QF3 - Match Thread - Wales v France - 20/10/19 - K/O 8:15 BST

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Post by miaow on Thu 10 Oct 2019, 6:33 pm

First topic message reminder :

Thought I'd get these made nice and early for a few reasons - but one being that we're already now looking ahead to the QFs with several teams having finished their group stage, so it's all heating up for the proper knockout stuff...barring any more disruption.

Wales

QF3 - Match Thread - Wales v France - 20/10/19 - K/O 8:15 BST - Page 10 Welshrugbyfans_trans_NvBQzQNjv4BqLAxMOlOd5aBPSsN63muQty33OXnK6NuLBTTCR2e9TgA

Team:Liam Williams; George North, Jonathan Davies, Hadleigh Parkes, Josh Adams; Dan Biggar, Gareth Davies; Wyn Jones, Ken Owens, Tomas Francis; Jake Ball, Alun Wyn Jones; Aaron Wainwright, Justin Tipuric, Josh Navidi.


Reps: Elliot Dee, Rhys Carre, Dillon Lewis, Adam Beard, Ross Moriarty, Tomos Williams, Rhys Patchell, Owen Watkin


France

QF3 - Match Thread - Wales v France - 20/10/19 - K/O 8:15 BST - Page 10 1444576535803_lc_galleryImage_French_rugby_fans_hold_ba

Team: Medard - Penaud, Vakatawa, Fickou, Huget - Ntamack, Du pont - Ollivon , Alldrit, Lauret -
Vaahamahina, Leroux - Slimani, Guirado (c), Poirot
Bench: Cat, Braille,Sentiano, Gabrillagues, Picamoles, Serin, Lopez, Rattez



Venue: Oita
Referee: Jaco Peyper
AR1: Nic Berry
AR2: Paul Williams
TMO: Marius Joncker


Last edited by miaow on Thu 24 Oct 2019, 1:53 pm; edited 3 times in total

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 11:20 am

For what it's worth, I though we looked nervous, for the first time in a long time under Gatland (if there have been recent examples, please remind me of them). Whether it was France's bright start, I don't know.

I thought we'd got over the fear of being favourites, but maybe we haven't. Either way, we don't have that to worry about from now on!

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 11:42 am

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:For what it's worth, I though we looked nervous, for the first time in a long time under Gatland (if there have been recent examples, please remind me of them). Whether it was France's bright start, I don't know.

I thought we'd got over the fear of being favourites, but maybe we haven't. Either way, we don't have that to worry about from now on!

Looked the same when the french had a good start in the six nations. I thought wales dug in well to claw the result back. Tomos Williams is really looking bright at scrum half. Thought Beard did well as well when he swapped out with Ball. The replacement front row didn’t disappoint either.

If SA we to topple wales they will have to put in an even bigger effort in the first twenty.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 11:59 am

Tomos Williams is awesome. Fearless.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 12:00 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Tomos Williams is awesome. Fearless.
sharp, quick and very intelligent too. So exciting when he comes on.

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Post by RiscaGame on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 12:09 pm

To be fair to Gatland, he highlighted that France have a high turnover rate and we might have some joy from mistakes. Man is a genius. He knew we could hold things back and have enough to win.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 12:12 pm

RiscaGame wrote:To be fair to Gatland, he highlighted that France have a high turnover rate and we might have some joy from mistakes. Man is a genius. He knew we could hold things back and have enough to win.

Thankfully he’s the coach for at lest two more games.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:02 pm

I know that's meant as a joke, but it's not very funny. Tomos is the Welsh spelling of Thomas. My paternal grandfather's name was Tomos Williams.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:22 pm

I am sure I read somewhere that they knew Francis must have some Welsh blood because he is Tomas - which was then purported to be the Welsh way of spelling it?

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:27 pm

The only other Tomas I can think of was that Munster and Ireland scrum half whose surname escapes me.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:30 pm

O'Leary?

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:31 pm

That's the fella.


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Post by Noble-Surfer on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:33 pm

LondonTiger wrote:I am sure I read somewhere that they knew Francis must have some Welsh blood because he is Tomas - which was then purported to be the Welsh way of spelling it?

The Welsh way of spelling it is Tomos. Tomas to me sounds more French/ Bretton/ Gaelic?

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Post by The Oracle on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:35 pm

Noble-Surfer wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:I am sure I read somewhere that they knew Francis must have some Welsh blood because he is Tomas - which was then purported to be the Welsh way of spelling it?

The Welsh way of spelling it is Tomos. Tomas to me sounds more French/ Bretton/ Gaelic?

Exeter-ish, I believe Wink
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:38 pm

The French spelling is Thomas, which is why it's also the English spelling.

At least we had the good grace to tweak it a bit Whistle

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Post by Duty281 on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:44 pm

whocares wrote:Peyper WC could be over it seems - clearly not the sharpest thing for an international pro ref to do...
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12278344

Hilarious and nothing wrong with it at all.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:45 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:The French spelling is Thomas, which is why it's also the English spelling.

At least we had the good grace to tweak it a bit Whistle

So Tomos was perhaps the spelling in England before the Saxons drove those people west? Run

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:47 pm

Right, that does it! boxing

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Post by Noble-Surfer on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 2:50 pm

The Oracle wrote:
Noble-Surfer wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:I am sure I read somewhere that they knew Francis must have some Welsh blood because he is Tomas - which was then purported to be the Welsh way of spelling it?

The Welsh way of spelling it is Tomos. Tomas to me sounds more French/ Bretton/ Gaelic?

Exeter-ish, I believe ;)

Well I guess Cornwall is almost Welsh... ;)

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Post by miaow on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 4:56 pm

whocares wrote:Peyper WC could be over it seems - clearly not the sharpest thing for an international pro ref to do...
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12278344

It probably does but...

a. Good banter
b. There was no controversy about the card
c. He's a terrible ref anyway

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Post by miaow on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 5:03 pm

RiscaGame wrote:To be fair to Gatland, he highlighted that France have a high turnover rate and we might have some joy from mistakes. Man is a genius. He knew we could hold things back and have enough to win.

Pretty much. Nothing about France says they have any more in their locker than they showed - some great instinctive disorganised running play, followed by terrible disorganised overrunning to allow Wainwright a 50m walk in, indiscipline and basic errors costing them the game.

France didn't score for the final 50 minutes of the game, only 30 of which were with 14, and the first 10 of which were against 14 Welsh players.

Wales need to adapt to accept that the defensive structures aren't going to be like an Ireland Wales 6Ns game, where it's just gainline hit after gainline hit, and adapt an attacking game to counteract that, but the defence is still working well - likewise, we made Australia really work for their third try, and that extra effort effectively did for them.

Again, Wales kept plugging away, plugging away, and France snapped. Some details were unexpected, but it really wasn't that much of a shock the way they game went. Even if the try were ruled out, Wales had a penalty at the scrum, 10m out, with 7 minutes to play. They'd waited all game to get in that territorial position. I always had hope based on experince, even if North's botched pass felt important at the time.

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Post by Pie on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:20 pm

Wainwright was immense but Ball put in one hell of. shift. Anyone criticizing the Guvnor needs to remove their head from their ass. Not only did he take yet another shot to the head left him with claret everywhere he bossed that game in the last 20 and made the win feasible. If we can just get JD2 fit and get a proper shift out of Adams/ Williams and North - or even 2 of them - then Boks very doable.

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Post by Pie on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:22 pm

Duty281 wrote:
whocares wrote:Peyper WC could be over it seems - clearly not the sharpest thing for an international pro ref to do...
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=12278344

Hilarious and nothing wrong with it at all.

Agreed, its Vaahahina should be sent home, even though he is going home anyway and his resignation from Int Rugby is welcomed - thugs no longer belong in this game, even in a French shirt. Makes me wonder still how that English idiot who snapped the lads elbow off wasn't banned for life

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Post by miaow on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:27 pm

Who is the Guvnor, Pie?

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Post by Pie on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:32 pm

miaow wrote:Who is the Guvnor, Pie?


Biggar

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Post by miaow on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:34 pm

Yeah, thought he kept his cool well and kept going even when the territorial gains were offset by Medard's boot and Wales knocking it on.

There's one gameplan, and one gameplan only. We keep kicking and kick until it works, until we're in the right areas to play.

Biggar does have fundamental weaknesses, that's fair - I don't think anyone can doubt that when you compare him to the ABs', England's, and even Australia's pivot options, but he's no worse than Pollard, and that's who we face next. The issue is when you compound Biggar and Parkes, there's just not enough running threat there.

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 7:07 pm

Pollards been very disappointing, he should have been one of the greatest based on his under 20s form and Bok start when he ran through the young beaudy in about 2014.

Reminded me a bit of Hugo Porta with perhaps a bit less flair. But he was solid, could run, kick, step and hustle and run his backline. He started well this year but has since fallen off a bit.

He could regain that firm in the semis as he’s a noted big match player.

Key for the Boks this week. If Pollard plays to his best, Boks will win.

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Post by tigertattie on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 7:33 pm

So Peyper is being reviewed by world rugby for that picture and big Vah has now “retired” from international rugby.

It’s a bit poo that this one indecent will be remembered for years to come.

Samoan tackles, Typhoons, threats of suing, teams getting a bye, italy sent home early, red cards, refs involved in “banterous” photos

It’s been quite the World Cup for all the wrong reasons

I hope it’s remembered for two great semi’s and an epic final and the welcome from the Japanese public rather than what we’re remembering just now!!!
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Post by miaow on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:01 pm

I'm actually not sure it will, Tiger. The cancelled games, yes - but the red cards? Doubt it. In 8 years' time it will be par for the course and accepted de facto that the game had 'moved on' and straight arms to the head aren't acceptable anymore. The elbow was nothing controversial - red cards happen when players are too fired up and too focused on domination.

There's also been a lot of good rugby, Japan will be remembered as the surprise package once more, Fiji played fantastically, Uruguay caused a huge upset and came of age. In fact, some battling performances from minnows all round showed, generally, an end to the absolute disparity between the best and the rest - continuity in coaching and players clearly aided the likes of Namibia and Russia. Perhaps the only minnows to disappoint where Samoa and Georgia, but the latter played their part, too.

It's no doubt a poor RWC for Scotland, and Ireland, but they're the casualties that means, for the rest of us, it'll be remembered for great Japanese rugby. By and large, typhoon aside, it would have been a great world cup.

And still more to come.

Pollard's kicking at goal did for Wales 4 years ago in spite of being a generally average kicker the rest of the time. Have to hope he misses one or two sitters.

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:33 pm

tigertattie wrote:So Peyper is being reviewed by world rugby for that picture and big Vah has now “retired” from international rugby.

It’s a bit poo that this one indecent will be remembered for years to come.

Samoan tackles, Typhoons, threats of suing, teams getting a bye, italy sent home early, red cards, refs involved in “banterous” photos

It’s been quite the World Cup for all the wrong reasons

I hope it’s remembered for two great semi’s and an epic final and the welcome from the Japanese public rather than what we’re remembering just now!!!

Yes thats a pity, and none of it to do with the Japanese public, rugby admin, nor players who have all set a standard for future hosts of this tournament. I think it'll generally be remembered as the 'typhoon tournament' being the largest single point of difference across them all but we all know the real success has been the hosts, who have changed the rugby landscape forever. Expect more great things out of Japan.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:41 pm

Taylorman wrote:Expect more great things out of Japan.

Great cars, motorcycles, phones, cameras, anime?

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Post by Pie on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 3:03 am

mikey_dragon wrote:
Taylorman wrote:Expect more great things out of Japan.

Great cars, motorcycles, phones, cameras, anime?

You should listen. Taylorman actually knows everything.

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Post by Taylorman on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 3:20 am

Thanks, I'll give you 3.14159265359 out of 10 for that one pie. thumbsup


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Post by Taylorman on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 3:32 am

Wales v South Africa – Referee: Jerome Garces. Assist: Wayne Barnes & Ben O’Keefe. TMO: Ben Skeen

My gosh, glad we are in the other one Very Happy

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Post by Pie on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 3:48 am

Taylorman wrote:Wales v South Africa – Referee: Jerome Garces. Assist: Wayne Barnes & Ben O’Keefe. TMO: Ben Skeen

My gosh, glad we are in the other one Very Happy

Until you lose and then no doubt those refs will all be motherless

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Post by Taylorman on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 4:37 am

Pie wrote:
Taylorman wrote:Wales v South Africa – Referee: Jerome Garces. Assist: Wayne Barnes & Ben O’Keefe. TMO: Ben Skeen

My gosh, glad we are in the other one Very Happy

Until you lose and then no doubt those refs will all be motherless

Let's be clear here pie. You're advocating violence against women on this forum now are you?

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Post by Rugby Fan on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 4:52 am

Taylorman wrote:
Pie wrote:
Taylorman wrote:Wales v South Africa – Referee: Jerome Garces. Assist: Wayne Barnes & Ben O’Keefe. TMO: Ben Skeen

My gosh, glad we are in the other one Very Happy

Until you lose and then no doubt those refs will all be motherless

Let's be clear here pie. You're advocating violence against women on this forum now are you?
Wouldn't want to make unnecessary excuses but I wonder whether pie meant to say something about the officials being born out of wedlock but got his terminology all wrong.

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Post by Taylorman on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 6:36 am

Oh...ok. Could be terminology from the pastry industry, pies, tarts and things. Very Happy

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Post by Old Man on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 6:59 am

The term motherless in South Africa means drinking yourself into a stupor, However in the context of Pie’s sentence that is definitely not what he meant. Wink

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Post by tigertattie on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 9:28 am

WR wrapping Jaco's knuckles for that photo and Jaco has apologised for it meaning the claims of it being a fake photoshop image were more fake news than the claims of the photo being fake news.

Some say it was banter and needs to be forgotten, some say it was a gross misconduct in this day of professionalism.

The red was not controversial, big Vah clearly smacks Wainwright in the coupon with his elbow and he's even gone as far as to say he meant to do it (which was pretty obvious). Some are saying the picture brings the decision to give a red card into disrepute, almost saying that Jaco gave the red when he souldnt have and now making a joke about giving it and doing Wales a favour. He didnt do them a favour, he red carded a player who carried out a thuggish bit of foul play.
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Post by TightHEAD on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 9:31 am

Glad Bigger came through the game ok.
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Post by LondonTiger on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 9:34 am

Pie wrote:
Taylorman wrote:Wales v South Africa – Referee: Jerome Garces. Assist: Wayne Barnes & Ben O’Keefe. TMO: Ben Skeen

My gosh, glad we are in the other one Very Happy

Until you lose and then no doubt those refs will all be motherless

I am rather confuzzled. You seem to be suggesting, over a number of threads, that both England AND New Zealand will lose.

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Post by Mr Fishpaste on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 9:36 am

I don't see what the problem is with the photo...

That particular red card was the least controversial card possible...and so the ref joked about it afterwards (so not evidence of prior bias)...so what.

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Post by LondonTiger on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 9:50 am

Mr Fishpaste wrote:I don't see what the problem is with the photo...

That particular red card was the least controversial card possible...and so the ref joked about it afterwards (so not evidence of prior bias)...so what.

It demonstrates a slight lack of common sense - Peyper is effectively mocking the Frenchman which going forward will diminish his authority, even if just slightly.

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Post by TightHEAD on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 9:51 am

Peyper is the worst Ref at the finals anyway, he sees things that never happen during a game.
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Post by tigertattie on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 9:52 am

Mr Fishpaste wrote:I don't see what the problem is with the photo...

That particular red card was the least controversial card possible...and so the ref joked about it afterwards (so not evidence of prior bias)...so what.

Its the joking about it afterwards that has some up in arms. You can see why though. An official is having a laugh at a moment of madness that arguably denied France a World Cup semi final. You could also argue that "joking" about the elbow makes light of a thuggish bit of play that World Rugby are taking as a serious matter and trying to stamp out the old thuggish ways.
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Post by Old Man on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 9:58 am

TightHEAD wrote:Peyper is the worst Ref at the finals anyway, he sees things that never happen during a game.

There are some that can see dead people, maybe Peyper has a gift? Wink

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Post by TightHEAD on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 10:01 am

Still think there is nothing wrong with photos like this, they are not robots they are rugby fans too.
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Post by TightHEAD on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 10:07 am

Old Man wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:Peyper is the worst Ref at the finals anyway, he sees things that never happen during a game.

There are some that can see dead people, maybe Peyper has a gift? Wink

The only gift he has is getting away with a nice juicy World Rugby cheque for substandard work!

Stealing a living.
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Post by Old Man on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 10:10 am

TightHEAD wrote:
Old Man wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:Peyper is the worst Ref at the finals anyway, he sees things that never happen during a game.

There are some that can see dead people, maybe Peyper has a gift? Wink

The only gift he has is getting away with a nice juicy World Rugby cheque for substandard work!

Stealing a living.

That isn’t a gift, it is a perk. Cool

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Post by Barney McGrew did it on Tue 22 Oct 2019, 10:24 am

If there was anything controversial about the RC maybe the photo would be unwise. But since Vahaamahina let his team, his country and rugby down in the most blatant and brainless way, he deserves every bit of ridicule he gets. Pretty sure most French would see it that way too – they were on their way to a SF. His retirement has significantly raised the average IQ of the professional rugby player.
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