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Woods - will he ever be good again

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neutral07
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SugarRayRussell (PBK)
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Post by SetupDeterminesTheMotion Fri Mar 25, 2011 9:35 am

After yesterday's deplorable 34 putts, is Woods gone forever.

What is the bigger story, the former World No 1 taking a 73; or the current world No 3 taking an 80.

According to all the media outlets, it looks like the former World No 1, is the bigger story.

Will the world media ever leave him alone, to make a comeback, or will he be in front of the cameras all the way ?

Are they now putting the boot in ? Not allowing him the breathing space to make any sort of recovery.

Or will he just walk away....
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Post by Doc Fri Mar 25, 2011 9:46 am

Setup, I don't usually bother commenting on Woods posts, but in this particular case ......

I guess you mention the 34 putts with your tongue firmly in your cheek as I'm happy with 34 putts per round. The 73 does however show he's not far away from being back, maybe not to his best, but he seems to be improving weekly. Not sure what time Tiger went out yesterday, but believe the wind got up later and it caught many out. I think Tiger's skin is thick enough to ignore the media hype and detrimental comments and will probably only make him work harder to put egg on some peoples faces. I will not be bothered either way as I've enjoyed watching him destroy fields and romp away with everything for years. The best golfer in my eyes, but probably the worst personality and personal life and worst behaviour/tantrums on course.

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Post by SetupDeterminesTheMotion Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:20 pm

I played the other days at Saurines over in Spain & had 43 putts. So a bit jealous of Tiger's 34...... Drool
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Post by super_realist Fri Mar 25, 2011 7:02 pm

Unless you hit 16-18 Greens in Regulation you should be pretty disappointed with 34 putts.

34 Putts for a pro is particlarly poor, they ought to be looking at an average of 28 which takes account of birdie putts and getting up and down. It can show two things, one that their putting wasn't very good and secondly that their approach shots weren't close enough to the pin to give them a chance at holing with one putt.
A 73 from a pro certainly doesn't suggest that Woods is back. Most pro's wouldn't be very happy with that, let alone use it as an indication of a return to form. Playing well does not always mean you score well, nor does scoring well mean that you played well.

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Post by golfermartin Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:46 pm

If I hit 18 greens in regulation and had 36 putts, I'd be happy. Level par would be my best ever competitive round. I normally take less than 36 putts because of all the "up and downing" I have to do to score!! Smile

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Post by Redrage Sun Mar 27, 2011 1:44 pm

Tiger barely hit a fairway the first two rounds (36%) and still got to -3, yesterday he hit 71% of them and went backwards... he is still a work in progress.

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Post by SetupDeterminesTheMotion Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:06 am

Well is Tiger back.

I dont think so. His play & ball striking is back but his putting is shocking.

Everybody can see; it his sheer will to compete that keeps him up there. But those short putts he missed all week at Augusta, surely needs some work to be done. If Sergio had missed all these putts, no one would be surprised, but everyone expects Tiger not to miss. The man is human.

And from his post-match interview yesterday; not a very pleasant human-being. What happened to all his acts of contrition last year, where he promised he would change. It just proves a leopard cannot change his spots, in his case a Tiger cannot change his stripes.

It just goes to prove that the media & the PGA tour let him away, with way too much; when he was world No 1, & now they find it so hard to reel him back in.

Attitudes can change when Jack started he was an arrogant sod, but realised he needed the supporters on his side if he was to progress in his game to takeover from Arnie. Woods came on tour as an arrogant sod & still is.
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Post by Davie Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:12 am

I didn't see much of Tiger's interview - what did he do that was so unpleasant?

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Post by MustPuttBetter Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:16 am

Davie - he was a 'little' abrupt

The American guy (can't remember his name) asked him if he had a chance he said 'we'll see' and then he asked if he'd go to the range to keepe warm and Woods said 'i'm going to eat, i'm starving' and that was it.
Nothing rude or contraversial, just concise (to be kind!)

I'm not sure why he would be like that as, missed putts or not, he was brilliant yesterday
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Post by Guest Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:17 am

Davie wrote:I didn't see much of Tiger's interview - what did he do that was so unpleasant?

The one I saw on the beeb was just a poor interviewer, asking whether Tiger was going to eat? Fool.

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Post by Redrage Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:25 am

Apparently Hank Haney said before yesterday that Tigers putting had cost him the last 6 Masters. I disagree that he would have factored last year since Mickelson was so good and he himself left some shots on the course. He wasn't far away in most of the others though but I am sure it wasn't all down to putting. This time is really did blow hot and cold for him, he still shot a great score and it looks like the long game is where he needs it to be, so now he will surely have the time to iron out the kinks in his putting. I see him getting back to no1 by the end of the year now.

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Post by LondonJonnyO Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:25 am

I didn't see the interview but it sounds like some idiot reading from a script of questions.

Note to interviewers: If it's Sunday and there is no chance of a playoff for the bloke you're interviewing the chances are he's not going to the range.
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Post by Davie Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:28 am

LondonJonnyO wrote:Note to interviewers: If it's Sunday and there is no chance of a playoff for the bloke you're interviewing the chances are he's not going to the range.

They do ask some stupid questions but to be fair, at the time of the interview, Tiger was clubhouse leader and those still out on the course were dropping shots all over the place. At that moment, it was possible he could have been in a playoff (though as we know with hindsight it was far from fact in the end)

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Post by LondonJonnyO Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:31 am

That's a fair assessment.

But having said that you have 15 and 16 which are both good chances to go a few shots lower... how often have you seen a player go eagle birdie at 15/16. A fair few.

That said what Charl did was just freakish. And I think he can now afford some remedial dental work to prevent him looking like Mr Ed's lovechild.
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Post by McLaren Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:19 pm

Charls wife looked like she could be a real handful in the bedroom, in a good way. Not to go too far off topic but on a similar theme how hot was Days wife?
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Post by navyblueshorts Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:21 pm

Davie wrote:I didn't see much of Tiger's interview - what did he do that was so unpleasant?

There wasn't much to see but the basic undertone from TW (IMO) was "When are you going to get the **** out of my face?" You'd need to see it. May just be me but I don't think so.

I may be wrong (it happens on occasion!) but I don't recall TW being asked if he was going to eat either. It was TW said he was starving and he was going to eat. The interviewer was asking what he was thinking of doing while he waited to see how it panned out behind as there was a chance TW'd be in the mix if a playoff was in the offing.
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Post by navyblueshorts Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:22 pm

McLaren wrote:Charls wife looked like she could be a real handful in the bedroom, in a good way. Not to go too far off topic but on a similar theme how hot was Days wife?

Why am I not surprised?
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Post by drive4show Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:59 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
McLaren wrote:Charls wife looked like she could be a real handful in the bedroom, in a good way. Not to go too far off topic but on a similar theme how hot was Days wife?

Why am I not surprised?

Welcome back Mac, we've missed your classic quotes Very Happy

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Post by sharrison01 Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:37 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
Davie wrote:I didn't see much of Tiger's interview - what did he do that was so unpleasant?

There wasn't much to see but the basic undertone from TW (IMO) was "When are you going to get the **** out of my face?" You'd need to see it. May just be me but I don't think so.

I may be wrong (it happens on occasion!) but I don't recall TW being asked if he was going to eat either. It was TW said he was starving and he was going to eat. The interviewer was asking what he was thinking of doing while he waited to see how it panned out behind as there was a chance TW'd be in the mix if a playoff was in the offing.

Interviewer asked something along the lines of "what are you going to do now, hit some balls, have a rest, grab some food?" to which Tiger said he was going to eat. Can't understand what the problem with his interview was?!? He'd literally just stepped off the green and knowing Tiger would have rather not spoken to anyone so that he could stay in that strong mental state that we have been so used to seeing him in. Didn't feel like he was overly rude but likewise didn't really want to speak which is more than understandable given that he was still in it at that point. Pouring your heart out or giving insightful opinions is for talk shows or press conferences (pre/post tournament or post transgression) not for 3 steps off the 18th green after a long and tiring round...

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Post by SugarRayRussell (PBK) Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Woods gets unfair stick he is a great golfer and if he never wins another major (although I think he will beat Jacks record) he should still be regarded as a great. The way some people talk about him is disrespectful.
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Post by navyblueshorts Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:13 pm

sharrison01 wrote:Interviewer asked something along the lines of "what are you going to do now, hit some balls, have a rest, grab some food?" to which Tiger said he was going to eat. Can't understand what the problem with his interview was?!? He'd literally just stepped off the green and knowing Tiger would have rather not spoken to anyone so that he could stay in that strong mental state that we have been so used to seeing him in. Didn't feel like he was overly rude but likewise didn't really want to speak which is more than understandable given that he was still in it at that point. Pouring your heart out or giving insightful opinions is for talk shows or press conferences (pre/post tournament or post transgression) not for 3 steps off the 18th green after a long and tiring round...

No-one is asking him to "pour his heart out" but a bit of civility wouldn't go amiss. He either a) doesn't get it, b) get's it but doesn't give a stuff or c) is getting seriously bad advice. Not sure which is worse (I suspect it's option b). As for it not being something after a long, tiring round; sorry, that's BS. It's part of the merry-go-round that he's on and he's been around enough to know it. Almost every other player interviewed under the same circumstances handled it better.
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Post by navyblueshorts Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:14 pm

prettyboy1304 wrote:Woods gets unfair stick he is a great golfer and if he never wins another major (although I think he will beat Jacks record) he should still be regarded as a great. The way some people talk about him is disrespectful.

He does get a great deal of unfair stick but generally, when you've dug yourself a hole, it's better to stop digging.
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Post by Davie Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:19 pm

Press conferences after the event are a different matter. In this case, Tiger was (possibly) not finished with at the time a real chance of getting into a play-off.

Incidentally, while I've already said I didn't see the whole interview, I did mention that on the day of the par 3 contest I thought Arnold Palmer was rather disrespectful of Di Dougherty when she tried to interview him (along with Player and Nicklaus). No one else picked up on that, and that was from a past champion in a fun event prior to a major - not still during that major when the player involved was potentially still in with a chance of winning.

Why does Tiger get stick but Arnie doesn't?

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Post by navyblueshorts Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:24 pm

Davie wrote:Why does Tiger get stick but Arnie doesn't?

He would have done from me if I'd seen it and it was as you describe. I don't have Sky however.....

I don't think Palmer has the same 'previous' as TW though and that might make a difference.
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Post by McLaren Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:26 pm

Why should Tiger care, and more to the point why do people such as navyblueshorts (what is with that name anyway) feel so needy that they yearn for tiger to love them? So what Tiger does not care about attracting fickle fans or brown nosing CBS. Get over it, and as he is a golfer concentrate on his golf. Which on the first nine yesterday was as good as anyone could ever be.
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Post by McLaren Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:27 pm

Davie wrote:Press conferences after the event are a different matter. In this case, Tiger was (possibly) not finished with at the time a real chance of getting into a play-off.

Incidentally, while I've already said I didn't see the whole interview, I did mention that on the day of the par 3 contest I thought Arnold Palmer was rather disrespectful of Di Dougherty when she tried to interview him (along with Player and Nicklaus). No one else picked up on that, and that was from a past champion in a fun event prior to a major - not still during that major when the player involved was potentially still in with a chance of winning.

Why does Tiger get stick but Arnie doesn't?

Given the people I meet in most golf clubs would it be unacceptable to suggest because he isn't black?
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Post by Davie Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:30 pm

No there are times when race/colour may come into it but I don't think that is the case in this instance.

It's just that Arnie is universally loved and while Tiger (rightly) has his fans and supporters, he also has his detractors. Those detractors will do anything to get on his case (his infidelities, his language, his cub hurling, his aloofness, spittlegate) to blow smoke across what he actually achieves

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Post by navyblueshorts Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:13 pm

McLaren wrote:Why should Tiger care, and more to the point why do people such as navyblueshorts (what is with that name anyway) feel so needy that they yearn for tiger to love them? So what Tiger does not care about attracting fickle fans or brown nosing CBS. Get over it, and as he is a golfer concentrate on his golf. Which on the first nine yesterday was as good as anyone could ever be.

He obviously doesn't care. Fair play if that's the case but stop being so overtly aggressive. If that's what he wants then he has to expect to come under fire for it.

As to the NBS moniker, it's a simple rugby lineout code (I was a lock forward) to determine where the thrower is aiming his throw.

I couldn't give two hoots if TW loves me or anyone else. He obviously doesn't...except himself that is. Ask his wife if she thought he loved her.

I actually enjoyed his golf yesterday. I would have been quite happy for him to win actually, if only to shut up those who go on about Foley ruining his swing when they don't know what they're on about. Politeness and the odd smile costs nothing and makes many things run better. He obviously doesn't understand this.

It sounds as if, by your reckoning Mac, he could walk into the Clubhouse with a Uzi, shoot all in sight and he'd still be fine as his golf is pretty decent.
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Post by navyblueshorts Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:17 pm

McLaren wrote:Given the people I meet in most golf clubs would it be unacceptable to suggest because he isn't black?

Yes, it would be unacceptable. I'm not at all surprised you bring it up however.

Davie wrote:No there are times when race/colour may come into it but I don't think that is the case in this instance.

It's just that Arnie is universally loved and while Tiger (rightly) has his fans and supporters, he also has his detractors. Those detractors will do anything to get on his case (his infidelities, his language, his cub hurling, his aloofness, spittlegate) to blow smoke across what he actually achieves

You actually think he shouldn't get called out about any of that stuff Davie??
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Post by Davie Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:20 pm

I think "all that stuff" is blown out of proportion NBS - not that he shouldn't be called on it at all.

Had to laugh at my own typo (cub throwing)

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Post by navyblueshorts Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:45 pm

Davie wrote:I think "all that stuff" is blown out of proportion NBS - not that he shouldn't be called on it at all.

Had to laugh at my own typo (cub throwing)

Yes, I suspect you're right about it being blown up too much. People are looking for it though ever since Hydrantgate etc and even the little things that would help so much he fails to do, either deliberately, through bad advice or just plain being stubborn/stupidity.

Enough of this methinks. Just thought it was a shame the way he handled a simple question or two after his round which was very good and nearly awesome.

Missed the feline abuse in your earlier post!
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Post by Noshankingtonite Tue Apr 12, 2011 2:19 pm

I watched the last 18 holes with my dad and brother and we don't generally agree on much when we are watching sport together, BUT the one thing we were all completely unified on last Sunday evening was that Woods is just downright moody and petulant in the way he reacts every time he misses a putt (even over 25 feet) or doesn't land his approach shots stone dead. His histrionics and down-right bad attitude are reminiscent of watching a group of 11 year olds kick a football around a playground circa 1978. We were all WILLING one of the newbys to win once it became obvious a European wasn't going to triumph. We were even cheering the Aussies on (which we would never normally do because of the antipodean rivalry at cricket and rugby between our two nations). If I was playing in a club comp with someone as rude and ignorant as Woods I'd be complaining to the committee. It's no wonder people don't like being paired with him. Great player he might be - gracious loser he certainly isn't!
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Post by neutral07 Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:11 pm

King Beer wrote:
Davie wrote:I didn't see much of Tiger's interview - what did he do that was so unpleasant?

The one I saw on the beeb was just a poor interviewer, asking whether Tiger was going to eat? Fool.

The questions from Macatee were simply awful, the questions should have been more about his round, what happen with is missed putts, how is swing felt. There isnt much to discuss about were you stand while players still had 5 holes left.


Noshankingtonite wrote:I watched the last 18 holes with my dad and brother and we don't generally agree on much when we are watching sport together, BUT the one thing we were all completely unified on last Sunday evening was that Woods is just downright moody and petulant in the way he reacts every time he misses a putt (even over 25 feet) or doesn't land his approach shots stone dead. His histrionics and down-right bad attitude are reminiscent of watching a group of 11 year olds kick a football around a playground circa 1978. We were all WILLING one of the newbys to win once it became obvious a European wasn't going to triumph. We were even cheering the Aussies on (which we would never normally do because of the antipodean rivalry at cricket and rugby between our two nations). If I was playing in a club comp with someone as rude and ignorant as Woods I'd be complaining to the committee. It's no wonder people don't like being paired with him. Great player he might be - gracious loser he certainly isn't!

It is called competitiveness and eternal search for perfection in his golf game, something you might not understand [sound like one those guys who would want competition banned in schools]. By the way he has sent his congratulations to Charl so he is very ungracious.

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Post by navyblueshorts Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:13 pm

neutral07 wrote:It is called competitiveness and eternal search for perfection in his golf game, something you might not understand [sound like one those guys who would want competition banned in schools].

There's ways and means to be competitive and TW's ways are not the means.
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Post by Noshankingtonite Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:23 am

neutral:
It's fine and dandy doing things after the fact - it's when he has these public petulant displays that he let's himself down. And yes I am competitive in work and in sport and NO I don't agree with the current ethos in schools for your info. I do however believe in ettiquette and behaving appropriately on the course.
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Post by super_realist Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:55 pm

Got to agree with shanking. There is no excuse for poor sportsmanship and lack of professional courtesy.

As much as I dislike Nadal for his shiversomely boring and repetitious celebration of biting the trophy he is very gracious in winning and in defeat. Woods could learn a lot from him, even Federer for all his off court smugness is ever the gent on it.

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Post by oldparwin Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:47 pm

With 3 majors still to be played for this year, my money would on that he bags at least one of if not all 3

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Post by super_realist Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:18 pm

Are you smoking crack OP? He still can't put 4 good rounds together. He might win one by a very slim margin, but I'll resign from all golf forums if he wins 3.

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Post by JAS Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:30 pm

I don't see him winning 3 either but.... the signs on the front 9 on Sunday were the strongest yet that he IS on the way back to where he was. His ball striking, tee to green was the best since pre knee op....yes his putting was way below him in his pomp (had his putting been as it was 4-5 years ago he would have won the tournament)

No he hasnt strung 4 together yet, when he does the rest can forget it. That i think is the first Sunday he's gave us a flashback in a very long time though.

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Post by NedB-H Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:49 pm

The irons and fairway woods have been decent enough for a while, what's been letting him down is his putting and his driving, and there's not a lot of evidence that those are coming back. Even when he was hot, on the Friday back 9 and Sunday front 9, he missed some putts, and on Sunday he barely used the driver, it was nearly all 3 wood. I'm bored of him stringing a few good holes together and people saying "he's back", he played well enough at the Masters, but he did last year too, and he never turned it in to wins then.

And another thing... "putting 4 good rounds together": this crops up all the time on these boards. How often do golfers go into a tournament and play 4 genuinely good rounds? In the vast majority of tournaments, the winner is actually someone who's played a couple of good rounds and a couple of decent, consolidating rounds, and has just sneaked the win over a few other players who also posted a mix of good and ok rounds. And usually when someone genuinely has posted 4 "good" rounds, they've won by a mile - think Oosthuizen last summer, Woods at Augusta '97 and Pebble & TOC '00, etc etc - simply because racking up 4 good rounds one after the other is a pretty rare thing to do. Winning golf tournaments isn't usually about 4 good rounds, it's about a couple of good rounds, and then keeping yourself in it for the ones where you're not scoring so well.

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Post by Onetoanother Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:28 am

He will be good again when he goes to A Scott long putter! 🤦

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Post by Noshankingtonite Thu Apr 14, 2011 4:08 pm

I personally think we could well get three more first-timers this year. I just think we are starting to see a changing of the guard at the top levels in the game. The twenty somethings are starting to usurp the over 30s and 40s. Woods long irons and fairway woods and some of his wedges were excellent; but he defo struggles with the lady Godiva and he's certainly lost a bit of his nerve around the sub-six footers.
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Post by sharrison01 Thu Apr 14, 2011 4:31 pm

If we're on to majors this year, Kaymer for The Open for me. Comfortable winner at St Andrews and Kingsbarn in the Dunhill and prob one of the strongest front runners in the world right now...

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Post by super_realist Thu Apr 14, 2011 6:55 pm

Ned, that's the whole point though isn't it. One of Woods main strengths was the ability to put four good rounds together and win a tournament by a mile.
He hasn't done that for well over a year, and doesn't look like doing so any time soon. Therefore he is no longer out on his own and is probably in a group of 12 or so who are likely to challenge consistently in majors but without dominating.

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Post by McLaren Thu Apr 14, 2011 8:14 pm

In Tigers prime it is hard to see the likes of Els being able to birdie the last 4 and win a major. The players in the early 2000's had a mental block when it came to beating tiger, it seems the new generation just have their own mental issues. Rory anyone?
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Post by super_realist Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:00 pm

Mac, you've overlooked Schwartzel's tremendous mental aptitude in the Masters, Rory's bottle may have crashed spectacularly but the likes of Scott, Day, Donald and Schwartzel were tremendous on Sunday and easily surpassed what Woods did on Sunday .
So one player bottled it, the others stood up and gave performances that on another day and in the absence of their peers would have won a major, but there can only be one winner. Thankfully for me this time it was Schwartzel, 90/1 at a quid each way. Bang, get in.

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Post by McLaren Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:05 pm

Did I not just say I couldn't see els finish with four birdies. That fact Charl did surely indicates I rate him highly if I think he performed better under pressure than legend of the game like Els.
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Post by super_realist Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:10 pm

Yes, but just because the likes of Els never did, it doesn't mean they weren't capable of doing so. After all, when did circumstances ever align to help you shoot four birdies in a row. I've only ever done it a few times, sadly never when I wanted it to.
Els is one of the top players of the last 20 years. I don't think Schwartzel is.
Golf is full of examples of players who have come out of nowhere to win majors. It doesn't necessarily mean they are made of sterner stuff than the people who played when Woods was in his pomp.

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Post by oldparwin Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:10 pm



I have not seen the hunger and determination in Tigers eyes on Sunday, for a long time, he is back and bet against him at your peril.

Remember i said it first, would not be shocked if he bagged the other 3 Majors this year.

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Post by super_realist Thu Apr 14, 2011 9:26 pm

No chance OP.
He's miles off where he was when he was dominant. There are too many people who now (thankfully) realise he's not the threat he once was and now have a very realistic chance of beating him to the line.
Suspect putting and poor driving will never win you majors, regardless of the "look in his eyes" whatever that sort of straw clutching is.
He used to dominate majors from bang to tape but now he has to fight it out like everyone else.
Of course I'll continue to bet against him, because due to the bumlickers, lickspittles and gloryhunters his odds are artificially and preposterously short. There's no value in placing a bet on Woods. Whereas I bet £2 on Schwartzel and won £114.

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