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The Official *England's Journey to Brazil 2014* Thread

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Post by Calder106 Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:35 am

First topic message reminder :

Wilshere out for 6 weeks according to BBC. Hairline fracture on foot. Considering Arsenal have been nursing him through the season because of his ankle injuries I think it would be a risk taking him (not questioning his ability) due to the tight schedule of games.

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Post by owen10ozzy Sat May 31, 2014 6:36 am

The thread should be called 'England in Rio - the truth'

Two goals from set pieces; showing why Baines offers more than cole! Given the vast majority of out goals at finals come from set pieces sensible idea having him. We certainly don't look threatening from anywhere else on the pitch (Sturridge will never be allowed that amount of time on the ball against the better teams)

Once more a performance devoid of ideas and any real plan as to how to break down what is a very poor team.

Rooney should be dropped; don't care what people say he hasn't shown anything on the international stage since 2004 to suggest he is a player who can 'single handily change a game' which is what people always say. By playing him Hodgson is failing to get the best out of Sturridge ..who needs a true striker alongside him like Suarez at Liverpool...whilst also nullifying the potential impact that the likes of Wilshere, Barkley and Lallana could all have by playing in the '10' role instead of him!

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Post by skyeman Sat May 31, 2014 6:38 am

The manager and players hopefully. Just no urgency from the starting 11.

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Post by Guest Sat May 31, 2014 6:39 am

owen10ozzy wrote:

Rooney should be dropped; don't care what people say he hasn't shown anything on the international stage since 2004 to suggest he is a player who can 'single handily change a game' which is what people always say.

I've been banging this drum for a while now. Not that anybody feels the beat mind.

Still gonna bang it.

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Post by Ent Sat May 31, 2014 6:40 am

I'm a united fan but can't disagree on Rooney.

Never rated him In that role, beat to go with someone else if they are playing 4231.

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Post by skyeman Sat May 31, 2014 6:40 am

Biggest cheer of the night. For a paper plane Very Happy 

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Post by Guest Sat May 31, 2014 6:47 am

Sturridge MOTM because everyone else, bar Hart, was simply appalling.


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Post by skyeman Sat May 31, 2014 6:48 am

It can only improve, a plus side.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler Sat May 31, 2014 6:48 am

Wilshere, Barkley and Lallana are now being ruined by Rooney playing. That Rooney, hes got nothing on two lads who cant play there for their club and a player from mid table.

Classic. If its not what you want then we're allowed to take all the negatives in the world, but if there are positives its a nothing game and they're all paedophiles or something anyway.

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Post by compelling and rich Sat May 31, 2014 6:50 am

ive been banging on about rooney for ages, playing like this for united and pretty much everyone on this board shot me down!!

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Post by Guest Sat May 31, 2014 6:51 am

I've been banging longer

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Post by mystiroakey Sat May 31, 2014 6:52 am

I think saying everyone has been rubbish bar Sturridge and hart from the starting 11 is harsh on Wellbeck. As allways puts a shift in and is the forgotten man.

Wilshire looking ok from the subs as has sterling

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Post by compelling and rich Sat May 31, 2014 6:53 am

John wrote:I've been banging longer

my dads bigger than your dad!!

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Post by skyeman Sat May 31, 2014 6:54 am

Wellbeck did a lot of running but his touch was poor tonight.


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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Sat May 31, 2014 7:00 am

Rooney scored 7 goals in qualifying, one bad friendly and he's the worst player since Kevin Davies
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Post by skyeman Sat May 31, 2014 7:01 am

Spain 0-0 Bolivia at HT. Maybe too critical early on then.

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Post by Guest Sat May 31, 2014 7:02 am

Olly wrote:Rooney scored 7 goals in qualifying, one bad friendly and he's the worst player since Kevin Davies

Michael Ricketts likes this.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Sat May 31, 2014 7:05 am

skyeman wrote:Spain 0-0 Bolivia at HT.  Maybe too critical early on then.
SACK THE WHOLE SPAIN TEAM, INIESTA WHATS HE DONE RECENTLY 

Or a sense of perspective, these friendlies mean eff all barring getting a bit of match sharpness/fitness and trying to avoid injuries
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Post by mystiroakey Sat May 31, 2014 7:05 am

Spain and friendlies mean nothing. 

Anyway. Set piece is key for us. But for me that is only going to work with wingers like sterling who wins free kicks and corners for fun. Wellbeck as good as I think he is at putting the effort in and holding the ball up from pings forward doesn't offer that potential for free kicks.

Great player when you want to protect a lead , but not so much when you Are going forward . Good enough striker though but wouldn't get ahead of Sturrudge or Rooney in the no. 9.. Rooney showing he isn't quite up to standard behind the striker.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Sat May 31, 2014 7:09 am

One day Gabriel Clarke might ask an interesting question

One day
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Post by Guest Sat May 31, 2014 7:16 am

The Uruguay v Northern Ireland game is on the BBC red button at 12.30 am for all you insomniacs and latesters.


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Post by mystiroakey Sat May 31, 2014 7:21 am

Cheers freak. Will watch

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Post by compelling and rich Sat May 31, 2014 7:27 am

Olly wrote:Rooney scored 7 goals in qualifying, one bad friendly and he's the worst player since Kevin Davies

yet goals against san marino and montenegro make him world class i presume?

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Post by NickisBHAFC Sat May 31, 2014 7:35 am

Amazed with the negativity tonight. Didn't watch the game myself, i was working late, but we won 3-0!!!

Lets get right behind the lads.

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Post by Duty281 Sat May 31, 2014 7:40 am

Looks like I did need some Kleenex after all, Theo so lovely with those gorgeous brown eyes of his and that heart-melting smile. I just want to tuck him in and....yeah best not.

As expected, England did not play with anywhere near the intensity that they will in two weeks time - I really don't know what people expect sometimes; England to charge around at 100%? Never in a friendly.

I did like the shape that England played, it's the best one for Roy's lads, and the willingness to pass the ball out from the back. Henderson-Gerrard was a good combination, the former showed good energy and passing, I just wish the latter would be a little more patient. Peru were negative, and showed little ambition, so it would always be difficult to break such a stubborn team down.

Lallana made good runs off the ball, England's best player for me, and interchanged well, and mixed it up suitably. To get the full effect from that, though, you'll need Sterling on the other wing, not Welbeck.

Rooney was lethargic, and still didn't look match-fit to me. Will hope for better in Miami, but it's only a quiet concern at the moment. Sturridge came up with one moment of brilliance which is always integral.

Hart sharp and alert. Baines very lively. Johnson needs better composure on the ball, and more pace in getting back into position after an England atack is over. Good to see Jagielka make it through unscathed.

Overall, it went as well as can be expected. Hope for a step-up in the games in Miami, before the real thing starts. I still hope to see the likes of Barkley, Wilshere, and Oxlade given some extended game-time before the tournament starts as well. 3-0 probably flattered England a touch, but the result was the least important thing on the night.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Sat May 31, 2014 7:40 am

compelling and rich wrote:
Olly wrote:Rooney scored 7 goals in qualifying, one bad friendly and he's the worst player since Kevin Davies

yet goals against san marino and montenegro make him world class i presume?
No pretty sure I didn't say that...

Just saying he hasn't been doing that badly in qualifying, one bad friendly doesn't overshadow that
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Post by compelling and rich Sat May 31, 2014 7:47 am

Olly wrote:
compelling and rich wrote:
Olly wrote:Rooney scored 7 goals in qualifying, one bad friendly and he's the worst player since Kevin Davies

yet goals against san marino and montenegro make him world class i presume?
No pretty sure I didn't say that...

Just saying he hasn't been doing that badly in qualifying, one bad friendly doesn't overshadow that

wellbeck also scored pretty well in qualifying, dont see many jumping to his defence. 5 of those 7 goals were against extremely weak teams. my whole argument of rooney not playing well then popping up scoring tap ins or pens like he has for united isn't really dis-proven by just stats aswell

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Sat May 31, 2014 7:50 am

compelling and rich wrote:
Olly wrote:
compelling and rich wrote:
Olly wrote:Rooney scored 7 goals in qualifying, one bad friendly and he's the worst player since Kevin Davies

yet goals against san marino and montenegro make him world class i presume?
No pretty sure I didn't say that...

Just saying he hasn't been doing that badly in qualifying, one bad friendly doesn't overshadow that

wellbeck also scored pretty well in qualifying, dont see many jumping to his defence. 5 of those 7 goals were against extremely weak teams. my whole argument of rooney not playing well then popping up scoring tap ins or pens like he has for united isn't really dis-proven by just stats aswell
Welbeck did alright tonight I thought, he always does for England

You can only score against what's put in front of you, and considering most of the teams in the group are "extremely weak teams" he's obviously gonna score the majority against them if they make the most of the group!
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Post by Duty281 Sat May 31, 2014 6:41 pm

Uruguay scraped past Northern Ireland 1-0...wow, so this is England's formidable Group D opponent?

Oh wait, it was only a friendly and the result was largely irrelevant. I doubt if their fans reacted in the same manner as some of ours on this board did.

Two weeks till Italy...

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Post by Dave. Sat May 31, 2014 6:44 pm

An under strength Northern Ireland might I add.

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Post by Duty281 Sat May 31, 2014 6:51 pm

Steven Gerrard has said England will peak against Italy, whilst Sturridge was a bit disappointed at England's lack of match sharpness.

For the game against Ecuador next Wednesday, which will be a step up in quality and conditions you feel, Roy has confirmed that Oxlade-Chamberlain and Jones will start. It seems likely that Shaw will be starting as well.

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Post by Guest Sat May 31, 2014 7:36 pm

Yeah, Ecuador will see Roy use the rest of the squad & then he will use the Honduras game, to select his starting eleven, with the weeks tactical work done & the squad being further acclimatised. That will be the game to really judge where we are at, as a team unit & physically in those conditions.

I think we've heard Gerrard say the side will peak before every major tournament, maybe this year will be different, but I don't have much confidence in them.

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Post by Duty281 Sat May 31, 2014 8:52 pm

I hope Barkley, maybe Wilshere, plays in the number ten role on Wednesday. But even if Barkley does well there, Hodgson won't have the nerve or the bottle to drop Rooney against Italy.

If only...

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Post by mystiroakey Sat May 31, 2014 9:00 pm

Yeah yep agreed duty. 

Tbh I would start Wilshire alongside Milner in the middle and Barkley no 10.
But Gerard like Rooney seems to be undropable.

Sterling has to start over welbeck as well.

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Post by Duty281 Sat May 31, 2014 9:06 pm

It's rumoured that England's next captain, after Gerrard, will be Wazza. I rather hope it's Joe Hart, otherwise Rooney will be undroppable for the next four years.

Ross Barkley and Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain are the two with the greatest potential in this squad, in my opinion.

I would love Barkley to get a go at ten in the next game, play a blinder, and really make Roy think. Oxlade's already confirmed to be getting a start; hope he plays well, he's the future after all, not Lallana or Welbeck.

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Post by Ent Sat May 31, 2014 9:17 pm

Think welbeck gets a rough time from people- he plays the role he is given perfectly IMO.

Lalanas place is more under threat, thought he offered little last night.

Rooney is a proven goal scorer but he's useless as a true no 10, hasn't got the craft/ability for it. I'd seriously consider dropping him if this is the formation to be used. Amazingly after finally getting gerrard and lampard out of the area he likes to drift into England stop playing him in his strongest position.

Henderson offers very little, Johnson is very poor and a liability.

Other than that standard friendly performance, lack of pace at centre half exposed a few times but offside trap should be tightened up by Italy.

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Post by mystiroakey Sat May 31, 2014 9:20 pm

Ox is the future, but your dream Walcott will be first choice when fit. And the way sterling is progressing he could outclass them all. He isn't one dimensional. He has it all. Threw balls, crosses, speed, dribbling. He is the real deal.

Walcott could end up playing striker and I hope he does, but that's no certainty.

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Post by mystiroakey Sat May 31, 2014 9:21 pm

Ent wrote:Think welbeck gets a rough time from people- he plays the role he is given perfectly IMO.

Lalanas place is more under threat, thought he offered little last night.

Rooney is a proven goal scorer but he's useless as a true no 10, hasn't got the craft/ability for it. I'd seriously consider dropping him if this is the formation to be used. Amazingly after finally getting gerrard and lampard out of the area he likes to drift into England stop playing him in his strongest position.

Henderson offers very little, Johnson is very poor and a liability.

Other than that standard friendly performance, lack of pace at centre half exposed a few times but offside trap should be tightened up by Italy.
Not from me. I rate Wellbeck , but IMO we need to play the attacking wingers. Welbeck is perfect on the wing when we want to shut up shop.

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Post by owen10ozzy Sat May 31, 2014 9:21 pm

Like a few people said last week; the team is already decided bar 2 positions maximum regardless of what Hodgson says.

His comments regards Rooney's match sharpness and whether he has any considerations to make about his strikeforce confirm that it is Sturridge & Rooney to start against Italy.

Like I said last night; I haven't seen Rooney produce on the highest stage for England since 2004...i.e. major tournaments or against top class teams. I don't think he suits the number 10 role as he often finds himself dropping to far back to be the link man between midfield & attack..

Lallana has showed his class and creativity in that role time and again this season (yes he starts left at times but he rarely stays wide instead coming in and playing in that role)...also think Barkley & Wilshere & even Oxlade would play that role better than Rooney.

Sturridge has to have someone playing alongside him or constantly in behind him to get the best out of him; like Suarez at Liverpool....

Hodgson either has to drop this '10' role entirely and just play 2 strikers (tell Rooney to stop running round like a headless chicken and stay up top) or drop Rooney all together and play someone more natural in the role.

I like England's shape and creativity/pace going forward in the last 20 mins last night; funnily enough when the likes of Stones, Wilshere, Barkley & Sterling were on the pitch...

Would like to see the following start against Ecuador;

Hart

Flanagan/Stones Cahill Jagielka Baines

Gerrard Wilshere

Sterling Lallana/Barkley Oxlade

Sturridge

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Post by Duty281 Sat May 31, 2014 9:57 pm

The main problem for me with Rooney is that he isn't direct enough. He doesn't run at defenders enough...or at all last night. You want your second striker, your number ten, to do exactly that.

Wilshere and Barkley will give you just that very option; a skillful directness at the heart of the opposition. I would favour Barkley more because he's more of a goal threat than Wilshere.

Owen - That's exactly the team I'd like to see on Wednesday, but with Jones at RB and Barkley at ten. I think Roy will have to make the seven man cut by Monday at the latest, and Stones and Flanagan will probably be culled by then.

Mysti - Walcott faces very tough competition on his return from injury, as the depth and quality of England's wingers is very good.

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Post by compelling and rich Sat May 31, 2014 9:57 pm

the problem england have had for years is the undroppables, the likes of gerrard and lampard have been forced in, when they couldnt play together. owen, rooney and beckham been forced to play not fit rather than give someone else a chance. and none of them get dropped despite there form. the likes of rooney, lamps and gerrard have been poor for england the majority of there career

but with managers with no balls it wont happen, nor because they would get crucified by the British media if they did drop them and we got beat

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Post by mystiroakey Sat May 31, 2014 10:20 pm

If Cahill performs he becomes captain for me. He will become undropable in a good way and I prefer the main centre back as the captain.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler Sat May 31, 2014 11:21 pm

I do find it funny that Rooney is the centre of this storm. I would question the midfield two and Sturridge last night. Sturridge got his goal but his movement was nowhere near what I'd expect, Henderson and Gerrard seem to offer little ingenuity. I feel like Rooney has to play deeper to help move the ball better and because we'll be overrun in midfield if he doesnt.

I also thought Lallana showed nothing more than glimpses, as did Welbeck, but its more fashionable to like one currently.

However, I'm also reasonable enough to have seen it as a dull friendly against a team with little to no ambition, our players a few weeks removed from football in a game with no intensity. Rooney is one who always looks a bit slower in his first steps back from a rest so I will expect more.

What we did do is keep the ball reasonably well and probably played, in that regards, in a way we'll need to be good at in Brazil due to the heat. I also think that whilst the quality of opposition will drastically improve, the team will probably play sharper when they have opponents who come at them.

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Post by skyeman Sat May 31, 2014 11:43 pm

Last chance really for Rooney to show just why he is called a World class player. On the big stage it rarely happens.  Please give us the Rooney of Euro 2004.

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Post by Guest Sat May 31, 2014 11:44 pm

Issues
-Gerrard & Henderson looked so open, when the opposition countered. Reason why Liverpool concede so many goals, they don't offer protection & Gerrard's legs are gone. Even with possession, they offered nothing & is the reason Rooney continues to come deep to provide the creativity these two are failing to produce.
- Lallana offers no pace down that right hand side, continues to come inwards & cramps up Rooney & everything just breaks down. Lallana also offers no protection whatsover for Johnson, hence why Glen looked appaling last night, when Peru countered. Welbeck on the other side is the example of how you work that position & offer offensive work & defensive support to Baines. Issue is, can Sterling do the kind of job Welbeck does because I'd rather have Sterling's pace & width on the counter, than Lallana's possession oriented play.
- Rooney? I'm hoping he's just not sharp yet but last night just reminded me of Algeria four years ago, no touch, sloppy, lethargic & just a mess all-round. No relationship with Sturridge whatsoever. It's a big worry.
- Jagielka? Still looks sluggish after so long out. Couple of mistakes last night, would of been costly vs top centre forwards that we will face. Lack of pace is another issue.

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Post by NickisBHAFC Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:10 am

mystiroakey wrote:If Cahill performs he becomes captain for me. He will become undropable in a good way and I prefer the main centre back as the captain.

This.

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Post by NickisBHAFC Sun Jun 01, 2014 5:39 am

Watching world cup bloopers on ITV one. Im LOL already. Brilliant.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:38 am

Cahill is a year or two of development away from being replaced in the England side by Stones and Jones.

I'd give it to Rooney. Can only be good for him mentally and he's got bags full of experience. I think the younger players are more likely to look up to him too.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:45 am

Imagine the meltdown on this board if we'd just drawn 0-0 with Ireland
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Post by Guest Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:48 am

and sturridge had broken his leg.....

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Post by Duty281 Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:52 am

If Roy gives the captaincy to Rooney then he'll also send the message that he's undroppable for the next two years. England should be looking for options other than Rooney after 10 years of him having untouchable status in the England team. The only other player that seems to be sure of his place, and with good reason, is Joe Hart, and he appears to be a commanding presence, so I would give him the captaincy after this World Cup.

In all truth, I wouldn't be surprised if Rooney retires after this World Cup from England duty. He's always had the air of a fellow that thinks internationals aren't his cup of tea. If that does happen, and one must assume that Gerrard and Lampard will be retiring after this tournament, that will be the final end of England's "Golden Generation".

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