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Scotland squad for SH tour

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Post by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Wed 16 May 2012, 9:39 pm

Backs - Ansbro, Blair, Brown, Cusiter, De Luca, Evans,Grove, Hogg, Laidlaw, S Lamont, Scott, Visser and Weir.

Forwards - Barclay, Cross, Ford(c), Grant, Gray, Hall, Harley,Kellock, S Lawson, Murray, Rennie, Ryder, Strokosch, Vernon and Welsh

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Post by IanBru Wed 16 May 2012, 9:47 pm

Is this confirmed?

I'm having trrouble believing it... It's just too close to what I was hoping for!
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Post by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Wed 16 May 2012, 9:50 pm

So, by position:

Props: Cross, Grant, Murray & Welsh (Low can count himself extremely unlucky)

Hookers: Ford, Hall & S Lawson (MacArthur can count himself extremely unlucky)

Locks: Gray, Kellock & Ryder (If Gilchrist is being rested, I don't have a huge issue with that; only other possibility was Muldowney)

Backrow: Barclay, Harley, Rennie, Stroks & Vernon (Vernon can count himself extremely lucky!)

Halfbacks: Blair, Cusiter, Laidlaw & Weir

Centres: Ansbro, De Luca, Grove & Scott (Dunbar can count himself quite unlucky, altho his emergence in the last two months may have come just too late)

Back three: Brown, Evans, Hogg, S Lamont & MacVisser

Braveheart

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Post by KickAndChase Wed 16 May 2012, 9:54 pm

No Morrison, I'm happy. Some back up for Hogg now, good. Keep S Lamont on the wing and centres at centre and we're doing very well in the back devision.

Laidlaw still being kept as a 10 for now ... obviously no problem with that. Hopefully Weir gets a full test though, with Blair inside him.

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Post by nickj Wed 16 May 2012, 9:55 pm

So chuffed my predictions were proved wrong!

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Post by nickj Wed 16 May 2012, 9:59 pm

We are really lacking a bonafide hard yards 8. Aren't we? Can Stroks play there?

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Post by Imperialbigdave Wed 16 May 2012, 10:07 pm

Oh my, I never thought id see the day where Graeme Morrison was fit and available, yet left out of the scotland team.
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Post by Pat_Mustard Wed 16 May 2012, 10:09 pm

Think he's played there a bit for Gloucester this season but doesn't have the same tackle-breaking power of a Denton or an on form Beattie. Can't believe Hall is ahead of MacArthur and disappointed no Gilchrist or Dunbar but not a bad squad by Robinson standards.

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Post by Captain_Sensible Wed 16 May 2012, 10:14 pm

I've a few quibbles around the edges of this squad (Murray for Low, for instance), but AR has got 90% of the decisions right. Hats off to him, let's hope for a good tour.

If everyone is fit and qualified, here is my 1st XV from that lot

1. Welsh
2. Ford
3. Cross
4. Gray
5. Ryder
6. Harley
7. Rennie
8. Vernon
9. Blair
10. Laidlaw
11. Visser
12. Scott
13. Ansbro
14. M Evans
15. Hogg

Subs – Hall, Grant, Kellock, Barclay, Weir, NDL, Brown.

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Post by flyhalffactory Wed 16 May 2012, 10:19 pm

Morning............ no Afternoon

Doesn't time fly when we all have a squad as near as damn it to what we all want (McInally, Dunbar perhaps should have be chanced) and we still can't praise the selection

Just waiting now for 21Century and sensieball to crucify "ARs" selection

For myself would like to see a
15 Brown
13 Ansbro
12 Scott
axis unleased for at least one aussie game
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Post by RDW Wed 16 May 2012, 10:19 pm

Think that team is spot on Captain_Sensible, but I'd probably pick De Luca at 13 to give Scott familiar people around him.

Also I can't see Robinson not picking Sean Lamont somewhere.

Such a shame that Vernon is our only number 8 available. He's not being playing much for Sale and I've never really been overly impressed with him at International level. The hard pitches might help his style though!

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Post by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Wed 16 May 2012, 10:20 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Think that team is spot on Captain_Sensible, but I'd probably pick De Luca at 13 to give Scott familiar people around him.

Also I can't see Robinson not picking Sean Lamont somewhere.

Such a shame that Vernon is our only number 8 available. He's not being playing much for Sale and I've never really been overly impressed with him at International level. The hard pitches might help his style though!
+1

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Post by RDW Wed 16 May 2012, 10:25 pm

flyhalffactory wrote:

Doesn't time fly when we all have a squad as near as damn it to what we all want (McInally, Dunbar perhaps should have be chanced) and we still can't praise the selection


Good point flyhalf - I was ready to tear Robinson a new one if he'd made some bad calls, so well done Robinson for picking a decent squad! clap

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Post by nickj Wed 16 May 2012, 10:27 pm

Bloody hell. The Scots contingent on 606 seem happy. I never thought I'd see that day! Wink

Nice work Robinson. You look to have vindicated my blind faith FOR NOW...

However I would have loved to see MacArthur, Moray Low, Chris Fusaro, Stu McInally, Ruaridh Jackson, Alex Dunbar all picked. And perhaps they would have been had the squad stayed at 32+ too. But I'm generally pretty darn chuffed.

Low, Fusaro and Dunbar will be rightly gutted to miss out and I would have loved Beattie to have used the tour as a springboard to a return to form. Here's hoping the South of France proves to be his tonic.

Here's my starting 15:

Welsh, Ford (C), Cross, Gray, Kellock, Rennie, Stroks, Vernon, Blair, Laidlaw, Visser, Scott, De Luca, M Evans, S Hogg

S Lawson, Murray, Harley, Barclay, Cusiter, Weir, S Lamont

Hall, Grant, Ryder, Grove , Ansbro, Brown


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Post by Majestic83 Wed 16 May 2012, 10:37 pm

Pretty happy with that squad he has selected. Really pleased for Tom Brown who I think has come on leaps and bounds this season and will really challenge for a back 3 place.
The one area that I am concerned about is the No8 spot as Vernon has never convinced me especially against hard hitting teams which these 3 teams will be.
Personally I would have taken Blair Cowan who is a big ball carrier but that would be my only negative.

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Post by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Wed 16 May 2012, 10:47 pm

No.8 is the glaring weakness, where he'll either play a distinctly average Vernon or an out-of-position Barclay

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Wed 16 May 2012, 10:49 pm

We miss our no 8 ball carrier. I can't see where we are going to make the hard yards around the fringes with Hamilton/Denton not being there.

my squad :

1. Welsh
2. Ford (c)
3. Cross
4. Gray
5. Ryder
6. Harley
7. Rennie
8. Vernon (has to be)
9. Blair
10. Laidlaw
11. Visser
12. Scott
13. DeLuca
14. Ansbro
15. Hogg

16. Lawson
17. Grant
18. Kellock
19. Stroks
20. Weir
21. Grove
22. Brown

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Post by Imperialbigdave Wed 16 May 2012, 11:03 pm

I think if Lineen had just dropped Barclay instead of shoehorning him into another position, Fusaro wouldve toured as there would be no justification for taking a player who cant get a game at club level (see Danielli and Beattie). As it stands however, we have a very unbalanced backrow no matter who plays as there are no ball carriers in it (unless Vernons toughened up a bit at sale, havent seen much of him since he went down).
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Post by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Wed 16 May 2012, 11:07 pm

Imperialbigdave wrote:I think if Lineen had just dropped Barclay instead of shoehorning him into another position, Fusaro wouldve toured as there would be no justification for taking a player who cant get a game at club level (see Danielli and Beattie). As it stands however, we have a very unbalanced backrow no matter who plays as there are no ball carriers in it (unless Vernons toughened up a bit at sale, havent seen much of him since he went down).
He hasn't, IBD, soft as putty the twice I've seen him against Exe

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Wed 16 May 2012, 11:10 pm

In all the packs we have seen, where is the Abrasive/Hardman in them?

Without Denton/Kelly B and Hamilton we look like we might get bullied upfront. Harley will tackle all day long but Rennie isn't an abrasive carrier and Stroks IMO has never lived up to his billing as a hardman.

The abrasive momentum will now have to come from the likes of Vernon, when Ford and Gray are burried in rucks.... Shocked
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Post by funnyExiledScot Wed 16 May 2012, 11:27 pm

I'm pretty happy with this squad. As with others, there are a few selections around the edges I'd have done differently, but by Robinson's standards this squad selection is blindingly good.

The ones I quibble:

1. Euan Murray over Murray Low. I don't think this can be justified on form or potential. Experience is Murray's only real trump card.

2. Dougie Hall over Pat MacArthur (although I do concede that Hall has played well recently).

3. Kellock over Gilchrist. Youth, form and potential on the one hand, experience in delivering mediocrity on the other. I personally would have been bolder here, but I know others rate Kellock more highly than I do.

4. Grove over Dunbar. I don't feel hugely strongly about this one, but I think that's Dunbar's form has been better than what I've seen of Grove this season (which has been largely limited to highlights of games to be honest). I also like that Dunbar covers 12 and 13. I don't want S Lamont at 12 this tour. I suspect the idea of Scott at 12 and Dunbar at 13 was just too green for Robinson.

I'm still pretty pleased though overall.

On the Vernon point, we ought to give this a chance. He's been picked not as a first pick but as a replacement to Denton. There are no other options jumping out at the moment. Beattie (my pick) hasn't had much game time for whatever reason, McInally is in the same boat not being a first choice pick for Edinburgh and whilst Ali Hogg has played a lot, his form hasn't exactly made him stand out.

Vernon has played quite a bit this season, albeit between 6 and 8, and if Scotland are to adopt a fast paced offloading game on hard SH tracks, then Vernon could very well prove to be a big hit. Good opportunity for Harley to play next to him and prove that he can shoulder some of the ball carrying duties. I'd far rather Vernon than Barclay at 8.

My 1st XV from the squad (assuming Visser is eligible, which he won't be for Aus):

1.Welsh 2.Ford 3.Cross 4.Gray 5.Ryder 6.Harley 7.Rennie 8.Vernon 9.Blair 10.Laidlaw 11.Visser (S Lamont for Aus) 12.Scott 13.NDL 14.Evans 15.Hogg

16.Grant 17.S Lawson 18.Kellock 19.Barclay 20.Weir 21.Ansbro 22.Brown

That's actually a pretty exciting team. Might be worth watching these games afterall.....

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Post by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Wed 16 May 2012, 11:43 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:If either Scott or Dunbar do not tour, and Morrison does, I will adopt a Schizoid-esque approach to 606 and post nothing without commencing with an anti-Robinson tirade.

Oooh, close one, no Dunbar but equally no Morrison, so we can let you off the rant!


funnyExiledScot wrote:Wednesday is judgement day for Robinson. Has he learned anything from the last dismal 12 months, or are we to see another bunch of silly selections.

The following, in my view, are silly selections:

- Jacobsen
- Murray
- Kalman
- Dickinson
- Hall
- Kellock (perhaps less silly than the others)
- Barclay being considered as a number 8
- Ali Hogg
- Rory Lawson
- Morrison
- S Lamont
- R Lamont (if he's alive)
- Walker (ditto)
- Murchie
- Southwell

Any of the above and Scotland are well and truly in reverse gear.

So that's 5 from your list, fES, are we now "well and truly in reverse gear"?!?! Wink

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Post by Scottish Optimist Wed 16 May 2012, 11:47 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
That's actually a pretty exciting team. Might be worth watching these games afterall.....

But are the games even being shown on TV? Shocked

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Post by funnyExiledScot Wed 16 May 2012, 11:55 pm

ASBO - as I said above, I dispute the selections of Murray, Hall and Kellock. Don't agree with those.

As for Barclay, I'm holding onto the hope that he's picked as cover at 7, and not as a first choice 8 - how's that for optimism!?

I suspect the selection of S Lamont is (a) because Visser can't play against Australia, and (b) because we need a ball carrier in the backs to come off the wing and make some hard yards in the absence of a decent ball carrier in the back row. I can understand this (however, if Lamont is picked at 12 then my good will evaporates!).

Still, I'm in genuine shock that Morrison hasn't been picked. Frankly that in itself has caused the sun to shine!

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Post by funnyExiledScot Wed 16 May 2012, 11:56 pm

Scottish Optimist wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
That's actually a pretty exciting team. Might be worth watching these games afterall.....

But are the games even being shown on TV? Shocked


Surely we can convince the gaelic brigade at Alba to go off and get some sunshine. They are all extremely pale and pastey.

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Post by Scottish Optimist Thu 17 May 2012, 12:01 am

Good idea - can't wait to hear "Visser for the linee" in the commentary of a Scotland game laughing

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Post by RDW Thu 17 May 2012, 12:06 am

The Aus game is on TV (at 10 30 am here) but even if the other two games are on TV they will be at 3am on Saturday night / Sunday morning!

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Post by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 May 2012, 12:10 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:The Aus game is on TV (at 10 30 am here) but even if the other two games are on TV they will be at 3am on Saturday night / Sunday morning!


3am on Sunday morning is perfect. It'll be just like the World Cup. Go out, get hammered, push through and watch the game with the filthiest kebab money can purchase.

I suspect however that the TV stations won't be fighting eachother for the rights to these games. Particularly now that the star draw, Graeme Morrison, has been axed but the progressive Andy Robinson.

Do we genuinely think Robinson picked this squad, or has someone hacked into his inbox and done the honours!?

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Post by Scottish Optimist Thu 17 May 2012, 12:11 am

The Aus game is on Sky isn't it? Don't really fancy the cost of the sports channels for one game but doubt I'll have much trouble convincing a few friends to go to the pub for breakfast.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 May 2012, 12:18 am

I'm sure the delightful Bar OZ will be screening it......

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Post by sensisball Thu 17 May 2012, 12:36 am

Glad that my Croatian hit man can stand down and I can keep my meagre savings after AR’s latest selections!!
The majority of the new players appear to have been picked on form: Ryder, Grant, Harley etc.

With only three locks travelling Ryder will definitely get some game time, if only from the bench, which is great as he has been outstanding all season.
He could well prove part of the answer to having no hard carrying 8 in the squad.
Hall is clearly going to fulfil the same role as Moray Low in New Zealand, namely back up if injury occurs otherwise he won’t trouble selection. Robinson clearly thinks that with two inexperienced props McArthur was a bridge too far for him.

Low was never going to tour as Robinson doesn’t rate him. Don’t know if Murray has found any form recently but his scrummaging was appalling at the end of the 6N. If he doesn’t do a job in the scrum what else does he do? (Answers on a postage stamp please)

I also fear that Harley is also there to make up the numbers. Without a strong ball carrying number 8 I can see AR starting with Stroks, Vernon/Barclay and Rennie with Barclay / Vernon on the bench, utilising all his experienced back rowers.

This would be a mistake as Strokosch doesn’t offer much more in terms of carrying than Harley and since returning from his shoulder op he hasn’t hit the heights of a couple of seasons ago in terms of his tackling. Harley’s defensive qualities are phenomenal, as is his work rate, and his additional presence in the lineout would also be a big bonus.

In the backs really only one selection that I have issue with. If Scott has a poor first game or is injured then Lamont will move to 12 and the whole game is up in terms of being able to play any wide rugby. So I would have liked to have seen Dunbar instead of NDL.

Having directly cost us the win against Italy by being binned and for putting us in a large hole against Wales, by being binned, NDL should have been given the summer off. Probably playing with club colleagues at 9, 10, 12 and 11 (for the last two matches) this surely must be last chance to show he has the mentality to play international rugby. If he gets binned again then Robinson should bin him permanently.

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Post by Tattie Scones RRN Thu 17 May 2012, 12:38 am

funnyExiledScot wrote:
Scottish Optimist wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
That's actually a pretty exciting team. Might be worth watching these games afterall.....

But are the games even being shown on TV? Shocked


Surely we can convince the gaelic brigade at Alba to go off and get some sunshine. They are all extremely pale and pastey.

Aye but the young quine who always seems to be interviewing Beattie or Troy Nathan is lovely for a pastey!

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 May 2012, 12:58 am

sensisball wrote:Glad that my Croatian hit man can stand down and I can keep my meagre savings after AR’s latest selections!!
The majority of the new players appear to have been picked on form: Ryder, Grant, Harley etc.

With only three locks travelling Ryder will definitely get some game time, if only from the bench, which is great as he has been outstanding all season.
He could well prove part of the answer to having no hard carrying 8 in the squad.
Hall is clearly going to fulfil the same role as Moray Low in New Zealand, namely back up if injury occurs otherwise he won’t trouble selection. Robinson clearly thinks that with two inexperienced props McArthur was a bridge too far for him.

Low was never going to tour as Robinson doesn’t rate him. Don’t know if Murray has found any form recently but his scrummaging was appalling at the end of the 6N. If he doesn’t do a job in the scrum what else does he do? (Answers on a postage stamp please)

I also fear that Harley is also there to make up the numbers. Without a strong ball carrying number 8 I can see AR starting with Stroks, Vernon/Barclay and Rennie with Barclay / Vernon on the bench, utilising all his experienced back rowers.

This would be a mistake as Strokosch doesn’t offer much more in terms of carrying than Harley and since returning from his shoulder op he hasn’t hit the heights of a couple of seasons ago in terms of his tackling. Harley’s defensive qualities are phenomenal, as is his work rate, and his additional presence in the lineout would also be a big bonus.

In the backs really only one selection that I have issue with. If Scott has a poor first game or is injured then Lamont will move to 12 and the whole game is up in terms of being able to play any wide rugby. So I would have liked to have seen Dunbar instead of NDL.

Having directly cost us the win against Italy by being binned and for putting us in a large hole against Wales, by being binned, NDL should have been given the summer off. Probably playing with club colleagues at 9, 10, 12 and 11 (for the last two matches) this surely must be last chance to show he has the mentality to play international rugby. If he gets binned again then Robinson should bin him permanently.

+1

Last chance saloon for NDL. He deserves a crack surrounded by his club mates. If he can't cut it he should be dropped.
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Post by RDW Thu 17 May 2012, 2:29 am

Tell you what - something we've not really talked about is how awesome this tour will be for the guys!

2 weeks in Australia Wallaby followed by 2 weeks in some stunning island paradises, all for 3 games of rugby? Not bad. Scotland squad for SH tour 4278589029 appletini

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Post by flyhalffactory Thu 17 May 2012, 2:52 am

You guys do realise that Robinson has picked over 25% of players who have never even played at this level, we are playing a top 3 nation in their own back yard.

So anyone who doesn't think that a

15 Hogg
13 Dunbar
12 Scott

has all the potential for ruining careers before they have got off the ground. We have to be sensible, we have to protect our young guns by using some experience. I think Robinson was wise not to throw Denton in at the WC but introduce him into the fold at the 6Ns.

Also if we are going to play Ansbro on the wing Shocked he is not a winger IMHO Hogg is a better wing, then again I would rather Brown than Hogg at FB anyway.

15 Brown
14 Hogg
13 NDL
12 Scott
11 Schlong

I would also like to try
10 Weir
9 Laidlaw

At some point in the tour
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Post by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Thu 17 May 2012, 3:04 am

flyhalffactory wrote:You guys do realise that Robinson has picked over 25% of players who have never even played at this level, we are playing a top 3 nation in their own back yard.

So anyone who doesn't think that a

15 Hogg
13 Dunbar
12 Scott

has all the potential for ruining careers before they have got off the ground. We have to be sensible, we have to protect our young guns by using some experience. I think Robinson was wise not to throw Denton in at the WC but introduce him into the fold at the 6Ns.

Also if we are going to play Ansbro on the wing Shocked he is not a winger IMHO Hogg is a better wing, then again I would rather Brown than Hogg at FB anyway.

15 Brown
14 Hogg
13 NDL
12 Scott
11 Schlong

I would also like to try
10 Weir
9 Laidlaw

At some point in the tour
No need to over egg it, FHF, we all know it'll be the Australia A team given that the match is on a Tuesday before they play Wales on the Saturday.

Selecting experience over form is mind-numbingly daft.

And why is Ansbro not a winger? Much of his Saints career was on the wing

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Post by Scot Abroad Thu 17 May 2012, 3:05 am

flyhalffactory wrote:You guys do realise that Robinson has picked over 25% of players who have never even played at this level, we are playing a top 3 nation in their own back yard.

So anyone who doesn't think that a

15 Hogg
13 Dunbar
12 Scott

has all the potential for ruining careers before they have got off the ground. We have to be sensible, we have to protect our young guns by using some experience. I think Robinson was wise not to throw Denton in at the WC but introduce him into the fold at the 6Ns.

Also if we are going to play Ansbro on the wing Shocked he is not a winger IMHO Hogg is a better wing, then again I would rather Brown than Hogg at FB anyway.

15 Brown
14 Hogg
13 NDL
12 Scott
11 Schlong

I would also like to try
10 Weir
9 Laidlaw

At some point in the tour

Hogg on the wing? Is that a serious suggestion. I don't recall him playing there this season. You just said we should be protecting our young guys and combine youth and experience but you want Brown, who is uncapped, to start at FB? Seems a bit silly to me. Dunbar isn't even in the squad so what's the point mentioning him?

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Post by alexgmacdonald Thu 17 May 2012, 3:39 am

Scot Abroad wrote:
flyhalffactory wrote:You guys do realise that Robinson has picked over 25% of players who have never even played at this level, we are playing a top 3 nation in their own back yard.

So anyone who doesn't think that a

15 Hogg
13 Dunbar
12 Scott

has all the potential for ruining careers before they have got off the ground. We have to be sensible, we have to protect our young guns by using some experience. I think Robinson was wise not to throw Denton in at the WC but introduce him into the fold at the 6Ns.

Also if we are going to play Ansbro on the wing Shocked he is not a winger IMHO Hogg is a better wing, then again I would rather Brown than Hogg at FB anyway.

15 Brown
14 Hogg Doh
13 NDL
12 Scott
11 Schlong

I would also like to try
10 Weir
9 Laidlaw

At some point in the tour

Hogg on the wing? Is that a serious suggestion. I don't recall him playing there this season. You just said we should be protecting our young guys and combine youth and experience but you want Brown, who is uncapped, to start at FB? Seems a bit silly to me. Dunbar isn't even in the squad so what's the point mentioning him?

Hogg on the wing just doesnt make sense Shocked

Why take a player who is playing very well and put him in a position that he hasnt played? I dont think anyone can argue with the fact that he deserves the FB jersey


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Post by flyhalffactory Thu 17 May 2012, 3:43 am

Scot Abroad wrote:
flyhalffactory wrote:You guys do realise that Robinson has picked over 25% of players who have never even played at this level, we are playing a top 3 nation in their own back yard.

So anyone who doesn't think that a

15 Hogg
13 Dunbar
12 Scott

has all the potential for ruining careers before they have got off the ground. We have to be sensible, we have to protect our young guns by using some experience. I think Robinson was wise not to throw Denton in at the WC but introduce him into the fold at the 6Ns.

Also if we are going to play Ansbro on the wing Shocked he is not a winger IMHO Hogg is a better wing, then again I would rather Brown than Hogg at FB anyway.

15 Brown
14 Hogg
13 NDL
12 Scott
11 Schlong

I would also like to try
10 Weir
9 Laidlaw

At some point in the tour

Hogg on the wing? Is that a serious suggestion. I don't recall him playing there this season. You just said we should be protecting our young guys and combine youth and experience but you want Brown, who is uncapped, to start at FB? Seems a bit silly to me. Dunbar isn't even in the squad so what's the point mentioning him?

Hogg.... didnt he play on the wing recently (when Murchie played FB apologies if incorrect), and in my mind Brown has the potential to be a more balanced FB, and TBH Hogg has only a few caps anyway. The point I am making is Ansbro in my mind has been brought into the squad as a centre not a wing, if you are to play NDL 13 then you cannae play Ansbro at 14, Hogg is faster (correct me if I am wrong), or even Max Evans is a better option.

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Post by sensisball Thu 17 May 2012, 3:45 am

Scot Abroad

I said i would rather have Dunbar than NDL because of his constant brain farts resulting in 10 minutes on the side lines (Italy and Wales).

I think that is why FHF thought a back line with Scott, Dunbar and Hogg would be light of experience.
My thought was that Dunbar would be an ideal back up to Scott in case of loss of form or injury or to come off the bench. Otherwise we are looking at Schlong at 12 and we all know how well our backs play in that scenario. He is not and never will be an int. 12.

The squad contains 3 outside centres ( 4 if you count Max) but only 1 specialist 12. i think this imbalance could come back to bite us, that is why i suggested Dunbar.

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Post by alexgmacdonald Thu 17 May 2012, 3:50 am

flyhalffactory wrote:
Scot Abroad wrote:
flyhalffactory wrote:You guys do realise that Robinson has picked over 25% of players who have never even played at this level, we are playing a top 3 nation in their own back yard.

So anyone who doesn't think that a

15 Hogg
13 Dunbar
12 Scott

has all the potential for ruining careers before they have got off the ground. We have to be sensible, we have to protect our young guns by using some experience. I think Robinson was wise not to throw Denton in at the WC but introduce him into the fold at the 6Ns.

Also if we are going to play Ansbro on the wing Shocked he is not a winger IMHO Hogg is a better wing, then again I would rather Brown than Hogg at FB anyway.

15 Brown
14 Hogg
13 NDL
12 Scott
11 Schlong

I would also like to try
10 Weir
9 Laidlaw

At some point in the tour

Hogg on the wing? Is that a serious suggestion. I don't recall him playing there this season. You just said we should be protecting our young guys and combine youth and experience but you want Brown, who is uncapped, to start at FB? Seems a bit silly to me. Dunbar isn't even in the squad so what's the point mentioning him?

Hogg.... didnt he play on the wing recently (when Murchie played FB apologies if incorrect), and in my mind Brown has the potential to be a more balanced FB, and TBH Hogg has only a few caps anyway. The point I am making is Ansbro in my mind has been brought into the squad as a centre not a wing, if you are to play NDL 13 then you cannae play Ansbro at 14, Hogg is faster (correct me if I am wrong), or even Max Evans is a better option.


No, I'm sure it was outside centre (his preferred position). He certainly has the pace to play on the wing but I think his counter-attacking from fullback and hitting the line in attack have proven that he either needs to be in the centre or at FB.

12. Scott
13. Ansbro
15. Hogg

Thats what I'd like to see with Visser and any of Brown, Evans or Lee Jones (when fit again) on the wings.

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Post by RDW Thu 17 May 2012, 3:51 am

Grove and ansbro have played at 12 before, ansbro quite recently, so you'd hope they'd start at 12 before Lamont

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Post by flyhalffactory Thu 17 May 2012, 3:52 am

sensisball wrote:Scot Abroad

I said i would rather have Dunbar than NDL because of his constant brain farts resulting in 10 minutes on the side lines (Italy and Wales).

I think that is why FHF thought a back line with Scott, Dunbar and Hogg would be light of experience.
My thought was that Dunbar would be an ideal back up to Scott in case of loss of form or injury or to come off the bench. Otherwise we are looking at Schlong at 12 and we all know how well our backs play in that scenario. He is not and never will be an int. 12.

The squad contains 3 outside centres ( 4 if you count Max) but only 1 specialist 12. i think this imbalance could come back to bite us, that is why i suggested Dunbar.

Exactomundo
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Post by flyhalffactory Thu 17 May 2012, 3:56 am

alexgmacdonald wrote:
flyhalffactory wrote:
Scot Abroad wrote:
flyhalffactory wrote:You guys do realise that Robinson has picked over 25% of players who have never even played at this level, we are playing a top 3 nation in their own back yard.

So anyone who doesn't think that a

15 Hogg
13 Dunbar
12 Scott

has all the potential for ruining careers before they have got off the ground. We have to be sensible, we have to protect our young guns by using some experience. I think Robinson was wise not to throw Denton in at the WC but introduce him into the fold at the 6Ns.

Also if we are going to play Ansbro on the wing Shocked he is not a winger IMHO Hogg is a better wing, then again I would rather Brown than Hogg at FB anyway.

15 Brown
14 Hogg
13 NDL
12 Scott
11 Schlong

I would also like to try
10 Weir
9 Laidlaw

At some point in the tour

Hogg on the wing? Is that a serious suggestion. I don't recall him playing there this season. You just said we should be protecting our young guys and combine youth and experience but you want Brown, who is uncapped, to start at FB? Seems a bit silly to me. Dunbar isn't even in the squad so what's the point mentioning him?

Hogg.... didnt he play on the wing recently (when Murchie played FB apologies if incorrect), and in my mind Brown has the potential to be a more balanced FB, and TBH Hogg has only a few caps anyway. The point I am making is Ansbro in my mind has been brought into the squad as a centre not a wing, if you are to play NDL 13 then you cannae play Ansbro at 14, Hogg is faster (correct me if I am wrong), or even Max Evans is a better option.


No, I'm sure it was outside centre (his preferred position). He certainly has the pace to play on the wing but I think his counter-attacking from fullback and hitting the line in attack have proven that he either needs to be in the centre or at FB.

12. Scott
13. Ansbro
15. Hogg

Thats what I'd like to see with Visser and any of Brown, Evans or Lee Jones (when fit again) on the wings.

Good call, deffo what I would want, (albeit I think we should see Brown at FB to start for at least one of the games, we all might be suprised how he can crank it up at international level), and yes I agree Hogg deserves the FB jersey
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Post by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 May 2012, 3:58 am

If Dunbar was to be included I think it should have been ahead of Alex Grove. Not a biggie for me though.

NDL should start at 13. Ansbro perfectly capable of playing on the wing.

Hogg on the wing is Hadden-esque.

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Post by alexgmacdonald Thu 17 May 2012, 4:04 am

flyhalffactory wrote:
alexgmacdonald wrote:
flyhalffactory wrote:
Scot Abroad wrote:
flyhalffactory wrote:You guys do realise that Robinson has picked over 25% of players who have never even played at this level, we are playing a top 3 nation in their own back yard.

So anyone who doesn't think that a

15 Hogg
13 Dunbar
12 Scott

has all the potential for ruining careers before they have got off the ground. We have to be sensible, we have to protect our young guns by using some experience. I think Robinson was wise not to throw Denton in at the WC but introduce him into the fold at the 6Ns.

Also if we are going to play Ansbro on the wing Shocked he is not a winger IMHO Hogg is a better wing, then again I would rather Brown than Hogg at FB anyway.

15 Brown
14 Hogg
13 NDL
12 Scott
11 Schlong

I would also like to try
10 Weir
9 Laidlaw

At some point in the tour

Hogg on the wing? Is that a serious suggestion. I don't recall him playing there this season. You just said we should be protecting our young guys and combine youth and experience but you want Brown, who is uncapped, to start at FB? Seems a bit silly to me. Dunbar isn't even in the squad so what's the point mentioning him?

Hogg.... didnt he play on the wing recently (when Murchie played FB apologies if incorrect), and in my mind Brown has the potential to be a more balanced FB, and TBH Hogg has only a few caps anyway. The point I am making is Ansbro in my mind has been brought into the squad as a centre not a wing, if you are to play NDL 13 then you cannae play Ansbro at 14, Hogg is faster (correct me if I am wrong), or even Max Evans is a better option.


No, I'm sure it was outside centre (his preferred position). He certainly has the pace to play on the wing but I think his counter-attacking from fullback and hitting the line in attack have proven that he either needs to be in the centre or at FB.

12. Scott
13. Ansbro
15. Hogg

Thats what I'd like to see with Visser and any of Brown, Evans or Lee Jones (when fit again) on the wings.

Good call, deffo what I would want, (albeit I think we should see Brown at FB to start for at least one of the games, we all might be suprised how he can crank it up at international level), and yes I agree Hogg deserves the FB jersey

Of course, he deserves his chance. to be honest I havent seen enough of Brown to make a call on him.

I think in regards to the centres, there is plenty of talent coming through to permantanly banish Schlong and Morrison from the Scotland set up. Scott, Dunbar, Bennett, Ansbro, Grove, De Luca and even Hogg at 13. (forgive me if I've missed anyone).

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Post by flyhalffactory Thu 17 May 2012, 4:08 am

funnyExiledScot wrote:If Dunbar was to be included I think it should have been ahead of Alex Grove. Not a biggie for me though.

NDL should start at 13. Ansbro perfectly capable of playing on the wing.

Hogg on the wing is Hadden-esque.

The point is we bang on about "can't pass or won't pass" and yet if we don't play a tight centre partnership which we now won't then we need wingers who are fast and or know where the try line is, in my mind Ansbro is not quick enough to have free ball, or doesn't know where the try line is like Visser, he will be like a present Schlong "average speed" and doesnt have a good enough nose for the line
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Post by Scot Abroad Thu 17 May 2012, 4:13 am

Ok that clears it up a bit. I wouldn't start De Luca in the first game, instead going for Ansbro at 13.

9 Blair
10 Laidlaw
11 SLamont
12 Scott
13 Ansbro
14 Evans
15 Hogg

20 Cusiter
21 Weir
22 Brown

True we only have one specialist 12, and I'd have taken Dunbar if it was my decision, but I wouldn't play him and Scott together. The above selection has a pretty interchangeable back three and outside centre so players can (and probably will) be moved around depending on who's coming off.

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Post by 123456789 Thu 17 May 2012, 4:15 am

I hope that we start a team of:
1. Welsh
2. Ford
3. Cross
4. Gray
5. Kellock/Ryder
6. Harley
7. Rennie
8. Vernon or Barclay, I don't care tbh we're very short of the number eights
9. Blair
10. Weir, although I wouldn't mind Laidlaw
11. Visser
12. Scott
13. De Luca
14. Evans
15. Hogg

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Post by Morgannwg Thu 17 May 2012, 4:21 am

I think your best players in the backs are: 15. Hogg, 14. Evans, 13. Lamont, 12. Scott, 11. Visser, 10. Weir, 9. Laidlaw.
Whether that backline can work remains to be seen.
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