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Golovkin v Jacobs

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Post by Steffan on Sat Mar 18, 2017 11:33 pm

First topic message reminder :

Not sure if anyone is staying up for this as I guess it's pretty much a guaranteed GGG win. Same goes for Gonzalez I guess

But if you are you can keep me company Hug

All my Irish mates are tipping Michael Conlan to go all the way after last night in MSG

I think winning in rugby today and stopping and English Triple Crown and Grandslam has gone to their heads personally

Anyway...after the Haye v Bellew shambles here's to a good night of boxing


Regards

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:48 am

Gonzalez losing highlights the difficulty of rating the little men, he's racked up numerous titles across four weights but he's not come close to dominating any of them and the guys he's beaten are a real mixed bag. I do find it odd that he's not fought a single unification fight yet, Cuadras and Estrada are the stand out opponents with the rest being.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:48 am

Not a great fight failed to take off

This must mean Golovkin Canelo is going to happen surely

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:50 am

I always thought canelo and GGG will be pencilled in for September. The fight will happen, especially as GGG looked a little less special.




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Post by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:52 am

Calling Gonzalez better than Arguello like some have been doing

Was that a bit premature?

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:58 am

Gonzalez was never in that conversation for me, the 126-135lb jump is far harder to do than the little man four (I don't even think there should be divisons below Flyweight) plus the level of opposition was markedly different. To be hyper critical I don't think Gonzalez has beaten anyone as good or tough as Jim Watt for example let alone the quality Arguello was ploughing through at Super Featherweight.

I'm very much of the same mindset as Truss I only really take notice from Bantamweight and above, the talent pool below that simply isn't there.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:59 am

Truss is going to be on here creaming himself saying I told you so Golovkin not that good

He did look pretty one dimensional in this fight

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:04 am

It's one fight against a Daniel Jacobs who looks a lot better and tougher than the guy Pirog starched a long time ago, it's ridiculous that dominant boxers get marked down for having a single fight where they don't steamroll their opponent.

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:07 am

Can't get too ahead of ourselves after one performance. I think GGG is a class fighter, it was just the opposition that frustrated me. I have seen many boxing guys from the US pick Canelo to beat GGG before this fight.

Perhaps they think there are some chinks to expose. I can't comment on this fight yet, as I have not seen it. However Brook and Monroe did show that GGG can be outboxed. Canelo isn't lightning quick, but he is a good boxer and very big. He also has a lot of youth on his side.

The fight needs to happen.

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 10:26 am

I also will add, I think GGG is class in certain areas. He definitely has some issues though and perhaps has a bully streak. If someone can take his power and box well, they have a very good chance of beating him.

If Canelo can handle the power (he will) and throw more punches than normal, he can definitely win the decision. I'm reading a lot of reports, that GGG had no urgency to his attack. Perhaps the bigger man made him think before he attacks.

As Hammer has said, every boxer has off nights. Every athlete does. However I think GGG has been showing a bit of slippage recently in his movement. Him getting caught by Brook was no accident, or him showing bravado. It was simply Brook showing the skills he possessed, to land punches on GGG.

GGG will still be favourite against Canelo, but anyone that rights of Canelo is an idiot. He struggled with Floyd and Lara's speed and movement, he won't have these issues with GGG.

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Post by BoxingFan88 on Sun Mar 19, 2017 11:12 am

Jacobs had a good game plan and boxed well

I didn't score it but I thought at times he was too negative using excessive movement

I don't think that should be rewarded

Interesting fight but not one to rewatch

And idksab

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Post by mobilemaster8 on Sun Mar 19, 2017 11:53 am

Yeh was a decent fight, had GGG by a couple, close decision but went the right way.

Jacobs is a hell of a fighter, I predicted it to be a late stoppage and at times GGG looked like he could step up and really land some shots.

It was a real surprise. Was he respectful of Jacobs power? Possible.

After the fight he just stated Jacobs is his favourite boxer and he didn't want to crush him...and that he had respect.

Was he being soft in the ring...I don't know...he looked fresh as Frak in the interview after as per normal.

Such a talent.

Think he will smash Alvarez into next week and give him a real hammering. Alvarez is very good, young, large...but GGG seems really angry about this guy...maybe he won't be as soft or let up and may just go to steam roll him....should be a great fight though.


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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:01 pm

So GGG carried Jacobs in your view??

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Post by milkyboy on Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:04 pm

Ggg - one tight decision doesn't suddenly make him average, it makes him human. Hopefully the question marks over his monster status will make future fights easier to make. Are their signs of slippage (he's knocking on a bit) or is it just the best guy he's faced? Could be either or both, future fights will show us.

As for golovkin carrying him?! Yeh, thought he'd risk a close decision to avoid hurting a fighter he likes. He's all heart!

Always thought canelo was a reasonable long shot against ggg... likes guys who come at him. Suspect his odds have improved... and hopefully, oscar might feel more prepared to risk him.

Gonzalez. He's clearly an excellent fighter, so a close defeat above his prime weight shouldn't be held against him too much. In the grander scheme of things though, in terms of 'greatness' there are 2 issues with lower weight division hoppers... the tiny gaps (even as a proportion of weight) between some of the divisions and the talent pool at the very lower weights is a lot smaller... = Fewer fighters competing for more belts. Not his fault, just a factor for consideration.

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:21 pm

Good post Milky

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Post by Atila on Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:35 pm

AdamT wrote:Good post Milky
Milky doesn't hear that very often.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:45 pm

Jacobs against Eubanks is a fight I'd like to see, very interesting fight would like to see Eubanks in with another good boxer, there are plenty who believe Jacobs could beat junior

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:49 pm

Herman Jaeger wrote:Jacobs against Eubanks is a fight I'd like to see, very interesting fight would like to see Eubanks in with another good boxer, there are plenty who believe Jacobs could beat junior

Wait a second, there are people who think Jnr would beat Jacobs?

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 12:56 pm

There was anyone who thought Jacobs could beat Golovkin? He came damn close didn't he

It would be a very good fight I think Eubanks has a much better chance than you think


Last edited by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 1:07 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sun Mar 19, 2017 1:01 pm

I don't think Jacobs being better and tougher than we thought is going to help Eubank is it, someone who has fought above domestic level once and was made to look average for the most part.

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Post by milkyboy on Sun Mar 19, 2017 1:03 pm

Atila wrote:
AdamT wrote:Good post Milky
Milky doesn't hear that very often.

No, not with the idiots round here fella. My genius generally goes unappreciated. Very Happy

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 1:11 pm

Jacobs has stopped Mora twice. Mora is no world class operator, but he is tough and can box.

Jacobs has dominated some decent fighters too. I admit, I thought GGG would smash him around the midway stage, as many others did too.

Are we guilty of overrating GGG? Or under rating Jacobs?

Probably a bit of both.

Anyway if Canelo isn't next, do you guys think GGG will fight BJS next?

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Post by BoxingFan88 on Sun Mar 19, 2017 2:03 pm

Ggg just wasn't at it at all last night

Jacobs movement caused him big problems

Many people are saying ggg took it easy

Perhaps he did to bait other people in the ring?

I don't buy it though you should never let a fight go that close especially away from home in the other guys back yard

We have to go on the last performance in the ring and that one wasn't very good

I still think he can beat canelo

But put on a performance like that and you won't get the decision next time

I'll be cooling the ggg hype I got a bit carried away

It's sad because I really thought I saw something special

When he stepped up the level he didn't perform for whatever reason

Also shout out to gonzalez absolute Warrior lost a close fight and I did think he lost

But he always delivers still a huge fan and always will be

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 2:10 pm

You hyped him as much as pacquiao boxing88. I still think he is a fantastic 160 fighter, but this has to be said.

His competition up to Jacobs hasn't been great. Yes he beat whoever was out there, but the 160 division has seen better days.

Anyway on good note, is he now 34-0, with 30 knock outs? Not a bad record at all!!

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Post by BoxingFan88 on Sun Mar 19, 2017 2:17 pm

Well yeah it is

Only as good as your last performance and based on that need to cool it down

Probably cool down talk of 168 as well

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 2:25 pm

I wonder how many think he would smash Froch now? Obviously I mean Froch at his peak.

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Post by mobilemaster8 on Sun Mar 19, 2017 2:29 pm

Jacobs would destroy Eubank.

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Post by Derbymanc on Sun Mar 19, 2017 2:32 pm

No idea AdamT until we see GGG's next fight (and depending on who it's against) we won't really have a measure on if he's been so overrated or just had a bad day at the office (benefit of the doubt at the minute).

I do think he'd annihilate Eubank though, but then again I don't really rate him that much at all. (Eubank)

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Post by hazharrison on Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:10 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Gonzalez was never in that conversation for me, the 126-135lb jump is far harder to do than the little man four (I don't even think there should be divisons below Flyweight) plus the level of opposition was markedly different. To be hyper critical I don't think Gonzalez has beaten anyone as good or tough as Jim Watt for example let alone the quality Arguello was ploughing through at Super Featherweight.

I'm very much of the same mindset as Truss I only really take notice from Bantamweight and above, the talent pool below that simply isn't there.

Gonzalez hasn't beaten anyone as good as Jim Watt? I'd put Cuadras, Estrada, Viloria and Yaegashi up again Watt (just off the top of my head).

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Post by hazharrison on Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:29 pm

milkyboy wrote:Ggg - one tight decision doesn't suddenly make him average, it makes him human. Hopefully the question marks over his monster status will make future fights easier to make. Are their signs of slippage (he's knocking on a bit) or is it just the best guy he's faced? Could be either or both, future fights will show us.

As for golovkin carrying him?! Yeh, thought he'd risk a close decision to avoid hurting a fighter he likes. He's all heart!

Always thought canelo was a reasonable long shot against ggg... likes guys who come at him. Suspect his odds have improved... and hopefully, oscar might feel more prepared to risk him.

Gonzalez. He's clearly an excellent fighter, so a close defeat above his prime weight shouldn't be held against him too much. In the grander scheme of things though, in terms of 'greatness' there are 2 issues with lower weight division hoppers... the tiny gaps (even as a proportion of weight) between some of the divisions and the talent pool at the very lower weights is a lot smaller... = Fewer fighters competing for more belts. Not his fault, just a factor for consideration.

I thought Golovkin showed signs of slippage. I wasn't overly impressed with Jacobs (I've seen opinions on him ranging from "performance of the year" to "running scared" - so it was obviously a divisive fight).

For those who feel Canelo now has a chance: he fights nothing like Jacobs.

Gonzalez is a great fighter. He lost the bout by a single round. It's tough to criticise him too much considering his appalling start (the knockdown was of the unlucky variety and the butts/cuts had an impact). I thought he just pulled it out but couldn't begrudge the Thai victory. He fought one hell of a fight. There may be fewer fighters in the lower weights but Gonzalez and Srisaket were head and shoulders above the middleweight duo (figuratively, at least). Far and away better fighters.

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Post by Derbymanc on Sun Mar 19, 2017 5:36 pm

Nice little write up from Welsh Devil (he's far too humble to plug his stuff so i will :-) )

http://www.ringnews24.com/2017/03/19/no-robberies-new-york-golovkin-sor-rungvisai-take-razor-close-victories/#.WM7Av9IX34Y

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:10 pm

He doesn't have to fight like Jacobs. Canelo has skills, power and youth. I don't make him but, GGG is a better match up for Canelo, than Floyd.

Canelo might beat him tbh.

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:20 pm

After watching that fight Today, ward would toy with GGG. To big and good.

I wouldn't pick GGG to beat Froch, Kessler and definitely not Calzaghe at 168. He's a small Mw and has no business moving up. Jacobs looked too big for him.

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Post by mobilemaster8 on Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:41 pm

Apparently Jacobs walked in at over 180lbs?!?!?!? No wonder he sacrificed the IBF ruling!

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:45 pm

AdamT wrote:After watching that fight Today, ward would toy with GGG. To big and good.

I wouldn't pick GGG to beat Froch, Kessler and definitely not Calzaghe at 168. He's a small Mw and has no business moving up. Jacobs looked too big for him.

Sounds like you thought Jacobs won, Adam?

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:53 pm

Nope GGG won, but was very tight.

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Post by hazharrison on Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:44 pm

I scored it today and had GGG 114-113 but watching live, felt sure Jacobs would get it.

They were both poor (to my eyes). Can you imagine what the likes of Monzon or Hagler would have done with either?

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Post by kingraf on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:00 pm

Maybe I'm thick, but I genuinely can't for the life of me see what happened in this fight that suggests Canelo could replicate whatever success Jacobs had. He isn't 6'0. He can't match Jacobs for speed. He doesn't hit as hard as Jacobs. He can't (to our knowledge) switch hit.

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Post by kingraf on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:01 pm

Maybe I'm thick, but I genuinely can't for the life of me see what happened in this fight that suggests Canelo could replicate whatever success Jacobs had. He isn't 6'0. He can't match Jacobs for speed. He doesn't hit as hard as Jacobs. He can't (to our knowledge) switch hit.

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Post by kingraf on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:02 pm

Maybe I'm thick, but I genuinely can't for the life of me see what happened in this fight that suggests Canelo could replicate whatever success Jacobs had. He isn't 6'0. He can't match Jacobs for speed. He doesn't hit as hard as Jacobs. He can't (to our knowledge) switch hit.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:07 pm

AdamT wrote:Nope GGG won, but was very tight.

I'll have to watch it again, he couldn't get himself into punching range all night for me

He should have a much easier night with Canelo I would think, though Canelo can bang to the body and Golovkin didn't like the body punches last night so that's something for Canelo to look at

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:09 pm

Canelo has good movement and timing. He is also very strong. GGG isn't Marvin Hagler Haz. That's for sure.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:18 pm

Fighters always have someone in their career that they struggle with who you think they shouldn't really struggle with

Maybe it could have been a bit of that last night I don't know

Coz the alternative to that is that Golovkin isn't quite as good as we thought

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Post by hazharrison on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:31 pm

AdamT wrote:Canelo has good movement and timing. He is also very strong. GGG isn't Marvin Hagler Haz. That's for sure.

I still feel GGG will wipe the floor with Canelo but yeah, GGG doesn't stand comparison with those two.

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:32 pm

Maybe Canelo struggles with Floyd and Lara types.

GGG is class, but I've always thought he isn't the complete package. I'm sorry to bring up Floyd, but if he could keep GGG honest at 154, he would take a decision.

There are levels in boxing and GGG is not a Manny or Floyd. Very Good MW fighting in a pretty easy era. Harsh lads, but my opinion.

I think Hopkins would of beat GGG at Mw. As long as he remembered to throw punches.

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:41 pm

Anyway I'm not bashing the guy. I just hope it was bad night. I think a fight with Canelo has potential fireworks.


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Post by hazharrison on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:48 pm

AdamT wrote:Maybe Canelo struggles with Floyd and Lara types.

GGG is class, but I've always thought he isn't the complete package. I'm sorry to bring up Floyd, but if he could keep GGG honest at 154, he would take a decision.

There are levels in boxing and GGG is not a Manny or Floyd. Very Good MW fighting in a pretty easy era. Harsh lads, but my opinion.

I think Hopkins would of beat GGG at Mw. As long as he remembered to throw punches.

Hopkins would have put in a similar shift to Jacobs - with more holding. It would have been a putrid fight.

Golovkin would roll over Floyd at 154. Too big.

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:52 pm

He probably is too big.

GGG maybe just had an off night. I tell you a fighter that would beat him handily. Our own Joe Calzaghe.

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Post by hazharrison on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:56 pm

AdamT wrote:He probably is too big.

GGG maybe just had an off night. I tell you a fighter that would beat him handily. Our own Joe Calzaghe.

Based on last night maybe. But that was the poorest version of GGG I've seen. Joe had plenty of poor nights, also.

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Post by AdamT on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:10 pm

Slippage Is there. Even against Brook I seen some.

Anyway could of been an off night, time will tell. The fact is, he is still the best fighter at 160.

Also Jacobs has improved. He's a confident guy and has some skills and good power.

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Post by catchweight on Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:15 pm

Hagler never had to fight 180lb fighters to be fair. But the weight classes now are ballsed up.


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