SF1 - Match Thread - ENGLAND v NEW ZEALAND - 26/10/19 - K/O 09:00 BST

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Post by miaow on Thu 17 Oct 2019, 9:55 pm

First topic message reminder :

Again, making these early for the sake of ease and consistency.

ENGLAND

Team:Daly; Watson, Tuilagi, Farrell (capt), May; Ford, Youngs; M Vunipola, George, Sinckler, Itoje, Lawes, Curry, Underhill, B Vunipola.

Replacements: Cowan-Dickie, Marler, Cole, Kruis, Wilson, Heinz, Slade, Joseph.

NEW ZEALAND

Team: Beauden Barrett; Sevu Reece, Jack Goodhue, Anton Lienert-Brown, George Bridge; Richie Mo'unga, Aaron Smith; Joe Moody, Codie Taylor, Nepo Laulala, Brodie Retallick, Sam Whitelock, Scott Barrett, Ardie Savea, Kieran Read (capt).

Replacements: Dane Coles, Ofa Tuungafasi, Angus Ta'avao, Patrick Tuipulotu, Sam Cane, TJ Perenara, Sonny Bill Williams, Jordie Barrett.



Venue: Yokohama
Referee: Nigel Owens
AR1: Romain Poite
AR2: Pascal Gauzere
TMO: Marius Joncker


Last edited by miaow on Thu 24 Oct 2019, 1:52 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Post by Poorfour on Sun 20 Oct 2019, 9:42 pm

The big difference in significance between Ireland’s result last year and England’s is what has happened to the teams since then.

Ireland won with a full strength team at the height of its powers. But Ireland have looked fragile since England took them apart in Dublin the following February. Teams now know that if they get in their faces, the Irish game plan breaks down.

England’s match against the All Blacks was more interesting. They were coming off a poor performance against the Boks, with a makeshift pack in which half the players had a combined total of less than 10 caps, and yet found a gameplan that saw them a boot length away from victory. The point being, Ireland had nowhere to go but down, England were (and are) still improving. 

Both matches saw one side clinically putting away another highly ranked side that most commentators thought would cause them trouble. New Zealand had the higher points difference - but not by much, and conceded two tries to one.

Everything about England’s RWC campaign has been very measured so far. They’ve been doing what they need to do and not giving much away. Eddie has masterminded New Zealand’s exit from the RWC twice before, and he undoubtedly has a plan to do it again. The NZ side he has to beat is better than the ones he knocked out, but then the side he’s coaching now is also better.
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Post by Taylorman on Sun 20 Oct 2019, 10:06 pm

MightyQuin wrote:The games last year are certainly irrelevant but you’d say the writing was on the wall for Ireland, given their more recent results.

I’d say both NZ and Eng have improved since the Autumn game last year and both will be fielding stronger teams. Scoreline will be similar in my opinion, just haven’t figured which way round it’ll be.

Yes true. Since last year they lost four, three convincingly, three when it mattered. When titles are on the line. By losing to Japan, Ireland took the hard road, and paid early. Things have changed for NZ rugby. Losses are part of reality as long as they're prioritised. Reality is the AB's can no longer expect to go out and win every single test when every single side is wanting to take your scalp more than anyone elses. 18 times a year with that sort of pressure? Too much. You've got to manage it, and prioritise.

And that makes making all roads lead to the World cup. The loss to Ireland last year wasnt ideal, but it was necessary. It tells you more about your own side.

Agree re England, they were impressive and I think of the 8 NZ and England stood out from the others, the Boks next, eventually.

Think it'll be a Bok vs NZ/ Eng final for sure. Besides their game plan, England have athletes, with x factor, and that's where NZ hope to be stronger.

England havent yet played one of the five considered likely winners yet, so 'could' be under cooked, though Argie and Oz gave them enough to work with.

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Post by Taylorman on Sun 20 Oct 2019, 10:10 pm

Poorfour wrote:The big difference in significance between Ireland’s result last year and England’s is what has happened to the teams since then.

Ireland won with a full strength team at the height of its powers. But Ireland have looked fragile since England took them apart in Dublin the following February. Teams now know that if they get in their faces, the Irish game plan breaks down.

England’s match against the All Blacks was more interesting. They were coming off a poor performance against the Boks, with a makeshift pack in which half the players had a combined total of less than 10 caps, and yet found a gameplan that saw them a boot length away from victory. The point being, Ireland had nowhere to go but down, England were (and are) still improving. 

Both matches saw one side clinically putting away another highly ranked side that most commentators thought would cause them trouble. New Zealand had the higher points difference - but not by much, and conceded two tries to one.

Everything about England’s RWC campaign has been very measured so far. They’ve been doing what they need to do and not giving much away. Eddie has masterminded New Zealand’s exit from the RWC twice before, and he undoubtedly has a plan to do it again. The NZ side he has to beat is better than the ones he knocked out, but then the side he’s coaching now is also better.

Yep, well said. England look solid, everywhere. They probably could have done with the France match, but theyre set up nicely now.

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Post by miaow on Sun 20 Oct 2019, 11:02 pm

Taylorman wrote:I replied to this

’You make NZ favourites simply because it's NZ and everything that means, but by how much? Hard to say.’

True I didn’t say you said England

Excellent. Arguing with yourself then.

Buy a diary?

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Post by miaow on Sun 20 Oct 2019, 11:19 pm

Mr Bounce wrote:The thing is, England-NZ last year was played with fourth and fifth choice loosehead props and a flanker at No.8. We were clearly missing a lot of good players and yet (admittedly with home advantage played in the rain) only lost by a point. They were 15-0 up at one point. Add to that a marginal (but correct) offside call for a chargedown and they would have won.

Several good points, Bounce, but just to focus on this, the more of the RWC goes by, the more Lawes' chargedown feels like a grave error in the grand scheme of things, and I'd be frustrated to be English. Perhaps there hasn't been anything as glaring as that, in the lead up to a try or score, but the offside line isn't being policed as it felt like it might be in the wake of that furore.

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Post by Taylorman on Sun 20 Oct 2019, 11:31 pm

miaow wrote:
Taylorman wrote:I replied to this

’You make NZ favourites simply because it's NZ and everything that means, but by how much? Hard to say.’

True I didn’t say you said England

Excellent. Arguing with yourself then.

Buy a diary?

No idea what you're on about, but you just carry on monitoring the site like a good little soldier huh?

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Post by miaow on Sun 20 Oct 2019, 11:42 pm

I'm saying if you want to write an outraged diatribe culminating with calling someone 'warped' and disagreeing with their 'logic', you should actually make sure the person you're responding to has said anything close to what you're arguing against. It's logical, really...haha.

Otherwise, buy a diary, and pop your thoughts down in there instead.

Or better yet, let out your spare room to this guy, and go and berate him evey time you have something you need to get off your chest...

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 1:19 am

Aah yup, I'll leave that with you. sending me self portraits is getting a little creepy.

On with the show! thumbsup

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Post by Rugby Fan on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:07 am

Weather watch:

Two systems have sprung up. One will dump water on us tomorrow (Tuesday), while the other is not currently expected to make landfall but rain is forecast at times on Friday and Saturday (match day)

https://www.jma.go.jp/en/typh/

The stadium for the semi-finals in Yokohama is uncovered. It dried out for the Japan-Scotland game because all rain stopped about 18 hours before kick-off, and it was a sunny day, with temperatures quickly rising above 30 degrees. It'll be low to mid-20s at best on Saturday. Even if it doesn't rain on the day, the pitch will probably still be damp.

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Post by miaow on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:12 am

Ideal for England tbh. Possibly a repeat of the game last year in terms of style and tactics.

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Post by miaow on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:15 am

Also, just a reminder - what happens if the weather results in a game being called off? The game gets rearranged, yes?

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Post by BigTrevsbigmac on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:24 am

Good news re Jack Nowell coming out today should be available for semi final as will be Johnny May

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Post by Rugby Fan on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 6:29 am

miaow wrote:Also, just a reminder - what happens if the weather results in a game being called off? The game gets rearranged, yes?
Yes. However, there's no talk of that right now, as neither of these systems is on the scale of Hagibis. Still I wouldn't want the second one to change course towards Yokohama.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:03 am

Not particularly interesting, but there are some permutations of results that could see NZ knocked out in the semi but ending the tournament top of the World Rankings.

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:12 am

Yeah top of the rankings doesn’t mean a lot without the title. No. 1 ranking is conceptual under the existing system and at best indicates a trend rather than who the best team is. The title is everything. Would rather be ranked tenth and win the title than first and not.

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Post by Gooseberry on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:14 am

Taylorman wrote:Yeah top of the rankings doesn’t mean a lot without the title. No. 1 ranking is conceptual under the existing system and at best indicates a trend rather than who the best team is. The title is everything. Would rather be ranked tenth and win the title than first and not.


Dont make me dig out all your posts about England in 2003....

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:14 am

LondonTiger wrote:Not particularly interesting, but there are some permutations of results that could see NZ knocked out in the semi but ending the tournament top of the World Rankings.

By being the most consistent team against all opposition over a very long period that is no surprise. I guess if england win the final and Nz come third?

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Post by Gooseberry on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:16 am

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:Good news re Jack Nowell coming out today

Odd timing to come out mid tournament

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:18 am

Gooseberry wrote:
Taylorman wrote:Yeah top of the rankings doesn’t mean a lot without the title. No. 1 ranking is conceptual under the existing system and at best indicates a trend rather than who the best team is. The title is everything. Would rather be ranked tenth and win the title than first and not.


Dont make me dig out all your posts about England in 2003....

Be my guest, you won’t find anything from me, besides, England we’re both that year. What’s your point?

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:20 am

Gooseberry wrote:
BigTrevsbigmac wrote:Good news re Jack Nowell coming out today

Odd timing to come out mid tournament

Better out than in. Always wondered...!

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:26 am

Again not particularly interesting but of the five teams touted to win this thing...NZ, SA, Ireland, Wales, England, NZ is the only one to beat another in that group, and have two, and will have to beat all four...should Wales beat SA.

SA have lost one, to NZ, and none of Ireland, Wales nor England have won one...England and Wales have yet to play one.

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Post by maestegmafia on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 8:53 am

Taylorman wrote:Again not particularly interesting but of the five teams touted to win this thing...NZ, SA, Ireland, Wales, England, NZ is the only one to beat another in that group, and have two, and will have to beat all four...should Wales beat SA.

SA have lost one, to NZ, and none of Ireland, Wales nor England have won one...England and  Wales have yet to play one.
wales have already beaten Ireland and England in the Six Nations when we won the Grand Slam.

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:00 am

maestegmafia wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:Not particularly interesting, but there are some permutations of results that could see NZ knocked out in the semi but ending the tournament top of the World Rankings.

By being the most consistent team against all opposition over a very long period that is no surprise. I guess if england win the final and Nz come third?

Most permutations require England to lose the final. The only ways for England to win the tournament and not top the rankings is for them to "win" one of the ties in a penalty shoot out.

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Post by Rinsure on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:00 am

Taylorman wrote:
The main reason the ABs won last night is because man for man they had better individual rugby players on the field each operating at far higher levels than their opposite.

The also have far better players man for man vs England as well. Doesnt mean they’ll win on that basis either, but it will be a big factor.

This piqued my interest. Here are the match-ups for NZ & Eng from the matches at the weekend:

1. Moody vs. Mako
2. Taylor vs. George
3. Laulala vs. Sinckler
4. Retallick vs. Itoje
5. Whitelock vs. Lawes
6. Savea vs. Curry
7. Cane vs. Underhill
8. Read vs. Billy
9. Smith vs. Youngs
10. Mo'unga vs. Farrell
11. Bridge vs. May
12. Lienert-Brown vs. Tuilagi
13. Goodhue vs. Slade
14. Reece vs. Watson
15. Barrett vs. Daly

In the front rows I'd say man-for-man England have the better players. It's close, for sure, and the NZers are possibly better in the tight, but the all-round skill-set of the England props edges it for me.

I'll give NZ the second row pairing, based on experience and achievements. I don't think there's a lot in it, again, but I can't really argue for the England pairing over the Kiwis.

Back row? Very close. Curry is the find of the year, and Underhill is a machine. Savea and Cane are two of the very best. It's a tough call as to who tops the pile. Billy isn't at his best (IMHO), but draws enough attention to drag in defenders. Same for Read, I think. On balance, a draw.

Half backs - okay, Smith is way ahead of Youngs on form. Mo'unga and Farrell? Very different, but when the chips are down I'd back Farrell every time. Probably my most contentious one, but I think Farrell is better.

Centres I have to lean towards the ABs, as Eng don't appear to know what our "best" midfield is. The "horses for courses" picking has its place, but possibly doesn't allow true partnership building. However, man-for-man I'd take Manu over Lienert-Brown, and Goodhue over Slade. I expect arguments here!

The wings are pretty evenly matched, and Beaden vs Daly? Well, I don't think we need to go there..

Not as clear-cut as you seem to posit, Taylorman. Certainly not "far better players man for man".

Can't wait.


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Post by Gooseberry on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:03 am

maestegmafia wrote:
Gooseberry wrote:
BigTrevsbigmac wrote:Good news re Jack Nowell coming out today

Odd timing to come out mid tournament

Better out than in. Always wondered...!

Maybe the prospect of having a semi against this fine young All Blacks side

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:29 am

Rinsure wrote:
Taylorman wrote:
The main reason the ABs won last night is because man for man they had better individual rugby players on the field each operating at far higher levels than their opposite.

The also have far better players man for man vs England as well. Doesnt mean they’ll win on that basis either, but it will be a big factor.

This piqued my interest. Here are the match-ups for NZ & Eng from the matches at the weekend:

1. Moody vs. Mako
2. Taylor vs. George
3. Laulala vs. Sinckler
4. Retallick vs. Itoje
5. Whitelock vs. Lawes
6. Savea vs. Curry
7. Cane vs. Underhill
8. Read vs. Billy
9. Smith vs. Youngs
10. Mo'unga vs. Farrell
11. Bridge vs. May
12. Lienert-Brown vs. Tuilagi
13. Goodhue vs. Slade
14. Reece vs. Watson
15. Barrett vs. Daly

In the front rows I'd say man-for-man England have the better players. It's close, for sure, and the NZers are possibly better in the tight, but the all-round skill-set of the England props edges it for me.

I'll give NZ the second row pairing, based on experience and achievements. I don't think there's a lot in it, again, but I can't really argue for the England pairing over the Kiwis.

Back row? Very close. Curry is the find of the year, and Underhill is a machine. Savea and Cane are two of the very best. It's a tough call as to who tops the pile. Billy isn't at his best (IMHO), but draws enough attention to drag in defenders. Same for Read, I think. On balance, a draw.

Half backs - okay, Smith is way ahead of Youngs on form. Mo'unga and Farrell? Very different, but when the chips are down I'd back Farrell every time. Probably my most contentious one, but I think Farrell is better.

Centres I have to lean towards the ABs, as Eng don't appear to know what our "best" midfield is. The "horses for courses" picking has its place, but possibly doesn't allow true partnership building. However, man-for-man I'd take Manu over Lienert-Brown, and Goodhue over Slade. I expect arguments here!

The wings are pretty evenly matched, and Beaden vs Daly? Well, I don't think we need to go there..

Not as clear-cut as you seem to posit, Taylorman. Certainly not "far better players man for man".

Can't wait.


Yeah I get what you’re saying but your assessment of man for man is different to mine. I’m not just talking about putting the names beside each other on a sheet of paper and going hmm, which ones better?

I’m saying that each AB is currently operating at very high levels of accuracy and pace within their roles and that collectively each is far better tuned to winning a WCup knockout.

Before the Irish match Sexton was considered better than Mo’unga, who according to ‘experts’ said Sextons experience, nerve, ability under pressure was superior to Mo’ungas in practically every way’.

The actual comparison was that it was Sexton that was poor, Sexton that cracked with key missed kicks for touch, and failed completely to get his side underway when it mattered, despite his confidence to...what was it? ‘create history’ before the match.

Your comparison method would have had Sexton ahead of Mo’unga, Murray possibly ahead of Smith, another poor performer, and probably several others in the Ireland team ahead when in fact, not a single one was.

World Cup knockout. I’ve said it for a year here, now it’s starting to realise...it is different from anything else.

Sooo, what I’m saying is, it’s ‘likely’ that the levels that the ABs are currently operating at will ensure those head to head comparisons go in the ABs favour.

So let’s pick one...Farrell vs Mo’unga. Let’s see how each goes ‘when the chips are down’ as you say. I’ll pick Mo’unga to be considerably better than Farrell.

Curry may be the ‘find’ but he isn’t against the ABs, he’s not played them has he? Not sure about last year. Granted he looks impressive.

Reece, Bridge, Scott Barrett, Goodhue are our finds. They won’t rate on paper, but I’m guessing at current levels they’ll all outplay their opposites. Each was far better than their Irish opposite, and each will be better for it.

Not saying ‘it’s a forgone conclusion’ but collectively, the ABs will ensure the individual comparisons, regardless of who has done what, will ‘mostly’ win out. It is their collective job, to ensure each member of the opposition plays poorly, and that’s what happened vs Ireland. Incidentally, that’s what happened versus France four years earlier in the same quarter.

England are much tougher than Ireland I agree, and Im talking best case scenario for the ABs here. But I feel the AB knowledge and understanding of how knockouts work justify that.

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Post by Old Man on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:34 am

All Blacks are the sum of their parts, the cohesion they showed on attack this past weekend and the offloading skills exhibited was unlike anything I have seen.

This All Black team doesn’t have the McCaws or Carters, but collectively they are much more.

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Post by TightHEAD on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:35 am

They are but Men, therefore beatable as Aus and SA have shown.

NZ haven't been tested yet.
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Post by Gooseberry on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:42 am

NZ rightly favourites but this shouldn't be a walk over for them. Cant see them being as tactically naive as Australia were, or letting 2/3 possession result in so few scores if they get that.

I agree with Taylormans point that on the cup sonfar theres more evidence that the all blacks are playing close to their best than Englands are. If that doesnt change for this game then it's hard to see how NZ lose.
England have some areas to improve in if they are going to beat them, or hope that NZ have an off day.


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Post by Collapse2005 on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:47 am

Rinsure wrote:
Taylorman wrote:
The main reason the ABs won last night is because man for man they had better individual rugby players on the field each operating at far higher levels than their opposite.

The also have far better players man for man vs England as well. Doesnt mean they’ll win on that basis either, but it will be a big factor.

This piqued my interest. Here are the match-ups for NZ & Eng from the matches at the weekend:

1. Moody vs. Mako
2. Taylor vs. George
3. Laulala vs. Sinckler
4. Retallick vs. Itoje
5. Whitelock vs. Lawes
6. Savea vs. Curry
7. Cane vs. Underhill
8. Read vs. Billy
9. Smith vs. Youngs
10. Mo'unga vs. Farrell
11. Bridge vs. May
12. Lienert-Brown vs. Tuilagi
13. Goodhue vs. Slade
14. Reece vs. Watson
15. Barrett vs. Daly

In the front rows I'd say man-for-man England have the better players. It's close, for sure, and the NZers are possibly better in the tight, but the all-round skill-set of the England props edges it for me.

I'll give NZ the second row pairing, based on experience and achievements. I don't think there's a lot in it, again, but I can't really argue for the England pairing over the Kiwis.

Back row? Very close. Curry is the find of the year, and Underhill is a machine. Savea and Cane are two of the very best. It's a tough call as to who tops the pile. Billy isn't at his best (IMHO), but draws enough attention to drag in defenders. Same for Read, I think. On balance, a draw.

Half backs - okay, Smith is way ahead of Youngs on form. Mo'unga and Farrell? Very different, but when the chips are down I'd back Farrell every time. Probably my most contentious one, but I think Farrell is better.

Centres I have to lean towards the ABs, as Eng don't appear to know what our "best" midfield is. The "horses for courses" picking has its place, but possibly doesn't allow true partnership building. However, man-for-man I'd take Manu over Lienert-Brown, and Goodhue over Slade. I expect arguments here!

The wings are pretty evenly matched, and Beaden vs Daly? Well, I don't think we need to go there..

Not as clear-cut as you seem to posit, Taylorman. Certainly not "far better players man for man".

Can't wait.


I reckon England have a better pack in particular the front row and the back row. NZ's locks might be better but if they are not by much.

NZ are probably better drilled and have better backs although only marginally better. I have a sneaking suspicion that England will win this but they will need to keep the faith.


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Post by lostinwales on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:48 am

I guess we'll find out soon enough about the match up. Worth saying about Curry is that he may not have played vs the ABS but Baggins has, and did very well. Underhill is better now than he was then and Curry is better still.

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Post by Collapse2005 on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:52 am

It does seem like 6 and 7 were the missing pieces for England. Also its been a long time since they have had two starting 10s as good as the 2 Fs.

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:52 am

Yep, that can happen too. I’m only talking best case scenario, mainly because we got exactly that vs Ireland, which gives you confidence. So staying positive, no reason the experience won’t make them even better.

England will say we’re not having that more than Ireland did, and that’s where ABs will be tested. Can they make England play poorly?

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Post by BamBam on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:53 am

I've made a massive mistake .. just discovered that the final kicks off at 9am UK time rather than 11am

I'm due to be flying from Bangkok to Phuket at 8am UK time Doh

Wonder if the mrs will ask questions if I try and change to an earlier flight

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Post by eirebilly on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:54 am

I fancy England to turn the All Blacks. England are a more powerful unit and have some very exciting backs for open play.


The All Blacks play the kind of style that suits England so I imagine its going to be a relatively high scoring exciting game with England running out victors.
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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:56 am

BamBam wrote:I've made a massive mistake .. just discovered that the final kicks off at 9am UK time rather than 11am

I'm due to be flying from Bangkok to Phuket at 8am UK time Doh

Wonder if the mrs will ask questions if I try and change to an earlier flight

Hmm early morning flight from Bangkok to Phuket - suspicious.

Careful mention of a wife - smokescreen?

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Post by LondonTiger on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:57 am

eirebilly wrote:I fancy England to turn the All Blacks. England are a more powerful unit and have some very exciting backs for open play.


The All Blacks play the kind of style that suits England so I imagine its going to be a relatively high scoring exciting game with England running out victors.

I wish I had your optimism. Whilst I think that Tmans analysis is rather one-eyed (England players not tested because they have yet to face NZ, well NZ players have not done that either Very Happy ), I am struggling to see beyond a win for NZ by a clear score.

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Post by BamBam on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 9:59 am

LondonTiger wrote:
BamBam wrote:I've made a massive mistake .. just discovered that the final kicks off at 9am UK time rather than 11am

I'm due to be flying from Bangkok to Phuket at 8am UK time Doh

Wonder if the mrs will ask questions if I try and change to an earlier flight

Hmm early morning flight from Bangkok to Phuket - suspicious.

Careful mention of a wife - smokescreen?

Well its actually mid afternoon Thailand time boxing

I had it all planned out .. land in Phuket an hour before kickoff, time to get to the hotel and find a bar showing the game Sad


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Post by TightHEAD on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:00 am

Any way back to the game.

Do we stick with Slade and Daly, Slade looked off the pace and Daly put in another performance I would expect to see from Daly at FB


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Post by Old Man on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:02 am

TightHEAD wrote:Calm down, Its all there, since when have posters have to clarify things for MODS?

Did I break any house rules with that post? No.

I even mention the team that I wanted to see in the semi's, every pundit and journalist are praising them as are most rugby fans.

Is that clear enough for you?

Sadly South Africa spoiled it for you. Hug

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Post by TightHEAD on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:03 am

Old Man wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:Calm down, Its all there, since when have posters have to clarify things for MODS?

Did I break any house rules with that post? No.

I even mention the team that I wanted to see in the semi's, every pundit and journalist are praising them as are most rugby fans.

Is that clear enough for you?

Sadly South Africa spoiled it for you. Hug

Yes, they look scrappy to me apart from their forwards.
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Post by Old Man on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:06 am

TightHEAD wrote:
Old Man wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:Calm down, Its all there, since when have posters have to clarify things for MODS?

Did I break any house rules with that post? No.

I even mention the team that I wanted to see in the semi's, every pundit and journalist are praising them as are most rugby fans.

Is that clear enough for you?

Sadly South Africa spoiled it for you. Hug

Yes, they look scrappy to me apart from their forwards.

Lets hope they pull it together before Sunday then. Need to beat the struggling Welsh this weekend. Whistle

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Post by Soul Requiem on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:08 am

I'm quietly confident about the semi-final, to ensure pack dominance I would be going with Marler to start and then bring Mako on later. I think it was the first scrum after he came on, the Aussie tighthead was trying to drop him but the strength he showed to keep the scrum up and then march his opposite number back is something very few looseheads can do.

Kruis instead of Lawes to counteract Retallick in the line out is a no brainer and again leaves plenty of room for dynamism late on if it's needed, I also wouldn't be against bringing in JJ for Slade who looked off the pace for the most part against Aus.

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Post by TightHEAD on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:09 am

I'm not concerned about that game. But I think their Forwards will grind out a result.
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Post by TightHEAD on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:13 am

Its nice Eddie has so many viable options to select from.

People moan that he doesn't know his 1st XV, I generally do not think we have one as we have a squad full of options that all offer something.
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Post by No 7&1/2 on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:16 am

Well we've been lucky with injuries for this one. Again we have no excuses for next saturday. Probably expect nowell to come in. Main questions are does he start marler and does he switch to ford : probably not in both cases.

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Post by Rugby Fan on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:19 am

Before the tournament started, Jones apparently said in an interview that you need lineout options in your back row against New Zealand. Curry has taken some when he's played but he could entertain the idea of starting Lawes, Kruis and Itoje, with one of Curry or Underhill on the bench. It would be a very big call...

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Post by Taylorman on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:19 am

LondonTiger wrote:
eirebilly wrote:I fancy England to turn the All Blacks. England are a more powerful unit and have some very exciting backs for open play.


The All Blacks play the kind of style that suits England so I imagine its going to be a relatively high scoring exciting game with England running out victors.

I wish I had your optimism. Whilst I think that Tmans analysis is rather one-eyed (England players not tested because they have yet to face NZ, well NZ players have not done that either Very Happy ), I am struggling to see beyond a win for NZ by a clear score.

Oh it’s definitely one eyed, and at the hyper end of optimism. One thing you can be sure about is that’s the way they’ll play...it’s all they know now. IMO, Given ABs are usually slow starters...Aaron Smith was saying they focussed big time on getting the start right, that’s where England should probably target. Shut them down as much as possible as early as possible.

The ABs will get a roll on at some point, that’s inevitable. It’s just how much damage they do when they do, and what England have done in terms of scoreboard pressure.

I think Jones is cagier than Schmidt. His reaction after it was too excessively praise the ABs as the greatest blah blah.

I thought that was smart. Gives Hansen nothing to work with. No point saying ‘ they won’t do that to us’.


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Post by No 7&1/2 on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:21 am

He may well be worried about that rugby fan. It was rettalick who won the game for them in the autumn. I hope he trusts curry and underhill to continue.

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Post by Afro on Mon 21 Oct 2019, 10:25 am

He has also come out and praised Curry's lineout improvement over the "last 6-7 weeks".

I don't think we'll see any changes in the XI, but Nowell for JJ on the bench
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