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Ryder Cup predictions.............

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 22 Sep 2014, 12:18 pm

First topic message reminder :

USA 15 - Europe 13

European top points scorer - Rory Mcilroy.............

European Lowest Points scorer - Lee Westwood....

USA Top points scorer - Jim Furyk.............

USA Lowest points scorer - Webb Simpson........

USA 8 - 8 Europe going into the singles......


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Post by beninho Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:33 pm

Has anyone said that he has a detrimental effect on the team? His record is ok, not terrible, 4 and half points less then Westwood both in 33 matches. Which is not much in the whole scheme of things, i would not say it is hysterically poor. In fact it is a hysterical overeaction to say it is hysterically poor...

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Post by beninho Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:38 pm

that was based on up to 2012, so i need to revise..westwood now has 21 in 37, still not much better really then Woods record.

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Post by kwinigolfer Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:41 pm

ben,
But by his own Number One standards it's a very poor showing.
At Ryder Cup level he'd be classified as a journeyman, certainly not one to warrant being sent out in every match.
(Westwood's record used to be exceptional but the last three RC's he's probably got a losing record, "past glories" indeed.)

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Post by Davie Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:45 pm

George1507 wrote:Tiger's record isn't that bad.

He's 13 wins, 17 losses and 3 halves. He's lost one singles match.

Nick Faldo has 23 wins, 19 losses and 4 halves, and he's supposed to be one of Europe's best ever players.

The difference between perceived failure and perceived success isn't much.

10 more wins and only 2 more losses doesn't seem a small difference to me

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Post by Davie Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:48 pm

And Woods has a reasonable singles record but pretty poor 4-somes and 4-ball - that is why he gets criticized for his record. Of a maximum 5 pts a player can win in one Cup, singles only counts for 1

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Post by super_realist Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:50 pm

beninho wrote:Has anyone said that he has a detrimental effect on the team? His record is ok, not terrible, 4 and half points less then Westwood both in 33 matches. Which is not much in the whole scheme of things, i would not say it is hysterically poor. In fact it is a hysterical overeaction to say it is hysterically poor...

Of course he is detrimental to the team, take out his singles wins and he's got 9 wins and 16 losses (3 halves) , which means a truly awful record in the team element of the game.

In 28 non singles matches he's won just 10.5 points. A strike rate of just 37.5%

Rubbish team player, and given the number of players he's partnered, you can't say it's down to the other players.

His record is still better than America's number one player though, Gerry Watson.


Last edited by super_realist on Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:53 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by beninho Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:51 pm

Kwini, its not great, and i am not saying it is. Its just its not horrendous as made out. He has clearly been played on reputation, but has always qualified pretty comfortably. Qualifying is based on an individual basis to be a member of a team. Maybe it should just be a flat pick for the captains, and no year long process.

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Post by super_realist Mon 22 Sep 2014, 4:54 pm

He hasn't always qualified comfortably. He's been a wildcard before, and barring "injury" probably would have been this time, despite being a millstone around the Americans neck.

He is literally Ryder CUp deadweight.

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Post by beninho Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:00 pm

He has a record very similar with Mickelson and Furyk. They are playing this time, why is he even being discussed anyway? He has no relevance on this years Ryder Cup.

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Post by super_realist Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:03 pm

THe issue was that 9C absence would be good for the Yanks, but Donald's would be detrimental to Europe.

To be fair, if you get beaten 7 times out of 9, it's not likely that any Yanks will have good Ryder Cup records.

THeir best player in the last 18 years, probably hasn't been much better than an Average European record.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:17 pm

Yes but when Woods was dominating golf.......He still lost tournaments and hit rounds of 70/71 and below....regularly

No golfer in the history of the sport has played well all the time....

Or else guys like Nicklaus would have 30 + majors... If he was as people say the best of his time...

Didn't Brian Barnes beat him twice in a day...and Jacklin draw with him ???

Too harsh...me thinks.

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Post by kwinigolfer Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:29 pm

http://www.pgatour.com/news/2014/09/22/what-it-feels-like-ryder-cup0.html

Nice article here, and right at the end the last comments are by Zach Johnson, a reminder that his record is strong but he's been on three losing teams, never a winner.
A lot will depend on the quiet guys of the US Team, Johnson, Kuchar, Walker - if they play well there could be trouble.
Whereas our TOP guys (Rose, Rory, Sergio, Stenson, Kaymer) are absolutely crucial.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:35 pm

Kuchar has been a dead loss..................Especially in the singles.....

On paper he should have beat Westwood easily last time.......Then he got smashed off Poulter in 2010....

Johnson bagged a good win over McDowell last time...

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Post by Hibbz Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:45 pm

I'm predicting a hideous amount of fist pumping, shouting and puke inducing faux passion.

I dislike intensely the way some players, who for 51 weeks of the year behave in a decent and respectable manner, feel the need to behave like bell#nds during the Ryder Cup.

That doesn't include Poulter, he behaves like a bell#nd all the time.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:47 pm

I want to see passion Mate...........I want to hear cheers.......I want to hear screams and I want to see the hideous outfits both sets of Wives will be wearing..

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Post by Hibbz Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:49 pm

Cool, I hope you enjoy it. I'd rather just watch golf.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:50 pm

Switch off the TV this weekend........and do us all a favor..

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Post by Hibbz Mon 22 Sep 2014, 5:57 pm

That TV's lost it's taste so try another flavour.
Antmusic, antmusic, antmusic, antmusic.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 22 Sep 2014, 6:12 pm

Hibbz wrote:That TV's lost it's taste so try another flavour.
Antmusic, antmusic, antmusic, antmusic.

This guy's gone nuts...bless him.


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Post by kwinigolfer Mon 22 Sep 2014, 6:32 pm

Hibbz has been listening to too much Dave Matthews . . . . .

What's the betting Watson dresses his guys up in tartans and flat caps . . . . . the wags will likely be in kilts every day.

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Post by kwinigolfer Mon 22 Sep 2014, 7:00 pm

After Rickie Fowler's silly haircut, I wonder if there'll be any more decorative efforts by USA.
A while ago, one of the Tour's tattooed guys, hidden from Ponte Vedra Beach's prying eyes, suggested via Twitter that Bubba had the most tat's on Tour; perhaps he'll get USA tattooed up his arm, across his forehead, you name it.

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Post by super_realist Mon 22 Sep 2014, 7:35 pm

Probably got The Bible all over him Kwini.

I wonder when this tattoo craze is going to end.

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Post by pedro Mon 22 Sep 2014, 8:51 pm

I saw the US RC outfits on the PGA.com website and they are surprisingly cool. Ralph Lauren I think.

Haven't seen the European outfit, but would assume it's horendous 90's style worthy of Borat from Kazakhstan.

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Post by GPB Mon 22 Sep 2014, 9:42 pm

Its Match Play for christ sakes.  You can shoot 67 and lose. and 71 and win.

Poulter went undefeated at Medinah.  Aside from 5 holes on Sat afternoon, he really did not play that well. 

His first foursome match with Rose, they beat Woods and Stricker.  Woods could not find the planet with his driver in that match.  Rose and Poulter were only 1 under and won easily.  I think Ollie and Clarke could have beat Woods and Stricker that match.

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Post by GPB Mon 22 Sep 2014, 9:46 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:After Rickie Fowler's silly haircut, I wonder if there'll be any more decorative efforts by USA.
A while ago, one of the Tour's tattooed guys, hidden from Ponte Vedra Beach's prying eyes, suggested via Twitter that Bubba had the most tat's on Tour; perhaps he'll get USA tattooed up his arm, across his forehead, you name it.

Bubba has been shirtless in the Golf Boys video.  and he went shirtless for the Ice Bucket challenge a few weeks ago.  Unless his hairy chest and back covered up his tattoos (doubtful) he didn't have any tattoos on his torso.

The US Junior Ryder Cup had a good day one against Europe's finest Juniors.  7.5 - 4.5.

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Post by 4putt Tue 23 Sep 2014, 3:05 am

My Ryder Cup predictions.

Thomas Bjorn. Played 2, lost 2. I really hope he only plays two matches. He qualified by playing well early in the season. he's form is not so good now.
Lee Westwood. Played 2, lost 1, halved 1. Played very poorly in last weeks Welsh Open. Suspect short game. If I had to trust my life on someone holing a 4 foot putt I'd rather have Luke than Lee. Having said that I think Lee's a great bloke and will be an asset to team spirit.

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Post by super_realist Tue 23 Sep 2014, 6:57 am

I don't think any player plays less than 3 these days. The captains seem to realise following the Mark James debacle that all players should be involved a lot more than they used to be.
MArk James put Coltart up against 9C in singles, and in no other games.

At the other end, I don't think anyone will play 5 either. So 3-4 will be the norm.

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Post by 4putt Tue 23 Sep 2014, 8:32 am

Ok, then I revise my predictions. Just add another loss onto Bjorn and Westwood. Very Happy

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Post by JAS Tue 23 Sep 2014, 8:37 am

I think the Americans will play their hearts out for Watson and that will be a factor. I.e. It'll reduce the margin of defeat and make it really close...again.

Top scorers
Europe Sergio
US Fowler or Zach

Low Scorers
Europe Bjorn
US Simpson

strange choice of Furyk as top scorer, I think he'll be used sparingly and he has scar tissue, 3 jabbing the 18th at Medina to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Fowler on the other hand is the American I think has made the biggest progress in the last couple of years.

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Post by Sand Tue 23 Sep 2014, 8:38 am

super_realist wrote:I don't think any player plays less than 3 these days. The captains seem to realise following the Mark James debacle that all players should be involved a lot more than they used to be.
MArk James put Coltart up against 9C in singles, and in no other games.

At the other end, I don't think anyone will play 5 either.  So 3-4 will be the norm.

Think that just shows how poor a captain James was. Wasn't Coltart a wild card as well???

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Post by Sand Tue 23 Sep 2014, 8:44 am

Day 1 Practice pairings

McIlroy, Kaymer and Sergio
Poulter, Rose, Gallacher
Bjorn, Westwood, Donaldson
Stenson, Dubuisson, McDowell

Not any surprise for me, I don't see McIlroy and McDowell playing together this week.

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Post by John Cregan Tue 23 Sep 2014, 8:55 am

Sand wrote:Day 1 Practice pairings

McIlroy, Kaymer and Sergio
Poulter, Rose, Gallacher
Bjorn, Westwood, Donaldson
Stenson, Dubuisson, McDowell

Not any surprise for me, I don't see McIlroy and McDowell playing together this week.

The McIlroy/McD pairing has failed over the last 2 RC's so I think it's better it's ended

Opening 4 balls for me would be:

McIlroy/Garcia
Stenson/Donaldson
Bjorn/Kaymer
Rose/Poulter

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Post by pedro Tue 23 Sep 2014, 9:38 am

John Cregan wrote:
Sand wrote:Day 1 Practice pairings

McIlroy, Kaymer and Sergio
Poulter, Rose, Gallacher
Bjorn, Westwood, Donaldson
Stenson, Dubuisson, McDowell

Not any surprise for me, I don't see McIlroy and McDowell playing together this week.

The McIlroy/McD pairing has failed over the last 2 RC's so I think it's better it's ended

Opening 4 balls for me would be:

McIlroy/Garcia
Stenson/Donaldson
Bjorn/Kaymer
Rose/Poulter
Think you are right on two pairings (Rose/Poults, McIlroy/Garcia), but I think the pairings will be based on the who's playing together in the practise rounds. So make it Westy with Donaldson or Bjorn and Stenson/McD. Based on the practice pairings I think Dubie and Gallacher will sit over first session.

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Post by McLaren Tue 23 Sep 2014, 9:40 am

Did anyone else hear the woosie interview on 5 live this morning?  He was talking about the captains responsibilities and listed picking the design of the bag as one of them.  To which the presenter responded "and also making sure there are the correct number of clubs in the bag".  Woosie responded pretty poorly.
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 23 Sep 2014, 10:15 am

Mickelson/Bradley
Furyk/Kuchar
Watson/Simpson
Mahan/Fowler..

Foursomes first I take it ??

Mcilroy/ McDowell ....
Poulter/Rose
Stenson/Duboissen
Westwood/Garcia

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Post by Bob_the_Job Tue 23 Sep 2014, 10:17 am

kwinigolfer wrote:After Rickie Fowler's silly haircut, I wonder if there'll be any more decorative efforts by USA...

Just when I had been starting to respect and rate him...
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Post by Sand Tue 23 Sep 2014, 10:40 am

Fourballs first Trussman.

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Post by hend085 Tue 23 Sep 2014, 10:47 am

i suspect Simpson/Mahan/top5 to play very little. cant see them playing first session. i think westwood might only play 3 times for Europe. hopefully Donaldson plays 4 games. hes been great all year unlike many others.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 23 Sep 2014, 11:09 am

Prefer the foursomes first.....

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Post by Shotrock Tue 23 Sep 2014, 2:20 pm

Super - Certainly don't want to hijack this thread, but as we await for balls in the air later this week, here's a rankings list I suspect you'll enjoy (never seen the old course down so low ...)

http://www.golfjournal.de/travel/plaetze/die-100-besten-golfplaetze-europas/?no_cache=1&cid=5429&did=2942&sechash=55e4b229

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Post by super_realist Tue 23 Sep 2014, 2:26 pm

Can't say I disagree with that Shotrock.
Take the history away from the Old Course and it's nothing remotely special as a course.

It's a decent course, but it's not major class, too easy, not enough interesting holes.
Just flat out dull at times.
Glad to see it down at 30.

The Old Course is to golf courses what TUrf Moor is to football, lots of history, but not exactly a top class venue.

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Post by longgame Tue 23 Sep 2014, 4:35 pm

Furyk wont be top point scorer whatever odds you have at the bookies il give you better on that.
Yes he is consistent but he hasn't won for 4? years.

Putting has killed him this season - his consistency owes to the fact he is very straight and hits lots of greens.
Iv played the PGA at Gleneagles and even off the black tees (which are shorter than what the pros will play from) it is a bit of a beast as you get little to no run on shots.
Furyk doesn't fizz the ball off the club either like most pros - his ball flight is more "ploppp" than penetrating so I cant really see any argument for him being top point scorer.

My predictions will be:

Europe 15.5 - USA 12.5

European top points scorer - Justin Rose

European Lowest Points scorer - Dubuisson

USA Top points scorer - Fowler

USA Lowest points scorer - Speith

9.5 - 6.5 going into singles for EU


I will expand on a couple of those picks.....
Rosey has been massively overlooked I think. he is likely to play all 4 doubles and has had a solid season (looked tired at the end) also a very steady mental game which is key in match play.

Speith (for the opposite reason to rosey) will be my pick for worst American. Has had a terrible 2nd half of the season and whilst youth can be blamed, he has butchered a couple of tournements earlier in the year when leading or right up there, due mainly to a poor mental approach (I remember when he missed the green on the par 3 in TPC - his reaction from there and attitude over the next few holes cost him a chance at winning that)

The americans have more "natural" pairings - Phil&keegan, Bubba&webb but I think man to man EU are better.

personally I would have Gallagher out first on day 1 - the noise will be immense and I think if he put some blue on the board it would create huge momentum, if he loses - no bigger - he is a rookie and expected to lose as the lowest player on the team

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Post by sirbenson Tue 23 Sep 2014, 7:13 pm

Looking forward to it, think the USA will just edge it slightly.

Hope for McGinley's sake that's not the case.

If either of this combo are paired together...Mcilroy/Garcia or Poulter....I don't know how I can quite support them tbh

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Post by sirbenson Tue 23 Sep 2014, 7:26 pm

The Mcilroy and McDowell feud is real in my eyes.....they obviously won't say that.

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Post by super_realist Tue 23 Sep 2014, 7:28 pm

I don't really understand how it is they are supposed to have fallen out?

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Post by pedro Tue 23 Sep 2014, 8:33 pm

Rory suing McD's mgmt firm. Don't know the details but McD has admitted it did strain their relationship, but that "all is fine now". Hmmm wouldn't run the risk if I was McGinley plus their record is not that great.

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Post by 1GrumpyGolfer Tue 23 Sep 2014, 9:44 pm

As part of the case McIlroy has asked to see McDowell's records with the Mgmt firm. Can't say I would be too happy at that if I was McDowell.

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Post by GPB Tue 23 Sep 2014, 10:45 pm

Oliver Brown of the Telegraph writes that Fowler's haircut is "thuggish jingoism".  A haircut!  I wonder how long it will take Ollie to get the knot out of his knickers.

 http://www.geoffshackelford.com/homepage/2014/9/22/telegraph-on-rickies-haircut-exhibition-of-thuggish-jingoism.html

How does a someone misspell "Jimmy"?  "Spieth" is excusable, but "Jimmy"?

http://www.golfdigest.com/blogs/the-loop/2014/09/europeans-begin-mind-games-mis.html

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Post by robopz Wed 24 Sep 2014, 1:03 am

I haven't read through this entire thread.. so if this has been covered above, I apologize in advance...

I don't like the way scoring is "discussed" when talking about individual player records in RC's... the way the matches are scored, being worth ONE point per match is fine... but when discussing individual records the crediting of 1 point to each player in a fourball or foursomes match is kinda whack... bottom line... there are only 28 total points available, but when you total up the individual records it appears as though there are 44.

IMO if you want to more accurately measure what a players worth is to a team... credit each player with 1/2 point for a foursomes or fourball win... 1/4 point each for a half. Then credit the full point for individual wins, or 1/2 point for the half.

But then again... you got to be careful on using just points to judge a players worth. I've just heard too many past captains, and too many RC participants go on and on about what a guy is worth in the locker room or as some kind of inspiration to his team to believe its ALL about the points a guy wins or loses. And then some guy can be on the losing side or not hardly played in the prior matches, but be HUGE to the outcome when its all on the line. Take Kaymer in 2012 for example. He along with Rose get drubbed in the only partner match he plays... but behind Poulter's play for the week... He's the guy who ended up with the match that mattered the most... and he came through.

robopz

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Ryder Cup predictions............. - Page 2 Empty Re: Ryder Cup predictions.............

Post by robopz Wed 24 Sep 2014, 1:20 am

Predictions?   I have NO clue how the matches will turn out.  As we know from past results... it ain't all about who's stronger on paper... but if you ask me... considering the course and the specific players involved... it looks pretty equal on paper anyway.

But there's ONE thing that I think the USA has in their favor this year that they usually don't.  The Euro Captain's have never been reluctant to play a player they perceive as "weak" in only one or two matches.  That's benefited the Euro's because in the past when they had lack of depth, it's allowed them to "hide" at least some of it the first two days... and they've managed the concept masterfully.

While American captains seem to have been trying to play the politically correct "everybody gets a participation ribbon" method... and everybody gets at least three matches.

But I don't think Watson will play it that way at all.  IMO unless some American is just playing horrendously bad... each of the American 12 will get at least 1 start in the first 4 sessions.  But if Tom doesn't see reason to play them more... I don't think he'll feel pressured to do so.   So it appears as though the American's have some players that need "hiding" this year... I think Tom will do just that.  

And what's that old saying... "I was watching the dog when the fireplug peed on me".  Same goes with Ryder Cups...  As so often happens, my prediction is this year it won't be the big stars or names that's the hero of the cup... somebody(s) we don't expect is gonna come out of the woodwork and be HUGE for his team...  and it could be ANYBODY... even guys like Westy or Webb who folks think aren't coming in with any form.  

My guess when it's all said and done... no more than a single match and a half decide this thing...  13-1/2 to 14-1/2... 13-15 flip a coin.... either way... or even 14-14 (which would suck even worse for us cuz we don't need no freeking moral victories, we need a WIN dammit)

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