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Confederations Cup

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Post by Crimey Sat Jun 15, 2013 8:05 pm

First topic message reminder :

Just kicked off and Neymar has scored a wonder goal to kick the competition off. A very good way of proving some doubters wrong I suppose.

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Post by Guest Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:50 pm

That's my draw bet done!

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Post by The Special Juan Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:53 pm

Indeed, I don't see Messi going anywhere, even though he is getting on a bit compared to Neymar Wink

Buffon's been very under par this tournament as Pearce + Lawro are saying. Last major tournament for the great man?
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Post by GSC Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:55 pm

Neymar will know he's going to be second fiddle to Messi
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Post by kingraf Sun Jun 23, 2013 3:25 am

Just as well he signed with Barca rather than Madrid. He was going to smell the bench halfway through the season. I mean... Ronaldo vs Neymar at this point in the play is still pretty obvious. While Messi vs Neymar is also obvious, I would imagine they are occupying different areas on the pitch, and I don't think Messi minds as much sharing the ball, and by extension, the goal tally.
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Post by compelling and rich Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:52 pm

one thing this tournament has shown is that buffon is on the slide and italy need to replace him, was a great goalkeeper probably third best I've seen (behind schmeichel and van der saar). 3 of those brazil goals he was at fault for, not solely his fault but two of them he parred them out right into the danger zone instead of turning them round the corner. 

and some may think im harsh on this one but its a big pet hate of mine that keepers let so many free kicks in on their side. it was a great strike by neymar but if buffon sticks to his side and makes neymar try to get it up and over the wall he catches that free kick. i see so many free kicks scored like that these days im not actually sure what goal keeping coaches are teaching. from short range free kicks if a player is good enough to get it up and over the wall then fair enough, its very rare we see it. pirlos free kick was awesome but was from much further out so gives more time for a keeper to see it and get across. just so happens that, that keeper dived out the way.

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Post by GSC Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:54 pm

compelling and rich wrote:one thing this tournament has shown is that buffon is on the slide and italy need to replace him, was a great goalkeeper probably third best I've seen (behind schmeichel and van der saar). 3 of those brazil goals he was at fault for, not solely his fault but two of them he parred them out right into the danger zone instead of turning them round the corner. 

and some may think im harsh on this one but its a big pet hate of mine that keepers let so many free kicks in on their side. it was a great strike by neymar but if buffon sticks to his side and makes neymar try to get it up and over the wall he catches that free kick. i see so many free kicks scored like that these days im not actually sure what goal keeping coaches are teaching. from short range free kicks if a player is good enough to get it up and over the wall then fair enough, its very rare we see it. pirlos free kick was awesome but was from much further out so gives more time for a keeper to see it and get across. just so happens that, that keeper dived out the way.

Possibly some bias there Wink
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Post by compelling and rich Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:06 pm

you could say bias, i prefer to say that i have seen the most of them week in week out to know how good they truly were Whistle

not sure i see any keeper getting close to those three anyway, possibly khan was up there. never been overly impressed with casillas. good keeper but not great and not as good as those ive mentioned. just very lucky to play for two of the greatest sides ever that he very rarely has any keeping to do


Last edited by compelling and rich on Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:07 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Crimey Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:07 pm

I think people might be overreacting with Buffon, one poor tournament doesn't make a player really. 16 clean sheets in 32 games last year in Serie A, only conceded 19 goals. Obviously the defence takes some credit, but that is world class. 

He's made a few mistakes this tournament but Italy in general have actually been pretty disappointing.

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Post by GSC Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:09 pm

I think Buffon is on a another level to VDS to be brutally honest. VDS carved out a career as a good reliable keeper, but Buffons been great.
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Post by compelling and rich Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:10 pm

Crimey wrote:I think people might be overreacting with Buffon, one poor tournament doesn't make a player really. 16 clean sheets in 32 games last year in Serie A, only conceded 19 goals. Obviously the defence takes some credit, but that is world class. 

He's made a few mistakes this tournament but Italy in general have actually been pretty disappointing.
i haven't really seen much of the Italian league this season so couldnt comment on his club form i was making my judgments from what ive seen for country where he's been poor against japan and brazil


Last edited by compelling and rich on Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:16 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by compelling and rich Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:15 pm

GSC wrote:I think Buffon is on a another level to VDS to be brutally honest. VDS carved out a career as a good reliable keeper, but Buffons been great.
 couldnt argue if you had buffon above him but VDS made things seem so easy. had it all and very very rarely made mistakes. its no coincidence that we broke all records for keeping clean sheets while VDS was in net for us. schmeichel had the ability to the spectacular but also made a fair few mistakes (mostly forgotten about with nostalgia) but for me having seen both VDS was more consistent.   

the only real shame for VDS was he spent far too much time at fulham, if we got him right after PS think we may have had another champions league to our name and VDS would be much more decorated (still has two champions leagues to his name). we had a great team but barthez was a clown and didnt have a decent keeper till he came

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Post by GSC Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:17 pm

I think if I were picking a GK for a season, VDS would be near the top of the list, but if I were picking one for a single game, he probably wouldn't be that high.

Whereas I could comfortably stick Buffon around the top of both.
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Post by compelling and rich Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:24 pm

GSC wrote:I think if I were picking a GK for a season, VDS would be near the top of the list, but if I were picking one for a single game, he probably wouldn't be that high.

Whereas I could comfortably stick Buffon around the top of both.
for me though consistency is one of the best attributes a keeper can have, to use an early example barthez could have his good days but was he as good as VDS, no nowhere near. think what VDS brought was he was so cool, never broke under pressure and had two great feet. could play it back to him on either foot and know he's finding a shirt even under pressure. complete opposite to the pyscho that was the great dane!!

like i said i like buffon and hes right up there aswell but do think VDS is slightly underrated

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Post by GSC Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:26 pm

The very best could combine that consistency with unbelievable shot stopping though. VDS, while consistent, was never the best shot stopper.
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Post by Crimey Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:30 pm

You do have to question why Van Der Sar, if he was so good wasn't snatched up by a bigger side earlier when he spent all those years at Fulham. He's good, but I think Buffon has been one of, if not the, best keepers in the world for over ten years now, three poor games in the Confederations Cup for me don't change that.

I think Italy have been pretty disappointing in general.

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Post by compelling and rich Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:36 pm

not sure why he stayed so long at fulham. i do remember reading something at the time that they chucked loads of wages at him, it was when tigana was in charge if i remember correctly. perhaps it was that

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Post by Guest Sun Jun 23, 2013 3:22 pm

Yeah his move to Fulham was a bit like Cesar to QPR.

If I remember correctly Al Fayed promised to throw serious money at it and build a championship challenging squad. 

Obviously didn't happen that way and he stuck around. Looking at his goals against stats I'd say he did a good job for Fulham and probably earned his move to Old Trafford.

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Post by The Special Juan Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:04 pm

I think UrGay will score more than 10 tonight.
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Post by kingraf Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:43 pm

Nigeria really should at least be level right now.
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Post by ryan86 Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:45 pm

I wonder if Chong Hue will end up in Europe.

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Post by The Special Juan Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:52 pm

Laugh This is quite funny viewing in a sadistic view. Poor Gus.
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Post by GSC Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:53 pm

This really casts a bad light on Brighton really. And that they were dumb enough to do this when he has a platform to air his defense.
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Post by The Special Juan Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:54 pm

I think he's handled that very well and played it pretty cool. Now Brighton look like the bad guy, as GSC says. I wonder if he really will appeal it though.
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Post by GSC Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:57 pm

Brighton have always been the bad guy. The whole point of this taking so long was so Gus would quit and they wouldn't have to pay him off.

Not exactly advertising well for a new manager are they?
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Post by The Special Juan Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:00 pm

I don't know much about the story so I can't really comment on what happened but if Gus didn't know until then, that's just classless. It's something you'd expect present-day Blackburn to do.
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Post by The Special Juan Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:10 pm

Who gets sent off playing against Tahiti!!? What a twonk.
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Post by Dave. Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:13 pm

Stay classy, San Diego Brighton!

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Post by kingraf Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:19 pm

Pretty good goal from Torres to be fair, but Nigeria have been remarkably wasteful in front of goal.
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Post by GSC Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:32 pm

Nigeria would be decent if they could finish
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Post by kingraf Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:32 pm

what a miss. I mean... wow
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Post by The Special Juan Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:40 pm

They need Yakubu. Or Kanu Wink
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Post by GSC Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:42 pm

Musa looks decent
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Post by The Special Juan Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:06 pm

Musa? I've been looking for him all evening as "Moussa" picard He's not having a bad club season either.

That was near enough as clinical a performance as you'll see from Spain. Are people really going to favour Argentina for the cup? Not me, I've learned my lesson about backing against Spain.
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Post by Duty281 Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:12 pm

Predictions for the semi-finals:

Brazil 1-2 Uruguay
Spain 2-0 Italy

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Post by NickisBHAFC Wed Jun 26, 2013 2:58 pm

Brazil 2-0 Uruguay

Spain 1-0 Italy.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:22 pm

Brazil 2-1 Uruguay

Spain 3-0 Italy

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Post by Bull Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:24 pm

Brazil 3-1 Uruguay
Spain 2-0 Italy

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Post by Guest Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:22 pm

Brazil 2 Uruguay 3
Spain 1 Italy 0

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Post by Duty281 Wed Jun 26, 2013 8:20 pm

Uruguay have had a pen saved in the 15th minute. Tense.

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Post by The Special Juan Wed Jun 26, 2013 8:21 pm

Brazil 0-0 Uruguay
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Post by The Special Juan Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:48 pm

Aside from Forlan, I've never really had much time for Uruguay. "Scum of the earth" Whistle

Brazil have hopefully put them in their place but unfortunately they'll get picked apart by Spain.
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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:06 pm

Honestly don't think I've ever seen Hulk do anything bar blast the ball miles wide/over the bar
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Post by monty junior Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:28 pm

GSC wrote:I think Buffon is on a another level to VDS to be brutally honest. VDS carved out a career as a good reliable keeper, but Buffons been great.

Indeed, don't forget Van Der Sar was turfed out at Juventus as soon as Buffon was bought.

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Post by compelling and rich Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:07 pm

turfed out but went on to win more even with wasted time at fulham

all buffon has to his name is 4 league titles while at juve, vds has that at united alone and a champions league medal (to go along with his ajax one) as well as best european keeper twice to buffons 1

i like buffon but do think he gets too much plaudits sometimes as he has always had a very defence heavy team in front of him.

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Post by GSC Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:10 pm

Christ, we're comparing medals for goalkeepers now.
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Post by GSC Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:13 pm

Theres also the 2 Serie A titles Juve got wiped out.

And a World Cup winners medal.

And if you want to be really picky, the 2 saved penalties in a CL finsl shootout to VDS' 1.

Or just that Buffons been one of the best keepers around for the last decade or so, while VDS has been good, not great.
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Post by compelling and rich Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:24 pm

there trophy cabinets would disagree

i left out world cup as its hardly vds fault he was born dutch, you cant choose which country to play for. vds has it rough having that defence in front of him! where as buffon was lucky to have his.

two pens save mean nothing as they still lost where as vds one save was enough to win it

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Post by GSC Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:25 pm

Trophy cabinets, have never, nor will ever, be a measure of how good a player is.
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Post by monty junior Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:28 pm

compelling and rich wrote:turfed out but went on to win more even with wasted time at fulham

all buffon has to his name is 4 league titles while at juve, vds has that at united alone and a champions league medal (to go along with his ajax one) as well as best european keeper twice to buffons 1

i like buffon but do think he gets too much plaudits sometimes as he has always had a very defence heavy team in front of him.

I really think medals are overrated when it comes to comparisons like this but as GSC says Buffon also has a World cup winners medals and has actually won 6 serie A's. He has also been pretty much unanimously one of the world's best since about 1999/2000, I can't remember VDS ever really being classed as anything above very good other than by a United or Fulham fan.

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Post by monty junior Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:31 pm

GSC wrote:Trophy cabinets, have never, nor will ever, be a measure of how good a player is.

Going by such nonsense Nicky Butt> Edgar Davids

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