Scotland post mortem

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Post by NeilyBroon on Sun 13 Oct 2019, 1:49 pm

First topic message reminder :

So we're oot.

Question is... what now?

Do we think toonie will stay? If he does take the can which seems quite likely then who do we get to replace him?

I think this has to be the end of a few players too. We can't keep picking people on past form.
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Post by majesticimperialman on Sun 03 Nov 2019, 8:48 am

Are Scotland keeping Townsend as their coach?

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Post by BigGee on Sun 03 Nov 2019, 8:53 am

At the moment yes, but the problem of his future with the team won't go away if we keep under performing.

Scotland and Toonie both need a good 6N and the we have a tour to SA and NZ

It does not get sny easier!

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Post by NeilyBroon on Sun 03 Nov 2019, 9:07 am

I get a horrible feeling we'll have a mediocre 6Ns which will see toonie through until we get utterly manshamed by nz and sa then he'll have the excuse of "number 1 and 2 in the world"
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Post by RDW on Sun 03 Nov 2019, 10:55 am

Excellent post GC. Similar to Erasmus teamtalk saying (I paraphrase) that a world cup final isn't pressure - not knowing where your next meal is coming from is pressure and they are the people they are playing for.

It was like watching Scotland yesterday from England - dropped restarts, white like fever, poor decisions!

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Post by 123456789. on Sun 03 Nov 2019, 11:46 am

I wouldn't be surprised if we did the traditional beat Italy and England, lose the rest and everyone will look past it because we beat England.
This Six Nations should be an opportunity for us. Wales and Ireland are moving on from very good, longstanding coaches and very distinctive playing styles. If, and it's an enormous if, we're on song then we can catch them on the hop. France at home and Italy away should be wins. I'd always back us against England at home. If, just if, we can get our best players playing well, if Townsend accepts he needs to modify our approach, if we get a bit of luck and a generous bounce or two then maybe we can do something special. More likely, Townsend won't pick on form, won't change his approach and the ball will bounce every way but ours.

On the matter of support I wanted South Africa to win. Not because I'm in any way shape or form anti-English. Most of my close friends are English and I'd have been very happy for them to do well. Similarly in 2018 I happily went to the pub in a Scotland shirt to watch England play in the football world cup because I was desperate for them to do well. For the precise reason that Britain is not always a nice place to live at the moment. People are incredibly divided on almost every important matter. When England were doing well at the world cup people that changed. It seemed like a return to the Britain of 2012 before the divisive referendums. When Britain welcomed the world and did so brilliantly. However, the story of Siya Kolisi is incredibly inspiring. The image of a black man lifting the world cup wearing the Springbok jersey shows the power of sport to change lives and shows how far countries can come in a comparatively small period of time. Any division in our country pales in comparison with those that existed in South Africa and Kolisi's life shows the ability of sport to change individual lives and unite countries. Every English supporter I have discussed that with has admitted that they would probably have felt the same if it was Scotland against South Africa.

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Post by BigGee on Sun 03 Nov 2019, 12:43 pm

Hsrd to argue with that numbers and hard to begrudge them the win.

They have also been extremely gracious about it.

They were worthy winners

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 04 Nov 2019, 6:44 pm

https://www.scottishrugbyblog.co.uk/2019/11/why-scotland-will-dominate-the-2021-lions-tour-of-south-africa/

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Post by BigGee on Mon 04 Nov 2019, 7:06 pm

Brilliant - some of it is even true!

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Post by RDW on Mon 04 Nov 2019, 7:33 pm

Someone's been on the funny pills again!

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Post by majesticimperialman on Mon 04 Nov 2019, 8:36 pm

I will now post on the right thread.

How many of the Scottish RWC team, will be in the squad come the 6ns?

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Post by Highland Shaun on Mon 04 Nov 2019, 8:43 pm

Hopefully not too many of them, it's time for a complete rebuild, and that includes the coach, he should have gone the Monday after the Japan defeat!!

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Post by RDW on Mon 04 Nov 2019, 8:52 pm

I think it won't be that drastically different. Barclay, Wilson, Laidlaw and P Horne are unlikely to be involved, and the likes of Skinner, Hutchinson and hopefully even R Gray will be called up. Scott and especially Bennet could come back into the fold too after a good start to the season. Huw Jones as well if he gets a run of games and shows form.

Wouldn't surprise me of Toonie unearths a 9 from somewhere to have a look at.

So in conclusion we've got plenty options, we just don't know who the best players are! This is especially true in the centres where we have a long lost to choose from:

Taylor, Harris, Hutchinson, Scott, Bennett, Jones, Johnson

Some of those probably won't even make the squad!

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Post by RDW on Mon 04 Nov 2019, 8:58 pm

Oh we need to expand our depth at LH as Gordie Reid is retired from international rugby.

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Post by Anglobraveheart on Mon 04 Nov 2019, 11:28 pm

I doubt that we will see Skinner. The report on 18 September was that he would be 12 to 16 weeks. He then needs to get match fit. It would be more sensible for him to get fit and regain form over the rest of the season with a view to the summer tour as a target.
Hopefully our back row players will all be fit, and we need to look at Matt Fagerson, Crosbie and the like to replace Wilson and Barclay. We may benefit from Barclay being there as an experienced tourist, but Wilson needs to be left out.
I also rate Matt Smith at Glasgow, and hopefully he will get some game time. He had a great game against Exeter a couple of years ago and showed a lot of promise.
As for centres, we need to just get real and with it. Harris, Grigg and P Horne should not be near the squad, ever again. Harris is not international calibre. End of.
The centre group should be Hutch, Jones, Johnson, Scott, Bennett and Taylor (providing he finds form) or McDowell. It's then a case of selecting the best two from that group to start. At a push, Taylor can play wing, but we do have cover there with Kinghorn.
I think Laidlaw will be around until the summer tour is over, and his experience in the squad will help, but he is 3rd choice after Horne and Price. We need to bring through the future too, so young Dobie would be a good squad member for experience.
I would also bring a fit and on form Richie Gray back in, with the second rows being Gray, Gray, Toolis and Cummings. I think that we might see Kiran MacDonald in the squad too, again, if only for experience around the squad.
The guys I would hope are excluded are Wilson, Gilchrist, Grigg, Harris, P Horne. These are good club guys, but are not the future, and we need to move on from them.
It's going to be a funny 6N, as I suspect there will be a RWC hangover for England and Wales, and Ireland have a changing of the guard potentially (oh how I would love us to turn them over in the opening match - would just love it) - sorry, did that come out loud?
As for France, as predictable as the weather and controllable as a box of frogs. And with Shaun Edwards as potential defence coach (blimey, he could do a good job for us) it could be a strong year for our gallic cousins.
So, in summary, we need the new blood and to build for the future. If we keep the old hands as first choice in place of the young blood, we will be humiliated both in the 6N, and the summer tour.

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Post by George Carlin on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 5:04 am

Anglobraveheart wrote:I doubt that we will see Skinner. The report on 18 September was that he would be 12 to 16 weeks. He then needs to get match fit. It would be more sensible for him to get fit and regain form over the rest of the season with a view to the summer tour as a target.
Hopefully our back row players will all be fit, and we need to look at Matt Fagerson, Crosbie and the like to replace Wilson and Barclay. We may benefit from Barclay being there as an experienced tourist, but Wilson needs to be left out.
I also rate Matt Smith at Glasgow, and hopefully he will get some game time. He had a great game against Exeter a couple of years ago and showed a lot of promise.
As for centres, we need to just get real and with it. Harris, Grigg and P Horne should not be near the squad, ever again. Harris is not international calibre. End of.
The centre group should be Hutch, Jones, Johnson, Scott, Bennett and Taylor (providing he finds form) or McDowell. It's then a case of selecting the best two from that group to start. At a push, Taylor can play wing, but we do have cover there with Kinghorn.
I think Laidlaw will be around until the summer tour is over, and his experience in the squad will help, but he is 3rd choice after Horne and Price. We need to bring through the future too, so young Dobie would be a good squad member for experience.
I would also bring a fit and on form Richie Gray back in, with the second rows being Gray, Gray, Toolis and Cummings. I think that we might see Kiran MacDonald in the squad too, again, if only for experience around the squad.
The guys I would hope are excluded are Wilson, Gilchrist, Grigg, Harris, P Horne. These are good club guys, but are not the future, and we need to move on from them.
It's going to be a funny 6N, as I suspect there will be a RWC hangover for England and Wales, and Ireland have a changing of the guard potentially (oh how I would love us to turn them over in the opening match - would just love it) - sorry, did that come out loud?
As for France, as predictable as the weather and controllable as a box of frogs. And with Shaun Edwards as potential defence coach (blimey, he could do a good job for us) it could be a strong year for our gallic cousins.
So, in summary, we need the new blood and to build for the future. If we keep the old hands as first choice in place of the young blood, we will be humiliated both in the 6N, and the summer tour.
Can't argue with that Anglo.

Who we ship on really comes down to whom we have adequate replacements for. There are some interesting calls. Sean Maitland is 31 now, but is there really another Darcy Graham who is screaming for selection over him? Not really.

Then there are calls to be made about who is actually test standard and who isn't. There are lots of examples. I have tried so hard to be balanced about what Grant Gilchrist brings but he compares really badly to the new generation of locks - Itoje, Kruis, Lawes, Ryan, Ball, Le Roux - he has neither the power of some nor the dynamism or athleticism of others.

Still makes my head explode when I look at our centre options. We gave Graeme Morrison 35 caps for christ's sake.
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Post by Anglobraveheart on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 6:42 am

GC, regarding Gilchrist, I have never felt the need to have power, dynamism or athleticism in a sentence contining his name. Unless it is prefixed by 'lack of'.
Ambling, ineffective and needless penalty magnet in the red zone are more apt IMO.
You are correct regarding Maitland. We have Darcy, Kinghorn, Seymour, and little else. McGuigan, Hughes, Hoyland etc are club players, and not consistent international standard.
To be fair to Graeme Morrison, his single dimension was all we had, in the reals of Marcus di Rollo, Hugo Southwell, Andrew Henderson, Ben MacDougal Simon Webster, and the inimitable Nick No Hands de Luca. None of them would be in front of Horne, Grigg or Harris mentioned above as now surplus.
We must move on with the young players coming through, and hope that the next couple of years U20s will produce some future talent to carry on where our current new pretenders take us to. Hopefully on an upward trajectory.

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Post by RDW on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 7:04 am

Harsh saying Harris isn't international class given he was one of our better players of the warm ups and world cup!

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Post by Tramptastic on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 8:00 am

Im not so sure the allegations of "totally useless" being thrown at Gilchrist are accurate. In my eyes he's as consistent is J. Gray - makes his tackles, hits rucks and carries ineffectively. It's true that you need someone athletic paired with one of those two, like Cummings or Big Gray..

Toolis is fairly useless for Scotland. If any lock should be dropped it's him.

I agree with RDW in that Harris was our centre highlight of the world cup. It wasn't his fault that we lost games and he didn't actually make many mistakes, made his tackles well and showed some deft hands at times.

What we all feel is that we wish Huw Jones had actually had form/fitness and had been picked ahead of Harris. However, Jones didnt, we all feel bitter about this and for some reason are aiming our frustrations at his replacement, Harris.

For the six nations we should be including in the wider squad: Scott, Bennett, Hutchinson, Harris and Huw Jones. Taylor as well if he stays injury free and finds some kind of form. Dunbar appears to be out of sight, out of mind and is made of glass which is a shame because he is defensively our best player and offers a different point of attack in our backline in comparison to the other options (with the exception of Scott who, these days, is also quite abrasive in trucking the ball up).

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Post by EWT Spoons on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 9:39 am

As much as I think we need to see changes I can’t see anywhere near as many as being suggested here.

I’d agree some players should probably be moved on, but if Willson (for example) is getting a game for Glasgow then he’s going to be included.  I get the impression Toonie is pretty loyal to some players and will keep playing them until his hand is forced.

On the winger front, Duhan qualifies in the summer/autumn next year and whilst I know this topic was specifically around the 6n, assuming SA don’t cap him first, (would be massively ironic if they capped him in the summer against us) then I think he might take Maitland’s place.  Obviously totally different players, but unless someone else bursts onto the scene, he’s likely the next cab off the rank.  Or of course Kinghorn will come in on one wing, Darcy on the other and Hoggy at FB.

Also P.Horne is going to be involved in some capacity, even if every other centre we have is playing out their skin, he'll be involved.

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Post by RDW on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 9:43 am

Duhan moved in the summer of 2017 - not sure exactly when. Hopefully it was in June to allow him to travel in the summer.

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Post by EWT Spoons on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 9:49 am

BBC reported his signing in May, so fingers crossed it's early summer, but I'm sure I read somewhere that it was just after the summer tests, so wouldn't be available until the autumn. However I am more than happy to be proven wrong on that one.

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Post by EWT Spoons on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 9:56 am

LondonTiger wrote:https://www.scottishrugbyblog.co.uk/2019/11/why-scotland-will-dominate-the-2021-lions-tour-of-south-africa/

They've been taking the piss out of the 'independent writer' the SRU have and the nonsense they've been coming out with (how it was the fans fault we lost to Ireland), so they're just punting out a load of toss in the same style. I assume.

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Post by RDW on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 9:58 am

Yeah that independent writer has been bloody awful

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Post by bsando on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 10:09 am

Sadly Huw Jones decided to have a drop in form at the worst possible moment. I really hope he can reboot and hit his former form in the 6N this year. Must be tough when you know you've been on a rapid climb from University to Western Province to Stormers and Super Rugby to Scotland international honours to then find yourself on the bench at Glasgow and not getting picked for the RWC.

I am hoping this 6N can be an opportunity for Danny Wilson to flex his muscles. When was the last time a high tempo, expansive style won a 6N title? The pack has to be powerful and effective to beat any side apart from Italy in the 6N. I know Scotland and Toonies Scotland in particular like to run around defences but I think all Scotland fans want to see our pack carrying more directly and less of the side to side passing with no real gain. The kicking game of Hogg and Russell need to be on point too of course otherwise all the hard work by the forwards will be for nought.

If we play like we did in the RWC we'll be staring at a 5th or even 6th place finish. Ireland and Wales may be in coaching transition but they're still going to be as dangerous as ever. France, in my opinion, are contenders for the title in 2020. They have finally found the pieces to the puzzle and this will be the toughest French team Scotland have come up against for a long time. England should be favourites. In fact, the 6N this year has a real possibility of returning to the ways of old, with one of England or France for 1st and Ireland Wales battling out 3rd/4th and Scotland Italy battling to avoid the spoon. I really hope not though.

If Toonie ejects some of the older players and adds a few younger players into the mix I think it will show fans he is looking ahead at the bigger picture. Retaining the likes of Barclay, Laidlaw, P Horne in the starting XV will have to result in wins to justify their inclusion otherwise fans will become even more restless. I would love for Toonie to just say that the slate is wiped clean and I will only pick on form. Previous experience and exploits are now irrelevant.

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Post by bsando on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 10:19 am

RDW wrote:Yeah that independent writer has been bloody awful

"Scotland’s preparations for the final group game against Japan were hampered by the weather and World Rugby’s administrators." picard

"there’s no doubt that it’ll be a straight shoot out between George Horne and Ali Price for the Lions 9 shirt." picard

"In the forwards Jamie Richie, Hamish Watson and Magnus Bradbury are the only combination capable of countering the threat posed by the Boks" picard

"Oli Kebble, Jaco van der Walt and Duhan van der Merwe are all likely to be in contention and unlike the Bok rejects favoured by Ireland these were players competing to get into an ascendant South African side" picard

This mystery pundit is not just shooting from the hip but shooting for the hip blindfolded riding a unicycle.

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Post by 123456789. on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 10:38 am

Quite obviously a wind up.

Stuart Barnes and/or Stephen Jones wrote an article in the times this weekend about the Lions. He had Russell at 10, Farrell at 12 and Hutchinson at 13.

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Post by RDW on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 10:44 am

I read an article saying Dobie could force himself into contention as the starting Lions 9 in 2 years.

I mean come on....

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Post by EWT Spoons on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 10:53 am

bsando wrote:
RDW wrote:Yeah that independent writer has been bloody awful

"Scotland’s preparations for the final group game against Japan were hampered by the weather and World Rugby’s administrators." picard

"there’s no doubt that it’ll be a straight shoot out between George Horne and Ali Price for the Lions 9 shirt."  picard

"In the forwards Jamie Richie, Hamish Watson and Magnus Bradbury are the only combination capable of countering the threat posed by the Boks"  picard

"Oli Kebble, Jaco van der Walt and Duhan van der Merwe are all likely to be in contention and unlike the Bok rejects favoured by Ireland these were players competing to get into an ascendant South African side"  picard

This mystery pundit is not just shooting from the hip but shooting for the hip blindfolded riding a unicycle.

Aye this is the piss take of the SRU's version.

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Post by bsando on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 12:43 pm

T123456789. wrote:Quite obviously a wind up.

Stuart Barnes and/or Stephen Jones wrote an article in the times this weekend about the Lions. He had Russell at 10, Farrell at 12 and Hutchinson at 13.

Stuart Barnes' Lions XV for 2021:
Liam Williams (Wales); Anthony Watson (England), Rory Hutchinson (Scotland), Owen Farrell (England), Joe Cokanasiga (England); Finn Russell (Scotland), Rhys Webb (Wales); Rhys Carre (Wales), Jamie George (England), Kyle Sinckler (England), Maro Itoje (England, capt), James Ryan (Ireland), Tom Curry (England), Sam Underhill (England), Billy Vunipola (England).

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Post by tigertattie on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 12:44 pm

Calm down folks.

Lets break this down!

Shoot out between Ali Price and George Horne for the lions 9 in 2021 - Who else in the world of GB and Ireland is there to compete with them?

Ritchie, Watson and Bradbury is our best backrow - Go on, give me a better backrow for Scotland right now!
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Post by bsando on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 12:46 pm

I’d probably say Johnny Gray could sneak into that team. The solid tackler alongside the abrasive and disruptive Itoje. He just needs to keep having performances like he did against Japan. If only he had better leadership qualities. 

Backrow Watson and Ritchie have to in the conversation too. Lions will have some excellent backrow options in 2021.

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 12:48 pm

Eugh Lions chat 2 years out, how utterly depressing.

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Post by SecretFly on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 12:51 pm

Let's talk about Lions silver medals?

No?

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Post by Anglobraveheart on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 1:03 pm

I think saying that Harris was the centre highlight in the WC is pretty much a measure of the mediocrity of our play in the midfield. The handling was poor and we looked like strangers a lot of the time. There was just no cohesion or real threat in attack, and defensively we were lacking in the two tougher games. Even then, there was little effectiveneds against Samoa, with 2 penalty tries to show for the endeavours.
My point reharding the centres is that fit and on form, Jones, Johnson, Scott, Bennett, Hutch and Taylor are a class above Harris. So given the option of those 6 being fully fit and on form, there is no need for Harris.
If Harris was good enough, he would command a better contract than Newcastle or the Gloucester bench. That may sound harsh, but it is the truth behind his ladt couple of seasons and this season. He may well have stood out at Newcastle, but they were relegated, and as we have seen with other players, they can look good in poorly performing sides, but that doesn't make they good internationals.
The six centres above (apart from young Hutch) have proven themselves at international level, and that is what we should be aiming to move forwards with.
As for Gilchrist, comparing his tackling qualities to J Gray's is amusing, how often have we seen him failing to get up in the line whilst the opposition romp through where he should have been. Sorry, IMO he's a paseenger penalty magnet. We need to move forward with future potential, not with never haves.

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Post by NeilyBroon on Tue 05 Nov 2019, 1:21 pm

You mean we're not a team of world beaters?

I only see one thing wrong with that article. Stafford McDowall will be captain.

Otherwise who could argue with that? We're just sandbagging for the 2083 WC.
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Post by tigertattie on Wed 06 Nov 2019, 4:19 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:You mean we're not a team of world beaters?

I only see one thing wrong with that article. Stafford McDowall will be captain.

Otherwise who could argue with that? We're just sandbagging for the 2083 WC.

We're not World Beaters, we're Dark Horses!
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Post by NeilyBroon on Wed 06 Nov 2019, 4:51 pm

tigertattie wrote:
NeilyBroon wrote:You mean we're not a team of world beaters?

I only see one thing wrong with that article. Stafford McDowall will be captain.

Otherwise who could argue with that? We're just sandbagging for the 2083 WC.

We're not World Beaters, we're Dark Horses!

Ah of course.

Well the odds will be that bad for us winning the 6Ns this it may be worth me spending 2 quid on a bet!

Every dark horse has its day. Too bad we're better at falling at the first hedge!
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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 7:57 am

NeilyBroon wrote:
tigertattie wrote:
NeilyBroon wrote:You mean we're not a team of world beaters?

I only see one thing wrong with that article. Stafford McDowall will be captain.

Otherwise who could argue with that? We're just sandbagging for the 2083 WC.

We're not World Beaters, we're Dark Horses!

Ah of course.

Well the odds will be that bad for us winning the 6Ns this it may be worth me spending 2 quid on a bet!

Every dark horse has its day. Too bad we're better at falling at the first hedge!

There’s the title of our 6N thread! Followed shortly after by the ‘why the dark horse had to be taken round the back and shot’ post-mortem thread.

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Post by NeilyBroon on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 9:57 am

I like it. It'll probably open with the question "why in God's name did toonie make pete horne captain?"
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Post by Tattie Scones RRN on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 12:36 pm

£70k??????

World Rugby need meeting off the bus.

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Post by miaow on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 12:37 pm

Sadly I think the old dark horse in Scotland is Lloyds Bank coming to bail them out.

And, ideally, to pay off Gregor... Run

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Post by RDW on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 12:42 pm

Bit of a farce. The SRU's comments were always regarding legal specifics about the commercial agreement. At no point did we say something like "everyone's making a big fuss about this Haggis thing, they should all just get on with it".

A real mess for all concerned.

Scotland post mortem - Page 8 EIxQlFKWoAAVuZp

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Post by Tattie Scones RRN on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 1:19 pm

I Hope Dodson tells them to go fck themselves.

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 2:23 pm

I hope so too, just so we have even more evidence of what a complete pr1ck he is.

Honestly I don't understand how anyone thinks how he conducted himself was remotely appropriate. I hear all the 'any other union would've done the same' and I can't help but think, but would they? Or would they have done the appropriate thing and kept these conversations with World Rugby behind closed doors? There was no need to go public, and it demonstrably created a fair bit of ill will towards Scotland from Japanese fans who would otherwise have had no reason to view us in anything but a positive light.

Bad call, terrible timing, brought the game into disrepute all because of one man's ego. Open and shut case for me.

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Post by NeilyBroon on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 4:26 pm

Aye reading the beeb article it seem very petty from the SRU. Just grow a pair and apologise and give money to charity.
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Post by RDW on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 4:47 pm

A few key points here that pretty much every journalist seems to be ignoring:

- Legal action was never threatened, just that they would seek legal advice. A key difference!
- Dodson's comments came during a 2 hour press conference where he expressed sympathy for the Japanese people several times and acknowledged how difficult a situation it was. WR and the press are making us out to be insensitive monsters who all we cared about was suing everyone.
- It is World Rugby's opinion that it brought the game into disrepute and was insensitive to all the people affected. I'm no lawyer but would that stand up in court - i.e. do they have any proof that it brought the game into disrepute? As mentioned above during the press conference we said what needed to be said about the effect it was having. We also released a statement saying similar sentiments.
- The Japan coach had a bit of a rant about it but he didn't say that Scotland have insulted the nation and were being disrespectful. Reading his quotes it was more anger of the insinuation that Japan would like the game to be cancelled (never said by the SRU) or that they didn't deserve their place in the QF (also never said by the SRU), and painting it as a David vs Goliath game given all his players are amateurs etc.
- There's obviously no bad blood between Scotland and Japan given we've agreed a test match next November.
- The 'independent' bloke that has passed this judgement is the same guy that tried to ban Ford and Gray during the last world cup - a decision that was later overruled. I guess he doesn't like the Scots!  Very Happy
- They say in their judgement that SRU's insinuation that teams are treated differently was one of the reasons they are guilty. What about Parisee's comments who clearly stated he thinks teams are treated differently?


There's absolutely no doubt that the whole situation could have been handled better, and I suspect Dodson's dealings with WR behind closed door is what they are most affronted about. I just do not believe this is a valid disciplinary case and I also don't understand why WR are doing it - it massively distracts from what was a very successful tournament. I can't imagine SRU will accept this - which WR must know - and it's going to get even more messy when the arbitration happens. This should have been dealt with behind closed doors.

For what it's worth I hope the SRU do end up donate to the charity even if we have our offences cleared.

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 5:19 pm

RDW wrote:
- Legal action was never threatened, just that they would seek legal advice. A key difference!

Come on, that comment was a clear shot across World Rugby’s bows and everyone is going to interpret it as such! You hardly seek legal advice just for a laugh, it’s not like anyone enjoys talking to lawyers Wink

The SRU’s actions directly created this story which in turn caused very real upset to some Japanese people at a difficult time for them. I can see why World Rugby have a problem with that personally

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Post by bsando on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 5:50 pm

I know the SRU won’t but they should say a quick but polite apology and pay the fine. It’s an unwanted distraction and as you may see from the rabid mob of commentators on the BBC website. Is it worth pursuing? I don’t think it is.

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Post by RDW on Thu 07 Nov 2019, 9:34 pm

Tom English again putting things better than I ever could.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/50338259

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Post by bsando on Fri 08 Nov 2019, 7:56 am

A good piece by English, WR shouldn't get off the hook for messing up the contingency plans in the first place. Had they organised that correctly there wouldn't have been an issue to begin with. How a stadium on the opposite coast of Japan and some accommodation for teams couldn't have been put aside for any Typhoon threat with 10 years of planning is pretty strange. Both the Canada and NZ fixtures should have been played at such a location behind closed doors.

Saying that, I think the SRU should respect the governing body that is WR and issue some sort of an apology and pay the fine (which is for a great cause so no qualms there). If WR don't back down then it may be a case of the SRU cutting its losses before they get in more trouble. Being the bigger person so to speak.

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