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CA Marketing Contracts & Mickey Arthur Sacked

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Post by Pal Joey Tue 04 Jun 2013, 2:19 pm

Cricket Australia has offered Fawad Ahmed and Gurinder Sandhu marketing contracts in an attempt to grow and diversify the player base whilst also increasing cricket's appeal to a wider multicultural demographic in Australia. The concept which was introduced as a result of the reduction in the number of Central Playing Contracts from 27 players (old arrangement) to only 17 last year (with 10 Marketing Contracts) - as recommended by the Argus report. This year there are 20 CPCs and 7 MCs.

Under an agreement with the Australian Cricketers' Association, players from outside the Central Contract List could be offered deals based on marketing appearances. Ricky Ponting (Melbourne Stars in 2013/4) and Michael Hussey (Sydney Thunder 2013/14) have also been offered these marketing contracts but will obviously not be available for the Ashes Series and will only be playing in the Big Bash.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/australia/content/story/638959.html

Meanwhile, Fawad Ahmed could yet play in the Ashes if Legislation before Federal Parliament is passed in time to allow his Australian passport to be fast-tracked. If not, then under ICC Regulations, he will have to wait until August 18, 2013 and would therefore only be available for selection for the 5th Test at The Oval. Despite the back-log of Bills in the last sitting days before Parliament is dissolved for the September 14 Federal Elections - this Legislation should have bi-partisan support. Similar Bills have already been passed; however they have excluded "cricket players" from the explicit scope of the legislation.

In other big news here; Channel Nine has retained the rights for broadcasting all home international matches worth a total of AUD $590 million over five years, an increase of 118% on the previous agreement. CA has also agreed to work with Channel Nine on a $60 million digital rights joint venture, for mobile and broadband coverage of international cricket.

Channel Ten has agreed to pay $100 million over the next 5 years for the rights to the Big Bash tournament and has promised fresh new faces to front its broadcasts. The two free-to-air stations will have a share of the cricket schedule this summer after a deal was finalised on Monday to provide a monstrously large boost to Cricket Australia's broadcasting revenue for the next five years.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/australia/content/current/story/638947.html


Last edited by Linebreaker on Mon 24 Jun 2013, 3:01 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Pal Joey Thu 06 Jun 2013, 1:36 pm

The Bill has passed through the House of Reps and Ahmed is on the plane to England having been selected to play for Australia A.
The amendment to the Citizens Act will become law when it passes through the Senate shortly.

http://au.sports.yahoo.com/cricket/news/article/-/17500392/cricket-pakistani-leg-spinner-fawad-ahmed-to-join-australia-a-tour-brings-ashes-dream-closer/
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Post by Pal Joey Mon 24 Jun 2013, 3:11 am

Mickey Arthur was relieved of his role as Australian cricket Coach in Bristol last night.

Darren Lehmann's appointment will be announced by Cricket Australia chief executive James Sutherland at a media conference on Monday morning.

http://au.sports.yahoo.com/cricket/news/article/-/17723777/mickey-arthur-sacked-as-australian-coach/

Hopefully "Boof" can inject some discipline into our current rabble and impart some of his winning touch into our national team's performances as he has done this year so successfully with Queensland.

Good timing two weeks or so out from the Ashes. Smile
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Post by alfie Mon 24 Jun 2013, 3:40 am

Extraordinary timing !

Maybe some of the Cricket Australia bigwigs might start to attract their rightful share of the responsibilty for some recent troubles next ?

Not a huge fan of Arthur , but this move looks like desperation...

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Post by subhranshu.kumar.5 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 5:42 am

I think it to be a desperate move from Australia. But it is sure that Aurther's presence is not liked by many Australian players. Aurther's some of the decisions like giving off field home work during the tour to India, I suppose was baseless and that too sacking players from the side. I don't know what effect will it do but one thing is sure that Aussies players are now going to play a free cricket without the Homework. Very Happy
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Post by Pal Joey Mon 24 Jun 2013, 7:34 am

Alfie,
They should clean out Sutherland, Inverarity and Howard while they're at it and bring in Boonie, a Waugh? and someone else who the players would respect.

kumar,
Congrats on the win yesterday. India are the most professional outfit and deserved it... most consistent team and all that. OK

Yeah, the homework-gate was pretty baseless in retrospect. There must have been many more underlying problems in the group in India... and now in England. Maybe he had issues with a few players but we'll never know all the details unless somebody writes a book about it. Pity, I thought he was a nice guy and would lift the players but obviously it hasn't worked out and he's an easy target.

I would take Warner out the back to the carpark and give him a slap around the ears whilst asking him at the same time "do you think Sachin or Viru would carry on like you are... what makes them great (and you not!) do you think?!!... any ideas, mate?" Laugh

I'm so disappointed in his attitude. He's had every chance to get his act together but you know what?... I don't even think he has the brains to realise what it all means. A shame really.
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Post by LondonTiger Mon 24 Jun 2013, 7:40 am

Darren Lehmann is a top bloke, was an outstanding cricketer with a great cricketing brain. Nothing but utter respect from us Yorkshire fans for him and his achievements. Tough ask to step in this close to the start of the series - but if tyhey do poorly he will be free of much of theblame that will be flung around.

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Post by KP_fan Mon 24 Jun 2013, 10:12 am

I wrote this a few days back on the other CT thread.........and the sacking of Arthur merely confirms the lack of unision inside the Aussie dressing room....


The decline in Aussie side has been so monumental and so rapid that it is sad and shocking.

It is hard to believe that this is owing to lack of talent alone....they still have the best pace bowling and bowling allrounder resources and reserves.
Batting has declined but ain't as bad as their white-washes in India and CT would suggest.

I think the bigger problem lies in leadership/ unity in the dressing room / team spirit/ discipline / favoritism or biasses in selections.

Clarke is a leader but I doubt an undisputed one.....he was promoted by Ponting....but resented by Katich.....Watson doesn't have an equation with the coach and clarke......he didn't do his homework..so he was out..then he is back in as a captain..then he is out as a vice captain also....then there is Wade & Bailey in the captaincy mix...and when you though Haddin was dead and buried he returns as a captain. Mercurial Smith doesn't find a place inspite of his near hundred in difficult Indian conditions.... nor Does Henriques inspite of his real hundred....and then they have an Oaf of a Warner.


The team spirit, the commonality of purpose, consistency in selections.... seems to be the biggest thing missing....in this Aussie team resembling for now like the multi-factions seen often in a Pakistan side.
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Post by KP_fan Mon 24 Jun 2013, 10:13 am

and Australia have announced bringing back Smith also since
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Post by Pal Joey Mon 24 Jun 2013, 10:29 am

Nice summary up there KP. Spot on!

They've also sent Fawad Ahmed home which seems strange so soon after flying him out to England. OK, maybe he didn't set the world on fire playing Gloucester and was told to go home, keep sharp and fit, etc... and wait by the phone because chances are there'll soon be an injury/controversy and we'll need you to give it a shot. What's the odds that will happen?

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Post by Duty281 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 10:37 am

Sounds rather like the cricket and rugby teams for Australia have imploded.

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Post by Pal Joey Mon 24 Jun 2013, 10:50 am

Duty281 wrote:Sounds rather like the cricket and rugby teams for Australia have imploded.

That's exactly the word I used when chatting to Eirebilly on fb just now. (He's doing fine, btw...) OK

Funny, I saw the 'choke' thread. How about a 'self-destruction' or 'implosion' thread? We sure do like to make things hard for ourselves these days. It never used to be like that. I'm just waiting for those dark clouds to part... but I think I'll be waiting a while yet.
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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Mon 24 Jun 2013, 12:42 pm

Good to hear Billy is doing well LB OK

Aussie cricket is in a bit of turmoil at the moment. If Arthur can't turn it around, then who will
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Post by alfie Mon 24 Jun 2013, 12:46 pm

Nice to hear you are in touch with eirebilly still , lb...and delighted to hear he is doing well .  I miss him on here.

Lehmann has a lot of good points and he won't shy from a challenge. I will be surprised if he can change much in the short term though...part of any Australian coach's problem at the moment is a distinct lack of horses...

Just seems weird to me : if the level of dissatisfaction with Arthur was such that they are ready to ditch him at this stage in an important tour , due to a poor start in a couple of ODIs and a bit of player shenanigans , surely they should have had the balls to make the change before the touring party even left ?  Then Lehmann would have had ownership of the whole affair from the off , rather than having to pick up the pieces as he goes...I wish him luck , but I think Australian fans will need to cultivate a little patience.


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Post by Duty281 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 12:57 pm

Linebreaker wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Sounds rather like the cricket and rugby teams for Australia have imploded.

That's exactly the word I used when chatting to Eirebilly on fb just now. (He's doing fine, btw...) OK

Funny, I saw the 'choke' thread. How about a 'self-destruction' or 'implosion' thread? We sure do like to make things hard for ourselves these days. It never used to be like that. I'm just waiting for those dark clouds to part... but I think I'll be waiting a while yet.

Good to hear. OK

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Post by Duty281 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 1:11 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cricket/23029476

Darren Lehmann is the new coach. Quick promotion from Australia A to...the Ashes.

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Post by KP_fan Mon 24 Jun 2013, 1:22 pm

The statements from Sutherland are telling......that Arthur is being held responsible for dissent/ divisivenesss inside the camp.
 
and that Clarke has lost his role in selecting the team.......which reading between the lines is to put to rest favouritism / biasses in selection issues.

And I do believe if the can work as a unit......the squad of 15 + all support staff pushing in the same direction, to same objective....Doesn't necessarily mean they will win ashes....but they will be far more competitive than we saw them in India or CT.

 
Cricket Australia said Arthur, in charge for two years, was dismissed due to "struggles on and off the field".
They added that the decision as "drastic", but necessary "with such a big series fast approaching".
Sutherland said: "The timing is far from ideal but we didn't feel we could sit back and hope matters would change without addressing issues critical to a high-performing team culture.
"Discipline, consistency of behaviour and accountability for performance are all key ingredients that need to improve. We see that the head coach is ultimately responsible for that."
Off-the-field issues during Arthur's tenure included four players - vice-captain Shane Watson, Mitchell Johnson, James Pattinson and Usman Khawaja - being dropped for the third Test of the tour to India for failing to submit presentations on team strategy.
Cricket Australia also announced that captain Michael Clarke had stood down from his role as on the team's selection panel.


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Post by KP_fan Mon 24 Jun 2013, 1:30 pm

Duty281 wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cricket/23029476

Darren Lehmann is the new coach. Quick promotion from Australia A to...the Ashes.

IPL unearths another international star;) 
headline for the future given that Deccan Chargers "identified" Lehman's potential and appointed him coach as early as 2009
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Post by LondonTiger Mon 24 Jun 2013, 1:37 pm

KP_fan wrote:
Duty281 wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cricket/23029476

Darren Lehmann is the new coach. Quick promotion from Australia A to...the Ashes.

IPL unearths another international star;) 
headline for the future given that Deccan Chargers "identified" Lehman's potential and appointed him coach as early as 2009

Hate to point out but he was player coach at Yorkshire and South Australia long before that.

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Post by Pal Joey Mon 24 Jun 2013, 1:40 pm

you missed the Wink
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Post by GSC Mon 24 Jun 2013, 2:06 pm

Sheer act of desperation. This is a far cry from the Aussie teams that routinely rolled us over.

The problem for any great team is the follow up act.
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Post by msp83 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 2:12 pm

Days before the Ashes, Cricket Australia has sacked coach Mickey Arthur, calling the decision a hard but necessary one. The Australians were suffering some poor performance for some time now, and the consistency has been missing from their game. More over, there were major behavioral issues. Cricket Australia seems to think Arthur has to be held accountable for the cultural issues afflicting the team along with the poor results.
Former test cricketer Darren Lehmann has been appointed as the new Australian coach.
Your thoughts?

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Post by msp83 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 2:34 pm

Cricinfo blog on the CA press conference.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/icc-champions-trophy-2013/content/current/story/644761.html

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Post by msp83 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 2:38 pm

Oh, didn't noticed the title change, and hence started a thread on the Arthur sacking. Can merge the 2 I suppose

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Post by GSC Mon 24 Jun 2013, 2:45 pm

Sheer act of desperation, hoping this can spark anything.
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Post by Duty281 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 3:08 pm

Australia are starting to look a bit desperate. New coach less than a month before the Ashes, as well as the whole business with Fawad Ahmed. It might be the platform for one of the greatest Ashes victories ever, but more than likely it will be the platform for England to dominate the upcoming 10 test matches. #6yearsofhurtforAustralia

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Post by KP_fan Mon 24 Jun 2013, 4:17 pm

GSC wrote:Sheer act of desperation.

I think you are hoping that this is an act of desperation.

To be honest Aussie cricket hit rock bottom in India and in CT.......and it can only go up from here.

and getting solid team spirit is the quickest way to push them 2 or 3 levels up from the rick bottom where they are now.

Good move.....if they solve the infighting and have a good dressing room spirit...half the battle is won
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Post by NickisBHAFC Mon 24 Jun 2013, 4:47 pm

It's just stupid, i really can't understand it. Might as well give us the ashes now Smile

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Post by Galted Mon 24 Jun 2013, 5:01 pm

His record in tests with Aus was actually pretty good (very good if you exclude the 0-4 in India), can only imagine it's because of continued player unrest.  I did think he should be sacked after the fiasco with players being required to compile presentations on tactics though.
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Post by msp83 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 6:30 pm

I thought what happened in India was way over the top. Even if they were trying to give a message, the management had to take responsibility for letting the situation develop that far. And when Warner punched Root and the episode developed into a massive embarrassment, reports starting comeing out that Warner was in fact one of the problems in India, the fact that Michael Clarke talked him up as a leader, and that the management tried to play the incident down in the immediate aftermath didn't place the management in a good light. I think Clarke is equally responsible, but for now he has got away with it, and Arthur had to take it all on himself. I am no fan of highhanded coaches, but I have my sympathies with Mickey Arthur.
England as such are a better side going into the test series, a divided change room would have further diminished the Australians. So if Lehmann can bring in a sense of unity to that changeroom, perhaps this move, panicky and harsh for sure, might turn out to be good.
And hopefully Michael Clarke would also learn the right lessons and understand that captaincy is not just about scoring runs and trying to be proactive on the field, its very much about management, knowing when and where to give the players the space they need, and get the team to play for him with spirit. He has got away with it for now, but if this series goes out of control, then that might in fact finish Clarke as captain.

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Post by JDizzle Mon 24 Jun 2013, 7:11 pm

KP_fan wrote:
GSC wrote:Sheer act of desperation.

I think you are hoping that this is an act of desperation.

To be honest Aussie cricket hit rock bottom in India and in CT.......and it can only go up from here.

and getting solid team spirit is the quickest way to push them 2 or 3 levels up from the rick bottom where they are now.

Good move.....if they solve the infighting and have a good dressing room spirit...half the battle is won

I didn't realise team spirit was that important. Surely if Micky Arthur is a better coach than Lehmann then he is better off involved? Whistle

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Post by GSC Mon 24 Jun 2013, 7:49 pm

JDizzle wrote:
KP_fan wrote:
GSC wrote:Sheer act of desperation.

I think you are hoping that this is an act of desperation.

To be honest Aussie cricket hit rock bottom in India and in CT.......and it can only go up from here.

and getting solid team spirit is the quickest way to push them 2 or 3 levels up from the rick bottom where they are now.

Good move.....if they solve the infighting and have a good dressing room spirit...half the battle is won

I didn't realise team spirit was that important. Surely if Micky Arthur is a better coach than Lehmann then he is better off involved? Whistle

They sacked him 2 weeks before the Ashes, this is desperation trying to get some kind of reaction.
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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Mon 24 Jun 2013, 8:27 pm

It's sort of like what Sunderland did with DiCanio in the Prem. Sort of.

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Post by kingraf Mon 24 Jun 2013, 8:49 pm

In cricket, where each team has a batting coach, fielding coach, Bowling coach, selection panel, video analyst, masseuse, barber, towel boy, waterboy, Bed-maker, social media advisor, and evening co-ordinator, I would say team spirit rates higher than the coach's ability. Australia, though is a little different, because the coach is also a selector, so you would think you want a cricket brain rather than a motivator.
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Post by KP_fan Tue 25 Jun 2013, 8:44 am

Lehman's first words.....focus is simply all the members pushing towards the same objective
and he credits IPL for falling in love with coaching Smile
 To me this one action alone (actually two in one actions).....replacing arthur with Lehman and taking away the selection rights from Clarke....has significantly enhanced Australia's prospects this Ashes.
 
Lehmann's cultural remedy for Australia
Daniel Brettig in Taunton
June 24, 2013
 

CA Marketing Contracts & Mickey Arthur Sacked 160391.2
Darren Lehmann has said the enjoyment factor is important for his players ©️ Getty Images
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Australia's new coach Darren Lehmann has pushed the importance of fun and a balanced perspective on life to remedy a team culture that has variously been described as toxic, insular, selfish, undisciplined, and just plain stupid. Lehmann has openly desired the national coaching job for quite some time, but given that it has fallen into his lap a mere two weeks before the first Ashes Test, his initial message to the touring team could not afford to be elaborate.
Upon the squad's arrival in the medieval town centre of Taunton, Lehmann sat down his players and staff to set out a simple but clear direction for the Australian team, both on the field and off it. Relieving the tension of the past few days in Bristol and London was high on Lehmann's list of priorities, while also ensuring focus shifted instantly to Wednesday's tour match against Somerset.
"Hopefully with the enjoyment factor, we'll get that going for a start," Lehmann said of the culture he wished to create. "When you start winning games you have a lot of fun so we need to start winning some games, simple as that. It's about getting all the lads and everyone in a direction we want to go. We're going one way and that is forward and everything starts afresh.
"It's about life as well, it's a game of cricket. It's important we have success and play well but it's a small part of your life, so we've got to make sure we are helping them grow their lives on and off the ground, that is really important to me. Family is a big part of it, enjoying each other's company while we're away, and learning about ourselves and different cultures and different people we have in the team.
"I'd be lying if I said it wasn't a job I loved and wanted to do because I fell in love with coaching the first day I started with an IPL franchise. It just probably happened in different circumstances that it comes across my path right now."
 
When referring to numerous matters of club versus state versus country issues, Australia's team performance manager Pat Howard remarked last summer that "no-one owns the players now". Lehmann though spoke with typical confidence about sculpting the natural talent at his disposal into competitive, thoughtful and loyal cricketers.
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Post by KP_fan Tue 25 Jun 2013, 12:23 pm

Michael Vaughan on Lehman's appointment:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/international/theashes/10139966/The-Ashes-2013-Darren-Lehmanns-appointment-makes-Englands-task-much-harder-says-Michael-Vaughan.html


The surprise was the sacking of Australia's coach Mickey Arthur.
I felt they would give him this summer to put things right but it is another good move.
For the first time in months I believe that Australia will pose England a threat now that Darren Lehmann is in charge.
There was a division in the camp. I wrote that last week.
Arthur could not control the players and they lost respect for him.
But the players will respect Lehmann. He is a larger-than-life character, straight talking and a good man-manager.
Do not be fooled by his history of liking a drink and a smoke. He is tough. He will tell people home truths.
I know because he is one of the three biggest influences on my career.
He encouraged me to be positive, to run hard between the wickets, to take on big shots to intimidate bowlers and to be an aggressive captain.
He taught me to enjoy playing the game and talking about it after play.
He will do all that with this young Australian team.
He knows he has not inherited the greatest group of Australian players but he knows if you are a strong group, with everyone buying into the culture, you can surprise teams. He does not have time to change techniques but he can change attitudes.
It is clear the Australians were not enjoying their cricket but he will make sure the environment is healthy.
He will tell players if they have a problem to bring it out in the open. The slate will start clean, but he will know that some of them have to change.
He will grab them one-on-one and tell them to improve.
Australia have been wasting mental energy on peripheral nonsense. He will break down barriers, clear up old issues and, if that is not possible, move people on.
Lehmann is shrewd and knows the kind of cricket required to be successful in England from his Yorkshire days.
Kevin Pietersen was the best player I played with for England but Lehmann was the best at county level.
He was a genius. OK, he was playing against county bowling, but he never denigrated the game.
He respected it and would listen to everyone, including the younger players.
He will encourage the lads to have a beer and discuss things. It will be old school.
I do not think he will be into ice baths but there will be plenty of ice for the cans. It is different from the modern way, but it is refreshing when you see coaches creating spirit and camaraderie.
He is Aussie through and through. He will give you a volley every now and then but bring humour to pressure situations.
That is what you need on a tour to England, one of the hardest in world cricket.
Lehmann will break the game down: win every session, ask his bowlers to build pressure with maidens and his batsman to realise when to attack and when to defend.
He will give players the a chance to make their own decisions.
In time, if they keep making the wrong decisions, he will get rid of them.
The best coaches in the world draw an extra 15 per cent out of you. A bad coach building a bad atmosphere can ruin you by 15 per cent.
Look at Shane Watson. He is a terrific cricketer and one I would want to build a team around.
But he is disillusioned and feels an outsider. That is down to atmosphere.
Lehmann will get him playing again. He will talk about the collective but tell each player his role.
From an England point of view I am starting to worry about Australia.
If they had not made this change, England would have steamrollered them.
I now think Australia have a chance, perhaps not in England this summer but in the return series.
By then, Lehmann will have had time. He is not a wizard and it will come down to Australians playing better cricket, but Lehmann will give them the platform to do just that.
Times have changed.
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Post by Duty281 Tue 25 Jun 2013, 12:26 pm

Michael Vaughan is the font of all cricketing knowledge. I remember after 1 test against India in the autumn he said:

"It's now absolutely official ... This England side cannot play Spin ... 4-0 is definitely on the cards...."

And we know how that turned out! I think Australia will just be looking for some solid performances in England. I don't think they'll believe they have a good chance of winning the series - they will instead target the return series in Australia as a winnable one.

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Post by KP_fan Tue 25 Jun 2013, 12:36 pm

^ I also think that england will win this series.....but the 5-0 annihilation that Australia's infight threatened at one stage is probably averted towards a 2-1 or 3-1 type scoreline
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Post by msp83 Tue 25 Jun 2013, 12:49 pm

Interesting observations from Michael Vaughan there. It is for sure that the likes of Shane Watson didn't feel wanted in this Australian setup, and although its largely down to Michael Clarke, the coach could have played a more constructive role and Arthur failed. With Clarke's role getting limited significantly, perhaps Lehmann would be able to get the team united and striving collectively towards set goals.
But the England batting unit is better than that of the Australians, and Graeme Swann and James Anderson's experience makes them the better of the 2 quality bowling lineups. So Lehmann or no Lehmann, Australia should find this England side to be a serious challenge.
But if they manage their A game, there are weaknesses to be exploited in this English lineup. With Joe Root more than likely to open for the first test, England will be going in with a new opening combination. Root is a player who has impressed everyone and adapted his game to different situations, and I won't be surprised if he produces the goods at the top as well. But What he has managed up to now is that he provided the middle order with solidity, and solved the issues at the number 6 position that has been a bit of a weakling for England for some time before his debut. With him moving up the order, there is the question of him adapting, but there is the greater problem of the number 6 position. Jonny Bairstow is a good player with a good future, but
he needs to attain greater consistency to be successful and there are certain technical issues that he has to address for the same. I feel at this stage, serious pace and good spin can trouble him. There is not much of a spin threat from Australia to worry about, but in Pattinson, Siddle and Starc, there is some good quality pace bowling.

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Post by kingraf Tue 25 Jun 2013, 1:28 pm

But what exactly has Shane Watson done to deserve having a team built around him? An average of 35 with the bat and 30 with the ball suggest he is one of those "Bit of both, not much of either" all-rounders. His talent may warrant more, but at this stage in the play, thats what he is. Michael Clarke has been an outstanding skipper, and rightfully deserves to have the team built around him.

Australia simply dont have the talent in the team right now, simples. England are far from unbeatable, mind. Compton still has question marks, Bell is going through a crisis of placement (havent seen one batsman get out caught of so many balls which hit the middle of the bat) KP has just gotten back. While tue English bowling impressed, Swann is a worry, and Jimmy didnt exactly show that Steyn comparisons were warranted last summer. Broad will take a fiver somewhere in the series, but he hasnt consistently bowled well.

Australia are woefully placed as it stands, but England are hardly riding the crest of a wave.
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Post by alfie Tue 25 Jun 2013, 1:48 pm

Will be very interesting to see which players respond to the change of coach with a quick improvement.  Watson has been all over the place lately so possibly might get his act together. Khawaja maybe ? Had a feeling he was not high on Arthur's list...
But even with some improvement in attitude I think this Australian team is likely to struggle on the tour of England.  They will fight , better perhaps under Lehmann , but I suspect they lack the batting strength to succeed in English conditions.
I notice quite a few cricket and media types here in Australia have pretty much conceded this series to England (very unusual for Australians !) , but are consoling themselves with a much more optimistic view of the following home series , where they feel different conditions , possible wear and tear on England's first choice bowlers as against a larger pool of similar level bowlers available to the home side , and - now - the Lehmann effect having time to work , all might combine to give Australia a good chance of getting the Ashes back at the best time : when the winning team can actually get to hold them for a year or two Smile

Actually plausible.  We'll have a better idea in a month or two

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Post by KP_fan Tue 25 Jun 2013, 1:57 pm

let's compare  the strength and weakness of Australia assuming Clarke plays:
 
---3 quality fast bowlers in Siddle + Starc+ any one more
--a good bowling allrounder in Watson...and if Watson can deliver his peak batting then a good for average 45 batsman
--Clarke....a world class batsmen
--Haddin or wade......a competent batsman WK
 
those are 6 places where man-to- man Australia can compete with England.
 
the one spinner slot is defnitely where Australia will lag
 
so that leaves addtionally  4 batters...where England has positive differential in their favour...
 
--so total 5 slots where man to man Eng is ahead of Aus
 
***for Aus to win they would need
 their competitive 6 to be performing at their top upsides
OR
England's 5 better slots to be consitently underperforming ***
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Post by msp83 Tue 25 Jun 2013, 3:20 pm

KPF, I have a feeling Prior actually is a head of either of Australia's wicketkeeping options.

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Post by msp83 Tue 25 Jun 2013, 3:23 pm

Cowan
Watson
Rogers
Clarke
Khawaja
Smith
Haddin
Starc
Siddle
Pattinson
Lyon.
That lineup could offer England a decent challenge.
If Watson doesn't deliver in the first couple of games, then bring Warner back in, and perhaps look at James Faulkner as the all-rounder.

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Post by Pal Joey Tue 25 Jun 2013, 3:47 pm

I'd drop Watson down the order and make Clarke bat at 3. When Warner gets his head back together... make him open with Rogers. I'm not a huge fan of Cowan as you know but he's got to hang  around the crease more than he has been and try and build a big score.

I just think Watto is not opening material, never has been. He'd be more suited to bully the old ball after a decent total is on the board... if that's at all possible. Also, we'd need him to turn his arm with the ball so no chance of his "I felt tired opening the batting after having just bowled in the last innings" excuse. He needs to toughen up and take more responsibility because he's been molly-coddled for too long already. If he breaks down yet again, then yes... get Faulkner in quick smart.
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Post by JDizzle Tue 25 Jun 2013, 3:55 pm

Clarke at 3 is a big risk. In all liklihood Jimmy will get a wicket with the new ball and if you get Clarke in early and get him then a fragile Aussie line up becomes paper thin. I'd keep him at 4, with Watto opening as that's the only place I've actually seem him score runs although I haven't seen much of him in Tests. At least he generally saw off the new ball against England last time.

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Post by Pal Joey Tue 25 Jun 2013, 4:15 pm

No JD, I reckon Clarke should have enough mettle to see off Jimmy in his first couple of spells with the newish ball. That should be his objective. He's more likely to succeed than Watson, who with his paltry average, would be even more likely to expose the middle order anyway. I'd like to see Watson play a similar role to Michael Hussey when the top order has done it's job.

Is that right? Jimmy has only 12 wickets @45 v Australia in England?
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Post by JDizzle Tue 25 Jun 2013, 4:21 pm

True, the school of thought always has been your best player bats at three and Clarke is without doubt that for Aus, but I'd prefer to keep him where he's scored all his runs especially when the top order looks better (Rogers, Cowan, Watson, Warner) than a middle order which would contain maybe Watson, Khawaja and Smith. I don't think Watson has the ability to do what Hussey did, nurdling the old ball about in the middle overs has never been his strength.

Wouldn't surprise me. Aus did score a lot of runs last time they were over here at Cardiff, Headingley and second innings at Lords and Edgbaston. He is most certainly a better bowler than then now though.

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Post by Mike Selig Tue 25 Jun 2013, 4:51 pm

Linebreaker wrote:
I just think Watto is not opening material, never has been.

That's the only place where he has anything resembling a reasonable average though...

I can't see Watson as an option anywhere other than as an opener TBH. He doesn't score enough big knocks to play at 3 or 4, and he doesn't manipulate the ball well enough to play 5 or 6 - even as an opener he eats up too many dot balls - so he'll just put loads of pressure on the other end.

Rogers has surely played his way into a starting position, and I'd bat him at 3 - clearly technically competent enough and his record suggests he can play a substantial knock. Then Clarke at 4 (there are very few teams nowadays I would say who play their best bat at 3 in test cricket), Smith at 6 and whoever of Khawaja or Warner switches himself on for 5 (I'm not convinced by either).

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Post by KP_fan Tue 25 Jun 2013, 5:31 pm

Watson and Clarke are the biggest stars in the Aussie line-up...Clarke Proven and Watson on potential to take the game away.

The've gotta be played where they are most likely to score runs........whihc means Clarke at 4 ...shileded a bit from the fall of the wickets to the new ball.......and Watson at 5 or 6.....where he can bash the day light out of eng's 3rd seamer and spinner and be also there to face the 2nd new ball.
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