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Stephen Jones' (Sunday Times) Lions Squad

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Post by LondonTiger Sun 02 Dec 2012, 12:46 pm

Make of it what you will:

FB - Goode, Halfpenny, Kearney
Wing - Bowe, Cuthbert, North, Visser
Centre - Barritt, JD2, BOD, Roberts
FH - Priestland, Sexton
SH - Care, Phillips, youngs
No8 - Denton,m Heaslip
Flankers - Croft, Ferris, Lydiate, Tipuric, Warburton
2nd Row - Charteris, Evans, Gray, Lawes
Hookers - Best, Hartley, Hibbard
Props - Healey, Jones, Ross, Sheridan, Vunipola


Some "interesting" choices.

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Post by Mr Taff Sun 02 Dec 2012, 12:56 pm

Barritt? Not british for starters.
Visser? again, not British.
Denton? again, not British.
Vunipola? What has he done?
Priestland? Oh my.

Other than that, not too bad.

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Post by Cyril Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:01 pm

Priestland Laugh Jones really does like to be controversial.

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Post by Coleman Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:01 pm

The guy is celarly a giant troll.

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Post by LeinsterFan4life Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:02 pm

Mr Taff wrote:Barritt? Not british for starters.
Visser? again, not British.
Denton? again, not British.
Vunipola? What has he done?
Priestland? Oh my.

Other than that, not too bad.
Kearney, bowe, BOD, Heaslip and sexton aren't British either. Should they not be on the team?

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Post by Mad for Chelsea Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:03 pm

oh dear picard

this is so far off the mark it's not even funny. FBs, fine. Wings, OK.

Centres: no Tuilagi (with Barritt instead)? bit bizarre

only two FHs, one of which hasn't played a decent game of international rugby for about a year...

scrum halves are just about OK.

n°8, ditto

he seems to have this obsession with Croft and Lawes, Lawes esp. has done very little to justify the hype so far.

hookers is OK

props is a serious mess. Sheridan and Vunipola? no Cole?!?!

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Post by Mr Taff Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:04 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
Mr Taff wrote:Barritt? Not british/Irish for starters.
Visser? again, not British/Irish.
Denton? again, not British/Irish.
Vunipola? What has he done?
Priestland? Oh my.

Other than that, not too bad.
Kearney, bowe, BOD, Heaslip and sexton aren't British either. Should they not be on the team?

Fixed.

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Post by samuraidragon Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:04 pm

Stephen Jones is a highly-paid WUM. Hardly any Welsh fans would put Priestland there.

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Post by Cyril Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:05 pm

Mr Taff wrote:Barritt? Not british for starters.
Visser? again, not British.
Denton? again, not British.
Vunipola? What has he done?
Priestland? Oh my.

Other than that, not too bad.
Cuthbert and North qualify as English so at least we're ok with them.

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Post by Morgannwg Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:05 pm

FB - Goode, Halfpenny, Kearney
Wing - Bowe, Cuthbert, North, Sharples
Centre - Barritt, JD2, BOD, Tuilagi
FH - Laidlaw, Wilkinson, Sexton
SH - Care, Phillips, youngs, Cusiter
No8 - Denton, Heaslip
Flankers - Wood, Ferris, Robshaw, Armitage, Warburton
2nd Row - Charteris, O'Connell, Gray, Palmer
Hookers - Best, Hartley, Hibbard
Props - Healy, Jones, Ross, Sheridan, Cole

English: 14
Irish: 10
Welsh: 9
Scottish: 3

I edited it for him, so I don't think it's too bad a selection. I don't care if we have more or less players than anyone but would like to see the best players go.


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Post by Mr Taff Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:07 pm

Laidlaw? Don't be silly
Wilkinson? Stop living in the past

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Post by Morgannwg Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:08 pm

Mr Taff wrote:Laidlaw? Don't be silly
Wilkinson? Stop living in the past

So who would you choose?
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Post by Mr Taff Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:09 pm

Morgannwg wrote:
Mr Taff wrote:Laidlaw? Don't be silly
Wilkinson? Stop living in the past

So who would you choose?

Ceri Sweeney.

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Post by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:11 pm

Mr Taff wrote:Laidlaw? Don't be silly
Wilkinson? Stop living in the past

On club form this season Wilko would be starting. Which is partly due to the lack of form of the other options.
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Post by Mad for Chelsea Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:11 pm

FH is a problem position at the moment to be fair, Sexton is good but nothing special. Priestland looks lost at the moment (that's not to say he's not a good player, he is, but he's very low on confidence right now). Flood is OK but nothing special either. Farrell? Played well yesterday and will kick the goals under pressure but... Burns? a bit raw but looked impressive yesterday. Biggar? not convinced. Laidlaw/Weir? etc. no-one stands out right now...

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Post by Mr Taff Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:13 pm

Stephen Jones (the fly half, not the journalist)
He is our answers fellow Lions supporters.

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Post by samuraidragon Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:16 pm

Mr Taff wrote:Stephen Jones (the fly half, not the journalist)
He is our answers fellow Lions supporters.

And if he's unavailable, let's try Stephen Jones the WUM.

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Post by Mr Taff Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:20 pm

The Jocks need to start pulling their weight, we can't produce all the players.

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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:33 pm

Strange calls from the big man, I'd throw Gilroy in if he plays well in the six nations instead of Cuthbert whom I'm not the biggest fan of. I'd get rid of Lawes and put in O'Connell and get rid of Tipuric and throw in SOB along with Croft for Wood. Lots of other selection's which I wouldn't agree with but I think Stephen Jones is being a slight troll.

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Post by Mad for Chelsea Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:42 pm

just re-read the list, and was laughing out loud...

I mean, Sheridan and Vunipola? the guys aren't even in the first two choices for England, and I'm not sure apart from "headless chicken potential" just what Vunipola has done in the AIs to be even talked about at the moment.

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Post by majesticimperialman Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:45 pm

LondonTiger wrote:Make of it what you will:

FB - Goode, Halfpenny, Kearney (Kearney?) How can he be placed in the lions squad when he has been injured?
Wing - Bowe, Cuthbert, North, Visser( North, Cuthbert) both good players just need to get back to their best form so at the moment Cuthbert yes North is a maybe,
Centre - Barritt, JD2, BOD, Roberts ( Roberts? no chance on present form. replace him with Tualaghi.
FH - Priestland, Sexton (Priestland?) This has got to be a joke. Yahoo Yahoo Yahoo
SH - Care, Phillips, youngs (Philllips? realy?
No8 - Denton,m Heaslip
Flankers - Croft, Ferris, Lydiate, Tipuric, Warburton (Croft? Why? he as been injured for most of the season hasn't he?
2nd Row - Charteris, Evans, Gray, Lawes
Hookers - Best, Hartley, Hibbard (Hartley? Why? again he is injured?
Props - Healey, Jones, Ross, Sheridan, Vunipola (Jones? i take it this is Adam Jones he is refering too? again why? He is injure and will n ot take part in any rugby untill next year i believe.


Some "interesting" choices.

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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:47 pm

Why put in Sheridan though, he is always injured, although Australia seems to be the only team he can successfully scrum against. Not sure about Vunipola but unless he plays in the six nations, but also very well, then theres options I'd prefer like Jenkins

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Post by majesticimperialman Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:56 pm

drsambo1928 wrote:Why put in Sheridan though, he is always injured, although Australia seems to be the only team he can successfully scrum against. Not sure about Vunipola but unless he plays in the six nations, but also very well, then theres options I'd prefer like Jenkins

Why would you choose Gethin Jenkins? When he is second choice for Toulon "Behind" Sheridan. And he seems to have put on a lot of weight since he moved abroad. imo.

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Post by Morgannwg Sun 02 Dec 2012, 1:58 pm

majesticimperialman wrote:
drsambo1928 wrote:Why put in Sheridan though, he is always injured, although Australia seems to be the only team he can successfully scrum against. Not sure about Vunipola but unless he plays in the six nations, but also very well, then theres options I'd prefer like Jenkins

Why would you choose Gethin Jenkins? When he is second choice for Toulon "Behind" Sheridan. And he seems to have put on a lot of weight since he moved abroad. imo.

You are correct, but I'm just wondering which article you copied the statement from. Jenkins had his sole good game yesterday. Paul James has a few years on his side and it's enabled him to become the better player now.
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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:03 pm

Well Sheridan gets injured all the time as well, since you Welsh lads are more informed then me, fine go with James, although a good six nations for Jenkins is not impossible.

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Post by majesticimperialman Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:04 pm

Morgannwg

Would you pick Gethin Jenkins based on the on start game yesterday?



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Post by Mr Taff Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:05 pm

Gethin is not the force he once was. He won't be going.

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Post by Morgannwg Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:06 pm

Well seeing as I've just stated James is the better LH one could probably presume the answer is no.
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Post by Morgannwg Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:07 pm

drsambo1928 wrote:Well Sheridan gets injured all the time as well, since you Welsh lads are more informed then me, fine go with James, although a good six nations for Jenkins is not impossible.

True, but I think it could be his last. It'll be a shame to see him go. The move to Toulon hasn't worked out well for him.
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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:10 pm

I never thought Sheridan was that good anyway to be honest. He lives off how strong he is and expects and expects other TH's to be scared of him and when they aren't he usually has a tough day at the office.

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Post by Morgannwg Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:12 pm

He's probably way too tall for a prop, but would be handy down under none-the-less.
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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:13 pm

Sure, Healy would be my starter regardless if he goes or not.

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Post by Poorfour Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:36 pm

Just to start with the props, Jones ditched Cole for Vunipola in his notes. So he's swapped a truly international class tight head for an unproven loosehead. The man has no credibility. Both Cole and Corbisiero emerged from the AIs with credit and I'd be worried if they didn't tour.
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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:39 pm

I wouldn't pick Cole but thats all I'm gonna say, In fear of England fans attempting to verbally murder me.

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Post by Mad for Chelsea Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:46 pm

drsambo1928 wrote:I wouldn't pick Cole but thats all I'm gonna say, In fear of England fans attempting to verbally murder me.

you mean you wouldn't start him or wouldn't even have him in the squad? not having him in the squad would be just bizarre IMO.

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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:50 pm

Depends, whats the loose to tight head ratio?

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Post by thomh Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:51 pm

This is the first time there'll be 23 man squad on the Lions tour, so I think they'll have to take 6 or 7 props. Cole is as good as any tighthead in the scrum, and his work around the field is great.

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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:53 pm

6 or 7? are you sure, i thought it would have been 5 at the most.

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Post by thomh Sun 02 Dec 2012, 2:55 pm

In the past maybe, but we need 4 in the match day squad this time around. I can't see them leaving themselves that vulnerable to injury problems, especially given the amount of rotation that takes place in the warm-up games.

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Post by Morgannwg Sun 02 Dec 2012, 3:00 pm

What I will say is that I didn't see much of the game yesterday so can not comment on Corbs performance. But I don't see why he is rated so highly by England fans. I think both Wales LH's are better, Healy is by far the best LH available though.
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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 3:01 pm

But with 7 props, you need other players to fill other positions, as much as i wished it, there are other players on the pitch apart from props

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Post by thomh Sun 02 Dec 2012, 3:04 pm

drsambo1928 wrote:But with 7 props, you need other players to fill other positions, as much as i wished it, there are other players on the pitch apart from props

Well they took 5 last time, when you only needed 3 in the matchday squad. No way they'll take fewer than 6.

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Post by drsambo1928 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 3:08 pm

Alright then, with 6 i'd go for Healy, Jenkins and James(I guess), and Jones, Ross and Cole(I guess)

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Post by killer938 Sun 02 Dec 2012, 3:13 pm

No Cole or Tuilagi is just ridiculous, the rest isn't too bad but would have to take a third fly half as well

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Post by glamorganalun Sun 02 Dec 2012, 4:17 pm

I am not sure if S Jones picked what Gatland would pick what normal person would pick Preistland!

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Post by ChequeredJersey Sun 02 Dec 2012, 5:24 pm

You'd pick Ross at TH?
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Post by majesticimperialman Sun 02 Dec 2012, 5:33 pm

glamorganalun wrote:I am not sure if S Jones picked what Gatland would pick what normal person would pick Preistland!

RoB Howely. Erm

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 02 Dec 2012, 6:14 pm

I think Jones' list is a bit silly. Only purpose, I believe, is to start discussions. And what better way to incite discussion than to have glaring omissions or strange picks.

Morg,
Corbs is a good prop and has the potential to be very good. But in my mnd, is still developing. Whether or not he is equal to, better, or worse than Wales' props, I'd suggest suspending discussion about him until after the 6 Nations. He played very well yesterday, but needs a good Six Nations to merit discussion about the Lions.

I do think Cole is a virtual certainty, which is a lot from me as I have not been a Cole fan at all.

Sheridan? Only because he eats Australian props instead of scones at afternoon tea. I have seen him a couple of times on tv this season and he looked good. But Lions good? Don't think so.

My biggest concern is our stand off. No 10 in any of the Home Nations is playing all that well (the bizarre nomination of Farrell for Player of the Year not withstanding). And that would be the only reason to bring in Jonny. As much as I love JW, I would hope a couple of our 10s elevate their play to beat out JW on merit. If not, let's pick Jonny and Stephen Jones and call it a day.


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Post by bedfordwelsh Sun 02 Dec 2012, 6:56 pm

Mr Taff wrote:Barritt? Not british for starters.
Visser? again, not British.
Denton? again, not British.
Vunipola? What has he done?
Priestland? Oh my.

Other than that, not too bad.

What planet are you on?

Faletau not British/Irish either people in glass houses etc
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Post by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 02 Dec 2012, 6:58 pm

Sheridan isn't a ludicrous choice except he might not be available for the start of training. Vunipola is just silly .

Sjones article has clearly been written to be silly and provoke outrage and geyser his blog buzzing with comments and links. This is what he is played for, not serious analysis.

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