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HEC Week 3 Who will be the winners and losers then...?

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Week 3 HEC who will win ?

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Poll closed

HEC Week 3 Who will be the winners and losers then...? Empty HEC Week 3 Who will be the winners and losers then...?

Post by maestegmafia Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:04 pm

I think gauging what posters have written on these boards in response that there is an average of about 2/3rds correct guess work. Some may have more, others lamentably guessed less so far, but it is a tight competition with plenty of surprises.

So week Three first of the double header weekends

Pool 1
Castres v Northampton, Saturday, 13:30
Scarlets v Munster, Saturday, 15:40

Pool 2
Cardiff Blues v Edinburgh, Friday, 20:00
Racing Metro 92 v London Irish, Saturday, 15:40

Pool 3
Glasgow v Montpellier, Sunday, 12:45
Bath v Leinster, Sunday, 12:45

Pool 4
Ulster v Aironi, Friday 19:30
Clermont Auvergne v Leicester, Sunday, 15:00

Pool 5
Saracens v Ospreys, Saturday, 18:00
Treviso v Biarritz, Saturday, 13:30

Pool 6
Connacht v Gloucester, Saturday, 13:30
Harlequins v Toulouse, Friday, 20:00

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Post by beshocked Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:09 pm

Scarlets
Castres
Cardiff
Racing Metro
Glasgow
Leinster
Clermont
Ulster
Biarritz
Saracens
Harlequins
Gloucester

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Post by Morgannwg Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:29 pm

Looking forward to Scarlets v Munster, I think the home team will win it. Although, that will rely heavily on Priestlands kicking game; it was superb up in Northampton. He won't want O'Gara in a position where he can drop-kick at goal.
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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:32 pm

Edinburgh V Cardiff could decide the group. If Edinburgh are ever going to raise their game it will be for this one. We have beaten the Blues at Cardiff before but not since Robinson was in charge.
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Post by maestegmafia Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:47 pm

Edinburgh vs Cardiff looks like an absolute cracking series over the two weekends. As does Scarlets vs Munster, Ospreys vs Sarries and Clermont vs Leicester. You would have to predict that it would go with the home team each game, meaning LBPs will be vital. But if anyone can find form in one of those and win away they could find themselves in prime position to take the group.

Wonderful that there are absolutely no easy matches. Each year this competition gets tougher.

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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:29 am

Leinster looking favourites with the voting public as most likely to win their game, three weeks in a row. Airioni the opposite looking at facing a third week of defeats by popular vote here...!



Last edited by maestegmafia on Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:55 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by caoimhincentre Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:49 am

maestegmafia wrote:Leinster looking favourites for three wins in a row. Airioni the opposite looking at facing a third week of defeats by popular vote here...!


2 wins in a row. they drew the first match

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Post by greybeard Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:50 am

Moral victory

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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:54 am

Sorry

Yes they did... It was a convincing draw though wasn't it...! Has been re-phrased...!




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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:00 am

Saracens looking like a popular vote vs the Ospreys...!

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Post by red_stag Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:03 am

Castres v Northampton = Northampton
Scarlets v Munster = Munster
Cardiff Blues v Edinburgh = Edinburgh
Racing Metro 92 v London Irish, Saturday = Racing Metro
Glasgow v Montpellier = Glasgow
Bath v Leinster = Bath
Ulster v Aironi = Ulster
Clermont Auvergne v Leicester = Clermont
Saracens v Ospreys, Saturday = Draw
Treviso v Biarritz = Biarritz
Connacht v Gloucester = Gloucester
Harlequins v Toulouse = Harlequins
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Post by Smirnoffpriest Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:04 am

Am suprised at how many people are voting for a Scarlet win

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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:25 am

Me too...! Against Munster as well. Maybe they think home advantage will swing it. Though both teams are the form sides in their group.

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Post by Guest Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:32 am

Tell you what im already nervous about the Munster double header.

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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:35 am

viewtothegym wrote:Tell you what im already nervous about the Munster double header.
Yes I am too. No one in their right mind likes playing munster, especially with the way they are playing. ROG is managing the game well, the pack are tough as old boots, experienced and hardened as a unit. But Howlett looks sublime at the moment...!

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Post by Guest Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:41 am

Yep they are playing at 60% potential and still winning,
Scarlets must man up then take all points on offer and play over 50% of the game in the Munster half then just maybe we might beat them.

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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:45 am

Scarlets have demonstrated some sensible rugby so far. Priestland being a very intelligent Architect behind a capable pack.

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Post by GunsGerms Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:00 am

Scarlets trounced last years finalists away from home. They have have earned the right to be confident against Munster especially since Munster struggled against Northampton.

Scarlets over the last couple of years have been quite inconsistent though, picking up some incredible wins and some pathetic losses.

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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:08 am

leinsterbaby wrote:Scarlets trounced last years finalists away from home. They have have earned the right to be confident against Munster especially since Munster struggled against Northampton.

Scarlets over the last couple of years have been quite inconsistent though, picking up some incredible wins and some pathetic losses.
Scarlets have had an atrocious injury rate over the last four years... Hense developing props like Gardiner and Jones at 18 or 19 years old last year... Luckily they have an amazing academy

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Post by Gibson Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:11 am

Castres v Northampton = Northampton
Scarlets v Munster = Scarlets
Cardiff Blues v Edinburgh = Blues
Racing Metro 92 v London Irish = Racing Metro
Glasgow v Montpellier = Glasgow
Bath v Leinster = Leinster
Ulster v Aironi = Ulster
Clermont Auvergne v Leicester = Clermont
Saracens v Ospreys Sarries
Treviso v Biarritz = Treviso
Connacht v Gloucester = Connacht
Harlequins v Toulouse = Harlequins
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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:29 am

Good calls their Gibson.

I was similar bar Blues vs Edinburgh and Bath vs Leinster.

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Post by Guest Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:33 am

Yep last seasons prop injury crisis at the Scarlets ruined any chance of beating the Tigers and getting out the group,
but Munster this season will be seriously tough because they have lots of very wise old heads who can win games in Europe for fun.

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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:34 am

well said view...!


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Post by GunsGerms Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:44 am

maestegmafia wrote:
leinsterbaby wrote:Scarlets trounced last years finalists away from home. They have have earned the right to be confident against Munster especially since Munster struggled against Northampton.

Scarlets over the last couple of years have been quite inconsistent though, picking up some incredible wins and some pathetic losses.
Scarlets have had an atrocious injury rate over the last four years... Hense developing props like Gardiner and Jones at 18 or 19 years old last year... Luckily they have an amazing academy

You cant win the Heineken cup if you dont have/dont use or cant rely on your full squad. Simple as that.

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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:51 am

Yes but they really did have quite a ridiculous amount of injuries, i think at one point they had three TH props out for the season, and two LHs, a first choice hooker and a large chunk of the backline.

You can only do so much with any squad, particularly on a limited budget.

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Post by red_stag Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:07 am

Sure its the way it is sometimes. Against Northampton Munster had 2 looseheads (Marcus Horan, Darragh Hurley), 2 hookers (Jerry Flannery, Mike Sherry), 1 tighthead (Peter Borlase), 1 backrow (David Wallace), 1 winger (Keith Earls), 1 Fullback (Felix Jones).

Leinsterbaby is right - you can do nothing without your backups. We were incredibly lucky to win that game (and against Castres) missing so many. Hopefully we can get them back quickly. However the squad fronted up.
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Post by Gibson Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:26 am

Scarlets dont have the depth to go all the way. Or maybe even to make a SF. Not yet.
But the way they are building from within, out of necessity- it wont be long before they do.

They can win this pool if they can stay ruthless - against the grain.

EDIT: If they do win their Pool, most teams would fear them in a QF.
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Post by maestegmafia Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:18 pm

No but they are deeper than before...!

Their academy is doing marvellous work identifying ability and refining it.

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Post by beshocked Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:23 pm

Gibson wrote:Scarlets dont have the depth to go all the way. Or maybe even to make a SF. Not yet.
But the way they are building from within, out of necessity- it wont be long before they do.

They can win this pool if they can stay ruthless - against the grain.

EDIT: If they do win their Pool, most teams would fear them in a QF.

Gibson you can speak for your own team but I know that Saracens wouldn't fear Scarlets. They beat Saints at FG? Big deal. Try and do it 3 times in a row.

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Post by Time For Trumpton Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:33 pm

beshocked wrote:
Gibson wrote:Scarlets dont have the depth to go all the way. Or maybe even to make a SF. Not yet.
But the way they are building from within, out of necessity- it wont be long before they do.

They can win this pool if they can stay ruthless - against the grain.

EDIT: If they do win their Pool, most teams would fear them in a QF.

Gibson you can speak for your own team but I know that Saracens wouldn't fear Scarlets. They beat Saints at FG? Big deal. Try and do it 3 times in a row.

How do you know that they couldn't do it 3 times in a row? This LLanelli team hasn't had the chance yet. I wouldn't bet against it given current form, and i also wouldn't bet against Scarlets beating Saracens either, home or away. Saracens were predictable in attack against Biarritz and their quick strike runners exposed defensive frailties not immediately apparent in recent matches.

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Post by beshocked Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:51 pm

Laugh This is exactly what I am saying. Puffing out your chests after one good win. Maybe you could do it. You are afterall the best team in Europe, the Pro 12 champions/leaders. Wait....a..minute... no you aren't.....you are 8th in the Pro 12 table.

You must lose a lot of money. laughing I find the hyping up of Scarlets hilarious. Actually win something first - either your pool, get in the top 4 in the Pro 12 or even a minor trophy like the LV cup or Amlin will do.

Saracens lost away to Biarritz who have one of the best home records in the HC. Big deal.

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Post by beshocked Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:56 pm

Oh and by the way for the record I don't mind Scarlets.

I like their players like George North,Scott Williams,Jonathan Davies and Rhys Priestland.

I just hope they aren't hyped up too much.

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Post by red_stag Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:57 pm

Beshocked from what I can see a large part of the Scarlets hype is not coming from their own fans.

Rather there are a great many people who are happy to see the admittadly unlikeable Northampton beaten. Munster aren't a popular team either and people like running rugby. They are a favourite amongst the neutrals and this is where hype is coming from.

Most Scarlets fans I can see seem to be cautiously enjoying their run of good form and think a home win over Munster is possible.
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Post by beshocked Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:03 pm

Oh right fair enough Red Stag.

Why are Northampton unlikeable? That bloke Chris Ashton is a great guy!

I don't like it when hype surrounds a player/team.

Just pointing out to Gibson that I don't see why teams should fear Scarlets. Nothing wrong with that. By all means don't underestimate but being afraid is laughable in my opinion.

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Post by Mickado Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:06 pm

Castres v Northampton = Castres
Scarlets v Munster = Munster
Cardiff Blues v Edinburgh = Cardiff
Racing Metro 92 v London Irish = Racing Metro
Glasgow v Montpellier = Glasgow
Bath v Leinster = Leinster
Ulster v Aironi = Ulster
Clermont Auvergne v Leicester = Clermont
Saracens v Ospreys = Saracens
Treviso v Biarritz = Treviso
Connacht v Gloucester = Connacht
Harlequins v Toulouse = Harlequins

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Post by Time For Trumpton Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:14 pm

beshocked wrote: Laugh This is exactly what I am saying. Puffing out your chests after one good win. Maybe you could do it. You are afterall the best team in Europe, the Pro 12 champions/leaders. Wait....a..minute... no you aren't.....you are 8th in the Pro 12 table.

You must lose a lot of money. laughing I find the hyping up of Scarlets hilarious. Actually win something first - either your pool, get in the top 4 in the Pro 12 or even a minor trophy like the LV cup or Amlin will do.

Saracens lost away to Biarritz who have one of the best home records in the HC. Big deal.

You imply i'm a Scarlets fan, I'm not, just a neutral observer. Nor am I one eyed, which is more than can be said for certain people.

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Post by red_stag Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:19 pm

beshocked wrote:Oh right fair enough Red Stag.

Why are Northampton unlikeable? That bloke Chris Ashton is a great guy!

I don't like it when hype surrounds a player/team.

Just pointing out to Gibson that I don't see why teams should fear Scarlets. Nothing wrong with that. By all means don't underestimate but being afraid is laughable in my opinion.

Yea I certainly don't fear Scarlets I'll be annoyed if we don't get 2 wins in Rounds 3 and 4.

Some teams like Munster, Saracens, Tigers, Ospreys and Northampton aren't usually liked by the neutrals for a variety of reasons.

Others like Harlequins, Scarlets, Leinster and Clermont are probably more popular amongst neutrals.

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Post by red_stag Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:21 pm

Leinster are overwhelning favourites. However I think Bath will be a match for them. If they win it won't be a thrashing.
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Post by Mickado Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:23 pm

From the little i saw of Bath at the weekend I think they would have to raise their game a fair bit to win. But I have a sneaking suspicision they could well do that.

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Post by red_stag Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:25 pm

I think they will Mick. Donald is only settling into the team. Give him another 3 weeks and he'll be flying it.
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Post by beshocked Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:26 pm

Who do you support then Trumpton? If you are referring to me I have two eyes thank you very much though occasionally I do wear an eye patch. All in the name of fashion of course.

Anyway I don't quite see your point. What are you trying to say? What do you disagree about?

We both agree Scarlets could win 3 in a row at FG vs Saints. I personally think it is very very unlikely but you are welcome to disagree.

If you want to bet on a hypothetical match between Saracens and Scarlets then go ahead.


True red stag. You would expect Leinster to have a very good chance as the current HC champions.

Very true. Ospreys are the odd one out there. The other four have recently relied on very strong packs predominantly.

Hardly surprising that the teams more known for their back play are more popular than the ones who enjoy strong defences and good set piece.

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Post by Mickado Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:27 pm

I won't start losing sleep over it just yet. Even if we do ship a loss they'll have to come to Lansdowne the following week so i'd be confident enough of getting at least 6 points out of the two games.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:28 pm

As a Tigers fan I'd be really happy with a LBP away to Clermont. Would set us up nicely in the pool. If we could win the following week and deny Clermont a LBP then I'd be ecstatic.

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Post by Time For Trumpton Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:30 pm

beshocked wrote: If you are referring to me I have two eyes thank you very much though occasionally I do wear an eye patch. All in the name of fashion of course.

Its good to see that you are able to recognise your own shortcomings, the cap obviously fit perfectly! Whistle

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Post by red_stag Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:31 pm

Ah yeah Mick I mean Leinster are the favourites of course. Just an inkling I have.

Beshocked the whole Galacticos, One True Region etc business has made the Ospreys unpopular of the years.

I was irritated to see that Ospreys coach said to the press they underestimated Treviso. The lost to them earlier in the year and Treviso had put FIFTY points on the Dragons two weeks ago. That type of attitude should have been cast away when the likes of Henson, Phillips and Byrne left.
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Post by Metal Tiger Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:40 pm

Castres v Northampton = Northampton (although I have said Saints for the last three weeks! Rolling Eyes )
Scarlets v Munster = Scarletts (was impressed by Scarlets at Saints, think they could edge this)
Cardiff Blues v Edinburgh = Cardiff (Cardiff at home only reason)
Racing Metro 92 v London Irish, Saturday = Racing Metro (Irish are in shocking form and don't travel well)
Glasgow v Montpellier = Glasgow
Bath v Leinster = Bath
Ulster v Aironi = Ulster (should be a 5 pt drubbing at Ravenhill... get the Ulster boys back on track)
Clermont Auvergne v Leicester = Tigers (we are in the ascendancy and have near full squad for this).
Saracens v Ospreys, Saturday = Saracens (by a clear margin judging on Ospreys performance this weekend)
Treviso v Biarritz = Biarritz
Connacht v Gloucester = Gloucester
Harlequins v Toulouse = Harlequins
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Post by beshocked Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:42 pm

Time for trumpton cap? Eh? I don't understand. Maybe too subtle for me.

red stag wasn't it the media who gave the Ospreys that tag?

Was the one true region the media again or is it something made up by the fans?

I definitely won't be underestimating Treviso at their place!

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Post by XR Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:49 pm

I expect the blues to beat Edinburgh, we have done so already this season (smashed them up in Murrayfield) and beat them 4 times last season. So i expect the winning streak to continue.

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Post by red_stag Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:54 pm

beshocked wrote:Time for trumpton cap? Eh? I don't understand. Maybe too subtle for me.

red stag wasn't it the media who gave the Ospreys that tag?

Was the one true region the media again or is it something made up by the fans?

I definitely won't be underestimating Treviso at their place!

It definitely was. Its the media who keep pushing the Saffercens agenda for Sarries and the media who portray Munster/Leicester as boring teams. Last year Munsters back three of Keith Earls, Felix Jones and Doug Howlett was electrifying. But the media focues on the other areas.

Its all just about image.
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Post by Smirnoffpriest Tue Nov 22, 2011 10:11 pm

Interesting to see how much positivity there is about the Scarlets and them beating Munster - I'm not sure, It'll be a very hard game, and we must hope we don't pick up many injuries in a tough Dragons game before hand.

Think the game will be close and as such I'm suprised at Scarlets getting 22 votes to Munsters 16 (though the gap was a lot bigger than that before)

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