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Friday Qualifiers

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NickisBHAFC
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Post by Steffan Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:21 am

First topic message reminder :

Here are the fixtures for the UK and EIRE teams:

Group A - Wales v Macedonia (1945 BST)

Group C - Germany v Republic of Ireland (1945)

Group F - Azerbaijan v Northern Ireland (1700)

Group H - England v Montenegro (2000)



My predictions?

Wales and NI to both draw 1-1

ROI to lose 2-0

England to win 3-1

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Post by Duty281 Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:34 pm

FreekShow wrote:
Duty281 wrote:2 people actually agree with me? Shocked 

Might need a lie down!
Banbury United will wipe the smile off your face tomorrow Duty!
We've lost the last 5 league games in a row, conceding at a rate of around 2.5 a game.

I don't really expect much in truth! Wink

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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:34 pm

Steffan wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:steffan- what's your thoughts on this cardiff situation???


Your head of recruitment has been sacked and a 23 year old from kazakhstan has been brought into to replace him that has never had any football experience!

this all happened after the staff had found abnormalities in spending(that you had overspent by 15m!!)
Its a disgrace and I wouldnt be suprised if Malky was not with the club by xmas time

Hope not. More protests outside the Cardiff City Stadium to come I know that much
ta, Get down there mate. I am sure your fans will stick together on this..

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Post by NickisBHAFC Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:34 pm

Had the radio on at work. Sounds like Townsend was class! Glad to see him passionate, maybe Walcott can take tips of Townsend, so he can actually play well for his country and not play crap time and time again!

Cracking result!!!

3 LIONS ON THE SHIRT!

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Post by CFCNick Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:37 pm

Fighting Talk facebook page comment - "Surely ITV have the perfect reason/excuse to sack Adrian Chiles now after his Polish stereotype remark?" To which was replied with "Please do. He is depriving a village somewhere of it's idiot."

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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:38 pm

It was a dream debut nick.. he was effective and threatening from the first minute till he came off.

The acid test will be if he performs the same v poland after being bigged up as the next pele!

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Post by NickisBHAFC Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:40 pm

Very true Mysti!


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Post by Duty281 Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:42 pm

I remember another young winger having a good game for England in a qualifier, where England won 4-1. That was Walcott, and there's been a lot more downs than ups since then.

I would still have Theo as first choice, but Townsend is a fantastic option to have on the bench, and to put pressure on Theo's place in the team. And pressure brings the best out in you.

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Post by NickisBHAFC Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:44 pm

I would have Walcott as first choice, but if he continues to play crap for his country and Townsend continues to bash on the door, then its a no brainier who to start.

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Post by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:44 pm

Duty281 wrote:
John wrote:England were awful first half, improved second half but that's all. result is nothing spectacular, nothing to shout about. This montenegro side should of been dead and buried months ago, shows how bad england have been in this group. The second goal was comical, embarrassing. Other than Jovetic, those players wouldnt even get in a league one team. Townsend this, Townsend that is all im hearing.....c'mon, reality check. Lampard has to go, so slow, ponderous offers nothing now. Cahill is just an accident waiting to happen, cant even pass properly.

Yeah, good result but half the job done. if anything, Lewandowski, obraniak, Piszczek, Blaszczyowski will offer more threat on tuesday.
We had 63% of the ball and 16 shots according to the BBC! Had 3 fantastic chances, and should have had a penalty!

That's awful?
Pick out a small section of my comment won't you. Doesn't surprise me with you though, can't say a bad word about England & your clearly jizzing your pants on the offensive tonight because of one good result. England should have had this group in the bag months ago, Montenegro should never of been in contention for qualifying in the first place. Possession means nothing Duty, guarantees nothing, especially if you don't do anything with it. 16 shots.....3 chances. What does that say? They were poor chances at best. First half we were poor, second half we improved and did what we should of done in the first place. End of. Much, much tougher tasks ahead. We've been saying to be more offensive for months to blow these minnows away but when we qualify for the WC, fully expect the negative Roy tactics to return.

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Post by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:44 pm

What did Chiles say?

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Post by Duty281 Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:49 pm

John wrote:
Duty281 wrote:
John wrote:England were awful first half, improved second half but that's all. result is nothing spectacular, nothing to shout about. This montenegro side should of been dead and buried months ago, shows how bad england have been in this group. The second goal was comical, embarrassing. Other than Jovetic, those players wouldnt even get in a league one team. Townsend this, Townsend that is all im hearing.....c'mon, reality check. Lampard has to go, so slow, ponderous offers nothing now. Cahill is just an accident waiting to happen, cant even pass properly.

Yeah, good result but half the job done. if anything, Lewandowski, obraniak, Piszczek, Blaszczyowski will offer more threat on tuesday.
We had 63% of the ball and 16 shots according to the BBC! Had 3 fantastic chances, and should have had a penalty!

That's awful?
Pick out a small section of my comment won't you. Doesn't surprise me with you though, can't say a bad word about England & your clearly jizzing your pants on the offensive tonight because of one good result. England should have had this group in the bag months ago, Montenegro should never of been in contention for qualifying in the first place. Possession means nothing Duty, guarantees nothing, especially if you don't do anything with it. 16 shots.....3 chances. What does that say? They were poor chances at best. First half we were poor, second half we improved and did what we should of done in the first place. End of. Much, much tougher tasks ahead. We've been saying to be more offensive for months to blow these minnows away but when we qualify for the WC, fully expect the negative Roy tactics to return.
Yes I will pick out a small section of your comment, namely the bit that I wish to disagree with.

England have done what you wanted, to attack, and blow Montenegro away. Yet you still have a whinge.

Lighten the feck up. It's a game at the end of the day.

And it's "you're" Wink


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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:52 pm

tbh didn't think we were awful first half, we were pretty average made some good openings just lack a little tempo, got it after half time
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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:54 pm

John come on mate you truly are going ott negative dude. Blimey us england fans need a bit of enjoyment SOMETIMES!!

Yes in truth we only did what we should have been doing before(you are right in that respect)

I thought we played well first half but montenegro were very organised and got 11 bodies behind the ball.

Lets all cross our fingers that the negative tactics dont return and that this could be the turning point. Dont think i am saying we will win anything, but at least we can be slightly proud of our football for once!

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Post by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2013, 10:59 pm

duty - montenegro were okay, did their job of defending, being the underdogs and being away from home. They also have much less talent at their dispersal compared to england.

oh my god - overly negative. All I said was we were awful first half & don't try and make out you werent having those thoughts at half time because everyone i was watching the game was saying that. I haven't gone off on a massive essay, sprouting negativity everywhere. Olly states we were average, that's not much difference to awful in this day & age in my opinion, especially when England are huge favourites at home, with the a huge difference in quality to the opposition.

Look England won, great. Lets not get carried away.


Last edited by John on Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:02 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Duty281 Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:00 pm

What were Montenegro in the first half then, if England were awful?

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Post by NickisBHAFC Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:01 pm

I can't really comment because i was only listening on the radio, but judging by it and what the commentators and my twitter feed were saying, it did sound like we were awful in the 1st half.

2nd half very much the opposite.

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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:02 pm

John wrote:oh my god - overly negative. All I said was we were awful first half? That's it, I haven't go off on a massive essay. Olly states we were average, that's not much difference to awful in this day & age in my opinion, especially when England are huge favourites at home, with the a huge difference in quality to the opposition.

Look England won, great.
Lighten up bud!

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Post by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:03 pm

John wrote:duty - montenegro were okay, did their job of defending, being the underdogs and being away from home. They also have much less talent at their dispersal compared to england.

oh my god - overly negative. All I said was we were awful first half & don't try and make out you werent having those thoughts at half time because everyone i was watching the game was saying that. I haven't gone off on a massive essay, sprouting negativity everywhere. Olly states we were average, that's not much difference to awful in this day & age in my opinion, especially when England are huge favourites at home, with the a huge difference in quality to the opposition. Also nick is now saying we sounded awful on the radio with some commentators.

Look England won, great. Lets not get carried away.
lighten up, haha.


Last edited by John on Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:04 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:04 pm

What is it that you want? England to turn into Spain overnight?

what will please you?

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Post by Duty281 Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:06 pm

In my humble, slightly p!ssed, overly-English, incredibly biased opinion, England were decent in the first half, but lacking a final ball and a quick tempo. You got the feeling it was only a matter of time before England scored.

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Post by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:09 pm

first half performance of england
Olly - average
Nick - awful on radio
john - awful
duty - decent

If anything, your now coming towards my judgment of our first half. haha, jokers.

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Post by CFCNick Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:09 pm

gazzyD wrote:What did Chiles say?
Apparently Dixon was talking about hoping Poland are crying at full time on Tuesday and Chiles commented something along the lines of hopefully not too bad because he has some building work at home this week.

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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:10 pm

By the way . Stating that we played better second half is actually false

We got a goal which opened the game up which allowed us to score more.

Monte were doing a CL knockout chelsea(11 men behind the ball and did it very well) against us before then and it took a great strike from townsend to give rooney the chance- from that point on - we may have looked better- but we weren't actually any better. Just that our opponents had to change tactics.

ANd if you are so disheartened by this performance i think you just expect way too much from england.

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Post by Duty281 Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:12 pm

You're*

England controlled the first half - were 6/10 in my opinion.

More like 8/10 in the second half though.

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Post by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:13 pm

im not disheartened by the performance, im just glad we're attacking teams now, instead of this rubbish negative 1-0 tactics. I fear we will return to those tactics in the WC group against much, much better teams but as for tonight, bar the first half....it was very promising. I said 'awful' & you lot over-reacted, let's all calm down.

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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:14 pm

I would say and these rankings are based on Hodgson's reign . 7/10 first half, 7.5 second half

The best he has done before is a 6/10

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Post by Duty281 Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:16 pm

John wrote:im not disheartened by the performance, im just glad we're attacking teams now, instead of this rubbish negative 1-0 tactics. I fear we will return to those tactics in the WC group against much, much better teams but as for tonight, bar the first half....it was very promising. I said 'awful' & you lot over-reacted, let's all calm down.
Awful would be England's first half v Croatia in 2007.

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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:17 pm

John wrote:im not disheartened by the performance, im just glad we're attacking teams now, instead of this rubbish negative 1-0 tactics. I fear we will return to those tactics in the WC group against much, much better teams but as for tonight, bar the first half....it was very promising. I said 'awful' & you lot over-reacted, let's all calm down.
I agree with alot of what you say / I was just shocked by the awful comment. If a goal had gone in earlier the game would have just opened up earlier. We were pressing and trying to score - its tough to do against a team that has the ability to defend in numbers..And although they will never have the skill level to hurt us, they played a pretty decent tactic first half. If rooney had not broken through at that time it may have ended in a 0-0 draw!!

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Post by Ent Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:33 pm

At the end of the day a goal keeping error and a terrible own goal turned a cert 0-0 into a 4-1 win for England.

Best they've played in years but still shows how far behind they are, 1/4 finals then out in Brazil yet again.

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Post by mystiroakey Fri 11 Oct 2013, 11:36 pm

well I wouldn't go that far ent- but a 0-0 was possible as i stated if that first goal didn't come at the 49th minute- however we did attack and we did try to open them up, We haven't in the past. Yes Hodgson was pushed in to this. But lets hope it will stick anyway!

Be positive!!! (well i am anyway)

ANd it's nice to watch an attractive game for once!!

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Post by Mike Selig Sat 12 Oct 2013, 11:42 am

Credit should be given where it's due. In a must-win game England played their best football in a while and Hodgson (who I have been critical of in the past and who IMO is still not the best man for the job) got his selection and tactics spot on.

Montenegro played defensively as expected and as such were always going to be hard to break down. They may not be the greatest side, but a side who puts men behind the ball and leaves little to no room between their midfield and back lines are always going to be difficult to score against, and with that in mind I really think the criticism that England took 49 minutes to score a goal is unwarranted. It was always going to be easier to break down the defense as the game went on and Montenegro grew tired.

What was heartening to see was that England tried to get through (and usually around) the defensive block by playing good football rather than hit and hope, and even when that tactic didn't yield immediate success they stuck to it, and eventually it worked. In the past we have seen England switch too soon to long ball tactics (or not even try to pass it through and around at all) and rightly been critical of this, so it's only fair to give praise when they do get it right.

For all the positives of course there are some uncertainties still: can England repeat that kind of performance on Tuesday? can they keep playing good football if it's still 0-0 after 60, 70, 80 minutes? can they get around better defensive sides than Montenegro which they will surely have to in the group stages of the WC? what happens when they play sides of equal or better ability?

For now though, half of the job has been well done, easily done even in the scheme of things. It's only fair enough to recognise that.

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Post by mystiroakey Sat 12 Oct 2013, 11:44 am

spot on mike

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Post by Duty281 Sat 12 Oct 2013, 5:07 pm

FreekShow wrote:
Duty281 wrote:2 people actually agree with me? Shocked 

Might need a lie down!
Banbury United will wipe the smile off your face tomorrow Duty!
music T-R-U-R-O,
T-R-U-R-O,
T-R-U-R-O,
Super Truro City!music 

2-1 Truro!

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Post by Guest Sat 12 Oct 2013, 5:13 pm

Duty281 wrote:
FreekShow wrote:
Duty281 wrote:2 people actually agree with me? Shocked 

Might need a lie down!
Banbury United will wipe the smile off your face tomorrow Duty!
music T-R-U-R-O,
T-R-U-R-O,
T-R-U-R-O,
Super Truro City!music 

2-1 Truro!
Laugh  clap 


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Post by Corporalhumblebucket Sat 12 Oct 2013, 5:56 pm

England's passing last night was a lot better and more accurate than on most recent occasions.  Number of times when ball given aimlessly given away not that huge.  I can remember one really bad one from Lampard but not that many others.  Montenegro not that poor a side, certainly looked very well organised in the first half.

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Post by GSC Sat 12 Oct 2013, 7:57 pm

England were ok to good, improved from their usual standard. Nice to see them actually command the ball against lesser nations, than cower behind the ball and hope for 0-0.

Still work to do before they reach Brazil though, Poland will be no mugs. Will be a lot of pressure tuesday if they dont start well
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Post by dummy_half Sun 13 Oct 2013, 11:34 am

I'm worried - I agree with Duty's ratings a few posts up - we were 6/10 in the first half and 8/10 in the second (would have been 9/10 other than for the sloppiness leading to Montenegro's goal).

The first half showed how difficult it is even for a decent side playing quite well to break down a side with reasonable quality content to sit back with 10 men behind the ball. Oh, and the referee allowing so much holding and shoving on set pieces didn't help - most times the ball in wasn't actually overhit, just that the runners were held back from getting to the right areas.
It did highlight one weakness in the team Hodgson picked, in that Gerrard and Lampard aren't able to carry the ball past their immediate opponent, so struggle to disrupt the defensive organisation - I think Wilshere would have made more difference in the first half.

Once we'd scored and Montenegro had to play a bit more, the distribution of Gerrard and Lampard to the wide players became more useful. and we looked dangerous. I was also pleased to see us sometimes being more direct and Hart kicking the ball up to Welbeck's head with Sturridge running behind - 3 or 4 times in the second half it put us in behind the defence with good possession because Welbeck had the beating of his fullback in the air and it menat quick ball. I'm not suggesting it should become our only tactic, but it is something that does help raise the tempo and negate the effectiveness of a packed defence.

OK, we had a slice of luck for the second goal, but Welbeck and Sturridge combined nicely down the right in the build-up and had got the Montenegro defence running back towards their own goal and there's always the chance of a defender slicing the ball in an attempt to clear.

Townsend though had a great game - his ability to go past his man and stretch the defence was the key tot he first goal (and to a couple of England's better chances in the first half) and his goal was excellent. Needs to work a little on crossing with his right foot, so that he has the option of going outside to the byline as well as cutting back and linking or shooting, but there is some promise.

Only change I would be tempted to make for the Poland game (other than either Jones or Smalling coming in because of Walker's suspension) is Wilshere for Lampard - Frank didn't have a bad game, but neither was he particularly good and he and Gerrard are still too similar (even though as both have aged they've changed their roles in the team). As I mentioned above, Wilshere gives another option for a player who can run with the ball as well as pass it, so can pull defenders out of their set positions.

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