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Best number 8 in the world?

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Best number 8 in the world?

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Post by PotNoodleMiner Wed 02 Mar 2016, 1:19 pm

With so many world class number 8s about at the moment its probably the strongest position in terms of player quality in the world right now so just out of curiosity to see who gets the majority vote, who would you say is the best 8 in the world at the moment?

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Post by Tattie Scones RRN Wed 02 Mar 2016, 1:21 pm

Who TF voted Denton?

He's not even the best No 8 in Scotland.

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Post by RubyGuby Wed 02 Mar 2016, 1:27 pm

Silly question, it has to be the welsh fella Vunipolo who's now ripping up trees for the RWC Champions elect
thumbsup

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Post by Alex_Germany Wed 02 Mar 2016, 1:34 pm

Parisse? He can't even kick a drop goal from 35m!

Though it would be interesting to see him playing for a top side.

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Post by englandglory4ever Wed 02 Mar 2016, 1:42 pm

If you think you know something about rugby then Read is your man. He's been the best for several years.

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Post by Galted Wed 02 Mar 2016, 1:45 pm

englandglory4ever wrote:If you think you know something about rugby then Read is your man. He's been the best for several years.

And if you know you know something about rugby then Vermeulen is your man. He's been the best for several years.
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Post by funnyExiledScot Wed 02 Mar 2016, 1:59 pm

1. Read
2. Vermeulen
3. Parisse




172. Denton

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Post by aucklandlaurie Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:02 pm

Id would pick David Pocock as a number 8 before some of those named above.

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Post by Mad for Chelsea Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:07 pm

two people voted for Denton Laugh

went for Vermeulen, though close between him and Read IMO. Pocock also deserves a mention, albeit some would argue he isn't really a number 8...

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Post by PotNoodleMiner Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:07 pm

For me its got to be Parisse, hes been consistently world class many years and looks like hes in the best shape of his career at the moment, hes got all the skills, high work rate and has a huge influence on his team, if he was an all black he would be regarded as the best 8 theres ever been

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Post by funnyExiledScot Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:09 pm

Pocock is a special player, no question. Reminds me of George Smith in that he can play pretty much anywhere in the back row and be extremely effective.

Doing a "Best number 7 in the world?" thread would be rather pointless. With McCaw retired it's more a question of "After Pocock, who is the best number 7 in the world?".

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Post by aucklandlaurie Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:11 pm

PotNoodleMiner wrote:For me its got to be Parisse, hes been consistently world class many years and looks like hes in the best shape of his career at the moment, hes got all the skills, high work rate and has a huge influence on his team, if he was an all black he would be regarded as the best 8 theres ever been


Would you really rate him better than Buck????

Parisse couldnt cut Bucks lunch.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:15 pm

Not sure that there are many on here that can lay claim to seeing much of Buck Shelford!!

Zinzan Brooke I'll give you.

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Post by rodders Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:17 pm

aucklandlaurie wrote: Id would pick David Pocock as a number 8 before some of those named above.

I'd pick him before them all! Well maybe not Reid.

Pocock
Reid
Vermulan
Parisse
Vainapolo
The fella who plays for wasps
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Post by englandglory4ever Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:17 pm

Parisse is your man if you like the froth more than the actual coffee. He'd win show pony of the year award hands down.

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Post by GeordieFalcon Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:18 pm

aucklandlaurie wrote:
PotNoodleMiner wrote:For me its got to be Parisse, hes been consistently world class many years and looks like hes in the best shape of his career at the moment, hes got all the skills, high work rate and has a huge influence on his team, if he was an all black he would be regarded as the best 8 theres ever been


Would you really rate him better than Buck????

Parisse couldnt cut Bucks lunch.

Most people seem to think Valentine is the best AB 8 ever. Id say Buck personally.

But Parisse would defo be up there. He would be awesome in an AB team.

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Post by aucklandlaurie Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:18 pm

Michael Jones was a bloody good Number 8 as well, well miles more talented than Parisse will ever be.

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Post by GeordieFalcon Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:21 pm

So Aukland...basically what your saying if he's not An Ab then hes rubbish and not fit to clean an AB's shoes.

picard

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Post by lostinwales Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:23 pm

It also depends on what you want from your no.8. Link man and all round workhorse, heavy duty carrier etc

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Post by PotNoodleMiner Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:23 pm

I just think he does all the things any of the other 8s can do plus hes got a skill set better than most northern hemisphere backs add in his leadership qualities and you've got the complete package, if he had players around him as good as the all black players he would get even more recognition and would be rugbys messi

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Post by aucklandlaurie Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:25 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:So Aukland...basically what your saying if he's not An Ab then hes rubbish and not fit to clean an AB's shoes.

picard

No what Im saying is that Parisse would not be the best All Black number 8 ever, if he was an All Black, which was Potnoodles claim.

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Post by marty2086 Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:29 pm

Mad for Chelsea wrote: Pocock also deserves a mention, albeit some would argue he isn't really a number 8...

I bet those saying that wouldn't mind him playing there for their team

Vunipola has looked great in the 6Ns with the workload shared around the back row and him being able to carry more one of the reasons Read looks good for the ABs so imagine Parisse beside Kaino and McCaw Drool

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Post by GeordieFalcon Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:29 pm

Maybe not the best ever but it would be interesting to see.

He's been a stand out in a woeful side.


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Post by LondonTiger Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:43 pm

I must admit that I voted for Denton. Mainly because I think polls like this are crazy.

Once upon a time I rated Parisse, but that was before hebstarted believing hisbown hype. Nowadays he is a preening prima dona who cares more forbhis appearance than the team performance. A man who would rather risknlosing the team a try by rippingbthe ball from a colleague so he can score the try. A man whotakes a crazy drop gial rather than be patient because he wantsvtge glory. A kan who can't be arsed to do the defensive duties, or clear out rucks and mauls because he wants tobstand in the backs.


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Post by Hazel Sapling Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:49 pm

For me it is between Read or Parisse. I gave it to Parisse who is leading players who are regularly beaten by Cardiff at club level and making them competitive (at least for an hour) against tier 1 nations. He also led Stade to the Top 14 last year.

Read is immense but plays with an incredible team around him for the All Blacks and that makes it hard to assess. You could put a squad level 8 there and he will look good. His play for the Crusaders was fantastic however he is not dragging them across the finish line as much as Parisse does.

Vermeulen is 3rd for me as injuries and form have dropped him a bit from his earlier highs. In form, he is in the conversation.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Wed 02 Mar 2016, 2:51 pm

aucklandlaurie wrote:Michael Jones was a bloody good Number 8 as well, well miles more talented than Parisse will ever be.

I thought Jones played 7 with Brooke at 8?

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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 02 Mar 2016, 3:12 pm

RubyGuby wrote:Silly question, it has to be the welsh fella Vunipolo who's now ripping up trees for the RWC Champions elect
thumbsup

Plus one.

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Post by beshocked Wed 02 Mar 2016, 3:21 pm

Read is the obvious winner.

If I was going to put those no 8s in order.

Read
Vunipola
Parisse
Vermeulen
Faletau
Picamoles
Lobbe
Heaslip



Denton

I put Billy that high because in last year's 6 nations he topped most of the stats, IMO he was the best forward. Played every minute of every game. He's been very consistent - was IMO England's most valuable forward in the RWC, big performance against Fiji off the bench and as a starter vs Wales till his injury, barnstorming start to the 6 nations with two man of the match performances.

Form wise he's up there, of course he's not got the track record of others but can't argue with his international form.

http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries/england-countries/six-nations-player-analysis-billy-vunipola-england-44095

Billy made 21 tackles in that game.... people think he's just a one dimensional ball carrier.

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Wed 02 Mar 2016, 3:36 pm

As it stands right now the v2 pecking order of votes is:

Read
Parisse
Denton
Vermeulen
Faletau
Vunipola
Picamoles


I do like Vunipola, he seems to be a complete player. Toby is getting a fair bit of praise recently for his defensive work, but IMO that is because his game with ball in hand has gone backwards.
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Post by TightHEAD Wed 02 Mar 2016, 3:48 pm

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:Who TF voted Denton?

He's not even the best No 8 in Scotland.


or Bath
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Post by Cyril Wed 02 Mar 2016, 3:53 pm

Nathan Hughes should be in that list.

What about Samu Manoa? How's he getting on at Toulon and is he playing lock or 8?

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Post by geoff999rugby Wed 02 Mar 2016, 4:00 pm

Denton does not belong in that company - a reserve in a struggling Aviva outfit

As someone said Hughes is right up there and Faletau has been the best in the 6Nations

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Post by Barney McGrew did it Wed 02 Mar 2016, 4:03 pm

I too don't totally buy the Parisse love-in. He's a great athlete and excellent rugby player, but doesn't seem to like the rough stuff. He seems to pop pass before taking contact most times.

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Post by Cyril Wed 02 Mar 2016, 4:08 pm

Parisse also seems to hold up a lot of imaginary cards. A very annoying trait.

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Post by beshocked Wed 02 Mar 2016, 4:15 pm

geoff Hughes is an excellent club no 8 but needs to make the step up to international level.

I wouldn't say he's up there when he hasn't proven himself yet.

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Post by fa0019 Wed 02 Mar 2016, 4:46 pm

Top 3 for me.

Read
Vermeulen
Faletau

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Post by BamBam Wed 02 Mar 2016, 5:08 pm

I'd go

Read
Vermeulen



Vunipola, Parisse, Faletau, Picamoles


Heaslip, Denton, Lobbe

Read and Vermeulen are the 2 best by a fair way for me, then the next 4 are all excellent and often unplayable on their day and Vunipola/Faletau could definitely push on to be up there with the top 2

Heaslip was in tier 2 not too long ago, but I actually think Stander is the better 8 at the moment

Lobbe would be higher, but he played flanker at the RWC didn't he? Facundo Isa (sp) looks a real talent at 6/8 for Argentina though

Hughes/Stander/Du Preez could all be in this list in a year's time

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Post by Exiledinborders Wed 02 Mar 2016, 5:38 pm

It is very difficult to judge. Read looks good but that is in a pack that pretty much always on the front foot. Parisse manages to look good stuck between a poor pack and a poor backline.

On balance I would rate Parisse the best.

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Post by Fanster Wed 02 Mar 2016, 5:44 pm

fa0019 wrote:Top 3 for me.

Read
Vermeulen
Faletau

Have to agree, I think Read is up there, and stand alone, Falatau is probably one of the best all rounders in the game outside of Read.

Vermeulans physicality is immense, and Vunipolas recent form ball in hand unreal, I just don't think these 2 offer more than one stand out attribute.

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Post by majesticimperialman Wed 02 Mar 2016, 5:50 pm

The best NO 8 in the world Kieran Read.


The best NO 8 in the NH is between Billy V, and Toby F, from Wales.

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Post by Pot Hale Wed 02 Mar 2016, 6:12 pm

The poll should be altered to a ranking one.   If there's only one choice, then I don't think many people would choose beyond Kieron Read, unless they're highly blinkered.

I also think Heaslip remains one of the most under-rated 8s in the game.   He's not even universally popular in his own country, but he has been one of the team's most consistent performers.   It would be a good thing if he was under pressure for his spot, like any professional should be, but I'd rate him higher than some of the others in the poll list, if that's what we're confined to.

1. Read
2. Parisse
2. Vermuelen
3. Faleteau
4. Heaslip
4. Picamoles
5. Vunipola
6. Lobbe
7. Denton
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Post by Rory_Gallagher Wed 02 Mar 2016, 6:25 pm

Fanster wrote:
fa0019 wrote:Top 3 for me.

Read
Vermeulen
Faletau

Have to agree, I think Read is up there, and stand alone, Falatau is probably one of the best all rounders in the game outside of Read.

Vermeulans physicality is immense, and Vunipolas recent form ball in hand unreal, I just don't think these 2 offer more than one stand out attribute.

The same Vermeulen who is probably the best 8 on the deck bar Pocock when he plays there? Who frequently leads the tackle count? The same Vunipola who was 3rd top tackler in last year's Six Nations?

The statistics tell a different story.

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Post by Recwatcher16 Wed 02 Mar 2016, 6:46 pm

Denton at Bath has been a complete disappointment. His carrying from no.8 has been dismantled by AP opponents, resulting in him shifting to no.6 and Houston being reinstated at no.8.
When  Faletau arrives next season Denton should be sent packing otherwise Houston will up sticks back to Oz as he has been name checked as a player Cheika wants back in an Oz franchise.

Best English 8 (pre the current rugby league,without the sixth tackle, era)- who never lost a 6N game ?  


Dean Richards.

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Post by Recwatcher16 Wed 02 Mar 2016, 6:49 pm

Best current rugby league exponent; Read.

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Post by Gwlad Thu 03 Mar 2016, 12:05 am

3 for Billy

That's one vote per game since the English press decided he was going to be The Best In The World.

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Post by BamBam Thu 03 Mar 2016, 12:19 am

6 for Faletau.. 3 more than Duane frickin Vermeulen?!!!!

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Post by englandglory4ever Thu 03 Mar 2016, 8:18 am

Gwlad wrote:3 for Billy

That's one vote per game since the English press decided he was going to be The Best In The World.

Listen up. Don't anyone dare vote for an England player please. Days and days worth of chippy Welsh posts will fill up this site with anti England jibes. Accompanied by pages of stupid smilies in a childish attempt to seem amusing. Can't take much more of that brain freezing rubbish.

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Post by doctor_grey Thu 03 Mar 2016, 8:51 am

Alex_Germany wrote:Parisse? He can't even kick a drop goal from 35m!

Though it would be interesting to see him playing for a top side.
I agree, Let's get him out of Stade Francais.............

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Post by LondonTiger Thu 03 Mar 2016, 9:33 am

Recwatcher16 wrote:
Best English 8 (pre the current rugby league,without the sixth tackle, era)- who never lost a 6N game ?  


Dean Richards.

He never played a 6Ns game.

Was not unbeaten in 5Ns matches either.

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Post by bluestonevedder Thu 03 Mar 2016, 10:22 am

Read and Vermeulen are streets ahead of any other no.8 in my opinion.

Read for his all-round game, and Vermeulen for his unbelievable carrying power and breakdown work.

Faletau and Vunipola are both edging closer but are still a way behind.

Never seen the fascination with Parisse to be honest. Pulls of the occasional wonder pass and gets a few drop goals, but for me, he shies away from the graft a typical 8 should do.

Denton is a shadow of the player he was when he made his Scotland debut against England. Where's that guy gone??

Love Manoa, but admittedly harder to watch him now he's moved on from Saints.

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