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France v Ireland, 11 October

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Post by George Carlin Sun 04 Oct 2015, 11:13 am

France v Ireland, 11 October France11France v Ireland, 11 October Irelan11
FRANCE v IRELAND
11 October 2015
KO: 16:45
The Millennium Stadium, Cardiff

Live on [tbc]

Referee: Nigel Owens (Wales)
Touch judges:Wayne Barnes (England) & Leighton Hodges (Wales)
Television match official: Graham Hughes (England)

A. Head to Head

93 Played 93
55 Won 31
7 Drawn 7
31 Lost 55
1508 Points 1084

B. Recent Form

14 February 2015
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
18 – 11 to Ireland

15 March 2014
Stade de France, Saint Denis
20 – 22 to Ireland

9 March 2013
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
13 – 13 Draw

4 March 2012
Stade de France, Saint Denis
17 – 17 Draw

20 August 2011
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
22 – 26 to France

13 August 2011
Stade Chaban-Delmas, Bordeaux
19 – 12 to France

C. Teams

FRANCE
France v Ireland, 11 October French10
15 Scott Spedding, 14 Noa Nakaitaci, 13 Mathieu Bastareaud, 12 Wesley Fofana, 11 Brice Dulin, 10 Frederic Michalak, 9 Sebastien Tillous-Borde; 1 Eddy Ben Arous, 2 Guilhem Guirado, 3 Rabah Slimani, 4 Pascal Pape, 5 Yoann Maestri, 6 Thierry Dusautoir (c), 7 Damien Chouly, 8 Louis Picamoles.

Replacements: 16 Benjamin Kayser, 17 Vincent Debaty, 18 Nicolas Mas, 19 Alexandre Flanquart, 20 Bernard Le Roux, 21 Morgan Parra, 22 Remi Tales, 23 Alexandre Dumoulin.

IRELAND
France v Ireland, 11 October Irish-10
15 Rob Kearney, 14 Tommy Bowe, 13 Keith Earls, 12 Robbie Henshaw , 11 Dave Kearney,  10 Jonathan Sexton, 9 Conor Murray; 1 Cian Healy, 2 Rory Best, 3 Mike Ross, 4 Devin Toner, 5 Paul O'Connell (c), 6 Peter O'Mahony, 7 Sean O'Brien, 8 Jamie Heaslip.

Replacements: 16 Richardt Strauss, 17 Jack McGrath, 18 Nathan White, 19 Iain Henderson, 20 Chris Henry, 21 Eoin Reddan, 22 Ian Madigan, 23 Luke Fitzgerald.


Last edited by George Carlin on Sat 10 Oct 2015, 10:50 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Notch Sun 04 Oct 2015, 11:51 am

GC, you're keen! I'm just going to worry about Italy until later this evening.
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Post by SecretFly Sun 04 Oct 2015, 11:52 am

Give us time to bloody draw breath! The Italy game hasn't even started yet. These long breaks between games in the Jacuzzis will be the death of us. Whistle

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Post by George Carlin Sun 04 Oct 2015, 1:24 pm

Jeez - you moaning bunch of gobsh!tes.
Run
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Post by Marshes Sun 04 Oct 2015, 3:06 pm

Lovig that Irish Wolfhound pick, what's she been in that I would of seen?

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Post by SecretFly Sun 04 Oct 2015, 3:14 pm

She starred as Lassie - heavily made up obviously. Stunning and emotional performance.

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Post by whocares Sun 04 Oct 2015, 6:01 pm

A fecking poodle. I hate these walking bags poo that just destroy our street.

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Post by Notch Sun 04 Oct 2015, 8:14 pm

Well... this week will be interesting.
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Post by SecretFly Sun 04 Oct 2015, 8:44 pm

After today...stomach-churning. We're back to not even knowing what kind of Ireland will turn up. Maybe that was the ploy, but it damn near cost us dearly. But I think Schmidt too smart to bluff it out so close to disaster to keep the French guessing.

So............. the fall-off was genuine. 'Worry' is the big word for the next week.

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Post by Engine#4 Sun 04 Oct 2015, 9:44 pm

What on earth has happened the maul?? It's been probably our most potent weapon for the last two years.  The Romanians and Italians swallowed it up.

I would start Henry against France.  SOB is not at the races and hasn't been for some time. Hopefully Payne is back too, he is the only back who can be trusted to offload successfully. The dreaded passive defensive line was also back Rolling Eyes

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Post by SecretFly Sun 04 Oct 2015, 9:52 pm

Intensity. We're a good 40% or more down on intensity required for such a competition. If we're trying to time it then that's much too close for comfort, and we're probably trying to be too smart. Only the All Blacks can pretend to be a wounded-duck now and again. We don't have the calibre to be playing those games, if games they are.

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Post by RubyGuby Sun 04 Oct 2015, 9:55 pm

C u at the curve on Friday. All will be revealed thumbsup

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Post by Marshes Sun 04 Oct 2015, 10:51 pm

Lots of work to be done.

The defensive line as someone mentioned was so passive today, and that was the same against England and Wales in the warmups. Giving up easy yards. The reverse is how languid the team looks in securing their own ball. Turned over way too many times.

Thought the scrum should be a big worry as well. Against Italy it really stuttered, that is before Atonio and Ben Arous get at it.

Henderson has to start, him and O Connell (even though POC was off the pace a little today) as well as Best were the only ones who can come off happy there. SOB now a bit of a liability, I think Henry is the more appropriate player for what Ireland need. I'd also have Ryan on the bench over Toner, offers more athleticism and abrasiveness off the bench. Earls back to the wing where he is more of a threat.

And hope and pray Sexton and Murray get back to up to speed

If we gift France the ball we were gifting Italy today, they will punish us more.

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Post by Marshes Sun 04 Oct 2015, 11:04 pm

Engine#4 wrote:What on earth has happened the maul?? It's been probably our most potent weapon for the last two years.  The Romanians and Italians swallowed it up.

I would start Henry against France.  SOB is not at the races and hasn't been for some time. Hopefully Payne is back too, he is the only back who can be trusted to offload successfully.  The dreaded passive defensive line was also back Rolling Eyes

Dead right, it has become so unstable and lacks any unity. Can we bring whoever is organising the Connacht mauls?

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Post by rodders Mon 05 Oct 2015, 10:42 am

France by 70!

I think Joe will pick:-

15 Kearney
14 Bowe
13 Payne
12 Henshaw
11 Earls
10 Sexton
9 Murray
8 Heaslip
7 O'Brien
6 POM
5 O'Connell
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 McGrath

Bench:- Healy, Cronin, White, Henderson, Henry, Reddan, Madigan, Zebo.

DK and Fitzgerald to miss the cut and will go for Hendo and Healy from the bench I think for impact although will be a tight call for these 2 and might be other way round.
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Post by PredictorofTeams Mon 05 Oct 2015, 10:50 am

rodders wrote:France by 70!

I think Joe will pick:-

15 Kearney
14 Bowe
13 Payne
12 Henshaw
11 Earls
10 Sexton
9 Murray
8 Heaslip
7 O'Brien
6 POM
5 O'Connell
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 McGrath

Bench:- Healy, Cronin, White, Henderson, Henry, Reddan, Madigan, Zebo.

DK and Fitzgerald to miss the cut and will go for Hendo and Healy from the bench I think for impact although will be a tight call for these 2 and might be other way round.

Hends dropped after a man of the match display? Ye good prediction........amateur

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Post by rodders Mon 05 Oct 2015, 11:00 am

Amateur sides drop people, professional teams rotate Wink

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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 11:15 am

I'd rotate Bowe then Whistle
... and Murray
... and Sexton
... and O'Brien
... and POC
... and probably Heaslip.

We do that and we might just win.................. Cool

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Post by Guest Mon 05 Oct 2015, 11:46 am

PredictorofTeams wrote:
rodders wrote:France by 70!

I think Joe will pick:-

15 Kearney
14 Bowe
13 Payne
12 Henshaw
11 Earls
10 Sexton
9 Murray
8 Heaslip
7 O'Brien
6 POM
5 O'Connell
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 McGrath

Bench:- Healy, Cronin, White, Henderson, Henry, Reddan, Madigan, Zebo.

DK and Fitzgerald to miss the cut and will go for Hendo and Healy from the bench I think for impact although will be a tight call for these 2 and might be other way round.

Hends dropped after a man of the match display? Ye good prediction........amateur

Against a powerful French bench it might make sense. Over the last few weeks I have thought Toner should start, with Henderson on the bench for this game, even though Henderson offers more than Toner. Not so sure now. What if we drop Toner, start Henderson and bench Ryan? Tough on Toner, he's done nothing wrong, but Ryan gives us more power.

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Post by PredictorofTeams Mon 05 Oct 2015, 11:58 am

Munchkin wrote:
PredictorofTeams wrote:
rodders wrote:France by 70!

I think Joe will pick:-

15 Kearney
14 Bowe
13 Payne
12 Henshaw
11 Earls
10 Sexton
9 Murray
8 Heaslip
7 O'Brien
6 POM
5 O'Connell
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 McGrath

Bench:- Healy, Cronin, White, Henderson, Henry, Reddan, Madigan, Zebo.

DK and Fitzgerald to miss the cut and will go for Hendo and Healy from the bench I think for impact although will be a tight call for these 2 and might be other way round.

Hends dropped after a man of the match display? Ye good prediction........amateur

Against a powerful French bench it might make sense. Over the last few weeks I have thought Toner should start, with Henderson on the bench for this game, even though Henderson offers more than Toner. Not so sure now. What if we drop Toner, start Henderson and bench Ryan? Tough on Toner, he's done nothing wrong, but Ryan gives us more power.
Ye not like the french starting pack are big or anything. Henderson was our best player last week and to drop him would be laughable. Professional sides don't drop their in form players, sh!t sides do! (cough George Ford)

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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:01 pm

We had tons of supposed power against Italy.  What do we rate our power on now?  We can no longer use the first two games.  They've become redundant as a measuring tool.

Henderson is a tough cookie and had a very good game in his own right.  But - is this a game for more experienced heads now?  More gristle than aggressive muscle perhaps but perhaps with more experience of these clashes (Toner) and more in tune with the nuances of the people around him (POC, O'Brien, Heaslip etc)?

I'm not saying I know the answer but Joe will undoubtedly have a few headaches this week making such decisions.

Two more games to get us to the semis.  Two biggest games now perhaps in our history.  We have to bring as much guile and smarts as we can to make it.

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Post by rodders Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:02 pm

PredictorofTeams wrote:Professional sides don't drop their in form players, sh!t sides do! (cough George Ford)

No but they put them on the bench if they think they are better utilized there, ask Sonny Bill how his form is.

The maul was noticeably better when Toner came on.
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Post by Guest Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:18 pm

PredictorofTeams wrote:
Munchkin wrote:
PredictorofTeams wrote:
rodders wrote:France by 70!

I think Joe will pick:-

15 Kearney
14 Bowe
13 Payne
12 Henshaw
11 Earls
10 Sexton
9 Murray
8 Heaslip
7 O'Brien
6 POM
5 O'Connell
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 McGrath

Bench:- Healy, Cronin, White, Henderson, Henry, Reddan, Madigan, Zebo.

DK and Fitzgerald to miss the cut and will go for Hendo and Healy from the bench I think for impact although will be a tight call for these 2 and might be other way round.

Hends dropped after a man of the match display? Ye good prediction........amateur

Against a powerful French bench it might make sense. Over the last few weeks I have thought Toner should start, with Henderson on the bench for this game, even though Henderson offers more than Toner. Not so sure now. What if we drop Toner, start Henderson and bench Ryan? Tough on Toner, he's done nothing wrong, but Ryan gives us more power.
Ye not like the french starting pack are big or anything. Henderson was our best player last week and to drop him would be laughable. Professional sides don't drop their in form players, sh!t sides do! (cough George Ford)

Henderson wouldn't be dropped. He would be on the bench, and on the bench for a specific purpose. To counter the threat that the French bench poses, and that threat is considerable, whatever you say about the starting pack being big. There is nothing amateur in that.

You also seem to have missed my suggestion of starting Henderson, dropping Toner and benching Ryan, for this game. Or perhaps dropping a form player like Toner would also be unprofessional? Horses for courses, I say.

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Post by rodders Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:26 pm

I don't think form comes into it, it comes down to the tactics we plan to use against France.
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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:30 pm

Hmmm, what will our tactics be?

Isn't it amazing that a few short weeks ago we were going to make short work of the bloody scatty French and their mad coach, Count Andre!

Now we have to get boring again and think of what tactics we'll need to come out of this game with a little pride and hopefully only a small defeat.... Whistle

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Post by geoff999rugby Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:36 pm

Not a hope in hell Henderson will be dropped and if he was it would be a big mistake..
As to power he has far more than Toner.

The only forwards that might be dropped are McGrath for Healy and SOB for Henry
I think he will only make the first of those changes I think he should make both

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Post by RubyGuby Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:37 pm

SecretFly wrote:Hmmm, what will our tactics be?

Isn't it amazing that a few short weeks ago we were going to make short work of the bloody scatty French and their mad coach, Count Andre!

Now we have to get boring again and think of what tactics we'll need to come out of this game with a little pride and hopefully only a small defeat.... Whistle

There's a familiarity here with the England v Aus. game last weekend, just saying like thumbsup

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Post by geoff999rugby Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:39 pm

rodders wrote:
PredictorofTeams wrote:Professional sides don't drop their in form players, sh!t sides do! (cough George Ford)

No but they put them on the bench if they think they are better utilized there, ask Sonny Bill how his form is.

The maul was noticeably better when Toner came on.

What about Healy, White, Henry and Cronin - maybe they made a difference too

Italy were tiring and if any substitutes improved our maul it has Healy and Henry rather than Toner

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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:43 pm

RubyGuby wrote:
SecretFly wrote:Hmmm, what will our tactics be?

Isn't it amazing that a few short weeks ago we were going to make short work of the bloody scatty French and their mad coach, Count Andre!

Now we have to get boring again and think of what tactics we'll need to come out of this game with a little pride and hopefully only a small defeat.... Whistle

There's a familiarity here with the England v Aus. game last weekend, just saying like thumbsup

Australia?

Are they here too?

Oh must look them up!!! Always love seeing the Aussies at the World Cup. Who are they playing in the Pools?

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Post by whocares Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:48 pm

SecretFly wrote:Hmmm, what will our tactics be?

Isn't it amazing that a few short weeks ago we were going to make short work of the bloody scatty French and their mad coach, Count Andre!

Now we have to get boring again and think of what tactics we'll need to come out of this game with a little pride and hopefully only a small defeat.... Whistle

I see you're at it again SF Smile dont you try to nick our underdog tag agin please Whistle

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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 12:55 pm

I wish I was joking this time, Who.  I'm happy we're through - just.  
At this point Argentina will be as much a handful as New Zealand, so not much real value between 1 or 2 - not for us anyway.  They'll both give us worries that the quarterfinal will be our last outing.

But I guess, all those thoughts are on delay until we see how we do against your French boys.  And I'd assume your boys are thinking the same thing.  A good performance - oodles more intensity and perhaps we'll be back again hoping we'd get Argentina!  But if we play badly again and France make short work of us - then it won't really matter who we face in the next round.

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Post by rodders Mon 05 Oct 2015, 1:00 pm

SecretFly wrote:Hmmm, what will our tactics be?

I think we'll play a varied game.

Plan A: Kick the ball to Michelak
Plan B: Don't kick the ball the Spedding
Plan C: Kick it to anyone but Picamoles.
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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 1:07 pm

rodders wrote:
SecretFly wrote:Hmmm, what will our tactics be?

I think we'll play a varied game.

Plan A: Kick the ball to Michelak
Plan B: Don't kick the ball the Spedding
Plan C: Kick it to anyone but Picamoles.
Plan C: Kick the ball to Bowe and get down on bended knee to pray, pray, pray that he doesn't try to tap, tap, tap it back.

Please Bowe. I'm beggin' ya. Catch the f**king thing or don't even rise. Wait for the buggar to come down and nail him but don't be tapping the f**king thing back.

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Post by rodders Mon 05 Oct 2015, 1:11 pm

Everyone is making the assumption that France want to win this game.

They have a much better record against the ABs than Argentina in the RWC,

I can see them not going full gas here.
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Post by Pal Joey Mon 05 Oct 2015, 1:47 pm

Was thinking exactly the same re France's 'bogey' team Argentina and their historically preferred diet of kiwi during World Cups. However, I don't think this would even come into consideration. They will want to top the group (like Ireland of course) and get something back on Argentina (if they finish 1st) this time around.
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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:07 pm

rodders wrote:Everyone is making the assumption that France want to win this game.

They have a much better record against the ABs than Argentina in the RWC,

I can see them not going full gas here.

So they'll let us win?

Hmm........ don't know whether to be happy or insulted.

Insulted it is!!!   mad We'll marmalise them now for that offence!  We'll brutalise them.  Shame them!  Bury them!!!

Andre:  "We are Hap-E.  We were going to let them beat uz but they waste ener -G, get all excit-ED and do it themselves.  Idy-OTs."

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Post by geoff999rugby Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:10 pm

SecretFly wrote:
rodders wrote:
SecretFly wrote:Hmmm, what will our tactics be?

I think we'll play a varied game.

Plan A: Kick the ball to Michelak
Plan B: Don't kick the ball the Spedding
Plan C: Kick it to anyone but Picamoles.
Plan C: Kick the ball to Bowe and get down on bended knee to pray, pray, pray that he doesn't try to tap, tap, tap it back.  

Please Bowe.  I'm beggin' ya.  Catch the f**king thing or don't even rise.  Wait for the buggar to come down and nail him but don't be tapping the f**king thing back.

Bowe made some great catches and when he tapped it back it was because the ball was too high to catch.
Deliberate Irish tactic - the problem was team mates not being there in support

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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:16 pm

No give. It's a 'tactic' that isn't working...and highly dangerous. The Italians knew his trait and kept running to be behind him...they caught at least two of them that I distinctly remember - maybe more. That's possession back quickly to them before our troops are fully there to defend in line.
Giving possession away like that is criminal...and Bowe has being doing it now for some time. The tap backs are not accurate enough, he doesn't sense support players around him just shunts back (or sideways) and hopes. Not good enough.

Maybe another of our developing 'ruses' but I find his behaviour frightening.

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Post by rodders Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:18 pm

SecretFly wrote:
rodders wrote:Everyone is making the assumption that France want to win this game.

They have a much better record against the ABs than Argentina in the RWC,

I can see them not going full gas here.

So they'll let us win?

I believe so yes,subconsciously they will want to avoid the Pumas, so I can see them getting edgy if they are ahead in the last 10 and maybe will leak a couple of late scores to get out of jail.
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Post by George Carlin Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:18 pm

Tommy Bowe = apparently the Marmite of the Irish fans' boards.
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Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:22 pm

I think Tommy on song is a delight. He's doing things though now and in the past season that spook me. He ain't Marmite, just a very naughty boy.

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Post by BamBam Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:23 pm

I haven't seen enough of it to comment, but is he reaching and tapping back because he hasn't quite got the pace to be in position for a proper attempt at a catch?

Jonny May knocked on a couple of times for the same reason against Australia

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Post by majesticimperialman Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:26 pm

The way Ireland played against Italy the other day, i would have to go for a France win.

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France v Ireland, 11 October Empty Re: France v Ireland, 11 October

Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:28 pm

BamBam wrote:I haven't seen enough of it to comment, but is he reaching and tapping back because he hasn't quite got the pace to be in position for a proper attempt at a catch?

Jonny May knocked on a couple of times for the same reason against Australia

I think it's he's hoping he might catch but jumps for too many that simply aren't on and ends up with one hand close, so attempts tap backs. I'd prefer him to be honest more often and say to himself 'I'm not going to get this one, I'll let the catcher down then nail him'.

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France v Ireland, 11 October Empty Re: France v Ireland, 11 October

Post by rodders Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:29 pm

SecretFly wrote:I think Tommy on song is a delight.  He's doing things though now and in the past season that spook me.  He ain't Marmite, just a very naughty boy.

Do you honestly think Bowe is dropping those balls of his own accord and this isn't a directive by Schmidt?

This is all a rouse by Joe to make teams think we are there for the taking, like giving the impression average Dave is a starting xv player, Earlsie is a center and Nathan White a test class TH prop.

Pete O'Mahoney was actually told not to make that tackle as Joe wanted a draw to confuse the French but he didn't do his homework so will be dropped along with Hendo, who was playing so well Joe had to take him off early the big eejit.
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France v Ireland, 11 October Empty Re: France v Ireland, 11 October

Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 2:39 pm

I know it's all a 'ruse', rodders. Joe is plotting on his drawingboard as we speak.... his little specs on and loads of things bubbling in his test tubes behind his back.

But I absolutely don't want to get into another battle with Nos na Gaoithe about the definition of 'acting'!! I was up all night with that fella.

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France v Ireland, 11 October Empty Re: France v Ireland, 11 October

Post by Blanko Mon 05 Oct 2015, 3:01 pm

Too many people not playing great. There's no one in the forwards other than Henderson giving you that nasty Pocock presence. Not sure what the answer is. Ireland did play better when Henry was in for SOBs shoulder last year yet we have reverted back to a once dynamic player who seems to have lost his dynamism.

And now to make things much worse Paynes walking around in a boot.

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France v Ireland, 11 October Empty Re: France v Ireland, 11 October

Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 3:08 pm

He better find the other one quickly... he's playing on Sunday.

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France v Ireland, 11 October Empty Re: France v Ireland, 11 October

Post by geoff999rugby Mon 05 Oct 2015, 3:38 pm

SecretFly wrote:No give.  It's a 'tactic' that isn't working...and highly dangerous.  .

That's as maybe but tell Schmidt it is his tactic - Bowe is just following the plan

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France v Ireland, 11 October Empty Re: France v Ireland, 11 October

Post by SecretFly Mon 05 Oct 2015, 3:48 pm

I don't have Joe's number. But I certainly would tell him he's either fooling himself or..................... well, the future opposition.


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France v Ireland, 11 October Empty Re: France v Ireland, 11 October

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