ICC Cricket World Cup - Part 4

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 6:02

Yes, England expected to be unchanged. Long boundaries apparently, which will suit England's excellent running ability!

If there were a decent replacement in the wings, I think Rashid's place would be under severe threat. He's got figures of 7/403 from 69 overs in the World Cup so far, which is hardly illuminating stuff.


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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 6:35

Duty281 wrote:Yes, England expected to be unchanged. Long boundaries apparently, which will suit England's excellent running ability!

If there were a decent replacement in the wings, I think Rashid's place would be under severe threat. He's got figures of 7/403 from 69 overs in the World Cup so far, which is hardly illuminating stuff.

To be fair Rashid has had to deal with short boundaries and flat pitches in every game apparently.

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 7:00

KP_fan wrote:
Gooseberry wrote:
KP_fan wrote:-

So NZ start as favorite as they can win both batting first and chasing.

Yet you spent so much time running new zealand down till they came to play england

I did not run them down....just put them in the due place.......and that they are still favorite tells us what Eng's due place is in this world cup.

Above "second place" south africa.

Which would upset Indian fans more, Pakistan or England beating them in the knockouts? Would you help pull down Kholis house if it happened? Or just blame the fact you cant use the same strip for every game or move the stands in a ground?

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 17:06

Crikey, Shakib is sat on number 6 in all time runs at a world cup despite having only batted 7 times so far, and in what hasn't been a massively high scoring tournament. He only needs 5 more to go past Guptill who was the highest scorer in 2015 over 9 games. also bear in mind previous world cups had more minnows to bash (Guptill played Afghanistan and Scotland). Rohit Sharma is just 2 runs ahead of him in this tournament, and could look to chase down Tendulkars all time record, hes 129 down with potentially 3 more games to do it (Tendulkar was 11 games but including Kenya twice, Namibia and Zimbabwe). Shakibs runs have come a shade under 1 a ball, only Finch in the top 10 this tournament has scored faster. 
When you add in that Sharma hasnt had to face the best bowling attack in the tournament, and isnt one of his teams leading bowlers (10 wickets) Shakibs value cant be understated. He was already well known as a very good all rounder, but it feels like this is the tournament that has elevated him to that legend status. Its a shame that this is likely to be his last world cup, or at least last one at his peak. I hope he can produce another fitting performance in their final game.
The Bangladesh coach has described them as the "the peoples team" and I do feel thats the case (along with new Zealand, unless you're and Aussie). 
I do fancy they could do a number of the massively inconsistent Pakistan if they can lift themselves and show the same guts and application they did yesterday. Pakistan are on a roll though, and should be very focused and motivated is England don't win todays game. 

Itll be interesting to see where the boundaries move to today with both sides largely reliant on pace. A tie suits both perfectly and would be great viewing so get your money on that. 
Blah blah bi laterals... the last series they played was very close, England edging it 3-2 , interestingly the two games they lost were the high scoring ones which clearly demonstrates that NZ are infact flat track bullies. 
Lockie Fergusson has been the breakout bowling star for NZ, but Boult could be the bigger threat for England who's record against left arm seamers is (relatively) awful.  
England should be favourites, and have more riding on this. Taking nothing for granted though, praying for some ground design intervention

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Post by JDizzle on Wed 3 Jul - 17:10

Ferguson has an injury that will be assessed at the ground this morning. Sounds like most of the journos expect him to be rested ready for the semis though.

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 17:21

Ooh that should shift the cricviz stats Englands way, and maybe even temper KPFs opinions a touch.

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 3 Jul - 17:46

KP_fan wrote:-Tomm Eng could knock out Pak.....NZ looks OK even if they loose unless they get hammed by a 100 runs and Pak wins by a 100 run vs BD Shocked

-if I was Williamson I would measure the length of the boundaries tomm morning just to ensure they have not automatically & inadvertently rolled in overnight.
And also check the coin he is asked to toss & Morgan will call accidentally doesn't have heads on both sides. Very Happy

-On a serious note NZ look a more rounded side who  have shown to absorb the pressure of chase much better than Eng have.
They have a solid 3 seamers who in mildly helpful conditions can restrict the opposition to a middish total that their batters can chase.

So NZ start as favorite as they can win both batting first and chasing.....while Eng we know need a holy constellation of 9 stars to align to facilitate a winning situation.

-NZ has fast bowlers who will undoubtedly target Morgan's body with short pitch...he has to work hard on not walking away and doing an uncontrolled hoik hook again.

It would have to be even more severe than that. Basically, if NZ get bowled out for 100 they're in trouble, especially if England have already hit 400 or they knock it off in 15 overs. Anything else and they'll probably be fine on NRR.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 3 Jul - 18:10

Confirmed Ferguson will miss today's match as a precaution.

*looks up NZ's backup seamer, sees it's Tim Southee who in the last world cup game vs England took a 7-for, cries*
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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 18:32

...and 6/65 in the last ODI he played

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 18:46



KP_fan wrote:So NZ start as favorite as they can win both batting first and chasing.....while Eng we know need a holy constellation of 9 stars to align to facilitate a winning situation.


At the risk of feeding the troll further its worth noting that new Zealand have only won one game batting first in this world cup (very narrowly). England have won one game chasing by a huge margin (I think the only batting second T we have had in the tipping competition).  NW have also lost a game chasing, England have yet to lose a game batting first. 
So by KPF logic England have a 50/50 chance of winning based on the toss alone. Thats even before they move the stands to suit them.

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Post by James100 on Wed 3 Jul - 18:49

Dobell - "Wood, Plunkett and Woakes have all marked run-outs.. Jofra bowling left-arm spin." Erm

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 3 Jul - 19:03

England win the toss and bat first, team unchanged
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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:07

Ferguson out is a massive blow to the Kiwis. England unchanged and batting first.

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:09

New Zealand bring in Southee and Henry for Sodhi and Ferguson.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:20

Just for reference, Sri Lanka mustered 338 on this ground a couple of days ago against the West Indies. It doesn't appear to be a make-260-and-win-the-game type day.

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Post by KP_fan on Wed 3 Jul - 19:20

Eng win the toss and bat first, and a nation breathes a collective sigh of relief. Wink
Eng ahead even before a ball is bowled.....but if any team can chase it down its NZ.

From NZ's POV they have to bowl well to keep it a 270ish chase to be in the game and even that will be difficult.
If Eng post 300ish......an Ind -Eng semifinal beckons and at Edgbaston Whistle
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Post by robbo277 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:23

Duty281 wrote:Just for reference, Sri Lanka mustered 338 on this ground a couple of days ago against the West Indies. It doesn't appear to be a make-260-and-win-the-game type day.

Yeah, both captains wanted to bat as well. Get those runs on the board early and make it difficult to chase in the second half.

Opening partnership big for England, but possibly not as important as it was against India, when we really had to weather the storm against the opening bowlers to cash in later. We'll need one of the top 4 to bat through for 100 though.

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:34

Not the worst idea by NZ to open with Santner - try something a bit different. South Africa and Pakistan both had a bit of joy with it earlier in the tournament, and even if he doesn't take wickets it buries a couple of his overs while the batsmen are getting in, rather than having to get 10 from him with the openers looking to accelerate.

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Post by alfie on Wed 3 Jul - 19:35

To tell the truth I'm more anxious about this game than I was the India match. I was confident Sunday . Probably being down to the last hurdle makes this one seem trickier... Suppose NZ can be more relaxed as they are effectively safely qualified ; but England need to make no mistakes here.

Opening with Santner was an interesting move. Canny chaps these Kiwis...

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Post by guildfordbat on Wed 3 Jul - 19:41

alfie wrote:To tell the truth I'm more anxious about this game than I was the India match. I was confident Sunday .  Probably being down to the last hurdle makes this one seem trickier... Suppose NZ can be more relaxed as they are effectively safely qualified ; but England need to make no mistakes here.

Opening with Santner was an interesting move.  Canny chaps these Kiwis...

Yeah, Roy can have a weakness there early on. Cracker of an opening ball from Santner and can understand it taking Roy by surprise but thought it odd that the keeper wasn't better prepared.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 3 Jul - 19:44

Duty281 wrote:Just for reference, Sri Lanka mustered 338 on this ground a couple of days ago against the West Indies. It doesn't appear to be a make-260-and-win-the-game type day.

Athers saying on comms he thinks the pitch might be even better for batting today than it was for that game - but there is some swing up early for Boult.

Strangely they haven't brought the boundaries into 40 yards.... Rolling Eyes
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Post by robbo277 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:46

England off to a bit of a flier on the scoreboard in the first 3 overs, but Santner nearly got Roy and Boult has been getting good swing.

Sounds like England are applying themselves well and then punishing the bad ball, which is all that's needed in this period of play. Southee is apparently looking rusty and he in particular is taking a bit of punishment.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:47

Plenty of swing for Boult, but he's bowling down the wrong line and squandering his chance...for now, anyway!

31/0 after 4. A rollicking start.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:50

The DJ's going to run out of tunes if England keep hitting this many boundaries!

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 3 Jul - 19:51

Southee's bowling 80mph half trackers and half volleys - maybe this is why he hasn't been playing...
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Post by robbo277 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:51

Duty281 wrote:Plenty of swing for Boult, but he's bowling down the wrong line and squandering his chance...for now, anyway!

31/0 after 4. A rollicking start.

Batting first England have taken a while to get going in previous games, I doubt we would have had a better 4 or 5 over score all tournament. It doesn't sound like we're being particularly aggressive either.

Still nervous I'll flick back to the text commentary and see us 40/2, but for now it's good stuff.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 19:56

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Southee's bowling 80mph half trackers and half volleys - maybe this is why he hasn't been playing...

He's hardly played any competitive cricket over the past two months. Nightmare scenario for him coming back to bowl on this pitch against this confident England batting line-up!

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Post by alfie on Wed 3 Jul - 20:00

Good to see Roy is fit and they haven't made any silly team changes (I had this vague fear they might try to get Moeen back in the team. I have nothing against Moeen - I leave that to Goose- but I doubt this will be a spinners paradise ; and with Rashid not doing too well either the thought of twenty overs of spin was concerning )

Mind you the pitch doesn't appear to be offering much to the pace bowlers so far ! England off to a bit of a flyer...

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 20:03

9 extras already is just ugly from NZ. I guess they just cant handle the pressure of what to them is pretty much a dead rubber

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Post by alfie on Wed 3 Jul - 20:05

Duty281 wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Southee's bowling 80mph half trackers and half volleys - maybe this is why he hasn't been playing...

He's hardly played any competitive cricket over the past two months. Nightmare scenario for him coming back to bowl on this pitch against this confident England batting line-up!

Which I guess is the problem with not rotating your bowlers. Why I'm a little annoyed England haven't played Curran in a game or two : imagine if injuries mean he needs to come in for a final - unlikely now , I know.

I rate Southee. But he's certainly been "off" so far this morning. Jonny in particular taking advantage.

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Post by alfie on Wed 3 Jul - 20:09

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Just for reference, Sri Lanka mustered 338 on this ground a couple of days ago against the West Indies. It doesn't appear to be a make-260-and-win-the-game type day.

Athers saying on comms he thinks the pitch might be even better for batting today than it was for that game - but there is some swing up early for Boult.

Strangely they haven't brought the boundaries into 40 yards.... Rolling Eyes

They only fiddle the boundaries when they're playing India . Didn't you know that , Olly ?

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 20:10

Ive heard of hitting through the cover(fielder)s ...but hitting the bull under the pitch covers and losing it is new one

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 20:14

Some of the hitting was looking a little ragged in the last couple of overs, seems they have calmed down a bit.
Roys control percentage on cricinfo is just 55%, although hes scoring runs it takes an element of luck to be edging that many without giving clear chances.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 3 Jul - 20:17

alfie wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Just for reference, Sri Lanka mustered 338 on this ground a couple of days ago against the West Indies. It doesn't appear to be a make-260-and-win-the-game type day.

Athers saying on comms he thinks the pitch might be even better for batting today than it was for that game - but there is some swing up early for Boult.

Strangely they haven't brought the boundaries into 40 yards.... Rolling Eyes

They only fiddle the boundaries when they're playing India .  Didn't you know that , Olly ?

Ah yes of course - apologies. I will note for future games
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Post by robbo277 on Wed 3 Jul - 20:20

Very good powerplay for England. 67-0 off the 10 and taken 5 overs of Boult without any damage (0-19). Fielders will move out but the balls will stop swinging.

On a big ground with the fielders out there might be a few more 2s and 3s, rather than the boundary options each time. Hopefully these two can knock it around in between their big shots, but it might play into Root's hands as well when he comes in.

I imagine these two will look to target Santner and maybe de Grandhomme as well when he comes on, although with Southee not bowling well maybe he'll be the one to target when he returns.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 3 Jul - 20:23

robbo277 wrote:Very good powerplay for England. 67-0 off the 10 and taken 5 overs of Boult without any damage (0-19). Fielders will move out but the balls will stop swinging.

On a big ground with the fielders out there might be a few more 2s and 3s, rather than the boundary options each time. Hopefully these two can knock it around in between their big shots, but it might play into Root's hands as well when he comes in.

I imagine these two will look to target Santner and maybe de Grandhomme as well when he comes on, although with Southee not bowling well maybe he'll be the one to target when he returns.

You've nabbed my post I was constructing about Joseph, Robbo! This is the perfect ground for him to nurdle himself above a run a ball when he comes in, picking gaps
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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 20:27

Excellent cheating by England to ensure that NZ only played 4 proper bowlers and one of them was undercooked. 
Its going to be a very big issue for NZ if Southee cant get his life together, a lot of overs from part timers against a big hitting side who are off to a flyer....Stokes and Buttler could create real carnage.

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Post by dummy_half on Wed 3 Jul - 20:36

Century up in the 15th over...

God we really missed Roy in the lost games

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Post by alfie on Wed 3 Jul - 20:36

Hundred up in the fifteenth clap

These two do play well together. The only drawback is that England tend to get so used to these starts that they tend to implode sometimes when one or both fail - as we've already seen in this WC.


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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 20:38

This is the most inoffensive and most gentle way of scoring 107/0 after 16 overs that you could ever wish to see. No 400 scores at this World Cup, yet. May not be a better chance in this tournament to do so!

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Post by guildfordbat on Wed 3 Jul - 20:39

Gooseberry wrote:Excellent cheating by England to ensure that NZ only played 4 proper bowlers and one of them was undercooked. 
Its going to be a very big issue for NZ if Southee cant get his life together, a lot of overs from part timers against a big hitting side who are off to a flyer....Stokes and Buttler could create real carnage.

Yes, we've also been very sneaky in moving out the boundaries so we can run more twos.

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Post by guildfordbat on Wed 3 Jul - 20:42

Duty281 wrote:This is the most inoffensive and most gentle way of scoring 107/0 after 16 overs that you could ever wish to see. No 400 scores at this World Cup, yet. May not be a better chance in this tournament to do so!

As Sir Geoffrey has just whispered in my ear, ''120/2 would make it look very different, lad!'' Wink But yes, Duty, 400 seems on atm.

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 3 Jul - 20:45

These two are looking a lot more comfortable than they were early on and kept the rate solid. 111/0 off 17 is about as good a foundation as youre going to get to chase the high 300's.

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Post by Pal Joey on Wed 3 Jul - 20:47

Pakistan can almost confirm their return ticket home after Friday. England look very comfortable out there; New Zealand unable to get that initial breakthrough. Still some way to go I know but have a feeling the Kiwis are about to suffer a third loss in a row unless there is a major turnaround in their fortunes... they look a little blunt today.
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Post by robbo277 on Wed 3 Jul - 20:48

Pal Joey wrote:Pakistan can almost confirm their return ticket home after Friday. England look very comfortable out there; New Zealand unable to get that initial breakthrough. Still some way to go I know but have a feeling the Kiwis are about to suffer a third loss in a row unless there is a major turnaround in their fortunes... they look a little blunt today.

At what point do Pakistan fans switch from wanting a NZ win to a huge England one to change that NRR equation?

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 20:49

guildfordbat wrote:
Duty281 wrote:This is the most inoffensive and most gentle way of scoring 107/0 after 16 overs that you could ever wish to see. No 400 scores at this World Cup, yet. May not be a better chance in this tournament to do so!

As Sir Geoffrey has just whispered in my ear, ''120/2 would make it look very different, lad!'' Wink  But yes, Duty, 400 seems on atm.

Indeed, and we've seen plenty of instances in this tournament of batting sides failing to fully capitalise from strong starts e.g. India yesterday.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 20:50

Pal Joey wrote:Pakistan can almost confirm their return ticket home after Friday. England look very comfortable out there; New Zealand unable to get that initial breakthrough. Still some way to go I know but have a feeling the Kiwis are about to suffer a third loss in a row unless there is a major turnaround in their fortunes... they look a little blunt today.

That NR between NZ/India really took some sting out of this encounter.

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Post by Pal Joey on Wed 3 Jul - 20:51

robbo277 wrote:
Pal Joey wrote:Pakistan can almost confirm their return ticket home after Friday. England look very comfortable out there; New Zealand unable to get that initial breakthrough. Still some way to go I know but have a feeling the Kiwis are about to suffer a third loss in a row unless there is a major turnaround in their fortunes... they look a little blunt today.

At what point do Pakistan fans switch from wanting a NZ win to a huge England one to change that NRR equation?

I'd say at around 419 runs after 50 overs, Robbo. Smile
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Post by Duty281 on Wed 3 Jul - 20:52

Commentators curse does for Roy. 123/1.

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Post by alfie on Wed 3 Jul - 21:05

Was fun while it lasted...but Roy will be kicking himself for missing out on a century today. Apart from the first ball of the day he'd looked totally in command.
Decent opening stand anyway.

YJB been playing some majestic strokes. He should have a brawl with Michael Vaughan every week Smile

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