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Silly season transfer rumours (continued)....

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Post by George Carlin Tue 14 Apr 2015, 7:48 am

First topic message reminder :

Continuation of the previous thread from the esteemed Mister GeordieFalcon:
https://www.606v2.com/t57129-silly-season-transfer-rumours
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Post by formerly known as Sam Tue 09 Jun 2015, 9:22 pm

I think a number of teams are waiting to see what comes out of the world cup. Any unexpected talent emerges and wants to cash in or any current talent is inexplicably left out of national squads and suddenly wants to move.

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Post by propdavid_london Wed 10 Jun 2015, 2:53 pm

Castrogiovani is leaving Toulon for Racing Metro -
http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_54590,00.html

I guess Maurad will be on the prowl for another prop post WC.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Thu 11 Jun 2015, 3:24 pm

Several props I'd have thought. Hayman has retired and Castro has gone. Maybe he's going to do something different and develop some. Certainly splashing the cash on Castro didn't work.

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Post by Welly Thu 11 Jun 2015, 6:01 pm

Ermm and Matt Stevens and Ma'afu are not big name props Wink

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Thu 11 Jun 2015, 6:13 pm

There's very few quality TH's about at the minute.

If you look at the "world class" bracket you could probably throw in Cole, Franks, Hierra, Zirakashvili and then you're struggling.

Slimani is coming through well for France but Mas is on the decline. JdP is solid but not world class and the less said about Aus TH's the better.

Who could they realistically go for?

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Post by Welly Thu 11 Jun 2015, 6:17 pm

Sgt_Pooly wrote:There's very few quality TH's about at the minute.

If you look at the "world class" bracket you could probably throw in Cole, Franks, Hierra, Zirakashvili and then you're struggling.

Slimani is coming through well for France but Mas is on the decline. JdP is solid but not world class and the less said about Aus TH's the better.

Who could they realistically go for?

Pretty sure all named are in contract. and JDP has signed for Monte.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Thu 11 Jun 2015, 7:07 pm

Ma'afu and Stevens are big...

Sgt, Cole has just signed a new contract at Tigers. If Toulon were willing to pay out the contract (best part of a million) and then pay Cole the 300 to 400k a year he'd demand they could land him. If they have a promising youngster coming through then Stevens and Ma'afu could hold the fort whilst they develop. Big name stars and local talent is what every fan wants to see turn out for their club .

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Post by broadlandboy Thu 11 Jun 2015, 8:01 pm

Even then I don't know if Cole would sign him being a local boy & I believe he quite likes the walk to work( whether that will change when Tigers move their training ground.)

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Post by Welly Thu 11 Jun 2015, 8:09 pm

Cole demands contract release due to having to drive to the training ground :p

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 12 Jun 2015, 10:15 am

Estate agents have field day as Tigers players move en mass to be closer to new training ground.

From what I've heard only the academy will be at the new training base for next season. First team to move the season after.

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Post by George Carlin Sun 14 Jun 2015, 11:38 am

Some youngfeller Wales U20s prop from Carmarthen Quins to Glasgow, apparently. Erm
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Post by 21st Century Schizoid Man Sun 14 Jun 2015, 11:40 am

What about Bismarck Du Plessis and Sam Whitelock to The Warriors GC ? Whistle
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Post by George Carlin Sun 14 Jun 2015, 12:11 pm

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:What about Bismarck Du Plessis and Sam Whitelock to The Warriors GC ? Whistle
That might have only happened in my head.
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Post by The Saint Sun 14 Jun 2015, 12:22 pm

George Carlin wrote:Some youngfeller Wales U20s prop from Carmarthen Quins to Glasgow, apparently. Erm

Send him back in a few years time when he's decent Smile.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sun 14 Jun 2015, 8:25 pm

George Carlin wrote:
21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:What about Bismarck Du Plessis and Sam Whitelock to The Warriors GC ? Whistle
That might have only happened in my head.

Glasgow just won the Pro 12 and had a decent showing in Europe. Surely they need to build on what they have as opposed to blowing the budget on a couple of SH players after a pay day.

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Post by George Carlin Sun 14 Jun 2015, 9:58 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
George Carlin wrote:
21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:What about Bismarck Du Plessis and Sam Whitelock to The Warriors GC ? Whistle
That might have only happened in my head.

Glasgow just won the Pro 12 and had a decent showing in Europe. Surely they need to build on what they have as opposed to blowing the budget on a couple of SH players after a pay day.
I was just thinking wistfully, Sam.

In actual fact, when you look at the movement of players out and in, what you describe is exactly what Toonie is claiming he has done:

Players In
Simone Favaro from Benetton Treviso
Grayson Hart from Edinburgh
Kieran Low from London Irish
Mike Blair from Newcastle Falcons
Sam Johnson from Queensland Reds
Greg Peterson from Leicester Tigers
Taqele Naiyaravoro from NSW Waratahs
Javan Sebastian from Carmarthen Quins

Players Out
Nikola Matawalu to Bath Rugby
Sean Maitland to London Irish
D.T.H. van der Merwe to Scarlets
Dougie Hall retired
Jon Welsh to Newcastle Falcons
Alastair Kellock retired
Murray McConnell to Nottingham
James Downey to Wasps
Tommy Spinks to Jersey
Euan Murray to Pau
Connor Braid released

We have to trust that he's seeing the unpolished diamonds in the game yet again as Matawalu, DTH and Maitland is an awful lot of firepower to be walking out of the door.
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Post by Geordie Mon 15 Jun 2015, 10:37 am

Well I can assure you that though Mike Blair is getting on a wee bit....he's still a class act. A great signing for you...and no doubting he'll be coaching as well..

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Post by Golden Mon 15 Jun 2015, 12:58 pm

Clermont sign Hosea Gear for next season.

O'Connells move to Toulon in doubt over concers about a previous shoulder injury. Pau interested if it falls through.

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Post by George Carlin Mon 15 Jun 2015, 1:09 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Well I can assure you that though Mike Blair is getting on a wee bit....he's still a class act. A great signing for you...and no doubting he'll be coaching as well..
Yes - it's all about getting into coaching for Mike now, Geordie, hence his move to Glasgow.

That and wanting to be around real people from Glasgow and Tyneside, rather than the approximation of Brideshead Revisited cast members that seem to frequent the streets and luxury wine bars of Edinburgh.
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Post by jimbopip Mon 15 Jun 2015, 1:15 pm

George, NoMaits was a junior All Black and World Cup winner as well as top try scorer with a Super 14 team. Not exactly an unpolished diamond was he ?

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Post by George Carlin Mon 15 Jun 2015, 1:36 pm

jimbopip wrote:George, NoMaits was a junior All Black and World Cup winner as well as top try scorer with a Super 14 team. Not exactly an unpolished diamond was he ?
Absolutely - Toonie does accidentally sign a top internationalist occasionally.

I am still waiting for him to make that kind of mistake a few more times before next season, particular on the tighthead prop side where he has seen fit to replace a British & Irish Lion and a mainstay Scotland internationalist (2 different people) with a Wales U20 squad member. No offence, like. I mean, what could possibly go wrong?
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Post by lostinwales Mon 15 Jun 2015, 4:00 pm

James Johnston to Wasps from Sarries

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Post by formerly known as Sam Mon 15 Jun 2015, 4:27 pm

James Johnston is a big salary off the Sarries books. He was purchased at his peak with Quins.

Wasps lose promising seven Gus Jones to London Welsh. Hope he doesn't follow Moriarty into Welsh colours. Bit surprised he didn't feature more for Wasps he was excellent for the under 20s last season.

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Post by beshocked Mon 15 Jun 2015, 5:27 pm

formerly known as sam perhaps Saracens have been told to release some players behind the scenes with of course Strettle leaving too.

Though saying that I wouldn't say Johnston is a big loss at all. The relatively cheap TH Petrus Du Plessis has been performing a lot better - Saracens also have Figallo and Longbottom who could be good when fully fit.

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Mon 15 Jun 2015, 5:30 pm

That leaves Sarries pretty light at TH with Figallo looking a shadow of his former self. Another one in perhaps?

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Post by formerly known as Sam Mon 15 Jun 2015, 9:47 pm

Johnston was big salary minimal impact as Beshocked says they have three tight heads with the cheapest in the best form. Doubt Saracens will chase another tighthead or winger as they have an embarrassment of riches waiting in the wings.

They could well be quietly creeping under the cap.

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Post by HammerofThunor Mon 15 Jun 2015, 11:54 pm

O'Connell has signed with Toulon for 2 years.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/33143831

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Post by thomh Tue 16 Jun 2015, 12:40 am

beshocked wrote:formerly known as sam perhaps Saracens have been told to release some players behind the scenes with of course Strettle leaving too.

Though saying that I wouldn't say Johnston is a big loss at all. The relatively cheap TH Petrus Du Plessis has been performing a lot better - Saracens also have Figallo and Longbottom who could be good when fully fit.

Do you think Johnston will be a big salary off the books, beshocked? There's been some talk among Quins fans that he slightly messed up his contract negotiation strategy when leaving Quins and didn't actually end up costing Saracens that much.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Tue 16 Jun 2015, 9:07 am

At the time he was supposed to have turned down French clubs to sign Sarries. I remember Quins fans being resigned to losing him to a French club with a bigger budget but were vexed he went to Sarries. Sarries wee trying to sign a quality tighthead around that time and had gone in for Cole before hand. They weren't playing with pennies though I doubt Johnston broke any records.

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Post by beshocked Tue 16 Jun 2015, 9:22 am

formerly known as Sam has explained it well.

Also he's right that Sarries have plenty of wing options - all which should all be on lower wages than Strettle bar of course Ashton.

Ashton,Wyles,Fercu,Ellery and the two young academy wingers Earle and Perkins (one ex U20s the other current U20s.

Wouldn't surprise me if someone like Bosch or Brown leaves too.

Neither started in the AP final because they had fallen down the pecking order.

Taylor was preferred to Bosch and Brown fell behind Itoje and Wray.

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Post by propdavid_london Tue 16 Jun 2015, 9:49 am

I would have been happier for Johnston to have come back to Quins than perhaps Adam Jones on a 1yr deal. But I guess Quins are also now spending close to the salary cap with all the other names coming in.

He was starting most games for Quins, so I never felt that he was moving to get more game time. It was obviously the Bucks, or the team holidays.

But, for whatever reason he hasnt really kicked on at Sarries and been bench warming for most of the time. Has he been injured or just out of form and not given a run of games?

Are Sarries going through a cost cutting exercise? Anything to do with recent salary cap inspections/findings that its been decided arent going to be published (for the good of the game).

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Post by George Carlin Tue 16 Jun 2015, 10:05 am

Weren't Brown and Bosch both injured for the final, Beshocked?
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Post by Geordie Tue 16 Jun 2015, 10:07 am

Slightly changing the subject young Leeds TH Paul Hill was outstanding v South Africa in the U20 semi final.

Hasn't he just moved to a Prem club or am I imagining that. I know we have signed his fellow prop LH Harris.

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Post by beshocked Tue 16 Jun 2015, 10:13 am

Wink  propdavid london not sure you can say it's just for the bucks or team holidays. Perhaps Johnston just wanted to play in a stronger team than Quins.

People naively believe that players go to the likes of Saracens and Bath just for money. Not that straightforward - it helps enhance their international career chances, also they want to be involved in semis and finals of major competitions.

To be honest I am not sure the new scrummaging rules have helped Johnston.

As for Adam Jones I am not sure he really fits the so called "Quins way". He's not exactly known for his pace,dynamism and carrying. You want to speed up the game not slow it down.

I do think that Roberts is an ideal signing though.


Don't know for sure if it's a cost cutting exercise but could be.

George Carlin I don't think Bosch was. Unsure about Brown.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Tue 16 Jun 2015, 10:45 am

Ransom as well Beshocked. He could take a turn on the wing and his fullback skills would allow a continuation of the high kicks that Strettle was so adept at fielding.

Sarries will have academy graduates demanding wage increases. Only natural they look to release the older players and try to keep hold of the younger ones.

Paul Hill signed for Saints from Leeds didn't he?

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Post by LondonTiger Tue 16 Jun 2015, 11:01 am

formerly known as Sam wrote:Paul Hill signed for Saints from Leeds didn't he?

Yes.

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Post by propdavid_london Tue 16 Jun 2015, 11:41 am

Hi Beshocked, apologies - I wasnt knocking Sarries, and yes perhaps he just wanted a change - would have also heard positive things about the club from his brother etc. I'm not sure it was about playing in a stronger team, as at the time of his transfer Quins were still a pretty quality outfit, he was getting regular game time too etc.
But Sarries do make a point of showing people how they treat their players....and that has to be a draw for some players. (not saying thats a negative thing though - its actually a very prudent business model).

I agree with you on the Adam Jones front, I'd love to be proven wrong but I have more of an incling that he will be bench warming a lot and brought on when the refs get a bit fed up of Collier of Sinkler etc. Adam Jones with the old engage rules would have been a good bonus though.

Roberts is another good bit of business, as long as Quins get their moneys worth.....Ive seen a lot of comments saying that he may not be available much with injury/international call ups etc. But we will have to see on that front, hes exactly the sort of player that Quins need to attract attention from defenders and make space for the others......Lowe, Charlie Walker, Yarde,Sloan, Brown I expect are all looking forward to working with him.

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Post by beshocked Tue 16 Jun 2015, 12:35 pm

formerly known as sam you're right but Ransom doesn't seem to be trusted by Saracens. I think a change in club might do him some good.

propdavid london the funny thing for James Johnston is that he now has two AP titles under his belt - one with Quins,one with Sarries.

Perhaps he can make it 3 with Wasps. Has any player won the AP with 3 separate clubs?

One good thing about Adam Jones will bring is experience and could be a very useful mentor for Sinckler and Collier.

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Post by propdavid_london Tue 16 Jun 2015, 12:56 pm

Interesting, Did Foden with with Sale and Northampton?
Strettle with Quins and Sarries
Ashton with 2 perhaps - although did he leave Saints before they won.
Youd struggle hard to find guys like Thorn that has won most competitions........apart from the Prem.

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Post by beshocked Tue 16 Jun 2015, 2:16 pm

Yes you're right propdavid. Foden did.

Strettle didn't win with Quins though. Neither did Ashton with Saints.

Wigglesworth has with Sale and Sarries, so has Hodgson now.

Though Wigglesworth must be one of the only players to start in two final victories for two separate clubs. Also he interestingly won the AP final 10 years after doing so with Sale - 2005 and 2015.

Can't think of any players who have done 3 though.

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Post by king_carlos Tue 16 Jun 2015, 5:16 pm

Vermeulen confirmed to Toulon which puts the Saints dreaming to bed.

I also see that the Top 14 transfer deadline passed at midnight. I'm not honestly sure how the rules work there but I guess that they are now not allowed to make any more additions to their squads until after the season starts?

If that's the case it could leave some free agents more likely to be coming to the Jeff next season.

From a Tigers point of view I see that Toby Flood hasn't signed for another Top 14 club following his release by Toulouse.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Tue 16 Jun 2015, 5:28 pm

Top 14 teams can still make medical joker signings.

Flood has struggled in France it's a shame as I thought his style of play could have really suited Tolouse. Not sure he'll be high on the Tigers priorities with two fly halfs already signed for next season. He could come back as a playmaking 12 but that will depend heavily on what plans Mauger has about our midfield going forward.

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Post by Welly Tue 16 Jun 2015, 6:18 pm

T. falateu has reportedly signed for Bath.

Was hearing saints fans saying they had signed a big 8

Saying
Duane
Falateu
Read

Were some of there options considering Reid is still in contract and the lions are coming I can't see him leaving for another 2 seasons.

Options seem to be lowering @8 now.

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Post by B91212 Tue 16 Jun 2015, 7:56 pm

I had heard it was a backrow player but nothing specific saying it was a big 8. Personally was/ am hoping it is an 8 as Manoa will be missed but it could still be a flanker I guess.

To be honest if Bath have signed Falateu then I would be more than happy to see Leroy Houston at the Gardens if he is surplus to requirements at the Rec. Big carrying 8 with a decent work rate and available all season. Can't see it but I can always live in hope!

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Post by B91212 Tue 16 Jun 2015, 7:58 pm

beshocked wrote:Wouldn't surprise me if someone like Bosch or Brown leaves too.
Think I read that Bosch had re-signed for another 2 years recently. Think it was on the beeb website, seem to remember McCall being quoted as saying he is enjoying his rugby again after thinking about packing up at the end of his contract in France.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Tue 16 Jun 2015, 8:57 pm

That's a surprise I thought Bosch would head back to Argentina and play for their Super 15 franchise as there are rumours it will pretty much act as their test team in the short term. Then again Ayerza gave them two fingers and signed a new deal at Tigers and it would down right dumb to exclude him which would then set a precedent.

I assumed Saints would sign sensibly and maybe from the Championship. They are run as a business and it's not like Manoa was on big money. Unless they have a kitty set aside and are looking marquee. Now if Gorgodze is bored of sitting in the stands at Toulon...

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Post by shuren34 Tue 16 Jun 2015, 8:58 pm

king_carlos wrote:Vermeulen confirmed to Toulon which puts the Saints dreaming to bed.

I also see that the Top 14 transfer deadline passed at midnight. I'm not honestly sure how the rules work there but I guess that they are now not allowed to make any more additions to their squads until after the season starts?

If that's the case it could leave some free agents more likely to be coming to the Jeff next season.

From a Tigers point of view I see that Toby Flood hasn't signed for another Top 14 club following his release by Toulouse.

We could still buy two more players after the deadline and any rugby players from the french league (top14 and prod2) without a job.
For Montpellier the official team for the next season is :
Prop:  Mikheil Nariashvili, Schalk Van der Merve, Yvan Watremez, Patric Cilliers, Jannie Du Plessis, Nicolas Mas, Jacobus Adriaanse, Jacobus Roux, Oleg Ishchenko, Clément Castets

These 2 players are only there for the World Cup

Hooker: Bismarck Du Plessis, Charles Géli, Mickaël Ivaldi, Craig Burden, Thomas Sauveterre

Lock: Sitaleki Timani, Robins Tchale Watchou, Thibault Privat, Tom Donnelly, Paul Willemse, Yohan Aliouat , Jacques Du Plessis (could play as flanker).

Flanker:Fulgence Ouedraogo, Kévin Galletier, Wiaan Liebenberg, Akapusi Qera (could play 8), Antoine Battut.

Number 8: Ben Mowen (could play flanker), Pierre Spies, Martin Devergie

Scrum-half: Nick White, Cameron Wright, Benoît Paillaugue.

Fly half: François Trinh-Duc, Demetri Catrakilis, Ilian Perraux (could play center), Ben Lucas (could play centre and fullback).

Centre: Robert Ebersohn, Anthony Tuitavaké, François Steyn (not before february 2016).

Wing: Julien Malzieu, Marvin O'Connor, Benjamin Fall (could play fullback), Timosi Nagusa, Seveci Nakailagi

Fullback: Jesse Mogg, Pierre Bérard (coul play centre), Anthony Floch.


Last edited by shuren34 on Wed 17 Jun 2015, 10:17 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by formerly known as Sam Tue 16 Jun 2015, 9:35 pm

Wow they've signed a lot of southern hemisphere players this off season.

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Post by whocares Tue 16 Jun 2015, 10:04 pm

Shuren, what is the likely 23 players match day squad from Montpellier keeping in mind the tightening of JIFF rules?

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Post by B91212 Tue 16 Jun 2015, 10:11 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:That's a surprise I thought Bosch would head back to Argentina and play for their Super 15 franchise as there are rumours it will pretty much act as their test team in the short term. Then again Ayerza gave them two fingers and signed a new deal at Tigers and it would down right dumb to exclude him which would then set a precedent.

I assumed Saints would sign sensibly and maybe from the Championship. They are run as a business and it's not like Manoa was on big money. Unless they have a kitty set aside and are looking marquee. Now if Gorgodze is bored of sitting in the stands at Toulon...
They could release Bosch I guess with Taylor and Tompkins coming through I guess if that's how Argentina want to play it and I don't think Argentina are dumb enough to exclude just about the best loose-head in world rugby right now. If they are then they needs their heads looking at.

I thought the whole Saints big name signing thing came from within the club itself? Gorgodze would fit with the whole play as many 6's in the team as possible Jim Mallinder philosophy.

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