Blues v British & Irish Lions, 7 June

First topic message reminder :

Blues v British & Irish Lions
7 June 2017
KO: 19:35 NZST (8.35am BST)
Eden Park, Auckland

Live on Sky Sports, Sky Sports HD and SkyGo

Referee: Pascal Gaüzère (France)
Touch judges: [tbc]
TMO: [tbc]

A. FORM:

19 June 1993: Auckland 23 - 18 British & Irish Lions

18 May 1983: Auckland 13 - 12 British & Irish Lions

23 June 1977: Auckland 15 - 34 British & Irish Lions

B. TEAMS:

Blues 
15 Michael Collins
14 Matt Duffie
13 George Moala
12 Sonny Bill Williams
11 Rieko Ioane
10 Stephen Perofeta
09 Augustine Pulu

08 Steven Luatua
07 Blake Gibson
06 Akira Ioane
05 Scott Scrafton
04 Gerard Cowley-Tuioti
03 Charlie Faumuina
02 James Parson
01 Ofa Tu'ungafasi

16 Hame Faiva
17 Alex Hodgman
18 Sione Mafileo
19 Patrick Tuipulotu
20 Kara Pryor
21 Sam Nock
22 Ihaia West
23 TJ Faiane/Melani Nanai

British & Irish Lions

Halfpenny; Nowell, Payne, Henshaw, Daly; Biggar, Webb; McGrath, Owens (captain), Cole, Itoje, Lawes, Haskell, Tipuric, Stander

Replacements: Best, Marler, Sinckler, Henderson, O'Mahony, Laidlaw, Sexton, L Williams

C. PREVIEW

GunsGermsV2 wrote:I thought Nowell was excellent apart from the try which was probably again more a system failure than Nowells fault.

He does seem to be the media scapegoat. To be clear, Ioane was excellent, but I think the error count across the team and that unfortunate SBW try right before half time were bigger factors. I do also think that Payne should have finished off that score. I'd back Joseph to have got there.

I watched the match last night but already knew the result and had read some of the comments.

Overall I thought the Lions were not too bad, Forwards were goodish with the tight five having a bit of an edge but this was offset by being a bit blunt in the backs, though I thought Webb was good at scrum-half.

It is still crazy to expect the Lions to play two matches within a week of landing in New Zealand.  Jet lag can take 1-2 weeks to work through.  They are also much worse than a scratch side because of the need to give everyone a start.  If they had a settled mid-week and Saturday side things would be better but for the sake of fairness, everyone needs a chance at this stage.

I still think they needed a week in New Zealand without a match to acclimatise.

I hope Gatland picks on tour form regardless because they need a few more sparks, the main worry may be about scoring more points but all the opponents will score tries as will the All Blacks.  Pick the guys doing something.

But the match was interesting and hopefully the Lions can get better. It was never going to be easy and I am sure they will lose more matches.

Lets see what develops.

On form Ioane is probably in the best wing in his position. If he's selected in the AB squad or starting line up is to be seen, however he is definitely someone we'll hear a lot more from.

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

After watching this match yesterday two things are certain; 1, Blues are a class act. 2, Jack Nowell had an absolute stinker, probably the worst on tour and funnily enough the English have remained quiet about it. If it was AWJ or any other Welsh player doing that they'd all be on here baying for blood.

You haven't read many comments then.

LondonTiger wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:I was disappointed to here that Nowell had a "torrid" day .

Was that because he was struggling individually because the Blues were just attacking so well and consistently?

His positioning was not great - though at times this may have been a "system" issue as often the defence was very narrow or not flat (and was awfully simlar to Seymour's positioning on Saturday). However rushing out of the line as he did (twice I think) and then miss the tackle is very much his own error, and he was run through once. Overall our defensive organisation was poor, but Nowell did appear to be the weakest link. Ball in hand he showed some flashes and some half breaks, but the Blues always scragged him well before it could be a proper break.

He did himself no favours, and with the limited time available to create a team he may already be consigned to the midweek games.

Well there's 2 English guys criticising him, took me 30secs to find.

He certainly disappointed.

Yeah, there's been plenty of criticism of Nowell's performance. He'll bounce back though.

He had a disappointing game. Not as poor as AWJ in the first game obviously.

Cyril wrote:Yeah, there's been plenty of criticism of Nowell's performance. He'll bounce back though.

He had a disappointing game. Not as poor as AWJ in the first game obviously.

Nobody will match that level of gashness mind. Though Henderson tried his best

Cyril wrote:He had a disappointing game. Not as poor as AWJ in the first game obviously.

Pretty sure AWJ wasn't worth -7 points but we know for a fact Nowell was. Most talked about England winger has a stinker, where are the venomous posts from all the English? You've even done it yourself again by bringing AWJ back into it. As I said before there's a severe lack of unity from the English for this Lions tour.

You'd have to be fairly stupid to compare AWJ and Nowell.

Poor wums.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Cyril wrote:He had a disappointing game. Not as poor as AWJ in the first game obviously.

Pretty sure AWJ wasn't worth -7 points but we know for a fact Nowell was. Most talked about England winger has a stinker, where are the venomous posts from all the English? You've even done it yourself again by bringing AWJ back into it. As I said before there's a severe lack of unity from the English for this Lions tour.

 Thats right Mikey, as Constable Glen Osborne says "Everyone has to stand together all as one" Even though I dont think he ever played against the Lions:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxorRtINRTc

Close game that was Laurie. I was impressed with a lot of your boys in blue. If I was rich I would certainly be trying to tempt them to the Dragons .

A lot of those players were brought into the representative level by Wayne Pivac.

 But sadly the Boys in Blue are very good at being beaten by the other New Zealand Super rugby teams.

aucklandlaurie wrote:A lot of those players were brought into the representative level by Wayne Pivac.

 But sadly the Boys in Blue are very good at being beaten by the other New Zealand Super rugby teams.

He's been doing the same with some Welsh youngsters in west Wales. And now he finally has Scarlets playing like a super rugby team they're a joy to watch.

That's no slight on Blues though. The teams in NZ are scary-good right now.

The Great Aukster wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

They were a strong squad, a squad that toured only loosing 1 match the whole tour (to Munster) with all the players getting time in the test squad. They were a full test team and in form. I stand by my statement.

eirebilly wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

They were a strong squad, a squad that toured only loosing 1 match the whole tour (to Munster) with all the players getting time in the test squad. They were a full test team and in form. I stand by my statement.

As far as I can tell 2 backs and 4 forwards from that XV played in the Ireland test right after. Now NZ may have mixed and matched across teh various Test matches, but strong as it may have been it does not to mee look like the full test team.

LondonTiger wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

They were a strong squad, a squad that toured only loosing 1 match the whole tour (to Munster) with all the players getting time in the test squad. They were a full test team and in form. I stand by my statement.

As far as I can tell 2 backs and 4 forwards from that XV played in the Ireland test right after. Now NZ may have mixed and matched across teh various Test matches, but strong as it may have been it does not to mee look like the full test team.

Back in those days, I am sure you remember LT (being an old man yourself ) the squads were all considered full test players as they all had appeared in full test matches I am sure if you asked the NZ team for that match, they would have considered themselves full test players.

LondonTiger wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

They were a strong squad, a squad that toured only loosing 1 match the whole tour (to Munster) with all the players getting time in the test squad. They were a full test team and in form. I stand by my statement.

As far as I can tell 2 backs and 4 forwards from that XV played in the Ireland test right after. Now NZ may have mixed and matched across teh various Test matches, but strong as it may have been it does not to mee look like the full test team.

Brian Williams, Bruce Robertson & Stu Wilson are NZ rugby hall-of-famers in that back line, ditto Knight, Haden, & Mourie in the forwards.

One suspects a few may have been dropped due to the Munster performance

I am not trying to demean the Munster win, right up there with Llanelli's earlier in the decade and far far ahead of the more recent wins teams like Leicester have managed against international touring sides.

Just weighing in on a minor disagreement that is far more entertaining than the guff to do with who should captain the Lions in each game.

LondonTiger wrote:I am not trying to demean the Munster win, right up there with Llanelli's earlier in the decade and far far ahead of the more recent wins teams like Leicester have managed against international touring sides.

Just weighing in on a minor disagreement that is far more entertaining than the guff to do with who should captain the Lions in each game.

Thanks Pete, it was hardly a second tier team that day

LondonTiger wrote:I am not trying to demean the Munster win, right up there with Llanelli's earlier in the decade and far far ahead of the more recent wins teams like Leicester have managed against international touring sides.

Just weighing in on a minor disagreement that is far more entertaining than the guff to do with who should captain the Lions in each game.

Fair play to ye LT

eirebilly wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

They were a strong squad, a squad that toured only loosing 1 match the whole tour (to Munster) with all the players getting time in the test squad. They were a full test team and in form. I stand by my statement.

Its almost as if someone should write a musical about it.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

They were a strong squad, a squad that toured only loosing 1 match the whole tour (to Munster) with all the players getting time in the test squad. They were a full test team and in form. I stand by my statement.

Its almost as if someone should write a musical about it.

Meanwhile the French are making a movie about beating the ABs in Auckland on Bastille Day in 1979

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

They were a strong squad, a squad that toured only loosing 1 match the whole tour (to Munster) with all the players getting time in the test squad. They were a full test team and in form. I stand by my statement.

Its almost as if someone should write a musical about it.

Meanwhile the French are making a movie about beating the ABs in Auckland on Bastille Day in 1979

And the Welsh are making a Hollywood Blockbuster about 'that dive' out of the lineout in 1978!

Griff wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

eirebilly wrote:AB team in 1978

B. R. Johnstone, J. E. Black, G. A. Knight, F. J. Oliver, A. M. Haden, W. G. Graham, G. N. K. Mourie, A. A. McGregor, M. W. Donaldson, E. J. Dunn, B. G. Williams, J. L. Jaffray, B. J. Robertson, S. S. Wilson, B. J. McKechnie

That's a quality side. McKechnie never started a test - though he did win a test off the bench vs Wales that tour. And 3 years later he faced the underarm ball https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKNQ-crIr50

So it was six non-Test starters after all - I said half a dozen which was obviously wrong!

They were a strong squad, a squad that toured only loosing 1 match the whole tour (to Munster) with all the players getting time in the test squad. They were a full test team and in form. I stand by my statement.

Its almost as if someone should write a musical about it.

Meanwhile the French are making a movie about beating the ABs in Auckland on Bastille Day in 1979

And the Welsh are making a Hollywood Blockbuster about 'that dive' out of the lineout in 1978!

That reminds me, I need to track down a copy of "Old Scores" from back in 1991