All Blacks' (likely) Squad Fitness (form?) Updates

First topic message reminder :

In response to LondonTiger's Lions' fitness thread, here's my crack at the NZ squad prospects. Any updates appreciated


Updated June 16th

Player	Position	Notes
Dane Coles	Hooker	Concussion. Looking unlikely for the Lions now
Codie Taylor	Hooker	Misfired in the lineouts for the Crusaders vs Lions. Excellent game vs Samoa
Liam Coltman	Hooker	Injury cover for Coles. Good for the Highlanders vs the Lions. Not selected vs Samoa
Nathan Harris	Hooker
Joe Moody	Prop	Scrum & defence good vs Samoa
Wyatt Crockett	Prop
Kane Hames	Prop	Maori Squad
Owen Franks	Prop
Charlie Faumuina	Prop
Jeffrey Toomaga-Allen	Prop	Not selected
Ofa Tu'ungafasi	Prop	Backup prop as he can play both sides of the scrum at a pinch
Brodie Retallick	Second row
Sam Whitelock	Second row	In good form prior to sitting out a 2 week ban for striking the (Golden) Lions player who took him out in the air
Scott Barrett	Second row	Back from injury for a good 30 mins off the bench vs Samoa
Luke Romano	Second row	Has slipped behind Barrett, but playing fairly well
Patrick Tuipolotu	Second row	Not selected
Jerome Kaino	Back row	Back from knee surgery & played well vs Samoa
Liam Squire	Back row	Broken thumb. Due back mid June
Stephen Luatua	Back row	Not selected
Sam Cane	Back row
Ardie Savea	Back row	Returning to the 'Canes' bench after concussion June3. Has been In imperious form at both 7 & 8
Kieran Read	Back row	Broken thumb. Due back early June - not expected to play before the 1st test
Luke Whitelock	Back row	Not selected
Elliot Dixon	Back row	Released to play for the Maori
Matt Todd	Back row	Injury cover selection
Akira Ioane	Back row	Injury cover for Abs, released to play for the Maori
Vaea Fifita	Back row	Injury cover for Abs. Good off the bench vs Samoa
Aaron Smith	Scrum half
TJ Perenara	Scrum half
Tawera Kerr-Barlow	Scrum half
Augustine Pulu	Scrum half	Not selected
Beauden Barrett	Outside half
Aaron Cruden	Outside half	Missed Samoa test due to leg injury for Chiefs vs Canes
Lima Sopoaga	Outside half	Hamstring kept him out until mid-May. Average for the Highlanders vs Lions, good off the bench vs Samao
Ryan Crotty	Centre	Rib cartilage injury. May be back for the 1st test
Anton Lienart-Brown	Centre
Sonny Bill Williams	Centre
Ngani Laumape	Centre	Bolter - playing like a young Nonu for the Canes this season
Jack Goodhue	Centre	Injury Cover for Crotty. Excellent Super Rugby season, had some good moments for the Crusaders vs the Lions
Malikai Fekitoa	Centre	Not selected
Charlie Ngatai	Centre	Missed a year of rugby due to concussion. In the Maori squad
George Moala	Centre	Not selected
Julian Savea	Wing	Not at his best yet. Normally peaks around August so WIP
Waisake Naholo	Wing	Excellent for the Highlanders vs the Lions
Nehe Milner-Skudder	Wing	In the Maori squad
Rieko Ioane	Wing	Excellent for the Blues vs the Lions
Seta Taminavalu	Wing	Not selected
James Lowe	Wing	In the Maori squad
Ben Smith	Full back
Israel Dagg	Full back
Damien McKenzie	Full back	In the Maori squad
Jordie Barrett	Utility	Decent on debut off the bench vs Samoa

ebop wrote:You reckon the ABs were rattled in Dublin. Because they tackled their hearts out and defended their line and didn't allow any tries in? Or are you referring to something else?

Who cares if they were rattled, which of course they were. They were hammered in the first half and thought they would do what they normally do but Ireland outplayed them and more importantly , outwitted them.

Gwlad wrote:

ebop wrote:You reckon the ABs were rattled in Dublin. Because they tackled their hearts out and defended their line and didn't allow any tries in? Or are you referring to something else?

Who cares if they were rattled, which of course they were. They were hammered in the first half and thought they would do what they normally do but Ireland outplayed them and more importantly , outwitted them.

Shesh, someone forgot to lock the gimp box overnight

We're talking about Dublin

ebop wrote:

Gwlad wrote:

ebop wrote:You reckon the ABs were rattled in Dublin. Because they tackled their hearts out and defended their line and didn't allow any tries in? Or are you referring to something else?

Who cares if they were rattled, which of course they were. They were hammered in the first half and thought they would do what they normally do but Ireland outplayed them and more importantly , outwitted them.

Shesh, someone forgot to lock the gimp box overnight  

We're talking about Dublin

Well you got out so stop moaning, do us all a favor and lock yourself back in later though

ebop wrote:

How do you think nz were outwitted in Dublin gwlad?

No 7&1/2 wrote:How do you think nz were outwitted in Dublin gwlad?

They got into a debate with a straw man.

Take it you weren't talking about Dublin at all then?

No 7&1/2 wrote:Take it you weren't talking about Dublin at all then?

It's ok if you don't want to answer. If you don't have a point you don't have a point.

No 7&1/2 wrote:It's ok if you don't want to answer. If you don't have a point you don't have a point.

Thanks for the expert tuition in Not Having a Point.

Why are so scared to just talk about rugby rather than wum. You had a point to make about nz being outwitted. Why not just expand to how?

7.5 stop wasting my time. I love to talk rugby just not ever with you because you're very boring. ta ta

Gwlad wrote:7.5 stop wasting my time. I love to talk rugby just not ever with you because you're very boring. ta ta

 You been back on the happy pills again Gwlad.

I'm boring fair enough. It was your own point you couldn't expand so it must be catching!

No 7&1/2 wrote:I'm boring fair enough. It was your own point you couldn't expand so it must be catching!

Round and round and round he goes, where he's going nobody knows.

Well its simple really. How do you think nz were outwitted? I don't think they were personally more too wound up lacking a few of their wise heads who had retired post wc.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Well its simple really.  How do you think nz were outwitted? I don't think they were personally more too wound up lacking a few of their wise heads who had retired post wc.  

Word of advice, set up a second 606v2 account then you can argue with yourself to your hearts content day in day out and give me a break. off you pop good lad.

So you can't think of a reason why they were outwitted? Why say it then?

If you would like to remove me for asking a further question on a point feel free tbh.

Hero, done

No 7&1/2 wrote:If you would like to remove me for asking a further question on a point feel free tbh.

So you'd prefer to leave rather than simply foe him?

I'm not going to foe someone sorry. I use the forum to discuss rugby 99% of the time. If you feel I've broken the rules that's fair enough. Honestly read this thread and any of my history and I'm not sure you'd find too much wrong bar challenging things o don't agree with and talking about points in general. If you don't want that and simply want everyone to agree with everyone else's posts it's not something id see the point of. I won't leave as I enjoy the forum. If you want to ban me for it I can't stop you.

No 7&1/2 wrote:How do you think nz were outwitted in Dublin gwlad?

Yes gwlad, how were the ABs outwitted in Dublin?

It's ok to back down

You were talking about Dublin - which you had to clarify earlier in the thread if you recall- and I was referring to Chicago, I would have thought that was patently obvious to absolutely anyone but apparently it wasn't. No harm done hope you understand now.

And what you think of me is irrelevant, not sure why you think I would be bothered

Noted that you have removed the reference to 'nobody will think worse of you'

That wasn't hard now was it

Good for you

ebop wrote:That wasn't hard now was it

Good for you

what wasn't hard?

Clarifying yourself

It's ok you know, no one will think any worse of you

ebop wrote:Clarifying yourself

It's ok you know, no one will think any worse of you

I was clarifying it for you not me, since you were clearly unable to grasp it from the get go.

Perhaps you can clarify why you removed the reference to what people will think of me in your last post - see edit - but have included it in this one? Do you not have the cohones to stick by your initial dig at me?

Of course I stand by what I write, can't help it if you post within a couple of minutes of my posts. I made the point by saying it in the next post. There's nothing wrong with the saying is there? You clarified yourself and that's good. It wasn't hard. Didn't need a string of posts beforehand and mod intervention to get there.

And back to your point. Yeah the ABs probably were rattled (in Chicago). They were making a late comeback but Ireland believed in themselves, stayed strong, scored a late try and deserved the historic win.

If there is nothing wrong with it and you 'stand by it' why edit it out?

Perhaps you can clarify, no one will think any the worse of you

Glad you finally can see the ABs were rattled in Chicago, phew that was a long road. Mods were necessitated by 7.5

The Abs intensity can be turned back on them and in Chicago was something they were unused to facing. The lions will aim to achieve constant high intensity in the Tests, direct at all times, quick ball and winning the collisions. The breakdown will win or lose the tests and in Conor Murray we have a player who can exploit the NZ tendency to linger in and around the contact area to slow ball down. Chicago proved that the All black gameplan is vulnerable to playing the high intensity game they play. if you can maintain the momentum for long enough.

You're right, no one should think the worse of me for editing it out and then saying the same thing a post later and saying I did so. It didn't add anything so I deleted it.

I never questioned ABs in Chicago because no one was discussing that game at the time you mentioned 'rattled' and you also didn't mention 'Chicago'. Yeah, it was probably obvious you were talking about Chicago but who can say?

Yeah that sounds like a pretty good objective to play high intensity rugby against the ABs. Ireland no doubt tried the same thing in Dublin but came up short by 3 tries to nil because there wasn't the surprise factor and the ABs were dialled in to it. If the Lions can keep up that level of intensity in all games in the schedule and win the series then I will be impressed. Yeah playing hard and direct rugby is probably the game plan with Gatland and I'm thinking it could also be a rolling maul-a-thon.

the reference to the ABs being rattled was, as stated, completely obvious to all but those who wanted to try and use it as some angle of attack. which was likewise, rather obvious.

So it didn't mean anything in the first post but did in the immediate next post? That some intense clarification

Mauls, another weak area for the ABs, notice how the things they're good at tend to be over valued as the pinnacles of rugby achievement and the things they're poor at like scrummaging and mauls, well, they just ain't important, old stuffy aspects of NH rugby  

Whoa, you just edited your post

Something to hide gwlad?

It didn't mean anything. You implied I had something to hide. I didn't. I posted the same words to show how hamfisted you are.

ebop wrote:Whoa, you just edited your post

Something to hide gwlad?

It didn't mean anything. You implied I had something to hide. I didn't. I posted the same words to show how hamfisted you are.

You did have something to hide, that's why you edited it

There you go being a hamfisted a*tist again

Lots of injuries in the Crusaders' win over the Chiefs in Fiji this morning - Matt Todd ruled out pre-match with concussion (the news was too late for me to tweak my fantasy team and bench him too mutter mutter).

And during the match Crotty (Crusaders' starting #12), McNicol (Chiefs' starting #12) & Donald (played 12 off the bench for the Chiefs all failed HIAs) - both teams finished with rather patched together midfields

ebop wrote:There you go being a hamfisted a*tist again

always resort to game calling, assume its all you have

Gwlad wrote:scrummaging and mauls, well, they just ain't important, old stuffy aspects of NH rugby

You said it mate

And finally you say something sensible

The Lions will rolling maul and rolling maul and rolling maul themselves to a standstill. In between scrummaging. And defending. And kicking points. Good luck with that one dimensional game plan. Probably all Gatland is capable of to be fair

Gwlad wrote:

ebop wrote:There you go being a hamfisted a*tist again

always resort to game calling, assume its all you have

It's not name calling it's stating common knowledge

"There weak points the Maul and the Scrum" do you ACTUALLY believe
those statements?"
As they Scrummage well,there own plays off the Scrum and Maul are
highly effective.Haven`t seen a full strength AB side go backwards v
anyone at the Scrum.
There own Maul is an effective scoring method,defence of no worse than
most other sides.
With the exception of the odd match NO side has shut them down for
the whole match.
Wales recently said how good they were closing them down for 60 minutes,
trouble was the game is 80 plus.Non stop tackling takes it`s toll look
at how often.NZ score or nearly score after the hooter.

Amen to that emack

Talk of the ABs scrum is clutching at straws

If anyone can point to a game where the ABs scrum cost them a game then I'm all ears

The only issue with the rolling maul is to ensure we don't get sucked into needless penalties and cards because that could influence games. It'll happen against the SR sides because the Lions will focus on scrums and rolling mauls and penalties and may end up winning those games with that game plan.

But the ABs will be more effective and more onto it and they don't get bullied by this kind of stuff.

And I'll add

If the Lions win the series

No matter how()

Then I will



Because that's what it's about

Kia kaha ABs because it's an onslaught and that's the beauty of it

Long live the Lions

NZ form team of the week (from http://www.nzherald.co.nz/rugby/news/article.cfm?c_id=80&objectid=11862032):

1. Aki Seiuli (Highlanders)
2. James Parsons (Blues)
3. Charlie Faumuina (Blues)
4. Brodie Retallick (Chiefs)  - Forward of the Week
5. Sam Whitelock (Crusaders)
6. Heiden Bedwell-Curtis (Crusaders)
7. Pete Samu (Crusaders)
8. Brad Shields (Hurricanes)
9. Augustine Pulu (Blues)
10. Richie Mo'unga (Crusaders) - Back of the Week. Honourary Mention Aaron Cruden (Chiefs)
11. James Lowe (Chiefs)
12. David Havili (Crusaders)
13. Anton Lienert-Brown (Chiefs) Honourary Mention Jack Goodhue (Crusaders)
14. Seta Tamanivalu (Crusaders)
15. Melani Nanai (Blues)

Interesting. Had heard ALB was off form, but maybe back to a Crotty-ALB midfield.

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:NZ form team of the week (from http://www.nzherald.co.nz/rugby/news/article.cfm?c_id=80&objectid=11862032):

1. Aki Seiuli (Highlanders)
2. James Parsons (Blues)
3. Charlie Faumuina (Blues)
4. Brodie Retallick (Chiefs)  - Forward of the Week
5. Sam Whitelock (Crusaders)
6. Heiden Bedwell-Curtis (Crusaders)
7. Pete Samu (Crusaders)
8. Brad Shields (Hurricanes)
9. Augustine Pulu (Blues)
10. Richie Mo'unga (Crusaders) - Back of the Week. Honourary Mention Aaron Cruden (Chiefs)
11. James Lowe (Chiefs)
12. David Havili (Crusaders)
13. Anton Lienert-Brown (Chiefs) Honourary Mention Jack Goodhue (Crusaders)
14. Seta Tamanivalu (Crusaders)
15. Melani Nanai (Blues)

Yes Retallick was immense last weekend, on top of his game, how he got to that tackle on the line I don't know.

Thought Cruden was better, but only two likely starting ABs this week. Reflects the depth, with a few still out.

ebop wrote:Amen to that emack

Talk of the ABs scrum is clutching at straws

If anyone can point to a game where the ABs scrum cost them a game then I'm all ears

The only issue with the rolling maul is to ensure we don't get sucked into needless penalties and cards because that could influence games. It'll happen against the SR sides because the Lions will focus on scrums and rolling mauls and penalties and may end up winning those games with that game plan.

But the ABs will be more effective and more onto it and they don't get bullied by this kind of stuff.

True, and if you can't breathe it makes scrummaging a bit more tricky as well...

Taylorman wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:NZ form team of the week (from http://www.nzherald.co.nz/rugby/news/article.cfm?c_id=80&objectid=11862032):

1. Aki Seiuli (Highlanders)
2. James Parsons (Blues)
3. Charlie Faumuina (Blues)
4. Brodie Retallick (Chiefs)  - Forward of the Week
5. Sam Whitelock (Crusaders)
6. Heiden Bedwell-Curtis (Crusaders)
7. Pete Samu (Crusaders)
8. Brad Shields (Hurricanes)
9. Augustine Pulu (Blues)
10. Richie Mo'unga (Crusaders) - Back of the Week. Honourary Mention Aaron Cruden (Chiefs)
11. James Lowe (Chiefs)
12. David Havili (Crusaders)
13. Anton Lienert-Brown (Chiefs) Honourary Mention Jack Goodhue (Crusaders)
14. Seta Tamanivalu (Crusaders)
15. Melani Nanai (Blues)

Yes Retallick was immense last weekend, on top of his game, how he got to that tackle on the line I don't know.

Thought Cruden was better, but only two likely starting ABs this week. Reflects the depth, with a few still out.

Cruden's goal kicking was a bit off, otherwise it was pretty close between the two - Barrett played fullback this week mind. But yeah, 2 or 3 likely starters if you include ALB. And quite a few who're unlikely to make the squad

Which ABs are available to Blues when the Lions touch down in Auckland?