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Bledisloe Cup: Match Thread

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Post by bsando Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:05 am

Date: Saturday, August 24
Venue: Westpac Stadium, Wellington
Kick-off: 8.30am UK
Referee: Jaco Peyper (South Africa)
Assistant referees:Craig Joubert (South Africa), Lourens van der Merwe (South Africa)
TMO: Shaun Veldsman (South Africa)

New Zealand

15 Israel Dagg, 14 Ben Smith, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Ma'a Nonu, 11 Julian Savea, 10 Tom Taylor, 9 Aaron Smith, 8 Kieran Read, 7 Richie McCaw (capt), 6 Steven Luatua, 5 Sam Whitelock, 4 Brodie Retallick, 3 Owen Franks, 2 Andrew Hore, 1 Tony Woodcock.
Replacements: 16 Dane Coles, 17 Wyatt Crockett, 18 Charlie Faumuina, 19 Jeremy Thrush, 20 Sam Cane, 21 Tawera Kerr-Barlow, 22 Colin Slade, 23 Charles Piutau.

Australia

1. James Slipper (Queensland Reds), 2. Stephen Moore (ACT Brumbies), 3. Ben Alexander (ACT Brumbies), 4. Rob Simmons (Queensland Reds), 5. James Horwill (c - Queensland Reds), 6. Scott Fardy (ACT Brumbies), 7. Michael Hooper (NSW Waratahs), 8. Ben Mowen (ACT Brumbies), 9. Will Genia (vc - Queensland Reds), 10. Matt Toomua (ACT Brumbies), 11. James O’Connor (Melbourne Rebels), 12. Christian Leali’ifano (ACT Brumbies), 13. Adam Ashley-Cooper (NSW Waratahs), 14. Israel Folau (NSW Waratahs), 15. Jesse Mogg (ACT Brumbies)

Replacements
16. Saia Fainga’a (Queensland Reds), 17. Scott Sio (ACT Brumbies), 18. Sekope Kepu (NSW Waratahs), 19. Kane Douglas (NSW Waratahs), 20. Liam Gill (Queensland Reds), 21. Nic White (ACT Brumbies), 22. Quade Cooper (Queensland Reds), 23. Tevita Kuridrani (ACT Brumbies)


Last edited by bsando on Thu Aug 22, 2013 4:57 am; edited 2 times in total

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Post by Taylorman Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:21 am

In terms of experience the ABs have it in spades so much theyre being called...'old'. The oz backline is very raw with 4 of the 7 relative newcomers with a lightweight but promising inside pairing- the obvious target for this one. Luatua stands out as the obvious AB newbie and needs to make his mark. Still not a Mogg fan..hes full of running but lacks something for me. The oz shock factor will be needed here to have any impact on this match.

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Post by maestegmafia Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:26 am

http://cargocollective.com/alternativerugbycommentary/1646981/Listen-Live

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Post by bsando Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:32 am

Agree with ya on Mogg, he does seem to lack something, I can't put my finger on it really. I think he is still very new and simply needs a few more games under his belt.

Interested to see how luatua gets on and the cruden vs toomua battle at flyhalf. I am confident mcmeniman can make a good impact for the wallabies in the backrow.

This match is going to bea classic, I can feel it!

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Post by Taylorman Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:40 am

bsando wrote:Agree with ya on Mogg, he does seem to lack something, I can't put my finger on it really. I think he is still very new and simply needs a few more games under his belt.

Interested to see how luatua gets on and the cruden vs toomua battle at flyhalf. I am confident mcmeniman can make a good impact for the wallabies in the backrow.

This match is going to bea classic, I can feel it!
yup! Sure good to be watching these matches again.

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Post by Ozzy3213 Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:50 am

Wobblies by 4.
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Post by GloriousEmpire Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:58 am

ABs will win at a canter, rusty though they are.

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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:01 am

31- all draw
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Post by Taylorman Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:03 am

good curtain raiser here with Northland and Ranger doing everything to wrestle the shield off he mooloos. 24-22 down with 7 mins left.

Forgot the SA match was in SA... easy win for SA in that case.

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Post by Ozzy3213 Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:07 am

Folau to expose Savea defensively for the winning try.
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Post by Biltong Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:08 am

I don't want to create a stir here, but I don't think Mogg is such a great player.

Sure he can be elusive, and he has a good boot, but for some reason he just doesn't fill me with confidence.
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:11 am

He has apparently missed 40% of his tackles at S15 Level which even at FB where the tackles are difficult isn't very good. If the ABs breakthrough the line, try time. I'd have put JOC or Folau at 15 and Cummins on a wing

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Post by Biltong Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:12 am

ChequeredJersey wrote:He has apparently missed 40% of his tackles at S15 Level which even at FB where the tackles are difficult isn't very good. If the ABs breakthrough the line, try time. I'd have put JOC or Folau at 15 and Cummins on a wing

I think that would likely be safer.
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Post by Ozzy3213 Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:14 am

Biltong wrote:
ChequeredJersey wrote:He has apparently missed 40% of his tackles at S15 Level which even at FB where the tackles are difficult isn't very good. If the ABs breakthrough the line, try time. I'd have put JOC or Folau at 15 and Cummins on a wing

I think that would likely be safer.
But is essentially a defensive tactic. Mogg's strength is in attack, and that is why he is there. McKenzie clearly thinks attack is the best form of defence and I think has picked his team accordingly.
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Post by Biltong Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:15 am

Ozzy3213 wrote:
Biltong wrote:
ChequeredJersey wrote:He has apparently missed 40% of his tackles at S15 Level which even at FB where the tackles are difficult isn't very good. If the ABs breakthrough the line, try time. I'd have put JOC or Folau at 15 and Cummins on a wing

I think that would likely be safer.
But is essentially a defensive tactic.  Mogg's strength is in attack, and that is why he is there.  McKenzie clearly thinks attack is the best form of defence and I think has picked his team accordingly.
Not sure I agree with you Ozzy, I think MOgg is there because Folau isn't the best exit strategy out of your 22. So I doubt whether McKenzie's selection is a more attacking one.
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:16 am

And that's with very few tackle attempts too, so it's not like he's getting close to lots of very hard tackles. That's pretty poor defence, no wonder EM didn't pick Quade if he feels he has to pick Mogg on form!
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:17 am

Eh, the hard call is when Speight qualifies- whom do you drop? JOC, or Mogg? And is Mogg's inclusion linked to Cooper's exclusion or not?
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:18 am

Ozzy3213 wrote:
Biltong wrote:
ChequeredJersey wrote:He has apparently missed 40% of his tackles at S15 Level which even at FB where the tackles are difficult isn't very good. If the ABs breakthrough the line, try time. I'd have put JOC or Folau at 15 and Cummins on a wing

I think that would likely be safer.
But is essentially a defensive tactic.  Mogg's strength is in attack, and that is why he is there.  McKenzie clearly thinks attack is the best form of defence and I think has picked his team accordingly.
With one glaring exception Wink
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Post by Biltong Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:18 am

I think AAC's time is short, Kuridrani and Speight are both devastating runners.
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:21 am

AAC helps hold that line together though, you can't have all your backline as devastating runners, someone has to be able to drive for yards, fix the defence and pass. Attack doesn't just mean being a devastating runner, that becomes easier for the other players if you have someone who can give them some space to work in
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Post by Biltong Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:24 am

amazing to see all four countries having an old head in the midfield.

de Villiers, AAC, Contepomi and Nonu.
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:25 am

Is Conrad Smith not more of an old head than Nonu?
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Post by Ozzy3213 Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:26 am

Biltong wrote:
Ozzy3213 wrote:
Biltong wrote:
ChequeredJersey wrote:He has apparently missed 40% of his tackles at S15 Level which even at FB where the tackles are difficult isn't very good. If the ABs breakthrough the line, try time. I'd have put JOC or Folau at 15 and Cummins on a wing

I think that would likely be safer.
But is essentially a defensive tactic.  Mogg's strength is in attack, and that is why he is there.  McKenzie clearly thinks attack is the best form of defence and I think has picked his team accordingly.
Not sure I agree with you Ozzy, I think MOgg is there because Folau isn't the best exit strategy out of your 22. So I doubt whether McKenzie's selection is a more attacking one.
Sure Mogg has the boot to get them out of trouble, but I am expecting to see Aus running the ball from deep. i can't see them wanting to kick to the AB's back three.
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Post by Biltong Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:27 am

I think he is younger than Nonu by a few years. But yeah, he isn't a young'un
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:28 am

Apparently both the same age
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:30 am

They shouldn't kick to the AB back 3 but similarly the ABs will need to kick out of hand very well- the Aussie back 3 are all great on the counter, Mogg and JOC are accomplished kickers good under the high ball and Mogg with a huge boot and Folau is maybe the best under the high ball in the world
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Post by Biltong Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:32 am

ChequeredJersey wrote:Apparently both the same age
I thought Nonu is 34, should perhaps read up more, eh?
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Post by Ozzy3213 Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:34 am

ChequeredJersey wrote:They shouldn't kick to the AB back 3 but similarly the ABs will need to kick out of hand very well- the Aussie back 3 are all great on the counter, Mogg and JOC are accomplished kickers good under the high ball and Mogg with a huge boot and Folau is maybe the best under the high ball in the world
Precisely, which is why I see both teams trying to keep possession and running it, as giving the oppo the ball is going to be seriously risky today.
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Post by Taylorman Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:34 am

Mogg is still not proven at test level, certainly not the RC level, and its not a given that he will be.

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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:37 am

Could argue the same for Ben Smith though TM Wink
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Post by Taylorman Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:56 am

Possibly, but I've no concerns about Ben Smith whatsoever. Hes been the best back of all 5 NZ franchises this year and has been made to bide his time on the bench for the ABs over the years, always playing solidly. This year he's simply got tougher. Sure its mainly sxv, but Smith I thinks a bad comparison to Mogg, who's looked decidedly flakey at times.

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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:58 am

I was just pointing out that Smith isn't established either. I personally think he's a generally superior player but being excellent at Club level doesn't automatically led to instant comfort at Test level.
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Post by Rory_Gallagher Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:00 am

Any streams guys?

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Post by Artful_Dodger Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:01 am

Sent you a pm Rory.

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Post by Artful_Dodger Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:04 am

(Its Sky Sports 4, link might open on Sky Sports 1, use the side menu to go to 4)

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Post by Rory_Gallagher Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:04 am

Ta, Artful! Very Happy 

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Post by Taylorman Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:10 am

ChequeredJersey wrote:I was just pointing out that Smith isn't established either. I personally think he's a generally superior player but being excellent at Club level doesn't automatically led to instant comfort at Test level.
yes thats a fair call. good start for him though...

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Post by Ozzy3213 Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:11 am

Great start from the AB's.
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Post by Taylorman Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:11 am

great stuff cruden...oz already showing defensive issues out wide.

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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:11 am

May I please get in on that stream too?
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Post by Artful_Dodger Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:13 am

PM sent CJ, scroll down to Sky Sports 4 on left hand menu when it opens on Sky Sports 1.

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Post by wales606 Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:13 am

JOCs defence exposed on the wing too, beautiful from cruden though
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Post by ChequeredJersey Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:16 am

Thanks chap
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Post by wales606 Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:16 am

Unusual errors from the all blacks after scoring, and now they kick out on the full
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Post by wales606 Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:17 am

First of the new scrims internationally....and it's a free kick
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Post by wales606 Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:18 am

Scrum seems better, just needs a straight feed
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Post by Artful_Dodger Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:25 am

Genia made a real mess of that after AAC's break.

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Post by wales606 Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:28 am

Artful_Dodger wrote:Genia made a real mess of that after AAC's break.
Yep, never seen him lose so much composure
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Post by wales606 Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:35 am

2/3 not straight calls, more scrums against the put in ideas the scrum halves figure it out
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Post by Artful_Dodger Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:36 am

Adam Ashley Cooper really causing the All Blacks midfield defence a lot of problems.

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