IRFU to spend even more money on their wages.

Irish rugby bosses will hand the four provinces an extra €3.2 million (£2.27m) a year to combat the threat of France's big-spending superpowers.

Philip Browne, chief executive of the Irish Rugby Football Union (IRFU), admitted the four provinces are "all struggling" to keep pace with their French counterparts.

The IRFU reported a surplus in excess of €8.7m (£6.18m) owing to ticket sales, new broadcasting deals and Ireland's two-straight Six Nations titles.

Browne admitted the IRFU have a duty to keep raising investment into Leinster, Munster, Connacht and Ulster where possible.

"At professional game level it allows to start putting a little bit more money into the academy system and the elite player pool," said Browne.

"What we're trying to do with David Nucifora [performance director] is to try and drive the high-performance system through the age groups so that we have contact with kids at an earlier age.

"It obviously allows us to put a bit more money into the provinces who are all struggling to some extent in terms of financial pressures that are coming to bear because of the money in France.

"We're trying to make them financially viable and sustainable but at the same time we've got to try to put competitive teams on the park. So it's about all those things, it's really around the high-performance system and player contracts where that money goes."

In the 2013-14 season, the IRFU posted a surplus of €7.3m (£5.9m). A second-straight surplus leaves the organisation in rude health ahead of next month's Rugby World Cup.

Oh, and just to add a link about spending as our Irish friends on here like us to provide such things, here is the IRFU annual report:-

http://www.irishrugby.ie/downloads/IRFU ... 201314.pdf
http://www.irishrugby.ie/downloads/IRFU ... 014_15.pdf

Looks like the Irish will be spending the highest in Europe now.

Looks like most of that money is going to developing players, not importing them.

So £2.3m (I'll round up) spread across 4 provinces would mean 1 extra elite level player retained or a significant improvement in the academies and youth development.

Thanks for highlighting this positive move by the IRFU to improve the pipeline for developing and retaining more Irish players, I needed a little pick me up after the depressing results of the weekend.

Spend,spend,spend. If you cant beat em, join em.

It just goes to show the disparity in the Pro12. There really should be a salary cap in our league. At the moment the Irish are spending more than the French.

Lord, whilst I agree it does show a real disparity between the sides in the Pro12 when it comes to money to spend, it also shows the difference between what the unions are wanting to do with their cash. The Irish are, in my eyes, doing the right thing here and investing their cash back into the systems that are really responsible for the extra cash being generated anyway.

LordDowlais wrote:Spend,spend,spend. If you cant beat em, join em.

It just goes to show the disparity in the Pro12. There really should be a salary cap in our league. At the moment the Irish are spending more than the French.

How do you make that out? Isn't Carter going to be on 1m per year for starters. Only one Irish player makes this list (and Burgess is earning more than him with Bath).

http://intheloose.com/2015/01/08/rugbys-top-10-best-paid-players-2015/

Sin é wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Spend,spend,spend. If you cant beat em, join em.

It just goes to show the disparity in the Pro12. There really should be a salary cap in our league. At the moment the Irish are spending more than the French.

How do you make that out? Isn't Carter going to be on 1m per year for starters. Only one Irish player makes this list (and Burgess is earning more than him with Bath).

http://intheloose.com/2015/01/08/rugbys-top-10-best-paid-players-2015/

Taken from your link

1.Dan Carter
Racing Metro 92, £1,000,000

Carter is set to become the best paid player in the world when he leaves New Zealand after the world cup to take up the Racing number 10 shirt in Paris. Although his base salary is around only half of this final figure, the other endorsement deals see him become rugby’s first million pound player.



So what they are saying is that Dan Carter is only being paid £500,000 (ish) by Racing.  I am sure that the sponsorship deals etc are considered by players when making moves, however they are not part of their wages from the team.  And as such surely they can not be counted as part of the teams wage bill.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Sin é wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Spend,spend,spend. If you cant beat em, join em.

It just goes to show the disparity in the Pro12. There really should be a salary cap in our league. At the moment the Irish are spending more than the French.

How do you make that out? Isn't Carter going to be on 1m per year for starters. Only one Irish player makes this list (and Burgess is earning more than him with Bath).

http://intheloose.com/2015/01/08/rugbys-top-10-best-paid-players-2015/

Taken from your link

1.Dan Carter
Racing Metro 92, £1,000,000

Carter is set to become the best paid player in the world when he leaves New Zealand after the world cup to take up the Racing number 10 shirt in Paris. Although his base salary is around only half of this final figure, the other endorsement deals see him become rugby’s first million pound player.



So what they are saying is that Dan Carter is only being paid £500,000 (ish) by Racing.  I am sure that the sponsorship deals etc are considered by players when making moves, however they are not part of their wages from the team.  And as such surely they can not be counted as part of the teams wage bill.

Those are loopholes the French are using to get round the salary cap. For example Toulon set up a polo-shirt firm to bump Jonny Wilkinson's wages, Toulouse own the airport and other businesses in the city and they sponsor players.

Although the money doesn't come from the club payroll indirectly the club are paying the players much more than they are declaring.

If the Irish were spending more than France then why do you think O'Connell is off to Toulon?

rodders wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Sin é wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Spend,spend,spend. If you cant beat em, join em.

It just goes to show the disparity in the Pro12. There really should be a salary cap in our league. At the moment the Irish are spending more than the French.

How do you make that out? Isn't Carter going to be on 1m per year for starters. Only one Irish player makes this list (and Burgess is earning more than him with Bath).

http://intheloose.com/2015/01/08/rugbys-top-10-best-paid-players-2015/

Taken from your link

1.Dan Carter
Racing Metro 92, £1,000,000

Carter is set to become the best paid player in the world when he leaves New Zealand after the world cup to take up the Racing number 10 shirt in Paris. Although his base salary is around only half of this final figure, the other endorsement deals see him become rugby’s first million pound player.



So what they are saying is that Dan Carter is only being paid £500,000 (ish) by Racing.  I am sure that the sponsorship deals etc are considered by players when making moves, however they are not part of their wages from the team.  And as such surely they can not be counted as part of the teams wage bill.

Those are loopholes the French are using to get round the salary cap. For example Toulon set up a polo-shirt firm to bump Jonny Wilkinson's wages, Toulouse own the airport and other businesses in the city and they sponsor players.

Although the money doesn't come from the club payroll indirectly the club are paying the players much more than they are declaring.

If the Irish were spending more than France then why do you think O'Connell is off to Toulon?    

I heard it was because he wants to play in a league with decent officials

There are some big loop holes in the French system that do make players overall take home far more than it would be elsewhere (I guess like there is in Ireland too with the tax thing), however if you are talking about wage bills, then surely you can only go on the actual wage someone is being paid directly by their employers. Otherwise you get caught up in technicalities, for example are Toulouse using their players to advertise their airport because they are well know players good for using in advertising, as opposed to purely to bump up players bank balances? As seems to be a regular line on here, is there any proof either way?

That IRFU are spending money they actually generate to try and retain home grown players is surely a good thing. Not overly keen on them flashing the cash to lure "project" players as that always feels a tad unethical but that is only a tiny number of players.

LordDowlais wrote:Irish rugby bosses will hand the four provinces an extra €3.2 million (£2.27m) a year to combat the threat of France's big-spending superpowers.

Philip Browne, chief executive of the Irish Rugby Football Union (IRFU), admitted the four provinces are "all struggling" to keep pace with their French counterparts.

The IRFU reported a surplus in excess of €8.7m (£6.18m) owing to ticket sales, new broadcasting deals and Ireland's two-straight Six Nations titles.

Browne admitted the IRFU have a duty to keep raising investment into Leinster, Munster, Connacht and Ulster where possible.

"At professional game level it allows to start putting a little bit more money into the academy system and the elite player pool," said Browne.

"What we're trying to do with David Nucifora [performance director] is to try and drive the high-performance system through the age groups so that we have contact with kids at an earlier age.

"It obviously allows us to put a bit more money into the provinces who are all struggling to some extent in terms of financial pressures that are coming to bear because of the money in France.

"We're trying to make them financially viable and sustainable but at the same time we've got to try to put competitive teams on the park. So it's about all those things, it's really around the high-performance system and player contracts where that money goes."

In the 2013-14 season, the IRFU posted a surplus of €7.3m (£5.9m). A second-straight surplus leaves the organisation in rude health ahead of next month's Rugby World Cup.

Oh, and just to add a link about spending as our Irish friends on here like us to provide such things, here is the IRFU annual report:-

http://www.irishrugby.ie/downloads/IRFU ... 201314.pdf
http://www.irishrugby.ie/downloads/IRFU ... 014_15.pdf

Looks like the Irish will be spending the highest in Europe now.

You're a bit late with this one, LD It has been done already.

The money isn't all going to the Provinces to spend on squad players. A fair chunk of it is going to development.

The Provinces will not have bigger player salaries than the big French clubs. As it has been pointed out many times now, even if the Provinces had the money, what would we spend it on? We are restricted by NIQ. The NIQ acts as a very effective salary cap.

LD's headline is misleading. The IRFU are not going to spending 'even more money on their wages'. They say specifically that they are going to put most of it into developing players.

Munchkin wrote:The Provinces will not have bigger player salaries than the big French clubs. As it has been pointed out many times now, even if the Provinces had the money, what would we spend it on? We are restricted by NIQ. The NIQ acts as a very effective salary cap.

I always used to think that too. However does it possibly work in reverse? As in Ulster are desperate for a tight head, and are unable to go down the NIQ route due to being at the limit, so they have to sign a IQ tight head, and Tarquin Smythe (A bench warmer at a decent Aviva Prem side) sends his agent over, with his grannies birth certificate proving he is irish, and as such can ask for more because Ulster are stuck to having to sign IQ.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Munchkin wrote:The Provinces will not have bigger player salaries than the big French clubs. As it has been pointed out many times now, even if the Provinces had the money, what would we spend it on? We are restricted by NIQ. The NIQ acts as a very effective salary cap.

I always used to think that too.  However does it possibly work in reverse?  As in Ulster are desperate for a tight head, and are unable to go down the NIQ route due to being at the limit, so they have to sign a IQ tight head, and Tarquin Smythe (A bench warmer at a decent Aviva Prem side) sends his agent over, with his grannies birth certificate proving he is irish, and as such can ask for more because Ulster are stuck to having to sign IQ.

I could see that being an issue, Scarlets, but the idea is to encourage home grown talent, and I applaud the ideal. Problem is, we're not very good at producing forwards in Ulster. Or maybe better to say, we are not very good at developing them. Hopefully the money allocated to development is spent very wisely.

Good news

Great stuff

It does not look as though they are spending their money on nurturing talent, Leinster are signing a New Zealand second rower aren't they ?

LordDowlais wrote:It does not look as though they are spending their money on nurturing talent, Leinster are signing a New Zealand second rower aren't they ?

They had a good look at a few Argies too over the weekend

He's signed until the end of the summer to cover for call ups amd retirements. We have been playing a 21 year old (Maloney) alongside McCarth this season and our other two young locks (Beirne and Thornbury) are always injured.

Kevin McLaughlin also had to retire. He was cover for the lock position.

Is LD single these days? No Chunkles?

Stone Motif wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:It does not look as though they are spending their money on nurturing talent, Leinster are signing a New Zealand second rower aren't they ?

They had a good look at a few Argies too over the weekend

Munster have just signed a prop who played for Uruguay at the world cup
Helping out our less well off friends in rugby by giving him much needed top level coaching

I don't understand why LD makes this out to be a bad thing?

A union supporting its teams is a good thing, I'm sure that if the WRU announced that it was putting an extra £2.27m a year to develop the regions he would be over the moon, but if the IRFU do it for the Provinces its a bad thing?

It seams like he would rather the Provinces were dragged down rather than the regions were raised up.

I would love it if the WRU, SRU and FIR all did the same.

Pete330v2 wrote:Is LD single these days? No Chunkles?

You can just mentally add in the one post replies to yourself.

Shameful.
Disgusting.
Pathetic.

Sin é wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:It does not look as though they are spending their money on nurturing talent, Leinster are signing a New Zealand second rower aren't they ?

They had a good look at a few Argies too over the weekend

Munster have just signed a prop who played for Uruguay at the world cup  
Helping out our less well off friends in rugby by giving him much needed top level coaching

We sign a NZ Maori international, Munster sign a Uruguayan TH and Connacht sign AJ Maginty. Doesn't seem to be much money there for foreign signings TBH.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:It does not look as though they are spending their money on nurturing talent, Leinster are signing a New Zealand second rower aren't they ?

They had a good look at a few Argies too over the weekend

Munster have just signed a prop who played for Uruguay at the world cup  
Helping out our less well off friends in rugby by giving him much needed top level coaching

We sign a NZ Maori international, Munster sign a Uruguayan TH and Connacht sign AJ Maginty. Doesn't seem to be much money there for foreign signings TBH.

To be real, I would love a salary cap in European Rugby. And I would be perfectly okay with it being much lower than what we spend on wages. But I'm talking about an identical salary cap for the French and English as well as the Pro12. A Pro12 only salary cap would be completely self-defeating whilst big French money is available, because they distort the market and it's our need to try and compete with them for the services of our best homegrown players that is driving us to put up spending on salaries.

So I don't see what is to be achieved by us limiting our salaries to Welsh levels, because we'll all just be crap together. It won't actually make the Pro12 better, it'll make it worse as we'd lose players and not be able to attract other decent players. This would mean everyone else was competing against weaker Irish sides. The standard is already too low to effectively do what it is for, which is produce test players. I don't see how anyone decreasing what they spend on players is ever going to raise that standard.

What we need to see is not the IRFU decreasing what they spend, but the other Unions somehow increasing it.

I am happy for the Irish provinces to do this as a Scottish fan (prefer Glasgow) as it makes them more visible for sponsors and TV, but its the difference in ownership structure that is leading to the funding issue in Wales compared to Ireland IMHO.

WRU had benefactors who footed the bill while they paid off their debt in the 2000s. No meal is ever free and rugby is more expensive than ever. The debt is almost gone (an impressive feat), but who gives money to another organisation for free? The dual contracts are a good start, but buying up the regions one by one may be an answer.

As an aside, I find salary caps morally wrong. It would be inappropriate to limit the income of a player who may only get 1 big contract before injury and has not got a back up plan. Rugby traditionally was private school because if you got hurt, you had money or a profession (doctor, lawyer, engineer) so no need to worry. A Fijian coming over may need to support his entire family and the opportunities for a high income in Fiji are quite low (GDP per cap of approx $5000). Who are we to limit the income of another profession because we find it unfair that other clubs are more successful at attracting fans and sponsors?

More money for the Provinces? Good.

I wonder why the Regions don't spend money? Oh that's right, they don't want to accept money from people with blood on their hands (WRU).

Notch wrote:To be real, I would love a salary cap in European Rugby. And I would be perfectly okay with it being much lower than what we spend on wages. But I'm talking about an identical salary cap for the French and English as well as the Pro12.

I would be intrigued to see the total wage bill for all European squads, including the central contracts, dodgy sponsorships, italian restaurants etc.

Would never happen of course, but with six different countries all paying wages in different ways it is impossible to compare the spending of teams from one country to another.

Yeah it's impossible for many reasons. And equally impossible to introduce or impose a uniform cap. I mean, the salary caps that exist in England and France are already being circumvented in different ways.

Notch wrote:Yeah it's impossible for many reasons. And equally impossible to introduce or impose a uniform cap. I mean, the salary caps that exist in England and France are already being circumvented in different ways.

The salary cap is a lot stricter in England rather than France over what counts as a payment. Yes some teams may well have broken it, some do use all the rules to their advantage but the actual expenditure is considerably lower than in France.

Not at all relevant of course to the discussion on what IRFU do with their money. Using extra income to support development of Irish rugby players seems rather sensible to me.

Correct me if I'm wrong; I was of the impression that there was a tax incentive for players to stay in Ireland their entire playing careers, they could then claim a rebate of something approaching 40% of their paid tax? One of the reasons O'Driscoll stayed at Leinster when he would have had his pick of French or English clubs. As Sexton went to France last year and now O'Connell etc does that mean that the tax deal has stopped or are the wages on offer so high they make the tax deal irrelevant?

Huge amount of money being offered by the French clubs. Sexton came back because he has a private sponsor.
As far as I'm aware the tax incentive is still in place, although obviously not for Ulster.

The tax incentive is still there but you can now still be eligible if you retire abroad. If POC retires out in Toulon he will get tax back on his income earned while in Ireland

ScarletSpiderman wrote:



So what they are saying is that Dan Carter is only being paid £500,000 (ish) by Racing. I am sure that the sponsorship deals etc are considered by players when making moves, however they are not part of their wages from the team. And as such surely they can not be counted as part of the teams wage bill.

I think that's wrong. The deal he would have with Racing is that his sponsorship earnings would be linked to his 'owned' status at the club. He'd be a 'trademarked' Racing player earning sponsorhip money for the club...and himself. Part of his inducement package to come. Doesn't football have the same kind of system? - attracting big name players as much for their potential advertising attractiveness as for the player's own skills?

ScarletSpiderman wrote:There are some big loop holes in the French system that do make players overall take home far more than it would be elsewhere (I guess like there is in Ireland too with the tax thing), however if you are talking about wage bills, then surely you can only go on the actual wage someone is being paid directly by their employers.  Otherwise you get caught up in technicalities, for example are Toulouse using their players to advertise their airport because they are well know players good for using in advertising, as opposed to purely to bump up players bank balances?  As seems to be a regular line on here, is there any proof either way?

Carter and other Racing players receive payments from Arena 92 Ltd(or whatever its name is) for their image rights. This company and Racing are both owned by Lorenzetti

Theres an article in one of the previous threads of Boudjellal talking about it and how Toulon do the same but its not easy to find

http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries/france-countries/top-14-finances-salary-cap-strongly-policed-france-42028

'Midi Olympique reported last month that Dan Carter’s salary when he joins Racing Metro after the World Cup will be around €500,000; but on top of that it is alleged the All Blacks fly-half will receive a similar sum from his image rights including an estimated €300,000 from the operating company of Arena 92, Racing’s new home from 2016 that will also host concerts and business conferences.'

“We’ve created with him a commercial enterprise of products branded ‘10’,” said Boudjellal. “This enterprise, based in France, generates a real turnover on the back of the sales of hats, t-shirts, polo (shirts), etc…should the proceeds from these sales be included in calculating the player’s salary? I don’t believe so.”

SecretFly wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:



So what they are saying is that Dan Carter is only being paid £500,000 (ish) by Racing.  I am sure that the sponsorship deals etc are considered by players when making moves, however they are not part of their wages from the team.  And as such surely they can not be counted as part of the teams wage bill.

I think that's wrong.  The deal he would have with Racing is that his sponsorship earnings would be linked to his 'owned' status at the club.  He'd be a 'trademarked' Racing player earning sponsorhip money for the club...and himself.  Part of his inducement package to come.  Doesn't football have the same kind of system? - attracting big name players as much for their potential advertising attractiveness as for the player's own skills?

I totally agree that by signing a big name player that the club can really make a killing of sticking his face on mugs, shirts etc, and selling them for a bomb. However, I am really not sure what this has to do with a player earning fro sponsorship deals outside of the club. Going by one of those over-simplified real life comparisons. If I do DJ work on the weekends, and someone who I work with recommends me as a DJ for a friends birthday, then the money I earn from that DJ job is not paid by my company, it is wages that I have earned myself from another source. That is pretty much the same as a player picking up a sponsorship deal (even via links with the club).

marty2086 wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:There are some big loop holes in the French system that do make players overall take home far more than it would be elsewhere (I guess like there is in Ireland too with the tax thing), however if you are talking about wage bills, then surely you can only go on the actual wage someone is being paid directly by their employers. Otherwise you get caught up in technicalities, for example are Toulouse using their players to advertise their airport because they are well know players good for using in advertising, as opposed to purely to bump up players bank balances? As seems to be a regular line on here, is there any proof either way?

Carter and other Racing players receive payments from Arena 92 Ltd(or whatever its name is) for their image rights. This company and Racing are both owned by Lorenzetti

Theres an article in one of the previous threads of Boudjellal talking about it and how Toulon do the same but its not easy to find

Truth is it is a loop hole.  And loopholes are ways people can do things we all know are wrong, yet technically be right.  The money a player earns outside of their wages paid directly from the club are classed as his wages, anything paid from people outside of the club are not part of their wage bills.  It is a bit like if there were caps in the pro12 Sexton not counting his private investors money as his wages, as it is not being paid directly by the club.

Loopholes really do suck, but if they exist the y will be used.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:



So what they are saying is that Dan Carter is only being paid £500,000 (ish) by Racing.  I am sure that the sponsorship deals etc are considered by players when making moves, however they are not part of their wages from the team.  And as such surely they can not be counted as part of the teams wage bill.

I think that's wrong.  The deal he would have with Racing is that his sponsorship earnings would be linked to his 'owned' status at the club.  He'd be a 'trademarked' Racing player earning sponsorhip money for the club...and himself.  Part of his inducement package to come.  Doesn't football have the same kind of system? - attracting big name players as much for their potential advertising attractiveness as for the player's own skills?

I totally agree that by signing a big name player that the club can really make a killing of sticking his face on mugs, shirts etc, and selling them for a bomb.  However, I am really not sure what this has to do with a player earning fro sponsorship deals outside of the club.  Going by one of those over-simplified real life comparisons.  If I do DJ work on the weekends, and someone who I work with recommends me as a DJ for a friends birthday, then the money I earn from that DJ job is not paid by my company, it is wages that I have earned myself from another source.  That is pretty much the same as a player picking up a sponsorship deal (even via links with the club).

Not at all, Scarlet.  You make it sound a casual link.  It isn't.  Had Carter come across and had he been given free rein to create his own sponsorship contracts, then the 1,000,000 would not have been mentioned.  That would be his own private affairs between himself, his agent and the companies he might work for.  And I doubt, even if they were declared, that he'd approach a private sponsorship portfolio all in the one go.  He'd do his negotiations month by month as sponsors came looking for him to do things month by month.

It's Racing that will be paid for Carter's services over the period of his contract by selected sponsors.  From that, Carter will get his contracted pay out, bringing him in and around that quoted 1 million mark.

I'd believe Racing will have a watertight contracts ensuring the only sponsorship work Carter does during his tenure with them comes through them.  But even if he's given leverage to earn more on the side with private sponsoring arrangements, that's not included in the overall package from Racing that's being talked about.  

It is payment - and one way or another it is coming from the club - it's just not the straight-up playing fee.

Fly, as per my reply to Marty, loopholes are a real sd. But they are technically (maybe not morally) right, and technically Carter is not being paid that by Racing.

....................... he's being paid by Racing.  I don't care how technical the bluff might be.  But I'm telling you it's not even a bluff.  That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere.  Sponsors pay Racing.  Racing pay Carter.  A Lawyer wouldn't take too long finding the detail.  The point I suppose is that the Top14 organisers don't care.  It doesn't concern them.  It's Racing business.

SecretFly wrote:....................... he's being paid by Racing.  I don't care how technical the bluff might be.  But I'm telling you it's not even a bluff.  That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere.  Sponsors pay Racing.  Racing pay Carter.  A Lawyer wouldn't take too long finding the detail.  The point I suppose is that the Top14 organisers don't care.  It doesn't concern them.  It's Racing business.

AS per the standard on here

Link???

SecretFly wrote:....................... he's being paid by Racing.  I don't care how technical the bluff might be.  But I'm telling you it's not even a bluff.  That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere.  Sponsors pay Racing.  Racing pay Carter.  A Lawyer wouldn't take too long finding the detail.  The point I suppose is that the Top14 organisers don't care.  It doesn't concern them.  It's Racing business.

They do care because the names of Carter etc works for them its bringing in the big tv deals for them but they won't do anything about it because they'll hurt themselves

As Scarlet says its a loophole and then becomes a Clintonesque debate on what is the definition of a salary

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:....................... he's being paid by Racing.  I don't care how technical the bluff might be.  But I'm telling you it's not even a bluff.  That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere.  Sponsors pay Racing.  Racing pay Carter.  A Lawyer wouldn't take too long finding the detail.  The point I suppose is that the Top14 organisers don't care.  It doesn't concern them.  It's Racing business.

AS per the standard on here

Link???

Scarlet I've added the link earlier on

marty2086 wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:....................... he's being paid by Racing.  I don't care how technical the bluff might be.  But I'm telling you it's not even a bluff.  That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere.  Sponsors pay Racing.  Racing pay Carter.  A Lawyer wouldn't take too long finding the detail.  The point I suppose is that the Top14 organisers don't care.  It doesn't concern them.  It's Racing business.

AS per the standard on here

Link???

Scarlet I've added the link earlier on

No you have no. You have provided a link that, again, says Carter is being paid 500k by Racing, and that he is expected to earn that much again through sponsorship deals etc. There is nothing in that article that backs up Fly's argument "That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere". And if anything it the link you have provided shows that Carter is technically being paid inside of the salary cap (via loopholes).

So can either of you provide a link that back up your claims that he is being paid !m by Racing?

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:....................... he's being paid by Racing.  I don't care how technical the bluff might be.  But I'm telling you it's not even a bluff.  That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere.  Sponsors pay Racing.  Racing pay Carter.  A Lawyer wouldn't take too long finding the detail.  The point I suppose is that the Top14 organisers don't care.  It doesn't concern them.  It's Racing business.

AS per the standard on here

Link???

Scarlet I've added the link earlier on

No you have no.  You have provided a link that, again, says Carter is being paid 500k by Racing, and that he is expected to earn that much again through sponsorship deals etc.  There is nothing in that article that backs up Fly's argument "That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere".   And if anything it the link you have provided shows that Carter is technically being paid inside of the salary cap (via loopholes).

So can either of you provide a link that back up your claims that he is being paid !m by Racing?

'€300,000 from the operating company of Arena 92, Racing’s new home from 2016 that will also host concerts and business conferences'

So yes it was already provided

Oh and the CEO of the operating company

Jacky Lorenzetti

http://www.arena92.com/

marty2086 wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:....................... he's being paid by Racing.  I don't care how technical the bluff might be.  But I'm telling you it's not even a bluff.  That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere.  Sponsors pay Racing.  Racing pay Carter.  A Lawyer wouldn't take too long finding the detail.  The point I suppose is that the Top14 organisers don't care.  It doesn't concern them.  It's Racing business.

AS per the standard on here

Link???

Scarlet I've added the link earlier on

No you have no.  You have provided a link that, again, says Carter is being paid 500k by Racing, and that he is expected to earn that much again through sponsorship deals etc.  There is nothing in that article that backs up Fly's argument "That arrangement will be in legal print somewhere".   And if anything it the link you have provided shows that Carter is technically being paid inside of the salary cap (via loopholes).

So can either of you provide a link that back up your claims that he is being paid !m by Racing?

'€300,000 from the operating company of Arena 92, Racing’s new home from 2016 that will also host concerts and business conferences'

So yes it was already provided

No, again that is proof that it is not coming from Racing, but from the complain that own Racing's stadium.

So I will ask yet again, can you prove that Racing are actually paying more than the 500k? Can you provide links to support your claim (rather than constantly disproving it yourself?)

marty2086 wrote:Oh and the CEO of the operating company

Jacky Lorenzetti

http://www.arena92.com/

So? It has the same bloke involved. That does not make it the same entity does it.