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UFC 200 McGregor vs Diaz 2

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Post by AdamT on Thu 31 Mar 2016, 11:03 am

First topic message reminder :

McGregor gets his chance of revenge at 170. White and Kavanagh wanted him to take the fight at 155, but he is obsessed with avenging the loss at the same weight.

My prediction! 2nd round submission for Diaz. I think he will take control earlier.

Also Aldo v Edgar is announced for the interim 145 title. I pick Edgar by late stoppage.

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Post by Guest on Wed 27 Apr 2016, 3:39 pm

fa0019 wrote:
DAVE667 wrote:
In the end he just believed too much in his own press and became a King Canute type fighter
Common misconception... Canute was a reasonable man but so beloved by his people that he was almost embarrassed by the esteem in which they held him. He said that he was no more capable of doing certain things than he was capable of commanding the sea to retreat. he never actually commanded the sea to retreat, the tale got twisted in the telling.

The comparison doesn't really apply to McGregor but the rest of the post is sound.


tip my cap to you sir if so. OK
Heard it on QI if I'm being totally honest but I'm delighted to have found reason to drop it into conversation.

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Post by Fernando on Wed 27 Apr 2016, 4:02 pm

The fight is officially off as Jon Jones vs Daniel Cormier II has replaced it.

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Post by rodders on Thu 28 Apr 2016, 9:16 am

AdamT wrote:
sohotnot wrote:
rodders wrote:You don't think it was Lawler they were eyeing up?

Listened to in an interview with Kavanagh the other day and this does seem like a genuine enough dispute about the west coast press conferences interfering with their training plans, hard to know though what is staged and not with the UFC.

Another report claimed the fallout was between Conor and Lorenzo and that White isn't involved.

From the sounds of it Jones might not be ready to fight so it looks like there will be more twists yet.

CM did mention fighting Lawler after he Ko's Diaz but there were rumours about GSP coming back and he was ringside for the fight. Diaz believes this was the case. Also rumours were that Diaz would face Lawler after beating CM but the rematch got made instead.

I think there is a possibility that all these press conferences were going to interfere with his training camp but as others have mentioned did CM really want to be going head to head with Diaz again? Its pretty obvious who got under who's skin more last time and how much trash talking can CM really do this time round after the way he was beaten? CM definitely needs a very good fight camp with a good game plan & a very cool head going into the fight this time otherwise its the same result.

Great post. He doesn't want any part of mind games. He knows Diaz will wind him the f**k up. Conor is a typical bully. Lethal at giving it, but does not want to receive it. That goes for striking and trash talk.

I have to say I still admire Conor here - he could easily settle for what he has achieved and toe the company line and rack up the $s.

If you look at his SBG teammates and how they have fared in the UFC, most of them were just happy to have appeared on the roster whereas Conor has been true to his word - he believes he is unique and that attitude is what has got him this far.

I'm still not 100% convinced this hasn't all been staged to avoid an immediate rematch but if not then fair play to McGregor for having the b*lls to stand by his principals.
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Post by fa0019 on Thu 28 Apr 2016, 12:34 pm

rodders wrote:
AdamT wrote:
sohotnot wrote:
rodders wrote:You don't think it was Lawler they were eyeing up?

Listened to in an interview with Kavanagh the other day and this does seem like a genuine enough dispute about the west coast press conferences interfering with their training plans, hard to know though what is staged and not with the UFC.

Another report claimed the fallout was between Conor and Lorenzo and that White isn't involved.

From the sounds of it Jones might not be ready to fight so it looks like there will be more twists yet.

CM did mention fighting Lawler after he Ko's Diaz but there were rumours about GSP coming back and he was ringside for the fight. Diaz believes this was the case. Also rumours were that Diaz would face Lawler after beating CM but the rematch got made instead.

I think there is a possibility that all these press conferences were going to interfere with his training camp but as others have mentioned did CM really want to be going head to head with Diaz again? Its pretty obvious who got under who's skin more last time and how much trash talking can CM really do this time round after the way he was beaten? CM definitely needs a very good fight camp with a good game plan & a very cool head going into the fight this time otherwise its the same result.

Great post. He doesn't want any part of mind games. He knows Diaz will wind him the f**k up. Conor is a typical bully. Lethal at giving it, but does not want to receive it. That goes for striking and trash talk.

I have to say I still admire Conor here - he could easily settle for what he has achieved and toe the company line and rack up the $s.

If you look at his SBG teammates and how they have fared in the UFC, most of them were just happy to have appeared on the roster whereas Conor has been true to his word - he believes he is unique and that attitude is what has got him this far.

I'm still not 100% convinced this hasn't all been staged to avoid an immediate rematch but if not then fair play to McGregor for having the b*lls to stand by his principals.

He was out of line dismissing the whole roster though. Saying he would clean up belt after belt after belt. This wasn't trash talking.. thats individual. McGregor disrespected all the fighters in the brand. It wasn't simply a ballsy persona.
I do respect him for taking the fights but this whole episode has really shown his flaws and actual personality insecurities. He was always a big featherweight, a natural lightweight and he fought a midcard lightweight and gave him everything he could. Its not like he could have fought smarter... he blitzed Diaz with his best yet Diaz simply shrugged and asked.... "that all you got". Not like he can out wrestle him, out work him with BJJ.

He has a British/Irish level of banter/humour which the US isn't really used to. Its a few notches above "come saturday night" and "you're taking food off my kids table" but within the UK & Ireland its nothing beyond a guy who has an acid tongue.

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Post by rodders on Thu 28 Apr 2016, 1:25 pm

fa0019 wrote:
He was out of line dismissing the whole roster though. Saying he would clean up belt after belt after belt. This wasn't trash talking.. thats individual. McGregor disrespected all the fighters in the brand. It wasn't simply a ballsy persona.
I do respect him for taking the fights but this whole episode has really shown his flaws and actual personality insecurities. He was always a big featherweight, a natural lightweight and he fought a midcard lightweight and gave him everything he could. Its not like he could have fought smarter... he blitzed Diaz with his best yet Diaz simply shrugged and asked.... "that all you got". Not like he can out wrestle him, out work him with BJJ.

He has a British/Irish level of banter/humour which the US isn't really used to. Its a few notches above "come saturday night" and "you're taking food off my kids table" but within the UK & Ireland its nothing beyond a guy who has an acid tongue.

I agree with some of that - he is a huge featherweight which has helped him achieve what he has and against bigger guys he's been found out a bit when his striking hasn't finished the job.

The trash talking I believe is just him trying to promote himself and also get under his opponents skins - I don't think it is an act but he is being a caricature of himself so a lot of it needs to be taken with a pinch of salt.

I think he is an exceptionally clever business man and a good fighter but this is a real challenge now in and out of the ring to keep at the top of the game.

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Post by fa0019 on Thu 28 Apr 2016, 1:31 pm

rodders wrote:
fa0019 wrote:
He was out of line dismissing the whole roster though. Saying he would clean up belt after belt after belt. This wasn't trash talking.. thats individual. McGregor disrespected all the fighters in the brand. It wasn't simply a ballsy persona.
I do respect him for taking the fights but this whole episode has really shown his flaws and actual personality insecurities. He was always a big featherweight, a natural lightweight and he fought a midcard lightweight and gave him everything he could. Its not like he could have fought smarter... he blitzed Diaz with his best yet Diaz simply shrugged and asked.... "that all you got". Not like he can out wrestle him, out work him with BJJ.

He has a British/Irish level of banter/humour which the US isn't really used to. Its a few notches above "come saturday night" and "you're taking food off my kids table" but within the UK & Ireland its nothing beyond a guy who has an acid tongue.

I agree with some of that - he is a huge featherweight which has helped him achieve what he has and against bigger guys he's been found out a bit when his striking hasn't finished the job.

The trash talking I believe is just him trying to promote himself and also get under his opponents skins - I don't think it is an act but he is being a caricature of himself so a lot of it needs to be taken with a pinch of salt.

I think he is an exceptionally clever business man and a good fighter but this is a real challenge now in and out of the ring to keep at the top of the game.


I think though part of his hype was that some people actually bought into the whole hype that he was some demi-god. "oh but his punching power etc etc, I think he could really do something all the way up to middleweight".

He's in a tough position. Go back to featherweight and people will simply see him as thus. Sure he will dominate but half his fans will go. He'd get murdered as a welter. Perhaps can compete as a lightweight but given a midcard lightweights simply batted him away like a fly it seems unlikely he would have the same aura.

Stay at welter and he's just a big mouth who gets beat up a lot. He'd become a laughing stock.

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Post by AdamT on Thu 28 Apr 2016, 1:33 pm

If he makes 145 without the use if banned IV, I think he would now get murdered at the weight.

I think he has no choice but to fight at 155. He can be a contender there. I don't think he can be dominant at 155, even if he manages to win the title.

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Post by rodders on Thu 28 Apr 2016, 1:45 pm

fa0019 wrote:
I think though part of his hype was that some people actually bought into the whole hype that he was some demi-god. "oh but his punching power etc etc, I think he could really do something all the way up to middleweight".

I don't think its a case of buying into the hype - logically you know these claims of winning all these belts are improbable - but that's part of the interest of someone like CMC.

From he outset he's been making these claims(winning the FW title) and achieving them so even when he makes even more outrageous statements it's hard not to tune in, even if they make you raise an eyebrow.

Agree with Adam above - 145 is not sustainable beyond 1 more fight but he'll have a big challenge to be competitive at 155 - anything above is a pipe dream.
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Post by AdamT on Thu 28 Apr 2016, 1:47 pm

He can be competitive at 155 .I won't completely write someone off after one defeat. He now realises his power can't beat EVERYONE. He is a very good athlete and self driven. His one weakness is his ground game. He is a fair bit behind the elite in that aspect.


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Post by fa0019 on Thu 28 Apr 2016, 3:35 pm

AdamT wrote:He can be competitive at 155 .I won't completely write someone off after one defeat. He now realises his power can't beat EVERYONE. He is a very good athlete and self driven. His one weakness is his ground game. He is a fair bit behind the elite in that aspect.


I agree, he'll be competitive as a lightweight but will not dominate as he has with featherweight. His strategy will have to evolve a lot. Its not like Diaz could absorb that much more punishment because he was in off season and put on a few Ibs naturally moving him technically into the welter catergory. McGregor was fighting a lightweight.

The increased no. of belts in my view has damaged the sport, the IV game plan has meant guys have dodged each other by keeping in separate divisions; happy to be the king of x division rather than put it all on the line. It would be great if they moved the weigh ins to fight night meaning guys couldn't shed weight. I heard JR talk about it a few months ago and how it would improve the sport but also the conditioning of the fights and the fighters. I am in no doubt half the time, round 1 surprise KOs are due to some fighters not being healthy because they had to cut too much to make the weight and were dehydrated and not quite with it.

At least CM fought the fights. I mean he would have fought GSP if he beat Diaz and I shudder to think what would have happened there. CM would have wound him up so much that GSP would have gone nasty on him.

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