Japan 2019 - Pool A Ireland Japan Russia Samoa Scotland

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 09 Sep 2019, 12:10 pm

First topic message reminder :

TeamPlayedWonDrawnLostTriesPFPA+/-BPPoints
Japan330098741+46214
Ireland3201117422+52311
Scotland320113982771210
Samoa310275381-2815
Russia3003119125-10600


Japan 30-10 Russia              
Ireland 27-3 Scotland  
Russia 9-34 Samoa                        
Japan 19-12 Ireland                          
Scotland 34-0 Samoa
Ireland 35-0 Russia
Japan 38-19 Samoa
Scotland 61-0 Russia
 

                                       
                     
12 October 2019         Ireland v Samoa                         Fukuoka Hakatanomori Stadium, Fukuoka
13 October 2019         Japan v Scotland                         International Stadium Yokohama, Yokohama


Two games left. If Ireland get a TBP win on Saturday they qualify for the quarter finals irrespective of the result on Sunday. Any other result and they need to wait and see what happens between Japan and Scotland.
Any win for Japan and they will top the group (in fact a draw or losing with two bonus points will guarantee the same)
Most interesting scenario is if Ireland win without a bonus point - opening up a chance for Scotland to top the group if all 3 teams end up on 15pts and Scotland are able to keep their points difference ahead of Ireland.


Last edited by LondonTiger on Wed 09 Oct 2019, 10:29 am; edited 5 times in total

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Post by eirebilly on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:30 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:
eirebilly wrote:By the law it is a red card.

I don't know how many times I have said and been shouted down by my country men that Aki is just not good enough and he will cost Ireland.

Well lads?

You are wrong. Harsh call. You are just looking for things to nit pick against him.

I do not agree with the laws, I do not think it was a red personally but the law is the law and as such it was a red.

Not nit picking, I am very consistent in what I have said regarding Aki for some time now.
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Post by Engine#4 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:34 pm

How that isn't a penalty against 6 I don't know.

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Post by eirebilly on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:35 pm

Good try from Sexton. TBP in the bag.

Sexton is having a great game.
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Post by EnglishReign on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:35 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:
EnglishReign wrote:If we're being consistent, it is a red unfortunately. I don't like it but it is.

Well they arent being consistent because Samoa got a yellow for something pretty similar.

It was 'similar' but the Samoan tackler couldn't have got any lower and Stockdale was basically on his knees and falling. On the other one, Aki was stood up lol.

I can understand the frustrations but there's also a clear difference as well.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:36 pm

This is a classic reason why cancelling the NZ and England games are unfair. Ireland will be without Aki for the quarters in the get there. You have to play out the games.

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Post by westisbest on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:37 pm

Great to get the 4 tries in the first half.

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Post by EnglishReign on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:38 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:This is a classic reason why cancelling the NZ and England games are unfair. Ireland will be without Aki for the quarters in the get there. You have to play out the games.

Especially with the cards adding up. Wouldn't surprise me if we had a damp squib 15 v 14 final because of it.

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Post by EnglishReign on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:40 pm

Great work from Ireland anyway, have completely dominated and not been affected by the red so far.

Over to Scotland now I say.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:41 pm

EnglishReign wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:
EnglishReign wrote:If we're being consistent, it is a red unfortunately. I don't like it but it is.

Well they arent being consistent because Samoa got a yellow for something pretty similar.

It was 'similar' but the Samoan tackler couldn't have got any lower and Stockdale was basically on his knees and falling. On the other one, Aki was stood up lol.

I can understand the frustrations but there's also a clear difference as well.

Not seeing it. Both similar head clashes, both wrapped, both dipping. Yellows would have been fine. The samoan ran into Aki, not much time to get low.

I will say though that Im not surprised with the red and Aki should have done better. RTE agree with the ref on both cards.


Last edited by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:45 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Brendan on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:42 pm

EnglishReign wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:
EnglishReign wrote:If we're being consistent, it is a red unfortunately. I don't like it but it is.

Well they arent being consistent because Samoa got a yellow for something pretty similar.

It was 'similar' but the Samoan tackler couldn't have got any lower and Stockdale was basically on his knees and falling. On the other one, Aki was stood up lol.

I can understand the frustrations but there's also a clear difference as well.

Ali's upper body is at 45 degree angle and his knees are bent, and the Samoan has bent knees and at an angle sideways.

It is funny Samoa with their game that mattered v Russia get the benefit of two red cards and then get the benefit v Ireland for a softer tackle.

Ireland will win well regardless as they will play territory, have better bench and have a solid line out.

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Post by eirebilly on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:46 pm

Question is, how long before Schmidt feels its ok to take Sexton off. He needs to be protected for the 1/4 finals at all costs.
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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:48 pm

Thats what I was thinking, maybe if we score next?

Maybe its better that we get the red out of the way now and hopefully none in the quarters.

Does a red definitely mean a suspension?

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Post by Pal Joey on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:51 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:This is a classic reason why cancelling the NZ and England games are unfair. Ireland will be without Aki for the quarters in the get there. You have to play out the games.

If you can watch NHK Live now just to see the scale of this horrible event. Dams overflowing and huge overflows causing major havoc downstream.

I don't think you realise what 500-700mm of rain can do. It's like the annual Dublin rainfall in the space of 24 hours. The place where you just were - Shizuoka - is where the typhoon hit. You probably wouldn't recognise parts of it now. You were very lucky to have been there last week and not today.

Similar thing happened to me in Hoi An, Vietnam in 2016 . Blue skies every day when I was there. Perfect weather.
5 days later the shops in the old part of town where I visited were under a metre of water. Total destruction. Cows washed out to sea. Many dead people.
So it's not question of fair or unfair. More life or death. Do you understand this?


Last edited by Pal Joey on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by EnglishReign on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:51 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:
EnglishReign wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:
EnglishReign wrote:If we're being consistent, it is a red unfortunately. I don't like it but it is.

Well they arent being consistent because Samoa got a yellow for something pretty similar.

It was 'similar' but the Samoan tackler couldn't have got any lower and Stockdale was basically on his knees and falling. On the other one, Aki was stood up lol.

I can understand the frustrations but there's also a clear difference as well.

Not seeing it. Both similar head clashes, both wrapped, both dipping. Yellows would have been fine. The samoan ran into Aki, not much time to get low.

I will say though that Im not surprised with the red and Aki should have done better. RTE agree with the ref on both cards.

Now I've seen it again I'm more inclined to agree with you there. I personally think if they want to change the game but not ruin it, make these incidents a yellow card offence and punish further retrospectively if needs be, as it's not something which can truly be analysed fully in a couple of minutes.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:53 pm

Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:This is a classic reason why cancelling the NZ and England games are unfair. Ireland will be without Aki for the quarters in the get there. You have to play out the games.

If you can watch NHK Live now just to see the scale of this horrible event. Dams overflowing and huge overflows causing major havoc downstream.

I don't think you realise what 500-700mm of rain can do. It's like the annual Dublin rainfall in the space of 24 hours. The place where you just were - Shizuoka - is where the typhoon hit. You probably wouldn't recognise parts of it now. You were very lucky to have been there last week and not today.

Similar thing happened to me in Hoi An, Vietnam in 2016 . Blue skies every day when I was there. Perfect weather.
5 days later the shops in the old part of town where I visited were under a metre of water. Total destruction. Cows washed out to sea. Many dead people.
So it's not question of fair or unfair. More life or death. Do you understand this?

Yeah and the forecast is for it to be completely gone tomorrow???

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Post by Pal Joey on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:55 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:
Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:This is a classic reason why cancelling the NZ and England games are unfair. Ireland will be without Aki for the quarters in the get there. You have to play out the games.

If you can watch NHK Live now just to see the scale of this horrible event. Dams overflowing and huge overflows causing major havoc downstream.

I don't think you realise what 500-700mm of rain can do. It's like the annual Dublin rainfall in the space of 24 hours. The place where you just were - Shizuoka - is where the typhoon hit. You probably wouldn't recognise parts of it now. You were very lucky to have been there last week and not today.

Similar thing happened to me in Hoi An, Vietnam in 2016 . Blue skies every day when I was there. Perfect weather.
5 days later the shops in the old part of town where I visited were under a metre of water. Total destruction. Cows washed out to sea. Many dead people.
So it's not question of fair or unfair. More life or death. Do you understand this?

Yeah and the forecast is for it to be completely gone tomorrow???

Yeah and what about the clean up? Did you include that in your contingency?????
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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:56 pm

Ireland will have a man less in their squad for the quarters now which is a disadvantage

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:56 pm

1 dead. 4 missing so far.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:58 pm

Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:
Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:This is a classic reason why cancelling the NZ and England games are unfair. Ireland will be without Aki for the quarters in the get there. You have to play out the games.

If you can watch NHK Live now just to see the scale of this horrible event. Dams overflowing and huge overflows causing major havoc downstream.

I don't think you realise what 500-700mm of rain can do. It's like the annual Dublin rainfall in the space of 24 hours. The place where you just were - Shizuoka - is where the typhoon hit. You probably wouldn't recognise parts of it now. You were very lucky to have been there last week and not today.

Similar thing happened to me in Hoi An, Vietnam in 2016 . Blue skies every day when I was there. Perfect weather.
5 days later the shops in the old part of town where I visited were under a metre of water. Total destruction. Cows washed out to sea. Many dead people.
So it's not question of fair or unfair. More life or death. Do you understand this?

Yeah and the forecast is for it to be completely gone tomorrow???

Yeah and what about the clean up? Did you include that in your contingency?????

There are many ways to skin a cat. You seem your favorable contingency is to give up. Thats not a contingency and if thats the analysus you shouldnt be scheduling a RWC where no contingency is possible. There are a whole host of possible options.

World rugbys problem is they had no proper contingencies in place.


Last edited by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:00 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 12:59 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:1 dead. 4 missing so far.

Cancel the RWC

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:00 pm

Dickish comment.

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Post by Brendan on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:04 pm

Ireland done now, getting the job done like the good old days

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:04 pm

Take Sexton off

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Post by Pal Joey on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:06 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:
Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:
Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:This is a classic reason why cancelling the NZ and England games are unfair. Ireland will be without Aki for the quarters in the get there. You have to play out the games.

If you can watch NHK Live now just to see the scale of this horrible event. Dams overflowing and huge overflows causing major havoc downstream.

I don't think you realise what 500-700mm of rain can do. It's like the annual Dublin rainfall in the space of 24 hours. The place where you just were - Shizuoka - is where the typhoon hit. You probably wouldn't recognise parts of it now. You were very lucky to have been there last week and not today.

Similar thing happened to me in Hoi An, Vietnam in 2016 . Blue skies every day when I was there. Perfect weather.
5 days later the shops in the old part of town where I visited were under a metre of water. Total destruction. Cows washed out to sea. Many dead people.
So it's not question of fair or unfair. More life or death. Do you understand this?

Yeah and the forecast is for it to be completely gone tomorrow???

Yeah and what about the clean up? Did you include that in your contingency?????

There are many ways to skin a cat. You seem your favorable contingency is to give up. Thats not a contingency and if thats the analysus you shouldnt be scheduling a RWC where no contingency is possible. There are a whole host of possible options.

What the hell are talking about? Whole host of what? "analysus", "Shuizoka" (as you said 5 times... and you were apparently there????), Fukuioka... you keep showing us all your complete ignorance of reality and have very little respect for anyone other than your own pathetic ego. You need to give up.
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Post by majesticimperialman on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:08 pm

Have the rules changed, the ref gives an advantage to Ireland, Ireland kick the ball down field, and the ref does not call advantage over. and still goes back for the penaltie.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:10 pm

The rules have not changed maj. Kick knock on advantage away and 9 times out of 10 you lose the advantage. Pen advantage comes back to the penalty.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:13 pm

Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:
Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:
Pal Joey wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:This is a classic reason why cancelling the NZ and England games are unfair. Ireland will be without Aki for the quarters in the get there. You have to play out the games.

If you can watch NHK Live now just to see the scale of this horrible event. Dams overflowing and huge overflows causing major havoc downstream.

I don't think you realise what 500-700mm of rain can do. It's like the annual Dublin rainfall in the space of 24 hours. The place where you just were - Shizuoka - is where the typhoon hit. You probably wouldn't recognise parts of it now. You were very lucky to have been there last week and not today.

Similar thing happened to me in Hoi An, Vietnam in 2016 . Blue skies every day when I was there. Perfect weather.
5 days later the shops in the old part of town where I visited were under a metre of water. Total destruction. Cows washed out to sea. Many dead people.
So it's not question of fair or unfair. More life or death. Do you understand this?

Yeah and the forecast is for it to be completely gone tomorrow???

Yeah and what about the clean up? Did you include that in your contingency?????

There are many ways to skin a cat. You seem your favorable contingency is to give up. Thats not a contingency and if thats the analysus you shouldnt be scheduling a RWC where no contingency is possible. There are a whole host of possible options.

What the hell are talking about? Whole host of what? "analysus", "Shuizoka" (as you said 5 times... and you were apparently there????), Fukuioka... you keep showing us all your complete ignorance of reality and have very little respect for anyone other than your own pathetic ego. You need to give up.

Reported your comments.

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Post by Pal Joey on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:15 pm

Thanks Collapse. Yours aren't worth the effort. Everyone can plainly see what you've written.
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Post by No 7&1/2 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:16 pm

Lamour is class.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:18 pm

Pal Joey wrote:Thanks Collapse. Yours aren't worth the effort. Everyone can plainly see what you've written.

Take a break and calm down elsewhere.

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Post by lostinwales on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:18 pm

Ireland do seem to be getting their mojo back ahead of next week.

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Post by EnglishReign on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:19 pm

Samoa have been bleedin' awful. an extra man for most of the game and I've barely seen them in the Irish half.

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Post by Old Man on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:22 pm

Samoahas been utterly disappointing

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Post by lostinwales on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:22 pm

EnglishReign wrote:Samoa have been bleedin' awful. an extra man for most of the game and I've barely seen them in the Irish half.

Irish pack have grabbed the ball and won't let anyone else get close to it. Samoa can't do anything without it. Brutal and maybe a little boring but its a side of Ireland that they will need in spades if they are going to get anywhere in this tournament

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Post by westisbest on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:23 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Lamour is class.

Playing his way into the quarters? Even if Kearney is fit.

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Post by tigertattie on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:24 pm

EnglishReign wrote:Samoa have been bleedin' awful. an extra man for most of the game and I've barely seen them in the Irish half.

I think they are the most indisciplined team at the World Cup

Even the ref is telling them that it’s not his fault they are hitting high or late.

It gets to a strange where rugby may want to look at something similar to the fifa fair play rules
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Post by majesticimperialman on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:25 pm

EnglishReign wrote:Samoa have been bleedin' awful. an extra man for most of the game and I've barely seen them in the Irish half.

Have to agree with you. I was hoping Samoa would give Ireland a real test match.

But in all fairness it as been like a training run/game for Ireland.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:28 pm

Good performance from Ireland, aparently not humid at all today. Might have made a difference.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:30 pm

I'd start him west. Kearney is very experienced and a safe pair of hands but lamour just offers so much more in attack.

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Post by westisbest on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:31 pm

Yeah. I agree

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Post by Pal Joey on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:33 pm

Good performance from the referee. Kept things under control and in good order. Allowed the game to flow.
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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:35 pm

I thought he wasnt bad either. Hoping fir a French ref for the quarters though.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:41 pm

Obviously playing the Aussies I'd like a ref who knows what a scrum is! When do they get announced?

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Post by No9 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 2:05 pm

Well all clear in this pool now.. 

Japan neeed.. 

1) Draw (with No BP or equal BP)
2) Lose with BP and Scotland NO BP
3) Win

Scotland have to..
4) Win not letting Japan get a BP 
5) Win with BP

Simple....

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Post by No9 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 2:07 pm

... oh, and not had chance to read past previous threads, so not sure how many disagreed or agreed with Aki's red card. 

IMO, it was coming. Aki has been tackling high like this now far too often (did it against Wales in Warm up), and was only a mater of time before he saw red. Right decision, and if he gets to play again in this RWC, hope he's learned his lesson.

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Post by Pal Joey on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 2:15 pm

The irony of that tackle was it was Samoan on Samoan.

So Bundee was probably just saying "hello... how's the family?" to his mate on the rugby field.
It was kind of a rushed greeting however... happened so quickly. No time for either player to really manoeuvre or get down low. Heads were always going to meet in that particular scenario.

Maybe the ref should have taken that into account and only given a yellow... but red was the call unfortunately.


Last edited by Pal Joey on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 2:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 2:16 pm

No9 wrote:Well all clear in this pool now.. 

Japan neeed.. 

1) Draw (with No BP or equal BP)
2) Lose with BP and Scotland NO BP
3) Win

Scotland have to..
4) Win not letting Japan get a BP 
5) Win with BP

Simple....

Or lose with two BPs and it doesnt matter what Scotland do

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Post by Engine#4 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 2:26 pm

No9 wrote:... oh, and not had chance to read past previous threads, so not sure how many disagreed or agreed with Aki's red card. 

IMO, it was coming. Aki has been tackling high like this now far too often (did it against Wales in Warm up), and was only a mater of time before he saw red. Right decision, and if he gets to play again in this RWC, hope he's learned his lesson.

Thought it was a red. Feel for Aki as 3match suspensions seem to be the order of the day for his offence. That said I would have preferred a Henshaw/Ringrose midfield anyway. Aki doesn't do anything better than the South African or New Zealand centres. Ringrose and Henshaw do.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 2:30 pm

It probably was a red to be fair and Aki probably was Irelands prime contender to do it

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Post by Brendan on Sat 12 Oct 2019, 4:30 pm

The most frustrating thing for me is the inconsistent calls by refs in the tournament.  Both Japan and Samoa benefited in the first few games.  The Japanese player did a clear shoulder charge on the Russian player (who went off for a HIA to not come back on) and not even a review.

I am glad they have started taking actions but a red in the first round is less punished then a red in the final round.  As others have said I hope Aki goes away and fixes his tackle style as it has been coming.

Maybe Aki could injury himself in training with a "back issue" so we can call up a replacement who can play.  Not in the spirit of the rules but it would be what winners do.

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