2nd Test, South Africa vs England; Cape Town 2nd-6th January

First topic message reminder :

South Africa (from):
H Amla (c), Q De Kock (wkt), AB De Villiers (wkt), K Abbott, T Bavuma, JP Duminy, F Du Plessis, D Elgar, M Morkel, C Morris, D Piedt, Rabada, R Rossouw, S Van Zyl, H Viljoen.

England (from):
A Cook (c), A Hales, N Compton, J Root, J Taylor, B Stokes, J Bairstow (wkt), M Ali, C Woakes, S Broad, S Finn, J Anderson, S Patel, C Jordan, M Footitt, J Butler, G Ballance.


Umpires: A Dar (Pak), B Oxenford (Aus)

Third umpire: R Tucker (Aus)

Match referee: R Madugalle (Sri Lanka)

Hammersmith harrier wrote:One of the older guys might be able to help out here but when was the last time an England keeper reached 150; Jones, Prior, Russell and Stewart never did.

Oh yes he did - http://www.cricketweb.net/statsspider/test/1351.php - the highest individual score ever by an England w/k, apparently. Next highest, also Alec Stewart, was this - http://www.cricketweb.net/statsspider/test/1420.php. Jonny B is now 3rd, just ahead of Leslie Ames who made 148*.

(PS: Who are you calling old? )

Did you not watch the India tour?

It could be worse... We could have been like Spain defending their #1 ness

Amla looks set for a big un here

kingraf wrote:Did you not watch the India tour?

It could be worse... We could have been like Spain defending their #1 ness

No I never saw it but the results speak for themselves. I suppose it is inevitable that the way the rankings work it doesn't always give an accurate depiction of who is the best team in the world.

259, run out off a dropped catch and now bowling straight to first slip. Ben Stokes is a hero

He is certainly must watch

Olly wrote:259, run out off a dropped catch and now bowling straight to first slip. Ben Stokes is a hero

Stokes now weighs in with a wicket.

Beginning to suspect Ben Stokes might win man of the match

Fine catch from Compton

Stokes can do no wrong...

England will have to work for wickets on this true surface...but if they can shift one of these two tonight they'll sleep well.

Oh dear Joe root

That was a sitter.

ABs probably good enough to get his own runs without us giving him lives.

South Africa will take losing only two wickets at close of play. It steadies what was a rocking ship and if they can bat through tomorrow then a draw will be a nailed on certainty.

Three wickets fell today. Two of them were run outs. Errol Flynn needs a whole to crawl under.

SimonofSurrey wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:One of the older guys might be able to help out here but when was the last time an England keeper reached 150; Jones, Prior, Russell and Stewart never did.

Oh yes he did - http://www.cricketweb.net/statsspider/test/1351.php - the highest individual score ever by an England w/k, apparently. Next highest, also Alec Stewart, was this - http://www.cricketweb.net/statsspider/test/1420.php. Jonny B is now 3rd, just ahead of Leslie Ames who made 148*.

(PS: Who are you calling old? )

I always had it in my head that his 170 against Pakistan was his highest score, only happened three times which is very surprising.

First few overs this morning haven't yielded any drama...

Amla looks very sound. AB a bit more inclined to nibble , edged one from Finn but to ground short of slips.

Think England will need to be both inventive and patient today.

Soon as I post that , Finn has AB looking decidedly uncomfortable for an over : an attempted pull nearly looping to mid wicket , and a couple of slightly awkward defensive moments...good over.

Very disciplined attack from England...just twenty runs in 13 overs so far; and most of them in the first over of the day.

Game of patience.

That drop by root last night a potentially match defining miss

alfie wrote:Very disciplined attack from England...just twenty runs in 13 overs so far; and most of them in the first over of the day.

Game of patience.

Very much so. Not just for England but also the SA batters and the crowd.

I would be interested to know the readings for today from Craig's road map.

Good session for SA ; through to lunch without loss ... but in truth that was the minimum requirement for them today. Next session is the big one : if Amla and AB take over , and the bowlers tire ; the evening session could see England's chances of forcing a win fade rapidly.
On the other hand : new ball in nine overs - if a break is made it could be quickly enlarged...lot of time left in this match.
Think England need two wickets in this session to stay on top.

England doing excellently to deprive South Africa of an expansive flow of runs on an exquisite batting track.

New ball soon - can England force a wicket or two? They're still 400 ahead.

Fielding has cost England dear so far

Quite a contrast with Sunday ...Amla and AB did a brilliant job for SA and have nearly made the draw a strong favourite .
England have bowled well with no help from the pitch ; but missing three chances has cost them.
Not out of it yet : get one more now and they still might fancy rolling up the later order ; but it's been hard work , and the bowlers will have lost their freshness by now - as will this ball shortly.
Need a bit of magic from someone ...one of those Broad spells ? We can hope...

alfie wrote:Quite a contrast with Sunday ...Amla and AB did a brilliant job for SA and have nearly made the draw a strong favourite .
England have bowled well with no help from the pitch ; but missing three chances has cost them.
Not out of it yet : get one more now and they still might fancy rolling up the later order ; but it's been hard work , and the bowlers will have lost their freshness by now - as will this ball shortly.
Need a bit of magic from someone ...one of those Broad spells ? We can hope...

Not been able to watch much today but the magic so far seems to be of a much more restrained variety and coming from Amla.

Seems a bit early to call it ... But this pitch is looking so good , I don't expect it to spin like a top even on Wednesday. Watching the way these two are playing - so comfortably ; can't see anything but a draw. Had a couple of catches been held we'd at least have seen SA been set a fourth innings target (though I suspect England would still have been hard pressed to take 20 wickets ) ; but as it is I'd imagine this is going to fizzle right out.

At least we had fireworks on Sunday and some tension this morning.
But ultimately , the pitch is just a bit too good.

Goodnight anyone else watching...

Was travelling yesterday and was following Stokes' innings on the phone now and and then. Sensational effort from young Stokes! He's a special talent. Soneone in the range of Andrew Flintoff and Kevin Pietersen. England haven't had a good history of managing such special players, they shouldn't snuff him out on silly regimented logics.......
Amla is trying to save face for his side and AB chipped in as he always does. Even Faf has looked like capable of holding a bit! South Africa still a long way behind.......

England have kept South Africa on a leash, in spite of some excellent application from the home batsmen.

So, you know, one inspired spell and England can still triumph.

A rather forlorn hope.

What a substandard, atrocious pitch though! Can play a stupid timeless test on this one. And though the South African team didn't talk a lot of nonsense, the commentators were doing exactly that when they were playing in India. Give me even the Nagpur track over this flat monster.......

msp83 wrote:Was travelling yesterday and was following Stokes' innings on the phone now and and then. Sensational effort from young Stokes! He's a special talent. Soneone in the range of Andrew Flintoff and Kevin Pietersen. England haven't had a good history of managing such special players, they shouldn't snuff him out on silly regimented logics.......
Amla is trying to save face for his side and AB chipped in as he  always does. Even Faf has looked like capable of holding a bit! South Africa still a long way behind.......

Well, Stokes seems to have his head screwed on pretty well, so far. He doesn't appear to be a booze hound like Freddie, or have a monster ego like KP, so hopefully his international career will be longer and more prosperous.

Flintoff I think fell a bit out of love with cricket and making him skipper didn't do him any favours. With the benefit of hindsight, KP was always an accident waiting to happen.

SA batting without a sense of purpose here. Going nowhere, and they are still nearly 300 away from England. Strange and stupid......

I wonder if they're getting in some much needed practice. I did think that there were only two results possible after stokes nutty innings maybe the Saffers have decided that they need time out on the square and they might as well get it while they can. A bit lacking in ambition but it might prove fruitful.

Not sure the pitch is that bad.

Some great innings, combined with some fairly rank fielding at times.

At 353-3, South Africa are still in with a chance to draw this one. But their rather negative approach in the last hour or so means that England are just a South African collapse away from making it back in total control. South Africa will not only have to take time out of the game, they have to come closer to England's 629 as well if they have to have a chance, otherwise 2 days are far too much to manage a blockathon.......

Cooks going to bat again after a day and a half in the field regardless

Considering only 9 wickets have fallen in three days (two run outs), struggling to see England taking the 17 they need for victory in two days

I would have thought SA might be keen to give us an hour's batting in the final session tomorrow and see what happens.

Assuming SA can get that far, declare maybe 50 in arrears and try to have us 2 or 3 down at the close - outside chance but this Test could still have an interesting end.

Wait and see how much the pitch detoriorates. The experts were all convinced it would suddenly become a minefield. Dissapointing performance form Englands bowlers ( drop Stokes, he still averages in the mid 40s its just not good enough ) and more so from the fielders ( drop Stokes, wasnt he picked for his fielding? ). If they can get their lives together SA have a weak underbelly and only have "all rounders" left once you are past Amla (isnt he shot? ) And Faf ( who was never any good in the first place ). I mean its not like you would expect a bowler and a wicketkeeper to put on a 300 stand is it?
Oh.

Think Guildford has it about right. if we can get to within a 100 runs only one team can win. We'll probably declare (if we're still in) and then pray to baby Jesus that England collapse. They've collapsed before for about 100 on what I thought was a pretty placid Lord's pitch. Don't think it will happen... but hey

999-9 the score so far, on the road strip, Patta-Pitch imported from Pune.

Great advertisement for Test cricket

Anderson has bowled 27 over for nothing when bowling with a monumental 600+ to play with....confirms how barren the pitch is and that for all his great record, he needs something..... just a little bit in the pitch to have any effect at all.

the Pitch and overall 1000 run score-line scoreline so far takes a bit of sheen off the otherwise and still a highly amazing knock from Stokes

One thing this road does offer for forcing a victory is the potential to blitz a lead or chase with the second innings. If SA can get the lead below 100 then bowl England out for around 200 then a chase of 300 in quick time on this isn't out of the question. Especially when it could be lead by their ODI top four of De Kock, Amla, FDP and ABDV.

Similarly for England, if we could bowl SA out in this innings with a lead of 150 then smashing a quickfire 200/250 before having a crack at SA with a decent number of overs.

Realistically I can't see either happening but the former seems more likely just now. Cook has become far more proactive in his captaincy but I just can't see the order being jigged with Root, Taylor etc bumped above Compton to try to kick start things to get a lead rapidly.

Hopefully something happens though because a tepid 5 day draw with barely 20 wickets taken in it is not what cricket needs in a rare highly anticipated test series.

Some imaginative scenarios being painted here

Would be nice to think some action might take place to entertain the fans over these last two days ... but does anyone seriously think either side is suddenly going to lose ten wickets for under 200 on this in less than a day ?

For SA to get within 100 at current rates will take until tea. On what we saw in the first innings their chances of then dismissing England in under two sessions appear rather remote. And any thoughts that SA might get careless and collapse this morning have already been shown to be fantasy - so England are unlikely to be batting much before the close tonight.

Now consider : if SA can bat until after lunch tomorrow - they might lead by , what 100 ? Still pushing it to see them then skit tiling England even if the pitch suddenly develops fangs.

Sorry...can't see anything but a bore draw from here. Not complaining too much : we've seen some electric batting from Stokes and then a monumental effort of concentration from Amla ; but it might not be a bad thing if we could import some of that rain from Sydney and put the later stages out of their misery...

Nope I can't honestly see it Alfie. Stranger things have happened and all that but bottom line this pitch is giving nothing.

I'm glad to hear that the groundsmen have openly admitted they have prepared a poor pitch and stated their frustration at it. So often when batting paradises are presented you hear officials from said ground steadfastly stating that it's an excellent pitch whilst the groundsmen are told to sit quietly. Here the groundsmen have stated that they hoped the cracks would open up and crumble to provide something for seam and spin. Unfortunately they haven't. Plus of course nothing has swung.

It will be a real surprise if either side took much risk to force a win. After a first innings of 629 to follow SA will be happy with a draw. With a 1-0 lead under their belts England likewise won't view a draw as the end of the world.

Good predictions chaps!

LondonTiger wrote:SA surely cannot play as spinelessly again, while we all know just how inconsistent England tend to be.

Cook almost guaranteed to lose the toss

Duty281 wrote:South Africa are in a terrible struggle at the moment - 4 out of the last 5 tests lost; Steyn gone; a batting order largely out of form.

England are in good spirits. An emphatic victory in the last game, still enjoying the triumph that resulted against Australia, and they have Anderson back. With lots of questions, being rightfully asked, posed about their consistency, motivation will be at an extreme high.

South Africa are bound to crumble again.

msp83 wrote: As we know South Africa are just not able to put the runs on the board these days.......

kingraf wrote:Stiaan will show you this Test Msp. He IS THE HYPE. Can almost guarantee Bavuma is gonna get the chop.

kingraf wrote:England bat first.
2-0

To be fait to Stiaan. The run was on

I'm guessing the cricket isn't the only thing that's moving slowly today Gooseberry...

an inning of character....from Amla

The pitch notwithstanding....there was pressure...of 629 runs.....of 4 or 5 losses in a row...of personal bad form.....of question marks on captaincy.....and he overcame all of that to produce 200 runs.....exuding character and temperament.

king_carlos wrote:Nope I can't honestly see it Alfie. Stranger things have happened and all that but bottom line this pitch is giving nothing.

I'm glad to hear that the groundsmen have openly admitted they have prepared a poor pitch and stated their frustration at it. So often when batting paradises are presented you hear officials from said ground steadfastly stating that it's an excellent pitch whilst the groundsmen are told to sit quietly. Here the groundsmen have stated that they hoped the cracks would open up and crumble to provide something for seam and spin. Unfortunately they haven't. Plus of course nothing has swung.

It will be a real surprise if either side took much risk to force a win. After a first innings of 629 to follow SA will be happy with a draw. With a 1-0 lead under their belts England likewise won't view a draw as the end of the world.

Interesting to hear those comments from the groundsman. Funny thing is , on day one I had high hopes for this pitch : there was pace and bounce , and Piedt actually turned a few balls sharply ... I expected a day or two would be excellent for batting but we would see spin and reverse come into effect as the game went on ...looks as if this pitch might start to deteriorate around next Sunday...

Quite apart from the risk factor in setting any target on this , I suspect England will not even want to bowl again here - that is if they ever get SA out in this innings. SA bowlers are well rested by now so they'll have a good go when this innings eventually ends ; but unless England commit mass suicide it is hard to see them folding up completely : I don't see any Warne or McGrath at this game ...

Third new ball due straight after lunch. Lucky for Amla he has his 200 else how would he cope with the pressure ?
Two more to save the follow on

KP_fan wrote:an inning of character....from Amla

The pitch notwithstanding....there was pressure...of 629 runs.....of 4 or 5 losses in a row...of personal bad form.....of question marks on captaincy.....and he overcame all of that to produce 200 runs.....exuding character and temperament.

Absolutely. All jokes aside , Amla has shown his true class in this match : he may not be the best captain around in terms of tactics or on field animation ; but he has led his side to safety by his own example and strength of will.

Well played indeed.

Issue for England now is, if we even get a chance to bat again and set a target, what score is safe on this pitch? Especially after seeing Stokes and Bairstow go at it on the 2nd morning. For example, would you feel confident leaving 300 with 2 sessions? If the opening pair batted through the first session and the new ball for 100 odd, they could definitely give it a go.

Even if SA were to declare 100 behind at tea, I'm struggling to see how England force a result. Cook won't take huge risks while 1-0 up in an away series.

Well played Amla, I think he's secured the draw for his side. I think SA will try to get level today, throw the bat at everything tomorrow morning to get a lead and then put England back in with 1.5-2 sessions to go to see if they can bowl us out cheaply and force a result.