2019/20 Premier League Thread - The Year We Find Out if Liverpool Winning the Title is More Important Than People’s Lives

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Mon 13 May 2019, 9:04 am

First topic message reminder :

2019/20 Barclays season thread

Start off by asking how long you think Ole will last at the wheel? For me, sacked by February 2020
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Post by Duty281 on Sun 29 Dec 2019, 5:22 pm

Another game ruined by VAR.

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Post by Soul Requiem on Sun 29 Dec 2019, 5:28 pm

This armpit rule for VAR is getting silly, it's meant to be for blunders not marginal calls.

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Post by westisbest on Sun 29 Dec 2019, 11:06 pm

That Wolves disallowed goal today is an absolute joke.
Need to change the offside rule.

Make it the whole body in front of the defender, not a body part.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 1:03 am

The Norwich goal being disallowed yesterday was even worse.
I also don't understand why they don't use retired refs, say in the last five years, to do the VAR, not relative untested rookies.

Having said all of which, the presumed "bigger" club on the day still gets 70% of the marginal calls, whether by ref or by VAR. Nothing's changed there.

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Post by Atila on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 1:45 am

So it's official, Moyes is back as West Ham manager.

I wonder if West Ham had thought about reappointing Sam Allardyce before going back for Moyes?

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Post by PaulHv2 on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 9:53 am

kwinigolfer wrote:The Norwich goal being disallowed yesterday was even worse.
I also don't understand why they don't use retired refs, say in the last five years, to do the VAR, not relative untested rookies.

Having said all of which, the presumed "bigger" club on the day still gets 70% of the marginal calls, whether by ref or by VAR. Nothing's changed there.

They don't though do they? Especially when it comes to the offside rule, we've had numerous chalked off this season for that exact same incident as have City. Fans moaning that linesmen make mistakes and don't call the close offside decisions, now VAR is calling them black and white you're moaning about that.
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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 11:40 am

Surprisingly a LiVARpool fan is pro VAR - as it hands them the league on a silver platter. A hollow title win it shall be, in this, a disastrous season forever asterisked in the history books by the intervention of this horrific system, that’s altering the game for the worse
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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 11:47 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Surprisingly a LiVARpool fan is pro VAR - as it hands them the league on a silver platter. A hollow title win it shall be, in this, a disastrous season forever asterisked in the history books by the intervention of this horrific system, that’s altering the game for the worse
I dOnT LikE VAr

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Post by PaulHv2 on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 12:52 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Surprisingly a LiVARpool fan is pro VAR - as it hands them the league on a silver platter. A hollow title win it shall be, in this, a disastrous season forever asterisked in the history books by the intervention of this horrific system, that’s altering the game for the worse

Haven't said I'm a VAR fan Olly, I was merely making a point that "fans" are still claiming that the bigger clubs are getting all the decisions is complete rubbish. I think VAR is taking the soul out of the game at times, but to claim that is the only reason Liverpool could win the title is just daft. To quote Chris Sutton "you're better than that Olly".
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Post by Atila on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 1:57 pm

Things will never change with regards to fans, players and managers moaning when things don't go their way. They all complained before we had VAR, and they'll still complain now we have VAR.

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Post by lfc91 on Mon 30 Dec 2019, 4:26 pm

I remember a lot of rival fans claiming VAR would be the end of Liverpool as title challengers as apparently Liverpool got alot of decisions that they shouldn't which VAR would now overturn. Now they are "LiVARpool" Funny old world.

In relation to the wolves game, the ref made an issue out of the first goal when he didn't have too. Stay out of it, VAR would have checked for handball anyway, seen it was fine, no issue.

The offside seems insane. Apparently it was millimetres in it and it was very hard to tell watching it. Thought it should have stood. Don't think it's good enough to judge something so close if they are still manually placing the lines in the studio?

Should say the majority or offside calls I'm happy with. Even if it is just a half a boot. If it's clear to see with the naked eye then fair enough. The wolves one and the firmino armpit etc are a different story.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Tue 31 Dec 2019, 3:55 am

I do think the VVD one was handball.

I just think the PL have made a hash out of this system. They can make little changes to improve it, they need to manage the media message a bit better. They need to do something that stops this media-led "VAR" costs 'insert team'. VAR has never cost anyone anything, they are just applying laws.

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Post by Duty281 on Fri 10 Jan 2020, 9:53 pm

Wanted West Ham to lose, but that’s another atrocious VAR decision to spoil the game.

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Post by Soul Requiem on Fri 10 Jan 2020, 10:02 pm

The rules now state that hand ball is hand ball whether deliberate or not so the correct decision was made.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sat 11 Jan 2020, 6:04 am

It’s the correct decision but an awful rule.

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Post by lfc91 on Sat 11 Jan 2020, 9:15 am

Can't blame VAR for that one. As has been said, just a poor rule that VAR has enforced correctly.

Although expect to see big changes to VAR before next season, the offside being the killer for me. Ruining the joy of a goal.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun 12 Jan 2020, 9:45 am

If they don't make changes to its implementation, and the mad rules that have been exposed so badly, then I can't see how it can work.

There needs to be a margin for offsides, a time limit on decisions and change to that handball rule.

It is wrong seeing goals scored and players and fans not celebrating properly.

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Post by Just John on Sun 12 Jan 2020, 5:12 pm

Dean Smith & Eddie Howe need to be put out of their misery. Be joining Norwich, otherwise.

Aguero level with Lampard on 177 goals clap
Sergio Aguero (12) overtakes Alan Shearer (11) and now has more hat tricks than anyone in Premier League history.

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Post by westisbest on Sun 12 Jan 2020, 6:41 pm

As good as City are, Jesus we were dreadful.
Can’t mess around with the ball in your own box, especially against the likes of city.

We need a striker in before Brighton.
Have to say only Heaton, Mings and Konsa, El Ghazi to an extent have been decent from our signings.

We miss McGinn big time.

Jack must be planning his next move like us fans planning on trips to Reading Bristol City QPR etc.

The worry at the start of the season with the amount we spent, was not to do a Fulham. We’ll certainly doing that now.

Need a miracle now I think to stay up.

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Post by Just John on Mon 20 Jan 2020, 10:45 am

Bar, Liverpool, the weekend results, pretty much sum up how poor the so-called top teams in the PL are right now. Been a dire season, overall, and, without VAR, there would probably be very little to discuss.

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Post by Duty281 on Wed 22 Jan 2020, 9:31 pm

Only interest left is seeing which two teams join Norwich in being relegated (think it’ll be West Ham and Bournemouth) and enjoying the regular United losses.

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Post by westisbest on Wed 22 Jan 2020, 10:26 pm

I think despite Liverpool having already won the league, it’s been a decent prem season so far.

Sheffield United doing well. Saints have been very good shooting up the table since the 9-0 defeat.
Lower teams(sadly apart from Villa) beating teams near the top.

Relegation battle is normally always more interesting than the title.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Thu 23 Jan 2020, 1:04 am

Duty281 wrote:Only interest left is seeing which two teams join Norwich in being relegated (think it’ll be West Ham and Bournemouth) and enjoying the regular United losses.


Just a shame that United's demise is laid at the door of Ole, instead of the annually culpable Glazers & their flunky Woodward.

Can't think of a successful US owner (possibly with the Fenway exception) during the past 20-odd years and the Glazer family is pretty much as bad as they come. Would be lovely to see them lose a fortune but sadly that's unlikely.

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Post by Soul Requiem on Thu 23 Jan 2020, 7:40 am

kwinigolfer wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Only interest left is seeing which two teams join Norwich in being relegated (think it’ll be West Ham and Bournemouth) and enjoying the regular United losses.


Just a shame that United's demise is laid at the door of Ole, instead of the annually culpable Glazers & their flunky Woodward.

Can't think of a successful US owner (possibly with the Fenway exception) during the past 20-odd years and the Glazer family is pretty much as bad as they come. Would be lovely to see them lose a fortune but sadly that's unlikely.

Aside from the five league titles and champions league the team won during the Glazer tenure, still the most successful English team during that period. Woodward however doesn't have a clue.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Thu 23 Jan 2020, 8:01 am

The title race is still rarely the thing I find most interesting in the Premier League, and with it being tied up so early (it would seem), we might get some good coverage of the battle at the bottom and whichever team falls into fourth place.

I suspect Chelsea will get away with it, but I’m hoping Wolves break in. Europa returning could make that harder.

The bottom three, I agree with Doots. Norwich bottom, West Ham 19th and then probably Bournemouth, although they are more likely to hit a big run of form than Villa so it’s a tight call.

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Post by westisbest on Thu 23 Jan 2020, 8:45 pm

Bournemouth villa is a massive game next week( glad I’ve got a ticket).

I’m really hoping Samatta hits the ground running.
Played last few games without a striker. As we know Wesley was below par.

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Post by westisbest on Thu 23 Jan 2020, 8:46 pm

Can’t see Bournemouth hitting a big run of form.

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Post by Duty281 on Fri 24 Jan 2020, 10:55 am

westisbest wrote:Can’t see Bournemouth hitting a big run of form.

Mind you, they’ve won the same number of league games as the Arsenal this season.

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Post by Galted on Fri 24 Jan 2020, 11:13 am

Duty281 wrote:
westisbest wrote:Can’t see Bournemouth hitting a big run of form.

Mind you, they’ve won the same number of league games as the Arsenal this season.

Surprised enough by that to have a look and only 2 teams have won fewer games than Arsenal.
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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Fri 24 Jan 2020, 11:49 am

Bournemouth have always been a streaky team.

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Post by Atila on Fri 24 Jan 2020, 6:12 pm

Soul Requiem wrote:
kwinigolfer wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Only interest left is seeing which two teams join Norwich in being relegated (think it’ll be West Ham and Bournemouth) and enjoying the regular United losses.


Just a shame that United's demise is laid at the door of Ole, instead of the annually culpable Glazers & their flunky Woodward.

Can't think of a successful US owner (possibly with the Fenway exception) during the past 20-odd years and the Glazer family is pretty much as bad as they come. Would be lovely to see them lose a fortune but sadly that's unlikely.

Aside from the five league titles and champions league the team won during the Glazer tenure, still the most successful English team during that period. Woodward however doesn't have a clue.
Football fans have short memories. It was only 3 years ago that Liverpool fans themselves staged a protest against their Fenway owners when approximately 10,000 fans walked out of Anfield in the 77th minute to protest an increase in ticket prices. Now though as they look like they're going to win the title, the Fenway guys are apparently the perfect owners that all clubs should try to emulate.

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Post by dyrewolfe on Tue 28 Jan 2020, 3:09 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Bournemouth have always been a streaky team.

Maybe should be renamed Baconmouth? Wink Whistle
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Post by PaulHv2 on Wed 29 Jan 2020, 6:01 pm

Atila wrote:
Soul Requiem wrote:
kwinigolfer wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Only interest left is seeing which two teams join Norwich in being relegated (think it’ll be West Ham and Bournemouth) and enjoying the regular United losses.


Just a shame that United's demise is laid at the door of Ole, instead of the annually culpable Glazers & their flunky Woodward.

Can't think of a successful US owner (possibly with the Fenway exception) during the past 20-odd years and the Glazer family is pretty much as bad as they come. Would be lovely to see them lose a fortune but sadly that's unlikely.

Aside from the five league titles and champions league the team won during the Glazer tenure, still the most successful English team during that period. Woodward however doesn't have a clue.
Football fans have short memories. It was only 3 years ago that Liverpool fans themselves staged a protest against their Fenway owners when approximately 10,000 fans walked out of Anfield in the 77th minute to protest an increase in ticket prices. Now though as they look like they're going to win the title, the Fenway guys are apparently the perfect owners that all clubs should try to emulate.

You have to then take on board the Fenway Group listened to the fans, and actually held fan forums to overcome these issues. Since then have implemented stratergies to avoid these issues reoccuring, this is a big part of them winning over the fans.
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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Thu 30 Jan 2020, 9:51 am

Plus the Fenway group are too busy coordinating covering up cheating in their other sports franchises in the US, to be worrying about Liverpool at the minute
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Post by Duty281 on Sun 02 Feb 2020, 6:33 pm

Tottenham keeping their top four hopes alive by Mourinho-ing City. Away to Chelsea later in the month could be season defining.

Arsenal continue their limp season. Haven’t been relegated for over 100 years, but they’re only seven points above the drop zone currently.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun 09 Feb 2020, 7:38 am

Since 94/95 when the Premier League went to 20 clubs there have been three teams who have been relegated after sitting outside the bottom six after 25 games

2001/02 Ipswich (12th after 25 games)
2008/09 Newcastle (13th after 25 games)
2010/11 Blackpool (10th after 25 games)

Newcastle and Palace fans cant rest easier, even with Palace not winning in seven.

The Bottom 6 (if everyone got the same result against their remaining opponents as in their previous meeting this season)

15 West Ham - 40 points
16 Bournemouth - 39 points
17 Brighton - 36 points
18 Aston Villa - 33 points
19 Watford - 32 points
20 Norwich - 25 points

As much as Brighton have had some weak draws lately, there is no way they finish below West Ham. Bournemouth have got some momentum, which is important. West Ham have none and are about to hit a very tough period of fixtures.

Watford maybe are dipping from the new manager bounce. I think it's Norwich, West Ham and then one of Watford or Villa.

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Post by Duty281 on Sun 09 Feb 2020, 10:02 am

West Ham’s fixture list is horrible. Will probably destroy all their confidence before getting to the easier run later in the season, as well as heaping the pressure on to get wins against the likes of Newcastle and Villa and Norwich. If West Ham do go down, they’ll likely be in severe financial jeopardy.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun 09 Feb 2020, 10:22 am

Those reports are based on a bit of propaganda and also last season's accounts. With the assets we have and the wage clauses in all contracts, it's nowhere near as bad as they suggest

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Sun 09 Feb 2020, 11:35 am

City vs West Ham postponed

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Post by Duty281 on Sun 09 Feb 2020, 12:01 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Those reports are based on a bit of propaganda and also last season's accounts. With the assets we have and the wage clauses in all contracts, it's nowhere near as bad as they suggest

I hope so, for their sake.

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Post by Duty281 on Sun 09 Feb 2020, 4:29 pm

16/1 available on Sheffield United to make the top four - excellent price.

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Post by Soul Requiem on Wed 12 Feb 2020, 12:18 pm

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/51474229

Footballers are a precious lot aren't they. The Gosling among them have been abusing and intimidating referees for years now but one of them makes a single sarcastic comment and he's up in arms. Time to step back and have a good hard look at yourself Dan.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Wed 12 Feb 2020, 1:09 pm

I both think Gosling is being a bit weak and Moss shouldn't be doing it. It's professionalism, and also bad refereeing. If he is getting abused to a point where he's losing his cool, surely he should have booked someone?

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Post by Soul Requiem on Wed 12 Feb 2020, 1:22 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:I both think Gosling is being a bit weak and Moss shouldn't be doing it. It's professionalism, and also bad refereeing. If he is getting abused to a point where he's losing his cool, surely he should have booked someone?

No doubting Moss shouldn't be saying anything but we're talking about guys who have been receiving abuse for years now so understandable that their standards slip now and then.

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Post by Just John on Fri 14 Feb 2020, 6:36 pm

Manchester City banned from all European competitions in 20/21 & 21/22 seasons. Fined £27m too.

Pep starting the car as we speak

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Post by Duty281 on Fri 14 Feb 2020, 6:42 pm

Hahahahahahaha.

Does this mean only three Premier League sides in the CL next season, or fifth place takes the final spot?

(Though I’m fully expecting this to be appealed and overturned)

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Post by lfc91 on Sat 15 Feb 2020, 10:11 am

Can't see this being upheld. At least not in its current severity (although here's hoping). Halved to a 1 season ban would be my guess.

If it is, hopefully 5th spot gets the champions league.

Could have massive implications for City. Pep could leave. The likes of Sterling and De bruyne won't want to give up 2 years of their career outside the champions league you would imagine. Would impact the players who would come over the next few seasons and their financial ability to actually buy them.

Could easily see the end of this great Man City team, with a rebuild over several seasons required.

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Post by Duty281 on Sat 15 Feb 2020, 10:22 am

Also rumours of a PL points deduction for Citeh, as the FFP rules are similar in the Premier League to the European competitions.

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Post by dyrewolfe on Sat 15 Feb 2020, 10:35 am

lfc91 wrote:Can't see this being upheld. At least not in its current severity (although here's hoping). Halved to a 1 season ban would be my guess.

If it is, hopefully 5th spot gets the champions league.

Could have massive implications for City. Pep could leave. The likes of Sterling and De bruyne won't want to give up 2 years of their career outside the champions league you would imagine. Would impact the players who would come over the next few seasons and their financial ability to actually buy them.

Could easily see the end of this great Man City team, with a rebuild over several seasons required.


If I understand it correctly, part of the FFP rules state you're not supposed to spend more than you earn...but since City are sponsored by Etihad...which is owned by the rulers of the UAE...they can pretty much spend whatever they like. Which seems wrong to me (unless I've got it hopelessly wrong).
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Post by Soul Requiem on Sat 15 Feb 2020, 10:48 am

That would be classed as financial doping Dyre. A team can only spend what it earns itself not the owners and sponsorship has to be at market value not inflated as has happened with City. Something should have been done years ago and I personally have never considered them great just an expensive team of mercenaries.

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