Leicester Tigers 2016/17 thread.

[Welly]

First topic message reminder :

2016/17:
Director of Rugby: Richard Cockerill
Head Coach: Aaron Mauger
Assistant Backs Coach: Geordan Murphy
Assistant Forward Coach: Richard Blaze
Defence and Scrum Half Coach: Scott Hansen
Head of Rugby Operations: Ged Glynn
Team manager: Matt Cornwall

2016/17 Senior Squad: (Confirmed So Far) (Blue = EQP)
Hookers: Bateman, McGuigan, Thacker, Youngs
Props: Ayerza, Balmain, Brugnara Cilliers, Cole, Genge, Mulipola, Rizzo
Locks: Barrow, Fitzgerald, Kitchener, Slater
Back Row: Croft, Fonua, Hamilton McCaffrey, O'Connor, Williams
Scrum Half: Harrison, Kitto, Youngs
Fly Half: Burns, Williams
Centre: Catchpole, Roberts, Smith, Toomua, Tuilagi
Back 3: Betham, Brady, Pieterson, Tait, Thompstone, Veainu
Squad number: 37, EQP: 24, Academy products: 8

Transfers
IN: (7)
McGuigan (Newcastle Falcons), Cilliers (Montpelier), Genge (Bristol), Hamilton (Agen), Toomua (ACT Brumbies). JP Pieterson (Sharks), Brady (Sale)

OUT: (12)
Ghiraldini (Toulouse), Pasquali (Treviso), De Chaves (London Irish), Crane (Bristol), Pearce (Sale), Bell (London Irish), Baikeinuku (retirement), De Villiers (Retirement), Benjamin (retirement), Morris (N/A), Camacho (N/A), Goneva (Newcastle Falcons)

Not Sure: (No official confirmation of leaving or Staying) 3
Aguero, Sio Loamanu,

Rumours:
Harry Wells (Bedford) Lock/6

2016/17 Development Squad: (15)
Bryant, Evans, Hills, Lewis, Mahoney, Maksymiw, J.Olowofela, R. Olowofela, Owen, Simmons, Thacker, Tuilagi, White, Worth, Yawayawa

Transfer
IN: (7)
Lewis, Mahoney, J.Olowofela, R. Olowofela, Simmons, White, Yawayawa

OUT: 11
Odogwu (sale), Beckett (Glous), Povoas (Coventry), Tresidder (Rotherham Titans), Douglas, Farnworth, Galletly, Hogan, Murrin, Nairn, Priestley-Nangle.


Academy
Academy Head Coach/forwards Coach: Brett Deacon
Academy Backs Coach: Anthony Allen

[LondonTiger]

Tom Youngs, mom. 

Made all his tackles, throws and was hooking the ball

He missed at least one, right in front of me . Constant foot up too

[king_carlos]

JPP has been named in the Boks squad for the AIs. Means he will miss the first 2 LV Cup games which he likely wouldn't have been involved in. He will also be with SA for the Quins (H) and Bristol (A) Prem games which are a 5 day turnaround so not ideal.

With LV cup games after this weekend I guess we will be full strength barring injuries, then rotate the week after for the trip to Bath. Guessing something near:

Ayerza, Youngs, Cole, Slater, Kitchener, Fitzgerald, O'Connor, McCaffery
Youngs, Burns, JPP, Smith, Betham, Tombstone, Tait

Reps: McGuigan, Genge/Mulipola, Bateman/Balmain, Evans, Hamilton, Harrison, Williams, Brady

Then can rotate to something like below for the Bath trip in LV round 1:

Genge, Thacker, Balmain, Slater (c), Wells, Owens, Evans, Hamilton
Harrison, Burns, Brady, Bryant, Roberts, Catchpole, Worth

Reps: McGuigan, Cilliers, Bateman, Maksymiw, Fred Tuilagi Jnr, Kitto, Williams, Yawayawa

[formerly known as Sam]

I've not seen last week's game but I can't imagine it was easy on the players. I'd expect and hope for some rotation this weekend and then substantial rotation for the weekend after. We can rest the likes of Cole, Ben, BOC and McCaffery comfortably given our squad strength.

[LondonTiger]

Purely from a club point of view there would be no point resting Cole and Lenny as they will be heading off for 5 weeks with England after Sarries game. For this weekend I would quite like to see Evans start simply because his work rate is far superior to BOC (who seems wo hang out on the wing even more than Croft did ).

[Welly]

Rather see Slater rested than play a AWC game with Lewis on the bench Wells and Maksymiw both been performing well during the A league (which is unbeaten)

Genge will prob be with the England training squad along with Evans. (If the squad stays the same).

Actually would rather the AWC was
1) Brugnara
2) Thacker
3) Cilliers
4) Wells
5) Maksymiw
6) Grahamslaw
7) Owen
8) Hamilton
9) Harrison (C)
10) Bryant/Worth
11) Brady
12) Smith
13) Manu (if fit Roberts if not)
14) Catchpole
15) Worth/Simmons

16) Mahoney/McGuigan
17) Hills/Betts
18) Balmain
19) Lewis
20) Fred Jnr
21) White/Simmons
22) Roberts/Thacker/Hardwick
23) Yawayawa

Honestly I think we are rotating enough of the senior squad to give the majority a rest during the AWC.

Whilst I can see the benefit of playing Burns and Williams for game time would rather give our 3rd choice 10 game time there in case another injury happens to them so either Bryant or Worth @ starting 10 for me.

[LondonTiger]

Hearing that Toomua is out for 6 months

[LondonTiger]

Just seen it on Tigers twitter - real shame.

[king_carlos]

Such a shame, listening to Cockers on the radio he was pretty adamant the club didn't have the money to sign injury dispensation cover. He usually plays his cards close to his chest so could just be dodging the question - given we never signed the number 8 that was reportedly being talked to I'd hope there is budget.

It's a body blow to the squad though. Hopefully Manu can get back reasonably soon. With him unlikely to feature this weekend then two LV cup games there is a bit of time to play with.

In the meantime I'd bring Smith back to play the same role he filled so well last season.

[Rugby Fan]

Wow. That's fewer games than Dan Carter managed for Perpignan.

Miserable for the player and club. Rotten luck all round.

[king_carlos]

It's a 3 year deal so we should see him again unlike Perpignan with DC.

From a Tigers perspective you just have to hope Toomua still settles well in the area whilst going through an obviously unhappy period from a playing perspective. To get back from multiple concussions only to damage your ACL is a hammer blow.

It's a huge knock to the squad with Manu so injury prone as well. The outside backs will have been as excited as the fans about playing outside Toomua-Manu.

[Welly]

Such a shame, listening to Cockers on the radio he was pretty adamant the club didn't have the money to sign injury dispensation cover. He usually plays his cards close to his chest so could just be dodging the question - given we never signed the number 8 that was reportedly being talked to I'd hope there is budget.

.

Cockerill isn't exactly know for telling the whole truth.....

[king_carlos]

Something you've heard there agent Welly?

[formerly known as Sam]

Hearing that Toomua is out for 6 months

 so much for him saving our midfield. Will the dream midfield ever happen?

[Welly]

Sounds like Roberts is starting.

[king_carlos]

From the Merc:

Tigers: 15 Mathew Tait; 14 Adam Thompstone, 13 Peter Betham, 12 Jack Roberts, 11 JP Pietersen; 10 Owen Williams, 9 Ben Youngs; 1 Marcos Ayerza, 2 Tom Youngs (c), 3 Dan Cole; 4 Ed Slater, 5 Graham Kitchener; 6 Mike Fitzgerald, 7 Brendon O'Connor, 8 Lachlan McCaffrey. Replacements: 16 George McGuigan, 17 Ellis Genge, 18 Logovi'i Mulipola, 19 Luke Hamilton, 20 Will Evans, 21 Sam Harrison, 22 Freddie Burns, 23 George Catchpole

I like that Roberts is starting, also good to see Catchpole on the bench. I really wish Freddie was at 10 though for Sarries away.

I wish that Matt Smith was starting at 12 with Roberts at 13 though. I find it odd he's had so little game time this season given the struggle for fit centres and abysmal defensive organisation.

[Welly]

Wonder if Smith is having trouble with injuries?

If he isn't in the LV cup squad then I suspect so.

[king_carlos]

That would be my guess Welly, another bit of rotten timing for club and player if so. Being such a humble bloke he'd never admit it but Matt must have loved coming back into form and gluing everything together in the midfield just when his team most needed it last season!

Good to see Catchpole back involved after his recent struggles though. Hopefully he looks sharp as he did on his last few Prem outings, he and Roberts both impressed against Bath end of last term.

Kind of wish Cockers had given Will Evans a start but I can understand why he isn't for Sarries.

[Welly]

I suspect O'Connor, McCaffrey and Fitzgerald will all prob go down south after the Sarries game for a 2 week break.

So best to use them now and have Evans going into the AWC fully fit and ready.

So prob would of been bench regardless of opposition.

Back row of
6) Hamilton
7) Evans
8) Leonardi
Looks good for Bath.

[king_carlos]

Yep, I expect that's the case Welly.

Leonardi is looking like an odd signing at the moment. He was added straight into the ERCC squad then hasn't featured in anything, even from the bench. I hope he shows something otherwise fans will start to question why he's here.

Will Owen hasn't been getting game time at Doncaster, anyone know why?

I'm still hopeful that Ed Milne will head back home after his medical degree as well. He seems to have become a fan favourite down at Rosslyn Park.

[king_carlos]

Out of interest what do we expect the front row to look like for the next couple of weeks?

Genge and Cole will be with England, at least for this weeks training camp. OTY and Marcos will be rested I think we can guarantee.

Do we reckon Logo will be rested or given a chance to find some match fitness? I reckon he'll be rested given his injury struggles.

Will Bateman feature as a prop, a hooker or make way completely for the younger guys?

Will Brugnara get game time having been dropped to the development squad?

1.Mulipola, Brugnara, Hills
2.Thacker, McGuigan, Bateman
3.Balmain, Cilliers, Bateman, Betts

Those are the options it seems. Hills and Betts seem unlikely to feature but both are probably ready if needed.

[LondonTiger]

Bateman playing LH is an interesting one for tomorrow.

[formerly known as Sam]

Bateman seems to be crowbared into the squad whenever possible these days. I've not really thought much of his performances when I've seen him play. Nice to see Balmain get a go.

Great to see Croft return.

[LondonTiger]

Second that on Croft. Just glad to see him fit enough to be included in a squad finally. He was an answer to a quiz question earlier this week, that stumped me:

"Which two Tigers players made the most appearances last season" (Betham and Croft with 28)

[LondonTiger]

While we have to apply some contact to the game, some really promising performance last night.

In the pack Thacker and Evans were excellent, while Croft put in a good 40 at second row. Brugnara and Cilliers will not be pressing for AP active however.

In the backs Worth and Catchpole both looked promising, but (perhaps not surprisingly) Burns was a coast apart. He was helps by a fine performance from Kitto.

[formerly known as Sam]

Good to hear that it's the academy lads putting their hands up. Some lads getting their debuts and Ant Allen having an unofficial audition for the defence coach job.

They were up against a similar stength Bath team and away from home so they've got to be happy with a win. Especially with losing Smith to injury, the younger midfield options could have struggled without his leadership. I've not seen the game, how did Balmain get on? I'd like to see him come back in to contention, he has a great work rate.

[LondonTiger]

I thought Balmain looked promising, but sadly he seemed to be limping when he left the field.

I seem to have had a few interesting autocorrect to my previous message.


Watching Ireland yesterday highlighted just why I am so impressed with Will Evans. The Irish were working extremely hard off the ball, but at the breakdown and tackle were choosing which battles to contest cleverly. This is what I see in Evans - his work rate is fantastic and his rugby intelligence highly impressive. He also put in some crunching Lydiate-style tackles. Real knee-choppers. BOC has left me rather underwhelmed - so I would love Evans to get much more game time.

[formerly known as Sam]

I hope it's not a serious knock. He needs to lay down a marker and force his way back into the first team.

If think BOC is more of an offensive 7 than a defending one. He is capable of the occasional crunching tackle but we've not seen that this year. Evans is just a straight up English openside though, a nightmare at the breakdown and a huge work rate. I'd like to see us go a little mobile in the backrow and have BOC, Evans and McCaffery. If they've got Slater and Kitch in the engine room we have enough weight in the pack collectively.

[Welly]

Balmain is off anyway from what I gather.

[formerly known as Sam]

Not a surprise Welly. Would explain why he's been banished from the first team this season. Shame he's got a really good work rate and is a solid scrummager though sadly not a destructive one. He'll be a good signing for someone. Means we're stuck with Bateman for a bit longer, maybe he'll have a good game eventually.

[king_carlos]

Balmain off with Rapava-Ruskin coming in from Worcs is the rumour I've heard. It would be a shame to lose Balmain but I could understand him moving on when he's struggling for game time and wants to keep progressing.

Rapava-Ruskin is a fantastic young LH though and would give us a great opportunity to rotate long term. Marcos will be 35 by next season after all. It would also allow Logo to concentrate more on TH, rather than jumping from side to side.

1.Genge, Ruskin, Ayerza, Hills
3.Cole, Mulipola, Cilliers, Betts

I'd be delighted with that going forward.

[formerly known as Sam]

Ruskin would be an excellent signing. He's a really good loosehead and us probably one of the most underrated players in the league. He's mobile, good in the loose and strong in the scrum. He seems to win penalties at the breakdown for Wuss as well.

I bet Ruskin won't be cheap and I bet we won't be the only ones taking an interest. He qualifies for both Georgia and England so could be an international in the future.

[king_carlos]

Ruskin wouldn't come cheap but with Balmain and Rizzo both likely to be heading off there would be some salary freed up to bring him in.

It's a rumour that has been hanging around for a while. If there's substance to it then it will likely be a case of him wanting a shot at Champions Cup and potential knockout rugby in order to further progress his career. A chance to learn from Ayerza is a decent selling point too for a 24 year old loose-head.

If he wants money then he will likely look elsewhere though. As it sounds like Carl Fearns has from multiple reports that he has opted to sign for Gloucester on £315,000 per year.

[formerly known as Sam]

I fear Ruskin may go the same way as Fearns. We have a deal on the table and it looks to be good but then the agent leaks the interest to the media for the "rumours section" then other clubs will come in and some have more cap to play with will offer bigger money. Fearns has attracted a lot of interest and so is probably sitting back and watching the offers role in. A promising loosehead like Ruskin is likely to be in the same boat.

If we could land Ruskin and Fearns that would be some very good business by us. Jettison Brugnara and Rizzo with Balmain probably off as well to free up plenty of cap for Ruskin and there's a cap rise in any case to slot Fearns into.

We have to hope that playing at Tigers is still a significant draw and that our patchy form won't put players off.

[king_carlos]

Rumours are that Fearns has already opted for Gloucs - £315,000 pa.

Apparently Brugnara and Balmain have already been told their contracts wont be renewed. Along with Rizzo probably leaving it does give room to sign a guy like Rapava-Ruskin. I could see it go either way. Between that cap being freed up and Marcos there as a tutor he could opt for Tigers. Then again he is talented enough to get a big money offer elsewhere that we can't match.

[formerly known as Sam]

Hopefully the draw of Tigers and our record with international props will help convince him. He'd be a great signing for Wasps and Sarries though so there'll be competition.

The papers in France that were stating Fearns had signed for us are not changing their tune and saying Glaws. Be a shame, Glaws are going nowhere fast and he'll be another good backrower behind a misfiring front five with erratic half backs running the show.

[hugehandoff]

anyone know if Manu is close to playing again?

[formerly known as Sam]

anyone know if Manu is close to playing again?

Last report has suggested towards the end of November but nothing is set in stone and who knows. Even if he's back fit it'll take longer than that for him to come back to his best form, probably a couple of months of action.

[king_carlos]

15 George Worth; 14 Adam Thompstone, 13 Jack Roberts, 12 Owen Williams, 11 Peter Betham; 10 Freddie Burns, 9 Sam Harrison (c); 1 Marcos Ayerza, 2 Harry Thacker, 3 Greg Bateman; 4 Harry Wells, 5 Graham Kitchener; 6 Tom Croft, 7 Will Evans, 8 Luke Hamilton

Replacements: 16 George McGuigan, 17 Ellis Genge, 18 Pat Cilliers, 19 Ed Slater, 20 Brendon O'Connor, 21 Jono Kitto, 22 Oli Bryant, 23 Mathew Tait.

An odd side for a AWC game. I can only guess the coaches are targeting this as our best shot at silverware this season.

Catchpole is unfortunate to drop out after performing well last season.

Must say that having Burns and Williams at risk for an AWC game is foolish IMO.

Good to see Crofty back starting though. Between Kitch, Wells, Croft and Wee 'arry our line-out should cause real damage against an inexperienced Dragons side.

[formerly known as Sam]

Dunno how inexperienced that Dragons side is. The bench is very young but the starting 15 has a number of normal starters.

I'm guessing that we are starting that midfield because it's the one we want to start against Quins. I'd expect to see Bryant and Tait brought on fairly early especially if we're in control of the game.

[dragon4life]

Our bench has virtually no experience apart from loosehead and hooker the rest will all make their debuts, the rest of the team is largely second or third choice apart from the loosehead, Dixon our 12, Hewitt the winger and Meyer the fullback who are all first choice. I'm worried about our 10 who is normally a fullback and is hopeless there so god knows what he will be like at fly half. Think you should win comfortably, we will only be dangerous is we can get the ball wide

[formerly known as Sam]

Our bench has virtually no experience apart from loosehead and hooker the rest will all make their debuts, the rest of the team is largely second or third choice apart from the loosehead, Dixon our 12, Hewitt the winger and Meyer the fullback who are all first choice. I'm worried about our 10 who is normally a fullback and is hopeless there so god knows what he will be like at fly half. Think you should win comfortably, we will only be dangerous is we can get the ball wide

Given our inability to defend this season there's always a chance to score against us. We should win, particularly as this is at Welford Road.

[LondonTiger]

KC, I always felt we would put out a reasonably strong side to get the team ready for next week. Quins will be heavily discussed by the Ais and I would not want us going into that game rusty.

[king_carlos]

LT, Catchpole and Bryant are the main frustrations.

Maksymiw is a young lad who didn't show up as much as Wells the week before so he's understandable to drop out. Leonardi is looking like an increasingly odd signing so against unsurprising. As for Baltrain, we all know how Cockers deals with players who are moving on at the end of the season.

Starting both Thompstone and Betham when Catchpole showed up well once again is inviting frustration from a young guy who would probably get offers elsewhere if he wanted game time. Start Betham to get him game time on the wing, bench either Thompstone or Tait would have been a better option IMO.

Same again with Bryant. Outside either Burns or Williams at 10 with a good pack this would have been a perfect chance to give him a go at 12.

37-3 up with not long left. As expected really with such a disparity in experience between the two sides.

[Welly]

Catchpole and Maksymiw both went off injured last weekend some prob still out, Maksymiw esp was in huge amount of pain think both where off by half time due to injuries or before 50.

Balmain also went off injured and didn't look to comfortable when shown on the bench so out aswell.
But yeh must be our coaches.
(Catchpole has also been suffering from injuries and illnesses the past 18 months or so.

I understand why we went with Burns and Williams 10 and 12 since that will prob be the case v Quins and we need some game time before hand.

[king_carlos]

Last I heard Catchpole was expected to be fit for today, was mentioned on the radio. I'm aware he struggled over last season but now he's fit I'd like to see him play more. Given he's the club RPA rep you'd presume he's a guy who wants to hang around, he's well regarded around the club.

Balmain as said I understand given he's leaving and Cilliers needs game time.

Unlike many fans I like our coaching staff and Cockers as a DOR. Most admit the coaches could do better at giving young players chances in stronger sides rather than just throwing them into make shift XVs during injury crisis. With plenty of talented centres coming through we should be looking to give guys game time.

[Welly]

Catchpole was out I believe.

Also when has Tigers track record of injuries been accurate? Croft was 2 weeks ready for about 2 months.

[king_carlos]

Welly, very true.

42 - 3 final score.

[formerly known as Sam]

Was it as one sided as it sounded? Hopefully this will boost some confidence ahead of the Quins game next week.

[LondonTiger]

Game my tickets to brothers and nephew, but his feedback was that Dragons just rolled over.

[king_carlos]

AWC has the same issue that a proper A-team league would have. The clubs all looks to use their AWC and A-teams so differently from game to game that you inevitably end up with too many mismatched games.

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