good enough at this stage with the bat. His bowling in any case is a very parttime mediocre option. Pant is a much better bat, Jadeja is a real proper bowler, and surely a better bat too. They can even consider Jadeja batting in the middle order, his batting has certainly improved in recent times. And the higher he bats, the better he seems to become, tends to think more like a batsman... He will surely be a better bet than Shankar at 4.

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Post by JDizzle on Fri 28 Jun 2019, 9:10 pm

Edgbaston has been a raging turner all season which is an odd one. Not sure if it is a conscious decision or not, but Jeetan Patel has been bowling a hell of a lot of over for Warwickshire and Gareth Batty got an 8fer a few weeks ago! It’s a different pitch to the other day, but can’t imagine it won’t spin.

As has been discussed on here before, YJB is a bit of an odd ball - he definitely struggles to express himself and does and says some plain weird stuff - Hi Cam Bancroft. So I wouldn’t put too much stock in anything he says to read in to the England camps emotions.

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Post by KP_fan on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 7:34 am

msp83 wrote:If they are not going for the 3rd spinner option in Jadeja, they should defenitly play Rishabh Pant and bat him 5 or 6 depending on the match situation. Vijay Shankar, 3 dimenssional and all that, is not good enough at this stage with the bat. His bowling in any case is a very parttime mediocre option. Pant is a much better bat, Jadeja is a real proper bowler, and surely a better bat too. They can even consider Jadeja batting in the middle order, his batting has certainly improved in recent times. And the higher he bats, the better he seems to become, tends to think more like a batsman... He will surely be a better bet than Shankar at 4.

-I have a feeling Ind will play Pant at No.6  and Move Dhoni up to 4 and drop Shankar.
That Shankar's bowling has not been needed in last 2 games....nor is likely to be on a spin friendly pitch and that Ind already has a 3rd spinner Jadhav as 6th bowler might all weigh against Shankar....in addition to the fact that he didn't get even a medium sized score either in last two games vs weaker sides.

-Ind has to be prepared mentally & in game plan for England batting first.
And  I want to see if Eng can walk the talk ....that their various players and coaches are talking " bat positively" like they did to become No.1.
India is so on top of their bowling that in that case Eng stands risk of being bowled out for 200ish Shocked

Eng's only way of beating Ind to bat dour, ugly, scrappy ( like Cook & Gooch used to)... but put 260-270ish on the board.
Given the character of pitches I would have talked  Alastair Cook out of retirement as a replacement opener....for max 4 games and asked him to go hold one end for 40 overs, I see he is still 34 and playing county cricket and making some good scores

I have a feeling though Eng's ego will come in the way of such  an approach...and that will play to India's advantage.....an Eng trying to live to it's image and prove points to their critics etc.
By approach I mean batting approach and not recalling Cook for that's too radical for them to even consider.

-And God forbid if Eng lose the toss...their chance of winning drops to 10 to 15%...Chasing down even a medium-ish score against that attack on a helpful pitch is not impossible but low likelihood.

-
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Post by Duty281 on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 9:51 am

Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh

The height of hilarity.

"Now lads, I know we've got Jason Roy coming back from injury, the fellow who's got three ODI centuries this year, but we're actually going to leave him out in favour of recalling someone who hasn't played an ODI since 2014 and who bats at a strike rate of 77. And after working on a particular way of playing over the past four years, we're going to throw it out at the first sign of difficulty."

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Post by Gooseberry on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 9:53 am

It's absolutely baking over Edgbaston today, following on from yesterday. As others have pointed out its been a spinners pitch not just this season but also in recent ODIs. The boundaries are a proper size too which makes the power hitting game riskier.
Although theres some cloud forecast for tomorrow's game expect a hard pitch that could well break up a bit.
The three spinners theory is possible but I just dont think India need that or would want to sacrifice their batting depth any further ( despite Shankar being their Vince).

I wouldnt say it would be ego at all for England to go out try to win the game with the bat. Its their only real chance. Of course that may depend if they are setting or chasing and be dictated by what India have scored, but if they are first up surely it's better to play to their strength and risk a big loss than get themselves in a mess playing a way they cant as has happened in several recent games. Sri Lanka in particular did an excellent job of putting the batsmen into their shells with negative bowling and having them get themselves out. India youd think though with their attack will be bowling more aggressively, England have always been at their best when they meet that head on and take bowlers apart. They may loose wickets in the process but finishing 8 down still leaves big hitters at the crease and suggests they havent left runs on the park trying to defend. They've got themselves bowled out for small totals not playing their natural game.
It doesnt mean being reckless, it does mean having the confidence to play and commit to shots rather than flapping half heartedly like Vince or Moeen under pressure.
The idea of getting Cook out of retirement is of course silly. They'd be better off calling Vaughn down if he can bear to be off Twitter that long and have him demonstrate what pathetic really is and why he (and Cook) both lost not only the captaincy of the ODI side but also their places in squads whilst still being active test players.
It might be hubris and over confidence but if England honour fearing they could lose heavily and thinking they arent good enough then they are more likely to play in a way that will nullify any chances they have.
I hope my nerves about the game and expectations of an India win are greater than theres are. (Although as a fan I do kinda hope they loose cos of the tipping competition)
The pressure really is all in them. It may provoke a positive response, or they may fold. But I'd rather they go down trying that meekly surrendering. This really is the first true test of this sides character, time for the likes of Buttler and Stokes to step up and show that big game temperament they are known for. Roy's probable return would be a huge boost even if hes short of actual cricket.





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Post by Nathaniel Jacobs on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 10:57 am

Afghanistan 31-2 after 5 overs, doesn’t look like they’ll be capable of doing England any favours

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 11:00 am

Duty281 wrote:Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh

The height of hilarity.

"Now lads, I know we've got Jason Roy coming back from injury, the fellow who's got three ODI centuries this year, but we're actually going to leave him out in favour of recalling someone who hasn't played an ODI since 2014 and who bats at a strike rate of 77. And after working on a particular way of playing over the past four years, we're going to throw it out at the first sign of difficulty."

Alastair Cook, who in his last two years of ODIs in 2013 and 2014, played 36 games, scored at an average of 30 with a high score of 78 - yes let’s get him back in fellas, genius!
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Post by Nathaniel Jacobs on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 11:02 am

The umpiring has been truly shocking at this World Cup has been awful. Already two decisions overturned after 6 overs.

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Post by Duty281 on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 11:15 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh

The height of hilarity.

"Now lads, I know we've got Jason Roy coming back from injury, the fellow who's got three ODI centuries this year, but we're actually going to leave him out in favour of recalling someone who hasn't played an ODI since 2014 and who bats at a strike rate of 77. And after working on a particular way of playing over the past four years, we're going to throw it out at the first sign of difficulty."

Alastair Cook, who in his last two years of ODIs in 2013 and 2014, played 36 games, scored at an average of 30 with a high score of 78 - yes let’s get him back in fellas, genius!

And batting at an average of 25.5 in this year's domestic One-Day competition, with a high score of 53!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/english-one-day/averages

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Post by Nathaniel Jacobs on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 11:21 am

Seriously if Roy wasn’t going to play I’d suggest the only realistic option would’ve been Philip Salt. He’s probably someone India have little to no knowledge about. He’s young and wouldn’t carry any baggage.

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Post by alfie on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 11:24 am

Nathaniel Jacobs wrote:The umpiring has been truly shocking at this World Cup has been awful. Already two decisions overturned after 6 overs.

Think umpiring has generally gone downhill a bit since drs took over. Doesn't matter though as drs is there to fix errors Smile

In truth the overall accuracy of decision making has probably gone up - a little. The trade off has been a lot of time wasted - or at least , sacrificed to the new method. I don't get too bothered about it any more : can't turn the clock back on this one.

Afghans in a spot of bother at 57/3.

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Post by Duty281 on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 11:31 am

Afghanistan are entertaining. Don't care about the conditions. Don't care that they're three down early on. They just want to attack.

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Post by Gooseberry on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 11:33 am

Wouldnt be much use as a 12th man if he doesnt carry bags

If they pick a replacement from outside the squad if means getting ruf of Roy for the entire tournament. They'd be better placed having Vince fall down the stairs or similar. The latest reports have England convinced he will be fit anyway, and if he isnt for this game almost certainly will be the next.
I dont think its just India who would be unsure who he is, probably England too. Hes played 16 list A games and has one century. If folk shuffled uncomfortably about Archers lack of experience that's taking it to another level.
That hes currently recovering from surgery kinda makes his selection somewhat problematic too.

If a replacement were needed it would likely be Denly. He barely missed out on the squad and is an all formats opener. Maybe struggled with the chances he did get with England bytbwon his call ups on domestic limited overs form. Hes also just scored a big century in the CC so has some confidence. It's hardly a great option but like most teams if you take away two world class openers the replacement options aren't going to look as good.


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Post by alfie on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 1:52 pm

Afghans over 200 ...but just lost their seventh. Shaheen doing a lot of damage .
Five overs left : battling to get much past 220 which shouldn't give Pakistan too much trouble.
Afghanistan haven't been rubbish . Not going to win anything , it seems ; but they competed with India and haven't completely folded with the bat against good opposition even while getting well beaten. I think it is to their credit they can field a team at all given the state of the country...

Eight out now for 210. Even 220 might be stretching it.

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Post by Duty281 on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 2:00 pm

Afghanistan's progress has been truly remarkable and, like you say, while they may have lost every game so far (and look like losing this one) they've avoided total humiliation. Their progress has been remarkable and unprecedented. Ten years ago they were playing the likes of Uganda, Argentina and the Cayman Islands in Division Three of the World Cricket League - astonishingly some players, like Afghan, Nabi and Shenwari, were playing in those games and are still around today.

Looks like Afghanistan will make 220-230 odd today. A puncher's chance.

In the other game, the Kiwis have done what England failed to do - get Finch early.

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Post by alfie on Sat 29 Jun 2019, 2:12 pm

...and now Warner.

NZ on top in the tenth. Might be the Australian middle order will be tasked with doing a bit more work than they've faced since that West Indies match...

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