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PGA Tour: All the Presidents (Cup) Men: Notes from the Ballwasher

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Post by kwinigolfer Wed 03 Dec 2014, 2:57 pm

First topic message reminder :

1).Only exhibitions on this week's schedule so let's look back at an event that has also been charitably described as an exhibition - with the odds heavily weighted towards the organizer.
Ah yes, the Presidents Cup!
The USA comfortably beat the International Team at Muirfield Village in 2013, but the members of each Team have "enjoyed" contrasting fortunes since then.

2).Team USA only have 3 x 2014 PGA Tour wins between them, one (Zach Johnson) in a limited field Tournament of Champions, another (Kuchar) by holing a 72nd hole bunker shot and Hunter Mahan's back-from-oblivion Barclays win. What have you done for me lately Messrs Bradley, Dufner, Haas, Mickelson, Simpson (altho' he did have a nice 2013 win in Las Vegas), Snedeker, Spieth (but what a final round master class he produced last Sunday in Sydney), Stricker, Woods?
Wonder how the Gleneagles US Ryder Cuppers will fare? Good starts by Bubba and Spieth, that's for sure.

3).The Internationals haven't done much better but Day and Scott had good wins on two Tours, Kings Charl & Louis did the business in South Africa, while Matsuyama proved that a second trip to Muirfield Village, for the Memorial, was the charm. For him at least. Whilst the biggest surprise might have been Angel Cabrera's win at The Greenbrier. Steady regression though from the De's Jonge & Laet, Els, Grace and Sterne, while Leishman flattered only to deceive.
Sterne, incidentally, is tied bottom of the PGA Tour's web.com Tour graduate reshuffle and will struggle to get in to many Tour fields, plus has lost his Top 50 status. The early favourite among tourists to lose his PGA Tour card.

4).The leaders for each Team for 2015, in South Korea, are:
*USA:
Watson, Walker, Kirk, Furyk, Moore, Kuchar, ZJohnson, Spieth, Horschel, Simpson + 2 x Capatain's Choices. (Still not quite sure how these points are accumulated . . . . )

*International:
Scott, Day, Matsuyama, Schwartzel, Jaidee, Leishman, Senden, DeLaet, Oda, Oosthuizen + 2.

5).web.com Q-School Finals kick off next week and European Tour members are voting with their passports, American David Lipsky being the most notable exception. Rikard Karlberg will be there, mini-Tour veteran Seamus Power from Ireland and Stefan Jaeger too, but no other Europeans that I can spot. Lots of Aussies but the days of European Tour golfers coming over for Q-School seem to be over for now. Not surprisingly.


PS: Let's hope we never lose a Tour Golfer in the freakish circumstances that Cricket lost Phillip Hughes. But, if we do, I wonder if a colleague will provide quite the quality of eulogy delivered today by Michael Clarke? What a moving tribute. Wish we had a Cricket Bat emoticon.

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Post by robopz Wed 10 Dec 2014, 5:47 pm

pedro wrote:What's better:
a) No golf courses being build, or
b) Something else
.?
Can we add another choice... c) One I could afford to play... :-)

IMO if Trump is to be criticized (in the golf realm), it's that he's certainly not about "bringing golf to the masses"... not that that's his responsibility though.

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Post by GPB Wed 10 Dec 2014, 5:59 pm

robopz wrote:Wouldn't this be easier if you'd simply respond with your usual tirade against everything Tiger Woods does or has ever been associated with (like you have about TW's course design in the past and like Kwini just did with Trump)


There was no tirade against Woods.  I was just stating an opinion that Woods is not really a golf course architect.  I think of architects as someone that considers topography, climate, soil, etc in their designs, not someone thats puts a bunker here, and kidney shape green there.

I suspect Trump will be more involved with the design than Tiger ever will be.  IMO, Tiger will make two site visits, one to look at the land, and one to open the course (if it doesn't dry up like his other Dubai course).

If Palmer and Player were getting this much attention for designing a golf course, I would say the same things.

Attention => Scrutiny.


BTW, what were GPB's other tirades against his course design business?  Other than the FACT that the one in Dubai and the one in the Carolina mountains never Open.

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Post by robopz Wed 10 Dec 2014, 6:52 pm

GPB wrote:BTW, what were GPB's other tirades against his course design business?  Other than the FACT that the one in Dubai and the one in the Carolina mountains never Open.
Oh come on... I'm not the type to keep "clip files", and maybe "tirade" was the incorrect choice of words, but you've never been one to do anything other than deride TW on his course design issues every chance you've ever gotten.

But you are dead on bringing up "Attention => Scrutiny."  (it's just that there's a distinction between Negativity and Scrutiny)

But scrutiny is going to be very much the case in a week or so when TW's Diamante El Cardonal project opens. TW's issue there is that it sits right next to the most highly acclaimed course design effort to open in Mexico for years, maybe even a decade... the Davis Love III Dunes course.  Tiger's results with El Cardonal are gonna have to be some kind of exceptional to compare favorably along side that one.

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Post by GPB Wed 10 Dec 2014, 7:21 pm

"...TW's issue there is that it sits right next to the most highly acclaimed course design effort to open in Mexico for years, maybe even a decade....."


I guess two months ago is not part of the last decade.


http://www.nicklaus.com/design/quivira/quivira-golf-club-los-cabos-debuts-october-1-2014.php



Geoff Shackleford gushed about it on Morning Drive and wrote this in his blog.

Geoff Shackleford wrote:Exciting times for Cabo San Lucas where they are recovering from hurricane Odile and opening a Jack Nicklaus course ten minutes from town. While Tiger's course reportedly opens next week (according to the select media invited by his people) is a private club and limited to the beautiful people, Quivira is public and offers a green fee structure depending on the time of day you play.

http://www.geoffshackelford.com/homepage/2014/12/8/video-first-look-at-nicklaus-designed-quivira.html



Why do Tiger sycophants have to resort to incredible hyperbole?  Seriously... "Mexico...a decade"?  I guess we forget about a PGATour golf tournament in Cancun about a month ago.  Ever heard of Mayakorba?  El Cameleon?


Why can't they just let his record speak for itself?  w/o hyperbole.  LAST DECADE!!  LMAO


Whistle



Edited:  Misunderstood the post.  You were bragging on DLIII course.  

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Post by GPB Wed 10 Dec 2014, 7:37 pm

Question on the El Cardinale course.

IIRC, Tiger was supposed to go to Mexico for a site visit on the day after the 2008 US Open.

The Monday Playoff with Rocco cancelled those plans. and then the subsequent surgery.

Was the course El Cardonal?  If so...the design process took a total of 6.5 years?  At least 6.5 years because it probably started before June 2008.

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Post by pedro Wed 10 Dec 2014, 10:02 pm

Personally I would think it would be great fun to design a golf course. Why wouldn't most golfers think likewise? (ok, after 10 courses it may become boring, but not the first handful)

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Post by robopz Thu 11 Dec 2014, 2:59 am

GPB wrote:Edited:  Misunderstood the post.  You were bragging on DLIII course.  
Yep... DLIII's course #52 on the Golf top-100 world list...
http://www.golf.com/top-100-courses-us-and-world-2013

Bottom line... TW's course is gonna have a helluva time stacking up next to stature of DLIII's Dunes...

Guess you were wrong... turns out I'm not a Tiger sycophant, but a DLIII Dunes course sycophant instead.... Very Happy


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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 11 Dec 2014, 3:16 am

Didn't think there was enough happening to warrant ball-washer notes this week but I see that Jeff Overton has made an ass of himself and got thrown out of a College Basketball game at Madison Square Garden.
What an idiot - imagine he might be missing from pgatour.com fantasy games for a few weeks.

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Post by robopz Thu 11 Dec 2014, 3:19 am

kwinigolfer wrote:Didn't think there was enough happening to warrant ball-washer notes this week but I see that Jeff Overton has made an ass of himself and got thrown out of a College Basketball game at Madison Square Garden.
What an idiot - imagine he might be missing from pgatour.com fantasy games for a few weeks.
Yeah this is twice now... I guess "restraint" isn't one of Boom Baby's strongest attributes.

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 11 Dec 2014, 3:25 am

I always gave great credit to Overton for coming back so quickly a few years ago after having his appendix yanked, think he was back inside a week.
But this moronic behaviour is getting a bit old.


Meanwhile, another erstwhile Ryder Cupper, Boo Weekley, has the early lead in the Aussie PGA, two shots ahead of Adam Scott among the early starters.

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Post by robopz Thu 11 Dec 2014, 3:38 am

GPB wrote:Question on the El Cardinale course.

IIRC, Tiger was supposed to go to Mexico for a site visit on the day after the 2008 US Open.

The Monday Playoff with Rocco cancelled those plans. and then the subsequent surgery.

Was the course El Cardonal?  If so...the design process took a total of 6.5 years?  At least 6.5 years because it probably started before June 2008.
The course talked about in 2008 was going to be in Punta Brava, way up north closer to San Diego.  It was one of 3 TW's initial projects that never opened...  Dubai partially completed to the point of grassing some holes... High Carolina never got past the raw clearing stage... and Punta Brava never turned a spade of soil.

EDIT: Just found this fairly comprehensive NYT article on TW's earlier design efforts, and why they didn't come about... also some info about the level of Woods involvement in a few of them... http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/03/business/03tiger.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 11 Dec 2014, 3:46 am

Some posters think we make too much of the sycophantic, largely brainless Golfing Press.

But here's an article about "Highs and lows from 2014", and the biggest pic is of a golfer raising a trophy from years gone by:

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/golf-central-blog/stock-watch-highs-and-lows-2014/


Not to mention two Rickie and Rory mentions in the same sentence - could just as easily have been another site.


Weird seizure for Top Five's missus - she is wired whether "on the bag" or on the sidelines. Hope she's OK, but also hope Reed gets himself another caddie.


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Post by McLaren Thu 11 Dec 2014, 10:16 am

Thanks for the NYT article Robo.


I do wonder if Wood's architecture business has just faced the same issues that the golf design industry has seen in the last few years. I would doubt Tiger tried very hard to save the projects but he will not be alone in the world of golf architecture in having 3 projects not see the light of day.

It could just be a sign of the times when having Tiger's name on a course isn't enough to get it up and running? Or Tiger could just be as feckless as he appears.
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Post by robopz Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:47 am

McLaren wrote:Thanks for the NYT article Robo.


I do wonder if Wood's architecture business has just faced the same issues that the golf design industry has seen in the last few years.  I would doubt Tiger tried very hard to save the projects but he will not be alone in the world of golf architecture in having 3 projects not see the light of day.

It could just be a sign of the times when having Tiger's name on a course isn't enough to get it up and running? Or Tiger could just be as feckless as he appears.
Mac... I'm glad I found that article too because it pretty well summed up most of what I heard or read prior on his projects that didn't get off the ground.

Just my opinion.... on one hand... sure... IMO the economy was a huge factor. But on the other hand, so was the very nature of the types of projects he chose to work with... ultra-exclusive and expensive, even by the standards of the uber rich, even more subject to economic factors than "lesser" projects might have been.

But lets get real here... Woods was charging a design fee that was some 3X or more the cost of "signature" projects by the other top architects, so it's pretty clear the larger part of that fee was for his "name" that was supposed to help sell the projects.

So while I would think trying to sell to the higher of the high end buyer might already be between tough to impossible as the economy began to crater, if these projects had a fighting chance to pull it off (which is very unlikely IMO) , those chances went DOA as TW's name was being drug through the mud.

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Post by McLaren Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:29 pm

I hope Tiger got trump to cough up $55 million for their little joint venture.

Also, no surprise that Jack had nothing but bitter comments towards Tigers golf design record so far. I doubt Jack would want is own Design business probed too closely.
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Post by navyblueshorts Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:36 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:robo,
I am totally prejudiced as far as Trump is concerned - such an obvious racist, right-wing sh1thead; just about as nasty an individual that ever soils our TV screens. Thankfully never mine unless his hair pops up on the news.
I hope the very worst for him but imagine all his projects follow the same mantra. Can't remember the exact quote now but along the lines of, "If I owe the bank $1M it's my problem. If I owe them $100M it's their problem." Wonder how that translates in Dubai?

Imagine he got out of his latest Atlantic City bankruptcy scot(sorry s_r)-free - plenty more to come I should think.

Would be nice to see him die destitute.

The World's Worst Man.
EDIT: Tied with Dick Cheney . . . . . .
He's awful isn't he? At least his first name is correct. Laughable that he's claiming it's OK that Dubya knew about the recent CIA methods. What a w*nker.
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Post by Shotrock Thu 11 Dec 2014, 12:47 pm

Mac -- Good point on Jack's design business. Although I never have a bad time on a golf course, I have played a handful of Jack "signature" designed courses. None of them the least bit memorable.

(Still have not been tapped on the shoulder for a round at Sebonack though.)


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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:09 pm

Walked round Muirfield Village for five memorable rounds Very Happy , and that is a fantastic golf course, for the Pros at least. Imagine it would be too demanding to play for hackers like me.

But a "Signature" course locally, mostly done by Jack Jr, is ordinary to say the least.

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Post by incontinentia Thu 11 Dec 2014, 1:58 pm

Good news for Team Ireland's Olympic Golf squad, Paul McGinley was announced as team leader for the 2016 olympics.
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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 11 Dec 2014, 4:44 pm

Minor modifications announced to the FedEx Play-Off points bonus:
Instead of all Play-Off tournaments garnering 5 times the regular season tournament haul (500 for the winner of a run-of-the-mill event) they'll get 4 times, so 2000 FedEx points to the winner.
Inconsequential to 99% of us, but the Players strongly felt that the regular season accomplishments should count for something more than has been the perception.

Still no word on Mrs Top Five.

And inco, that's a pretty sound decision for Irish Golf I would've thought?

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Post by 1GrumpyGolfer Thu 11 Dec 2014, 5:30 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:Minor modifications announced to the FedEx Play-Off points bonus:
Instead of all Play-Off tournaments garnering 5 times the regular season tournament haul (500 for the winner of a run-of-the-mill event) they'll get 4 times, so 2000 FedEx points to the winner.
Inconsequential to 99% of us, but the Players strongly felt that the regular season accomplishments should count for something more than has been the perception.

I'd be curious to see if that would have affected the overall outcomes in previous years; is this the Rory effect? 2 majors and a WGC but no FedEx. Or is this more for the guys who missed out on progress due to enhanced points in the actual play-offs?

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 11 Dec 2014, 5:45 pm

Hi Grumps,
Hope you have less snow than we do.

I think it's more to slow down the sort of impact Stuart Appleby and Geoff Ogilvy had this year, guys like Chez Reavie, Laird, Slocum in years past. But it WILL increase, marginally, the number of golfers who are guaranteed to qualify for the Tour Championship regardless of Play-Off success - in the same way that Dustin Johnson cashed in last year, while under suspension!

Would think it might have mitigated the chances of Haas & Snedeker in their winning years though - haven't done the arithmetic, but almost certainly Haas wouldn't have made it.

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Post by 1GrumpyGolfer Thu 11 Dec 2014, 7:19 pm

Thanks Kwini, just a mild coating of snow for us. We seem to have dodged a bullet with this last storm and I've only had the snow shovel out once this season. No doubt that will change soon...

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Post by robopz Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:08 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:Walked round Muirfield Village for five memorable rounds Very Happy , and that is a fantastic golf course, for the Pros at least. Imagine it would be too demanding to play for hackers like me.

But a "Signature" course locally, mostly done by Jack Jr, is ordinary to say the least.
I had the chance to play Muirfield a few times back when my kid was in school at Otterbein... I was probably high single digits at the time... and found the course most playable and enjoyable from the back, but not tips. Anybody who can get the ball reasonably airborne over the hazards shouldn't have such a tough go with it... you just can't worm-burn it around though...

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Post by robopz Thu 11 Dec 2014, 11:18 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:I think it's more to slow down the sort of impact Stuart Appleby and Geoff Ogilvy had this year, guys like Chez Reavie, Laird, Slocum in years past. But it WILL increase, marginally, the number of golfers who are guaranteed to qualify for the Tour Championship regardless of Play-Off success - in the same way that Dustin Johnson cashed in last year, while under suspension!

Would think it might have mitigated the chances of Haas & Snedeker in their winning years though - haven't done the arithmetic, but almost certainly Haas wouldn't have made it.
Actually Kwini... I think Hass would still have won it because there's still gonna be the same reset. Relatively speaking, Hass probably would have stayed the same or even gained a position going in the final... and since the final will still be playing with the same "scenarios" as before... no change.

Looks to me you nailed it on your first assessment... all this is really going to do is make it marginally harder for the Slocum's who've done little all year to win say the first playoff event and be almost guaranteed top-5 seed and being able to control their own destiny in the final. And it's gonna make it easier for the top-15, to hold onto top-30 spot regardless if they break an egg in the 1st three playoff events or not...

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Post by kwinigolfer Fri 12 Dec 2014, 1:29 am

Adam Scott joins the list of no-shows for the TOC.


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Post by Plunky Fri 12 Dec 2014, 11:11 am

Just read that Adam and the missus are expecting a baby in 9 weeks time !

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Post by kwinigolfer Fri 12 Dec 2014, 12:37 pm

Yup, Says he won't be playing again until the Honda. Hope he goes out with a win.

Tommy Fleetwood leading the way in Thailand, and Branden Grace making up for a wasted year(?) in South Africa.

Willett and Molinari could make the end of year owgr Top 50 interesting . . . .

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Post by robopz Fri 12 Dec 2014, 4:56 pm

incontinentia wrote:Good news for Team Ireland's Olympic Golf squad, Paul McGinley was announced as team leader for the 2016 olympics.
Cool that McGinley has worked himself a free trip to the Olympics and all... but can somebody explain to me why the Irish Olympic Team (or any country) needs a captain? At most they'll have four players, but then only if they had 4 in the top-15 in the world at the time... So for Ireland it will most likely be 2 players, Rory and probably McDowell.

But what pray tell does McGinley do? He doesn't set pairings or tee times, or have any input on the set up of the course... About all he can do is hold the guys head covers while they are warming up and right before they tee off say "Um... go play good, guys".

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Post by robopz Fri 12 Dec 2014, 5:00 pm

Westwood lurking one shot back in Thailand...  Worth 34 OWGR points, this event should be right inside Westwood's wheelhouse. Hard to believe that in his entire career he's earned 50 or more OWGR points in an event only 5 times. 3 Wins in the 50's and 2 second place finishes @60 in majors.  But he's done better than decent cleaning up in these types of events.

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Post by robopz Fri 12 Dec 2014, 5:05 pm

Plunky wrote:Just read that Adam and the missus are expecting a baby in 9 weeks time !
Yep... says he wants to come back at the Honda... but he better hope that baby doesn't need any extra time in the oven... Honda is only 11 weeks away.

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Post by pedro Fri 12 Dec 2014, 9:02 pm

robopz wrote:
But what pray tell does McGinley do?  He doesn't set pairings or tee times, or have any input on the set up of the course...  About all he can do is hold the guys head covers while they are warming up and right before they tee off say "Um... go play good, guys".
Paul: "Rory, 1st hole is a dogleg left with the pin back right. I think you should draw your tee shot but avoid the rough and fairway bunkers."
Rory: "Aye."
Paul: "Ok, I'm off to the beach, son... See you tonight"  appletini

PS. Whoever is the US captain, I doubt he'll bring in Navy Seals to give a motivational speech....

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Post by robopz Fri 12 Dec 2014, 9:27 pm

pedro wrote:
robopz wrote:
But what pray tell does McGinley do?  He doesn't set pairings or tee times, or have any input on the set up of the course...  About all he can do is hold the guys head covers while they are warming up and right before they tee off say "Um... go play good, guys".
Paul: "Rory, 1st hole is a dogleg left with the pin back right. I think you should draw your tee shot but avoid the rough and fairway bunkers."
Rory: "Aye."
Paul: "Ok, I'm off to the beach, son... See you tonight"  appletini

PS. Whoever is the US captain, I doubt he'll bring in Navy Seals to give a motivational speech....
Yes and yes... :-)

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Post by robopz Fri 12 Dec 2014, 9:29 pm

Good News Kwini/Pedro.... if the "sticky" Joburg Open thread can survive up top just a bit longer... it will soon be relevant again... :-)

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Post by Davie Fri 12 Dec 2014, 9:34 pm

robopz wrote:
Cool that McGinley has worked himself a free trip to the Olympics and all... but can somebody explain to me why the Irish Olympic Team (or any country) needs a captain? At most they'll have four players

That's a bit silly isn't it? Not defending the tattie-munchers but you mention any country

Take any "sport" - winter or summer olympics - they all have a captain, director, head coach or whatever you want to call it.

Would a curling team in the winter olympics not have a team manager apart from the players? Would a hockey team or a basketball team or a baseball team (is that still in the olympics?) not have a team manager? I'm trying to avoid the mass participant sports like track and field - you are talking about smaller teams .. but the same applies. Would a rowing pair or four not have a "manager"? Good luck to McGinley I say. As Pedro implies, I'm sure the Yoo-Ess-Ay "team" will have a captain as will everyone else competing

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Post by kwinigolfer Fri 12 Dec 2014, 9:46 pm

Davie,
I think Tom Watson has already been appointed . . . . . Run

Hopefully they'll keep Faldo & Montgomerie well away from Team GB.

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Post by Shotrock Fri 12 Dec 2014, 10:02 pm

Irishman Rory is all that Ireland needs. I could successfully "captain" that squad.

McGinley should be real busy making sure the bags arrive on time, scheduling practice rounds, scheduling press events ... Rolling Eyes

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Post by robopz Fri 12 Dec 2014, 11:04 pm

Davie wrote:
robopz wrote:
Cool that McGinley has worked himself a free trip to the Olympics and all... but can somebody explain to me why the Irish Olympic Team (or any country) needs a captain? At most they'll have four players

That's a bit silly isn't it? Not defending the tattie-munchers but you mention any country

Take any "sport" - winter or summer olympics - they all have a captain, director, head coach or whatever you want to call it.

Would a curling team in the winter olympics not have a team manager apart from the players? Would a hockey team or a basketball team or a baseball team (is that still in the olympics?) not have a team manager? I'm trying to avoid the mass participant sports like track and field - you are talking about smaller teams .. but the same applies. Would a rowing pair or four not have a "manager"? Good luck to McGinley I say. As Pedro implies, I'm sure the Yoo-Ess-Ay "team" will have a captain as will everyone else competing
Davie... I see your point... but this is entirely different situation. In the other sports you mention, for the most part you have "national teams" with captains or federations choosing the athletes who will competing, and captains/coaches directing their training for a good portion of the year (or years) leading up to the games.    But in golf... it's gonna be... OK you're individually ranked... so YOU get in... Captain had ZERO to do with getting the player qualified for the games and ZERO to do with getting the player prepared for the games.  

And there is NO team strategy as it's 72 holes individual stroke play.  So what does or should McGinley have to say to Rory or Gmac as they prepare for the competiton.... The ONLY people who have any business talking to them about their golf, training or strategy for the event are their individual coaches, caddies and trainers they've been with all along... not some "national" organization or captain.  

But I suppose some of the other comments on potential captains duties are valid... don't want to bother Rory or GMac on which ugly shirt to wear or where to get their laundry done... or setting their own alarm clocks... so I guess the Captain and his assistants can handle that... but seems to me "Captain" is a bit of a lofty title for those kinds of duties....

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Post by kwinigolfer Sat 13 Dec 2014, 12:46 pm

Most of the better players in action this week are contending, Scott, Kaymer, Westwood, Fleetwood, Grace, Molinari,Willett, Oosthuizen . . . . . but what's happened to Schwartzel?
Going for a Dunhill hat-trick (and 4th overall) he follows a promising start with a 76, by birdieing the last.

Thought he was on his way to a very special career when he won the Masters, but he's sputtered and struggled recently, especially with his putter. Today's effort looks especially poor.

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Post by kwinigolfer Sat 13 Dec 2014, 1:01 pm

Reports in the US Golfing Press that Fred Couples has been contacted about the US Ryder Cup Captaincy, but nothing definitive about whether he's actually been offered the position.

He'll be 57-ish when the time comes - can't see it meself.

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Post by McLaren Sat 13 Dec 2014, 1:03 pm

I would still like evidence that a captain has any use in a golf event, beyond picking how tees it up when.
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Post by kwinigolfer Sat 13 Dec 2014, 1:22 pm

That's certainly one opinion Mac . . . .

I would say the quality of good captain can make a huge difference, in Ryder Cup matches at least.

Some good skippers lose and some lousy ones win, but if the Captain is worth a couple of points, that's significant.

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Post by Shotrock Sat 13 Dec 2014, 1:31 pm

As Robo points out ... in a 72 hole stroke play event, where the "captain" has absolutely nothing to do with player selection, the role is nothing more than pomp and circumstance.


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Post by McLaren Sat 13 Dec 2014, 1:41 pm

Kwini

All I am rejecting is the evidence (as there is none that I know of) that the captain can increase the chances a team will win.
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Post by McLaren Sat 13 Dec 2014, 1:42 pm

Seal team 6 has chosen couples then?

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/golf-central-blog/report-couples-contacted-ryder-cup-task-force/?cid=twitter-gc-a-report-couples-contacted-ryder-cup-task-force-121214
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Post by kwinigolfer Sat 13 Dec 2014, 1:57 pm

Mac,
If you'd've seen the way Jacklin and his men worked their way round Muirfield Village with their Team, versus Nicklaus behaving like a grand Emporer, putting his metaphorical feet and up and imagining auto-pilot would do the job. And the way things started out, US up in all four matches early on Day 1, Nicklaus must have imagined he was right.

I spent quite a bit of time chatting w/Tommy Horton on the Friday & Saturday and the work that he was doing was an eye-opener. Nicklaus never stood a chance.

So yes, I believe that, for Ryder Cup Matches at least, the Captain is a big deal.

New Year's message to HRH: "Arise Sir Tony".

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Post by super_realist Sat 13 Dec 2014, 2:14 pm

McLaren wrote:Kwini

All I am rejecting is the evidence (as there is none that I know of) that the captain can increase the chances a team will win.

I think a Ryder Cup captain is certainly more important than say the Captain of a Football team. What exactly do they do? It's the most worthless job in sport as far as I can see.

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Post by McLaren Sat 13 Dec 2014, 4:17 pm

looks like somone will be missing from SPOTY

Teenager Charley Hull tops European Order of Merit in Dubai

Easily the most successful British golfer of the year.
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Post by super_realist Sat 13 Dec 2014, 4:52 pm

What a stupid statement Mac

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Post by robopz Sat 13 Dec 2014, 5:11 pm

Hmmm... by posting a rather pedestrian 72, looks like Brendan Grace has made a tournament out of the Alfred Dunhill Championship.

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