ICC Cricket World Cup - Part 4

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Post by Duty281 on Tue 02 Jul 2019, 9:02 pm

First topic message reminder :

Yes, England expected to be unchanged. Long boundaries apparently, which will suit England's excellent running ability!

If there were a decent replacement in the wings, I think Rashid's place would be under severe threat. He's got figures of 7/403 from 69 overs in the World Cup so far, which is hardly illuminating stuff.


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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:03 pm

Duty281 wrote:England keep getting out chipping tamely to the infielders. Have a thrash for goodness sake.

How have we not cottoned onto them bowling slower balls yet??
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Post by dummy_half on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:04 pm

Deleted - no longer relevant


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Post by alfie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:05 pm

England appear to have rather wasted that great start . Have to credit NZ bowlers though. I think Neesham - like his team in general - is a bit underrated on here.
Morgan gone now and there's a distinct danger that Boult might clean up the rabbits and they won't even bat the overs !

That said , batting just doesn't look as easy as it did early on . Don't think it is all just down to nerves , though they must be playing a part.

Need contributions now from the bowlers - with the bat for a start.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:08 pm

alfie wrote:England appear to have rather wasted that great start . Have to credit NZ bowlers though. I think Neesham - like his team in general - is a bit underrated on here.
Morgan gone now and there's a distinct danger that Boult might clean up the rabbits and they won't even bat the overs !

That said , batting just doesn't look as easy as it did early on .  Don't think it is all just down to nerves , though they must be playing a part.

Need contributions now from the bowlers - with the bat for a start.

It is promising for us that their seamers seem to have gotten something out of the pitch by banging it into the surface and bowling cutters/slower balls - early wickets will be the key I feel...Guptill bats 30 overs then we're struggling...
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Post by Nathaniel Jacobs on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:09 pm

Unless Guptill comes out slogging, we've got more than enough

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:14 pm

Boult bowled out and we still have players at the crease, which is a positive!

2 overs to go at 286-7. One for Henry and one for Southee you'd imagine. If we could take Henry's for 6 runs and keep these two in when Southee bowls, we could look to hit out against him as he's been the least impressive bowler on show. That would get us over 300 if it went to plan.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:15 pm

This 8th wicket stand is a little gem.

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Post by alfie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:15 pm

Rashid doing a good job here...he and Plunkett played intelligently to see off Boult's last over - even scored nine from it !
And now they're hitting out at this last couple of overs...going to get over 300 at least...

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:17 pm

Very good over this. 11 from the first 4 with both men picking up boundaries. Pressure back on NZ as England approach 300.

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:18 pm

299-7 with Southee bowling the 50th. First ball goes for a single to bring up the 300.

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:22 pm

(Topic needs renaming part 4...yes we have talked that much, albeit mostly about how short one boundary is) 

Couldve been worse, shoudlve been better. 

England still should win.

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Post by No name Bertie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:23 pm

If the old ball is travelling more slowly through the air - maybe that helps to explain the success of Englands tail.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:24 pm

NZ well in it after that fightback, but you'd make England favourites. England only cleared the ropes the once, which indicates that it's difficult to slog away successfully.

No real pressure on the Kiwis, to be honest. If they lose, they're through anyway, so it'll be interesting to see how they approach proceedings.

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:24 pm

Gooseberry wrote:(Topic needs renaming part 4...yes we have talked that much, albeit mostly about how short one boundary is) 

Couldve been worse, shoudlve been better. 

England still should win.

Yeah agree with all of that.

Not sure what the Winviz will say, but you'd put England at 60/65% from here. NZ openers haven't been in great form and if England can get early wickets they can squeeze throughout the innings.

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Post by alfie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:27 pm

305 ain't bad. Not the 360 that looked on when Roy and Bairstow were going strong...but not bad on a slowish surface.

NZ can basically relax and go for it I guess . And they have some fine hitters so you never know. But I think it won't be easy to sustain six per over throughout. We will see...

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Post by No name Bertie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:27 pm

I think NZ have to bat well throughout their innings to get close, with the odds being they will likely fall short.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:28 pm

Decent little partnership from Plunkett and Rashid to make sure we got over 300, probably about par you would say - maybe 10-15 runs under it. As Duty points out, only one six today (if only we'd moved the stands and boundaries in to make it 30 yards as we did against India, more silly decision making from England!) - does suggest it is a little tougher to get it up and over, albeit the outfield is quick so fours aplenty if gaps are found.

Interesting run chase ahead - NZ bat deep, and you have that gut feeling Guptill and Taylor are due scores (Taylor always seems to bat well against us)
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Post by dummy_half on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:32 pm

So 305 in the end. Not what we should have got from that start, but I fancy it should be enough.

Would seem that the wicket has slowed during the day, and getting the older ball away wasn't easy - several of our wickets seemed to be from playing a bit too early.

Agree with Goose, could have been worse, should have been better.

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:40 pm

Spoke on another post about NRR. It's all quite tricky before you know who bats first and then how much they make.

NRR considerations will only come in for NZ if they lose. For England, it would require a tie here or an England loss and a Pakistan tie / no result. Given the weather is fine and ties are unlikely I won't go into it too much. But if I did, I don't think Pakistan would have a hope of overturning England's NRR.

NZ's net run rate is 0.572. If they lose today, here are how some selected totals will impact their net run rate:

A 1 run loss would see their NRR fall to 0.498.
A 50 run loss would see their NRR fall to 0.376
A 100 run loss would see their NRR fall to 0.251
If New Zealand make fewer than 105, their NRR will fall below zero
Theoretically the worst New Zealand's NRR could finish (i.e. if they were bowled all out for zero) is -0.262.

As long as NZ make more than 100 here and keep their NRR positive, I think it will be too much for Pakistan to overhaul.

To get a positive NRR Pakistan would need to win their next game by about 280 runs if they batted first. Bowling first, they'd need to bowl Bangladesh out for 100 and knock that target off in 13 and a bit overs. If they let Bangladesh get out to a respectable 260 they'd have to chase that in 24 overs, or if they got a good 320 they'd have to chase that in 26 overs.

So while the door is open to Pakistan on NRR, it's not likely to be an issue and if NZ can get more than 100 it becomes basically academic.

Pakistan's best hope therefore remains that NZ win this game.


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Post by JDizzle on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:42 pm

NZ have never chased down more than 300 in a WC (not that it matters) and only one 300+ score has been chased down this tournament and that was at Taunton. It *should* be enough, but this is England.

CricViz has England at 62%, which seems a bit low to me. I’d have it 70/30. A couple of early wickets, especially Kane, and we are in them.

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Post by VTR on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:50 pm

Not a bad score, yes it looks like a waste after the start, but maybe the start was a lot better than average. Defend just over 300 to stay in the world cup sounds OK to me!

An aside point is Buttler has had a very quiet and disappointing tournament so far

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:56 pm

Woakes as expected (hoped) making the best of conditions already. he didnt start the tournament well but hes bossing it now

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:57 pm

VTR wrote:Not a bad score, yes it looks like a waste after the start, but maybe the start was a lot better than average. Defend just over 300 to stay in the world cup sounds OK to me!

An aside point is Buttler has had a very quiet and disappointing tournament so far

That hundred against Pakistan seems a long time ago for Jos indeed - hopefully he's saving a good one for the semis...if we get there

Nicholls out - that looked high to me. I was going to mention I was surprised he is opening and Latham is middle order, when in the test side they play in the reverse roles...?
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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 2:59 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
VTR wrote:Not a bad score, yes it looks like a waste after the start, but maybe the start was a lot better than average. Defend just over 300 to stay in the world cup sounds OK to me!

An aside point is Buttler has had a very quiet and disappointing tournament so far

That hundred against Pakistan seems a long time ago for Jos indeed - hopefully he's saving a good one for the semis...if we get there


He scored 64 in the next game too.
And didnt bat in the one after that. So the run of low scores isnt long.

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:00 pm

Was going over apparently, they mucked around chatting to review.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:00 pm

Bad umpiring, bad decision not to review. Bad cricket. Hawk-eye also made it closer to the stumps than I originally thought!

Anyway, Williamson to the crease early, against the moving new ball. Just what England desire.

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:02 pm

4/1 off 2 overs...my internal cricviz is switching very much Englands way.

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Post by alfie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:04 pm

Perfect start from Woakes clap

Though apparently height would have saved him on review. Must say I thought it would be clipping the bails watching live.

Anyway it is probably Guptill the early key as he can really tee off .

Today would be a good one for Archer to get into the wickets . He's had a good enough WC so far ; but a bit lopsided with five lots of three wickets against the five bottom teams and just one scalp in the three games against Pakistan Australia and India. I'm sure he'd like to get a bag today. Seems to have got over that minor injury , I'm glad to say.

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Post by KP_fan on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:07 pm

Eng inning going on Indian template.....or maybe worse.

deceleration after a booming start.
Moragn came and brought pressure with him (like he did against Lanka)
Stokes is the Dhoni of Eng...."eats" a lot of balls and if gets out with the acceleration, leaves the team struggling.

NZ can fight, game is not beyond them although Eng ahead 70-30 in my view.....and batsmen other than Williamson i.e Guptil, Taylo etal have to stand up today
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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:09 pm

alfie wrote:Perfect start from Woakes clap

Though apparently height would have saved him on review.  Must say I thought it would be clipping the bails watching live.

Anyway it is probably Guptill the early key as he can really tee off .

Today would be a good one for Archer to get into the wickets . He's had a good enough WC so far ; but a bit lopsided with five lots of three wickets against the five bottom teams and just one scalp in the three games against Pakistan Australia and India. I'm sure he'd like to get a bag today. Seems to have got over that minor injury , I'm glad to say.

Archer unlucky not to get Sharma in the last game as well though, but I agree he could do with an impact in one of our big knockout games to back up his pool stage wickets (today being a de facto knockout game).

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:11 pm

RRR up to 6.5 now .... pressure is on

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:13 pm

Pundits are saying NZ need to get off to a flier while the balls have a bit of hardness to them. NZ batsman are so far doing the opposite.

Will they attack overs 5-10 when they have their eyes in a bit? The back-up seamers after the 10th? Try and get after Rashid? Or just look to take the game deep, consolidate the NRR and then attack the last 15 with wickets in hand?

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:15 pm

He may not have done it with the bat, but that is an absolutely sensational grab by Buttler!
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Post by Duty281 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:15 pm

Sharp stuff from Buttler. I no longer care about his soft dismissal - that was pure redemption!

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Post by compelling and rich on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:15 pm

great catch!

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Post by alfie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:16 pm

Great catch by Buttler Yahoo

Danger man Guptill gone. Archer has his first ...NZ battling .

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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:16 pm

Guptil gone. It would be a hell of thing for New Zealand to get close now, needs a mircle innings form someone. 

14/2 in the 6th. RRR over 6.5

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:18 pm

If we can get Kane Williamson before NZ get too many more it might be time for Pakistan to switch allegiances to a huge England win.

Good to see both opening bowlers strike inside the powerplay. Opening batsmen and bowlers coming into form at the right time it seems.

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Post by No name Bertie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:21 pm

It is strange NZ didn't review Nichols lbw, which was going over the stumps. With both openers now back in the pavillion this is looking like a heavy defeat for NZ.

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Post by alfie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:22 pm

Yes Jos has had a bit of a dodgy run with the gloves recently - probably more so when standing up - but that catch was outstanding and should give him a handy confidence boost.
All he needs now is a big innings : be nice to produce it in a final ?

NZ have hitters later on : but they really need their two best bats now to rebuild the innings. Lose another one now and they are really in the soup...

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:36 pm

End of the powerplay and New Zealand are 37-2. Both openers gone, but Williamson and Taylor have consolidated nicely.

Woakes is 1-22 and Archer 1-15 from their opening spells.

On comes Plunkett and I'd imagine Wood from the other end. Same changes as in the last game against India.

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Post by alfie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:43 pm

Williamson is an outstanding batsman.  Hasn't been easy out there but he's survived some hostile bowling and produced a couple of lovely strokes.  If NZ are to have any chance he will need to bat deep.

RRR up to seven per over already.

OK , 6.82 Smile

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:58 pm

Oh wow, Williamson out! Run out off the deflection from Wood, at the bowlers end - the worst luck for NZ, great luck for Eng!
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Post by compelling and rich on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:58 pm

always a unlucky way of getting out but im not complaining

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:59 pm

And that's the game. A cruel dismissal, yes, but a dismissal nonetheless.

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Post by alfie on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 3:59 pm

Massive moment ! How unlucky for Williamson ...run out backing as Wood gets a fingertip to a drive and the ball goes onto the stumps...

The gods are smiling on England today , it seems.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 4:02 pm

Latham's had an awful World Cup - 41 runs from 6 innings so far. Chance for him to play himself into a semblance of form before the semi-final?

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Post by robbo277 on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 4:03 pm

Very big moment in this game. A freebie for England but what a massive, massive wicket. Williamson goes and now a lot sits on Taylor's shoulders.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 4:08 pm

That is nonsense from Taylor
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Post by Gooseberry on Wed 03 Jul 2019, 4:09 pm

That NRR is a thing suddenly

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