The "no arms" tackle
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TJ
doctor_grey
Pete330v2
mikey_dragon
Rory_Gallagher
Seagultaf
Cyril
lostinwales
VinceWLB
stub
Chunky Norwich
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The v2 Forum :: Sport :: Rugby Union :: Club Rugby
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The "no arms" tackle
Any referees here? Can anyone explain why one of these is a penalty. And the other isn't? Both were from this weekend's games, and both times, the referee stopped the game to look at the offences. Thanks.
Chunky Norwich- Posts : 4409
Join date : 2011-12-08
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Re: The "no arms" tackle
Not a referee and cannot understand the difference, in fact I thought that Billy V made more of an attempt to use his arms. I think that it is just inconsistent interpretation of the laws...
Sorry not to be more helpful.
Edit: actually not sure your clip was Billy V so apologies if my post is incorrect.
Edit 2: Not Billy V (was Burger) but still inconsistent interpretation of the laws.
Sorry not to be more helpful.
Edit: actually not sure your clip was Billy V so apologies if my post is incorrect.
Edit 2: Not Billy V (was Burger) but still inconsistent interpretation of the laws.
stub- Posts : 2226
Join date : 2013-01-31
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Although i'm not a ref and certainly don't intend to become one. This is a yellow in both case under the new rules directive but we all know Jacques Burger can get away with basically anything he wants.
Talking about "no arms" tackle Vunipola's yellow yesterday was a soft one.
Talking about "no arms" tackle Vunipola's yellow yesterday was a soft one.
Last edited by VinceWLB on Sat 21 Nov 2015, 10:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
VinceWLB- Posts : 3841
Join date : 2012-10-14
Re: The "no arms" tackle
VinceWLB wrote:Although i'm not a ref and certainly don't intend to become one. This is a yellow in both case under the new rules directive but we all know Jacques Burger can get away with basically anything he wants.
Burger was the one that was penalised.
Chunky Norwich- Posts : 4409
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Re: The "no arms" tackle
Chunky Norwich wrote:VinceWLB wrote:Although i'm not a ref and certainly don't intend to become one. This is a yellow in both case under the new rules directive but we all know Jacques Burger can get away with basically anything he wants.
Burger was the one that was penalised.
And should have received a yellow card in the process.
VinceWLB- Posts : 3841
Join date : 2012-10-14
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Both should have received yellows then I guess if that is what the laws say. To me the tackles looked identical. Different refs/different interpretations.
stub- Posts : 2226
Join date : 2013-01-31
Re: The "no arms" tackle
The only thing I'd say (based on the evidence above) is that in the Burger tackle its actually his arm that is in contact with the guy being, shall we say, 'tripped'. In the first instance its the tackler's shoulder.
lostinwales- lostinwales
- Posts : 13270
Join date : 2011-06-09
Location : Out of Wales :)
Re: The "no arms" tackle
lostinwales wrote:The only thing I'd say (based on the evidence above) is that in the Burger tackle its actually his arm that is in contact with the guy being, shall we say, 'tripped'. In the first instance its the tackler's shoulder.
True, Burger is certainly tackling a good bit lower which could perhaps be construed as a trip. That said the top one looks like the elbow kind of makes most contact.
stub- Posts : 2226
Join date : 2013-01-31
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Does Dan Lydiate ever use his arms? His 'tackling' should be carded every single time.
Cyril- Posts : 7162
Join date : 2012-11-16
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Cyril wrote:Does Dan Lydiate ever use his arms? His 'tackling' should be carded every single time.
The reason for the crack down on no arms tackles was the number of players being injured by what we're really shoulder charges, disguised as tackles. Unfortunately the small minded people who administer the game have yet again taken things too far. In my opinion neither of the tackles above or any that I recall by Lydiate are dangerous, they are chop tackles and trip up the ball carrier. I am really frustrated that an innocuous trip tackle is being treated in the same way as a kick or shoulder charge to the head, this is simply crazy and does nothing to reduce the risk of serious injury to players!
Seagultaf- Posts : 1404
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Ospreylia
Re: The "no arms" tackle
What about Dan Lydiate hyperextending Conor Murray's knee last season through one of his "chop" tackles?
Rory_Gallagher- Posts : 11324
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 31
Location : Belfast
Re: The "no arms" tackle
It's rare that I've seen Dan Lydiate commit a no-arms tackle. On the occasions that he did it very luckily went unnoticed.
mikey_dragon- Posts : 15227
Join date : 2015-07-25
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Rory_Gallagher wrote:What about Dan Lydiate hyperextending Conor Murray's knee last season through one of his "chop" tackles?
Webb experienced exactly the same injury against Italy and is still out injured, there was and is no suggestion that this was due to foul play. Rugby is a physical game and players will get unlucky injuries from perfectly legal tackles, we could I suppose remove all physicality and call the game soccer?
In my opinion hyper extension of the knee is actually more likely when the arms wrap around and trap the lower limb than if it's a trip tackle. What the game needs to do is to look at ways of reducing or preventing head injuries, as these have the potential to be life changing or (as has happened recently) life ending.
Seagultaf- Posts : 1404
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Location : Ospreylia
Re: The "no arms" tackle
"Any referees here? Can anyone explain why one of these is a penalty. And the other isn't? Both were from this weekend's games, and both times, the referee stopped the game to look at the offences. Thanks."
One ref got it wrong, the other got it right. It's called inconsistent reffing.
Next topic!!!!!!
One ref got it wrong, the other got it right. It's called inconsistent reffing.
Next topic!!!!!!
Pete330v2- Posts : 4460
Join date : 2012-05-04
Re: The "no arms" tackle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yz7fXJzCYo0
It is difficult to see if he does wrap the arms, but it is a late tackle, straight to the knee when the player isn't expecting it.
It is difficult to see if he does wrap the arms, but it is a late tackle, straight to the knee when the player isn't expecting it.
Rory_Gallagher- Posts : 11324
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 31
Location : Belfast
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Pete330v2 wrote:"Any referees here? Can anyone explain why one of these is a penalty. And the other isn't? Both were from this weekend's games, and both times, the referee stopped the game to look at the offences. Thanks."
One ref got it wrong, the other got it right. It's called inconsistent reffing.
Next topic!!!!!!
Cheers for your insight. A true rugby visionary.
Chunky Norwich- Posts : 4409
Join date : 2011-12-08
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Re: The "no arms" tackle
Chunky Norwich wrote:Pete330v2 wrote:"Any referees here? Can anyone explain why one of these is a penalty. And the other isn't? Both were from this weekend's games, and both times, the referee stopped the game to look at the offences. Thanks."
One ref got it wrong, the other got it right. It's called inconsistent reffing.
Next topic!!!!!!
Cheers for your insight. A true rugby visionary.
It's a pleasure, don't mention it, we will miss you when the Mods ban you very soon
Pete330v2- Posts : 4460
Join date : 2012-05-04
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Rory_Gallagher wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yz7fXJzCYo0
It is difficult to see if he does wrap the arms, but it is a late tackle, straight to the knee when the player isn't expecting it.
If that's late and dirty, Furlong's on AW Jones is late and dirty.
Chunky Norwich- Posts : 4409
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Re: The "no arms" tackle
Seagultaf wrote:Rory_Gallagher wrote:What about Dan Lydiate hyperextending Conor Murray's knee last season through one of his "chop" tackles?
Webb experienced exactly the same injury against Italy and is still out injured, there was and is no suggestion that this was due to foul play. Rugby is a physical game and players will get unlucky injuries from perfectly legal tackles, we could I suppose remove all physicality and call the game soccer?
In my opinion hyper extension of the knee is actually more likely when the arms wrap around and trap the lower limb than if it's a trip tackle. What the game needs to do is to look at ways of reducing or preventing head injuries, as these have the potential to be life changing or (as has happened recently) life ending.
I should add that I think Dan Lydiate has the best tackling technique in the game, and the so called chop tackle is only one string to his bow. I think that the shoulder charge to the knee area is a creeping issue in the game however as it can cause some serious damage. I for one am glad to see it get penalised as I want to see players have a long and prosperous career.
Rory_Gallagher- Posts : 11324
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 31
Location : Belfast
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Never liked this rule, never will.
We constantly see "no arms" rugby league style chest level tackles get unpunished so why tackles below belt level be punished?
We constantly see "no arms" rugby league style chest level tackles get unpunished so why tackles below belt level be punished?
VinceWLB- Posts : 3841
Join date : 2012-10-14
Re: The "no arms" tackle
VinceWLB wrote:Never liked this rule, never will.
We constantly see "no arms" rugby league style chest level tackles get unpunished so why tackles below belt level be punished?
Billy Vunipola received a yellow card for a very debatable rugby league style tackle on Friday night. It is getting looked at as well.
Rory_Gallagher- Posts : 11324
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Re: The "no arms" tackle
Whether, in theory, eith of the tackles were legal as specified in the Laws, both have the potential to be dangerous and both, therefore, should be penalised. No arms, shoulders in the knee area. Bin 'em both.
doctor_grey- Posts : 11870
Join date : 2011-04-30
Re: The "no arms" tackle
Rory_Gallagher wrote:VinceWLB wrote:Never liked this rule, never will.
We constantly see "no arms" rugby league style chest level tackles get unpunished so why tackles below belt level be punished?
Billy Vunipola received a yellow card for a very debatable rugby league style tackle on Friday night. It is getting looked at as well.
Awful decision. If that's yellow, then there's 8 or 9 yellows a game.
Chunky Norwich- Posts : 4409
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Re: The "no arms" tackle
Chunky - do you ever have anything positive to say about rugby? Why don't you go away?
TJ- Posts : 8523
Join date : 2013-09-22
Re: The "no arms" tackle
I have no idea how that could be considered a yellow and at the same time a blatant no arm tackle/shoulder to the face of a Glasgow player goes unpunished
cakeordeath- Posts : 1945
Join date : 2012-11-25
Re: The "no arms" tackle
doctor_grey wrote:Whether, in theory, eith of the tackles were legal as specified in the Laws, both have the potential to be dangerous and both, therefore, should be penalised. No arms, shoulders in the knee area. Bin 'em both.
Rory_Gallagher- Posts : 11324
Join date : 2011-09-18
Age : 31
Location : Belfast
Re: The "no arms" tackle
cakeordeath wrote:I have no idea how that could be considered a yellow and at the same time a blatant no arm tackle/shoulder to the face of a Glasgow player goes unpunished
One ref got it right and one didn't?
SecretFly- Posts : 31800
Join date : 2011-12-12
Re: The "no arms" tackle
In the Bath match, T'eo (I think) had a bit of a shoulder charge on Roko and no penalty or review plus Healy had a tackle reviewed by the referee which was deemed OK but seems to have a distinct lack of arms (may be more clumsy).
In the Sarries match, Burger was pinged when he got at least one and bit arms there, much more convincing than Healy's.
For Northampton, early on Waller got pinged when again seeming to use both arms. I rather agree the tackle towards was a bit marginal.
I gather referees on trying to clam-down but not always very consistent.
In the Sarries match, Burger was pinged when he got at least one and bit arms there, much more convincing than Healy's.
For Northampton, early on Waller got pinged when again seeming to use both arms. I rather agree the tackle towards was a bit marginal.
I gather referees on trying to clam-down but not always very consistent.
cb- Posts : 384
Join date : 2012-05-10
Re: The "no arms" tackle
VinceWLB wrote:Chunky Norwich wrote:VinceWLB wrote:Although i'm not a ref and certainly don't intend to become one. This is a yellow in both case under the new rules directive but we all know Jacques Burger can get away with basically anything he wants.
Burger was the one that was penalised.
And should have received a yellow card in the process.
And he did get away with a late, no arms, shoulder charge to the soft dangly bits of an LI player a few weeks back ...
Heaf- Posts : 6901
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