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European Tour - 2019

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Post by GPB Mon 14 Jan 2019, 6:56 pm

First topic message reminder :

New Year, Time for a New Thread.

EuroTour makes it 2019 Debut this week with the Abu Dhabi HSBC Classic Presented by EGA.  Next week is Dubai and the following week is the New Saudi Event

Guessing that the EGA Presentation got Abu Dhabi a promotion to a Rolex Series event.


DJ and BK are playing in Abu Dhabi.  So is Fleetwood, Stenson, Oosthuizen, RCB, Barnrat, Poulter, and Oleson

Despite the the Hired Guns from USA and Rolex Promotion, Abu Dhabi will have its lowest OWGR rating in 10 yrs.  Pelley can't be happy about that.

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Post by McLaren Sun 13 Dec 2020, 12:49 pm

Was it the US open where Reed hung on for 3 rounds with a great short game? One of the majors this year anyway. But like that event, even his short game couldn't bail him out all the time.


When asked post round about playing in the RC Lee actually sounded more keen to be the captain. And said outright that he expected to be asked. Which is fair enough.
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Post by McLaren Sun 13 Dec 2020, 12:59 pm

From a Scottish perspective it was a poor day for fat bob. Failed to get into the top 50 when the opportunity was right there. Would have been a key milestone for him.
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Post by TM2K Sun 13 Dec 2020, 2:06 pm

Pretty good viewing right up to the death...pleased for both winners, almost as much as Reed’s finish did!!

Westwood has always come across as a decent bloke and can be quite funny at times. Thought Fitzgerald was very impressive today, he’s still actually pretty young even though it’seems like he’s been around for ages. Shouldn’t really be a surprise to see him looking calm and composed to win a big event, If memory serves, he did win the US Amateur not that long ago.


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Post by LadyPutt Sun 13 Dec 2020, 2:44 pm

GPB wrote:Has the EuroTour announced a 2021 schedule?  I checked the ET website and I couldn't find one.  

Drop down menu stops at 2020

https://www.europeantour.com/european-tour/schedule/
Keith Pelley said on Sky this morning that it will be announced next week.
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Post by pedro Sun 13 Dec 2020, 2:54 pm

Westy! What a legend.

And Fitzy, yes he’s a sneaky good player. Just hang in there.

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Post by GPB Sun 13 Dec 2020, 5:17 pm

LadyPutt wrote:
GPB wrote:Has the EuroTour announced a 2021 schedule?  I checked the ET website and I couldn't find one.  

Drop down menu stops at 2020

https://www.europeantour.com/european-tour/schedule/
Keith Pelley said on Sky this morning that it will be announced next week.

Just like a promiscuous female ... "Better late than never!"

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Post by McLaren Tue 15 Dec 2020, 2:37 pm

ET 21 schedule.

https://www.europeantour.com/european-tour/news/articles/detail/european-announces-2021-schedule/


Only 4 Rolex (PGA, Scottish Open, Abu Dhabi HSBC and World Tour championship)


3 events in Scotland (Scottish Open @ Renaissance, Hero Open @ Fairmont and Dunhill links)
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Post by pedro Wed 16 Dec 2020, 12:13 am

A lot of seat filler tournaments that won’t attract big names.

Great to see they’re finally going to Marco Simone GC.

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Post by McLaren Thu 17 Dec 2020, 11:01 am

Morikawa is going to play the ODDC. Probably nothing to do with the "strategic alliance" as he will have scheduled it a while back but good to see that caliber of playing on the ET.


Speaking of the strategic alliance, does anyone know when the details of what it actually entails will be made public?
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Post by robopz Thu 17 Dec 2020, 2:57 pm

McLaren wrote:ET 21 schedule.

https://www.europeantour.com/european-tour/news/articles/detail/european-announces-2021-schedule/

Only 4 Rolex (PGA, Scottish Open, Abu Dhabi HSBC and World Tour championship)

3 events in Scotland (Scottish Open @ Renaissance, Hero Open @ Fairmont and Dunhill links)
Pretty good job by the ET being able to put together even this much of a schedule. 42 events thru mid November... and expect the normal add on's thru the end of the year to get them up to maybe 45-46 for the calendar year.

I wouldn't be too concerned about the loss of some Rolex events and French Open at this point. So many worldwide disruptions over Covid... its still near impossible to know where we will be by mid next year. I would expect the French Open back in 2022 and a full schedule along with whatever co-sanctions ET is gonna have with the PGAT. And with any events with the PGAT involved they're gonna have to be at least "Rolex level" to make it on the schedule. All good for now... and even better things for the ET in the future IMO.

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Post by JAS Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:05 pm

McLaren wrote:ET 21 schedule.

https://www.europeantour.com/european-tour/news/articles/detail/european-announces-2021-schedule/


Only 4 Rolex (PGA, Scottish Open, Abu Dhabi HSBC and World Tour championship)


3 events in Scotland (Scottish Open @ Renaissance, Hero Open @ Fairmont and Dunhill links)

So has the Scottish Open pretty much taken up residence at the Renaissance now? I thought it was quite fair to triangulate between East (Renaissance, Gullane), North (Castle Stuart, Royal Aberdeen) & West (Dundonald).

Wonder if ex-President 45 will start lobbying for Turnberry & Trump Aberdeen to be added to a rotation?

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Post by super_realist Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:16 pm

I would hope so. Take Trump out of the equation and both Turnberry and Trump Ayburdeen are first class courses You could add Dumbarnie to that list of potential Scottish Open venues too.

Personally I think Loch Lomond was the best venue for the Scottish Open.


Last edited by super_realist on Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:17 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by robopz Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:17 pm

JAS wrote:Wonder if ex-President 45 will start lobbying for Turnberry & Trump Aberdeen to be added to a rotation?
Seems pretty clear Turnberry and/or Trump Aberdeen is out of serious consideration as long as the Don is involved in ownership. Sad, but it is what it is, and not unreasonably so IMO.

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Post by super_realist Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:21 pm

I dont think the tour is that woke or left.

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Post by GPB Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:33 pm

Losing the French Open continues the Ryder Cup Curse on Ryder Cup venues and their traditional European Tour event.

European Masters was lost after K-Club hosted the Ryder Cup
Celtic Manor tournament was lost after Wales hosted the Ryder Cup (albeit temporarily as it back on the schedule)
Gleneagles lost its tournament after it hosted the Ryder Cup

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Post by super_realist Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:34 pm

GPB wrote:Losing the French Open continues the Ryder Cup Curse on Ryder Cup venues and their traditional European Tour event.

European Masters was lost after K-Club hosted the Ryder Cup
Celtic Manor tournament was lost after Wales hosted the Ryder Cup (albeit temporarily as it back on the schedule)
Gleneagles lost its tournament after it hosted the Ryder Cup

Gleneagles one was always a bit on/off and somewhat tinpot anyway.

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Post by JAS Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:45 pm

robopz wrote:
JAS wrote:Wonder if ex-President 45 will start lobbying for Turnberry & Trump Aberdeen to be added to a rotation?
Seems pretty clear Turnberry and/or Trump Aberdeen is out of serious consideration as long as the Don is involved in ownership. Sad, but it is what it is, and not unreasonably so IMO.

Doesn't the PGAtour play Trump venues e.g. Doral or have they stopped going there for more than just the fact that it was being refurbed.

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Post by navyblueshorts Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:52 pm

super_realist wrote:I dont think the tour is that woke or left.
But it's not a look they want or need; especially as Scotland isn't exactly short of good courses. If '45' stays out there, talking nonsense and even maybe running again in 2024, then I'd be surprised if any of his venues would be considered for some time. Correct as well, IMO.
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Post by super_realist Thu 17 Dec 2020, 3:58 pm

Seems a bit intolerant to me. I don't like Trump either but it's a bit cancel culture to not consider his courses just because he owns them.

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Post by McLaren Thu 17 Dec 2020, 4:25 pm

super_realist wrote:Seems a bit intolerant to me. I don't like Trump either but it's a bit cancel culture to not consider his courses just because he owns them.

How high should the cancellation bar be if you don't think even Trump has met it?
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Post by super_realist Thu 17 Dec 2020, 4:49 pm

Mac, golf is a deeply conservative institution. That's why I think they don't care who owns a course. If they allow organisations like Muirfield and the R&A into the coterie then not allowing Trump is a little hypocritical.

Do you check who owns a course before deciding whether to play it or watch a tournament played over it? No, I didn't think you did.

The Tour have tournaments in Saudi Arabia, China and Qatar for goodness sake.
If you don't hold tournaments on Trump owned courses then you shouldn't hold them in those places either.

You can't be all high and mighty about Trump with an indignant, petted lip, Lewis Hamilton level of hypocrisy but not mention the other venues that they do hold tournaments at which are even dodger than Trump.

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Post by Shotrock Thu 17 Dec 2020, 7:17 pm

What I find interesting is just how Trump is (mis?) managing his golf property investments. He'll need to be playing "long ball" as we say to get any sort of decent return.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-trump-golf-insight/donald-trumps-billion-dollar-golf-course-development-play-little-to-show-so-far-idUSKBN27C2ES

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Post by GPB Fri 18 Dec 2020, 3:11 am

There is going to be a PGA Championship at a Trump course in New Jersey in the near future.

Doral is off the table since they started going to Mexico.

The Puerto Rico event used to be on a Trump property, but I think Trump sold it


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Post by JAS Fri 18 Dec 2020, 6:38 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
super_realist wrote:I dont think the tour is that woke or left.
But it's not a look they want or need; especially as Scotland isn't exactly short of good courses. If '45' stays out there, talking nonsense and even maybe running again in 2024, then I'd be surprised if any of his venues would be considered for some time. Correct as well, IMO.

super_realist wrote:I tend to agree but the point is that if you have Saudi and Qatar on your list, then you can't very well claim that you are omitting Trump course because of who owns them. Even Lewis Hamilton, Prince Harry  or Benedict Cumberbatch could see that was hypocritical.

Well given the Human Rights abuses in China you could say the same about China as well. If you looked hard enough you could find reasons to avoid anywhere. We throw up our hands in horror at Trumps idiocy but...as the worlds 5th richest democracy why are so many dependent on foodbanks, why do we have so many homeless on the streets? I’d suggest we look at ourselves before getting quite so self righteous about the shortcomings of others.
Or... we look the other way, hold our noses and accept the way of the free market...which way do we go?  We shouldn’t be doing both and cherry picking what we want to condemn.

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Post by navyblueshorts Fri 18 Dec 2020, 9:02 pm

JAS wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
super_realist wrote:I dont think the tour is that woke or left.
But it's not a look they want or need; especially as Scotland isn't exactly short of good courses. If '45' stays out there, talking nonsense and even maybe running again in 2024, then I'd be surprised if any of his venues would be considered for some time. Correct as well, IMO.

super_realist wrote:I tend to agree but the point is that if you have Saudi and Qatar on your list, then you can't very well claim that you are omitting Trump course because of who owns them. Even Lewis Hamilton, Prince Harry  or Benedict Cumberbatch could see that was hypocritical.

Well given the Human Rights abuses in China you could say the same about China as well. If you looked hard enough you could find reasons to avoid anywhere. We throw up our hands in horror at Trumps idiocy but...as the worlds 5th richest democracy why are so many dependent on foodbanks, why do we have so many homeless on the streets? I’d suggest we look at ourselves before getting quite so self righteous about the shortcomings of others.
Or... we look the other way, hold our noses and accept the way of the free market...which way do we go?  We shouldn’t be doing both and cherry picking what we want to condemn.
I suggest we aren't such overt c***s though.
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Post by robopz Fri 25 Dec 2020, 10:58 pm

super_realist wrote:Seems a bit intolerant to me. I don't like Trump either but it's a bit cancel culture to not consider his courses just because he owns them.
Of course it's selective cancel culture there are no Trump courses in the rotation, but yet the tour plays in Saudi, Qatar and China.

But there's another side of it. Trump sucks all of the air out of the room of any event at his venues. The PGAT moved away from Doral not so much because of Trump's politics, but because he was swooping in and stealing the limelight away from sponsors who were paying $14 million to title the event.

And since Trump became POTUS, no new events had been scheduled on any of his properties. Not worth the distractions. Those that have been played since and scheduled for the future were already under contract prior to the election.

Also Puerto Rico never was a Trump owned property, but it was Trump managed. But went under bankruptcy and Trump management was kicked out.

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Post by McLaren Tue 29 Dec 2020, 10:33 am

Navy

This seems like the UK has been pretty c***y to me.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/16/unicef-feed-hungry-children-uk-first-time-history
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Post by McLaren Tue 29 Dec 2020, 10:35 am

I almost wonder if Super would have defended playing sports events in South Africa had he been around in the 80's?
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 29 Dec 2020, 12:07 pm

McLaren wrote:Navy

This seems like the UK has been pretty c***y to me.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/16/unicef-feed-hungry-children-uk-first-time-history
🤷
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Post by McLaren Tue 29 Dec 2020, 2:09 pm

What, you don't think that it's a bit sh***y our current government has got to this point?
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 29 Dec 2020, 3:24 pm

McLaren wrote:What, you don't think that it's a bit sh***y our current government has got to this point?
🤷 Don't really care. At least we don't lop heads off, or use concentration camps at the moment.
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 05 Jan 2021, 3:58 pm

Good to know they're capable of some amateurish mistakes:

Spoiler:

Poulter's shank and Paratore's hacking about in the rough highlights for me.
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Post by I'm never wrong Thu 21 Jan 2021, 2:36 pm

Good start by McIlroy and Hatton. Fog delay means Round 1 to be completed tomorrow. Might not be able to complete day 2 on Friday either.

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Post by I'm never wrong Fri 22 Jan 2021, 11:09 am

Rory just hit a 3 wood 322 yards. Admittedly downwind. But still.

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Post by McLaren Fri 22 Jan 2021, 3:11 pm

I'm never wrong wrote:Rory just hit a 3 wood 322 yards. Admittedly downwind. But still.

Yeh but he is still doing a McIlroy and throwing in a duff round.
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Post by navyblueshorts Fri 22 Jan 2021, 8:11 pm

McLaren wrote:
I'm never wrong wrote:Rory just hit a 3 wood 322 yards. Admittedly downwind. But still.

Yeh but he is still doing a McIlroy and throwing in a duff round.
Laugh True, that.
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Post by McLaren Sat 23 Jan 2021, 6:34 pm

He got it back today. I am not unrealistic enough to think he should go super low every day but just imagine Rory's career if he could have 3 good rounds and an average one, rather than 3 good rounds and a shocker.

Not that this weeks second round was a shocker, but you get the point.
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Post by LadyPutt Mon 25 Jan 2021, 8:13 am

Outplayed when put under pressure in the final round. Great golf from “angry golfer” Tyrrell Hatton. If you haven’t seen the video, check out YouTube!
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Post by McLaren Mon 25 Jan 2021, 4:23 pm

McIlroy might be one of the most difficult to asses golfers to have played since I started watching the game. If he spreads out his 4 majors then he probably faces less scrutiny but "bottles" like yesterday and no majors since 2014 leave you wondering how a player of such talent finds it so hard to win.

I guess we just spoiled by how easy Tiger made it look to translate being the best golfer in the world into winning tournaments.
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Post by McLaren Mon 25 Jan 2021, 4:25 pm

I think most top sportspeople would be seriously pissed that Tyrrell beat them and went ahead of them in the world rankings, with Rory I honestly doubt he cares.
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 26 Jan 2021, 10:21 am

McLaren wrote:McIlroy might be one of the most difficult to asses golfers to have played since I started watching the game. If he spreads out his 4 majors then he probably faces less scrutiny but "bottles" like yesterday and no majors since 2014 leave you wondering how a player of such talent finds it so hard to win.

I guess we just spoiled by how easy Tiger made it look to translate being the best golfer in the world into winning tournaments.
Looking back, think Tiger was unusual - don't think he gave a 4X about the money in the main. Nice and all that, but his drive was to win.

The rest? More than happy once they're made for life or, if they're lucky, win a single Major. Can't say I blame them - nice life playing golf for oodles of cash (at least, at this rarified level) and all 'normal' worries long since left behind. Some, I suspect, saw a challenge in trying to beat Woods when he was at his peak, but that's gone now.
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Post by beninho Tue 26 Jan 2021, 11:01 am

I don't think you can compare tiger to anyone current. Though, you can say the impact of TW is probably why the game is as tight as it is, with so many young players, with much better health and fitness regimes. Players will have good periods, but I cant see how they can dominate in his way.


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Post by GPB Tue 26 Jan 2021, 3:37 pm

"...with much better health and fitness regimes...."

Sure has helped Tiger.

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Post by Shotrock Tue 26 Jan 2021, 6:47 pm

I hear you Mac ... Rory is a tough one to figure out. An incredible swing and talent that, for some reason, does not win as often as I think he should (For what that's worth). There are times he makes it look so easy.

Still, because I'm a sucker, I'll bet on him for Augusta. He'll prove me right one of these years.

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Post by I'm never wrong Tue 26 Jan 2021, 7:44 pm

Shotrock wrote: He'll prove me right one of these years.
Will you ever get all the money back you've outlayed previously? Very Happy

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Post by Shotrock Tue 26 Jan 2021, 7:59 pm

I wish!


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Post by I'm never wrong Tue 02 Feb 2021, 9:24 am

Wonder how much was paid out in "appearance fees" to get DJ, Mickelson, Dechambeau, Reed, Finau, Kokrak, Na, Vegas and Els to turn up for the Saudi International? I wonder how many players would prefer to have a bigger prize fund rather than OWGR points? Phoenix Waste Management Open suffers a bit but still has Koepka, MvIlroy, Rahm, Schauffele, JT and Wolff as headliners.

(Not a patch on Kwini, sorry.)

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Post by GPB Tue 02 Feb 2021, 3:47 pm

French Open is trying to ward of the Euro Ryder Cup Venue/Tournament curse.

https://www.alistairtaitgolf.com/post/the-french-open-deserves-better

GPB

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European Tour - 2019 - Page 14 Empty Re: European Tour - 2019

Post by pedro Wed 03 Feb 2021, 11:55 pm

I'm never wrong wrote:Wonder how much was paid out in "appearance fees" to get DJ, Mickelson, Dechambeau, Reed, Finau, Kokrak, Na, Vegas and Els to turn up for the Saudi International?
Nothing. They go for the weather and the culture.

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European Tour - 2019 - Page 14 Empty Re: European Tour - 2019

Post by GPB Thu 04 Feb 2021, 7:23 pm

pedro wrote:
I'm never wrong wrote:Wonder how much was paid out in "appearance fees" to get DJ, Mickelson, Dechambeau, Reed, Finau, Kokrak, Na, Vegas and Els to turn up for the Saudi International?
Nothing. They go for the weather and the culture.

Don't forget about the hot women and their Burqas~

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