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Political round up.............

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Post by JuliusHMarx on Wed 26 Jun 2019, 3:34 pm

First topic message reminder :

Soft thread split, hard thread split, no-deal thread split. Who gives a sh!t as long as we get a thread split by the 15:35 deadline.

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Post by GSC on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 2:39 pm

if Boris tables a vote of no confidence the other parties would support it, then form their own national government, pass a queens speech, get a brexit delay then call a GE.

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Post by Afro on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 2:42 pm

GSC wrote:if Boris tables a vote of no confidence the other parties would support it, then form their own national government, pass a queens speech, get a brexit delay then call a GE.


Its this bit that I imagine is being frantically discussed behind the scenes. It sounds like they don't quite agree on it yet, so need to get their act together
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Post by Soul Requiem on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 2:44 pm

It is also worth noting that the government has no legal requirement to dissolve if they lose a vote of no confidence.

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Post by GSC on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 2:49 pm

theres 2 weeks for a government that commands the support of a majority of MPs to form or its automatically a GE.

The sticking point was whether Corbyn would lead a temporary government or someone like Harman or Clarke. I think Corbyn had softened on that
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Post by Samo on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 3:13 pm

GSC wrote:theres 2 weeks for a government that commands the support of a majority of MPs to form or its automatically a GE.

The sticking point was whether Corbyn would lead a temporary government or someone like Harman or Clarke. I think Corbyn had softened on that

I think Corbyn needs to realise its his best chance. He's unlikely to win enough support himself. He'd be relying on the 20odd MP's Johnson kicked out the party voting against the Conservatives which isnt a given. Some would, many wouldnt. A neutral or joint leadership bid is more likely to command the support of the commons. What happens then is anyones guess. Request the extension from the EU then have a GE would be my guess.

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Post by GSC on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 3:30 pm

that would be it. nobody benefits from an extended national government than the Tories come election time
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Post by lostinwales on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 4:03 pm

Grauniad answered a question on who would be most likely to come in as PM if BJ quits. They suggested Raab.

Boris might still manage to not go down as the worst PM in history

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Post by Soul Requiem on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 4:11 pm

lostinwales wrote:Grauniad answered a question on who would be most likely to come in as PM if BJ quits. They suggested Raab.

Boris might still manage to not go down as the worst PM in history

If Labour win the general election he'll be saved.

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Post by Afro on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 4:14 pm

lostinwales wrote:Grauniad answered a question on who would be most likely to come in as PM if BJ quits. They suggested Raab.

Boris might still manage to not go down as the worst PM in history

Could be worse. Could be Chris Grayling.

At least Boris knows what he is doing, even if it is illegal and dishonest
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Post by lostinwales on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 4:21 pm

Afro wrote:
lostinwales wrote:Grauniad answered a question on who would be most likely to come in as PM if BJ quits. They suggested Raab.

Boris might still manage to not go down as the worst PM in history

Could be worse. Could be Chris Grayling.

At least Boris knows what he is doing, even if it is illegal and dishonest

He thinks and acts as if he knows what he's doing. That is different. I know he and his team have plans, but when it comes down to it any chance he has had to get something wrong he pretty much has.

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Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 4:24 pm

lostinwales wrote:Grauniad answered a question on who would be most likely to come in as PM if BJ quits. They suggested Raab.

Boris might still manage to not go down as the worst PM in history
Really? picard This is a man who couldn't find his arse with both hands and directions. Is this the 'best' we've got? Jesus wept...
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Post by Samo on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 4:41 pm

Johnson on Sky News saying “there are people who just want to frustrate Brexit”

But I thought prorogation had nothing to do with Brexit? His bumhole is getting jealous from the amount of Poopie that comes out his mouth.

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Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 4:53 pm

Samo wrote:Johnson on Sky News saying “there are people who just want to frustrate Brexit”

But I thought prorogation had nothing to do with Brexit? His bumhole is getting jealous from the amount of Poopie that comes out his mouth.
Laugh I'll have to remember that putdown OK.

A good point as well, but I think he's that dumb he can't spot the fact those two things aren't compatible and he's also just confirmed the fact he's a lying turd on the record.
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Post by lostinwales on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 5:05 pm

Samo wrote:Johnson on Sky News saying “there are people who just want to frustrate Brexit”

But I thought prorogation had nothing to do with Brexit? His bumhole is getting jealous from the amount of Poopie that comes out his mouth.

The no.10 statement complaining about the supreme court getting involved with Brexit is just... odd.

They seem to be saying that the judiciary should not have got involved because the prorogation was about Brexit.

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Post by CaledonianCraig on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 5:59 pm

Afro wrote:
lostinwales wrote:Grauniad answered a question on who would be most likely to come in as PM if BJ quits. They suggested Raab.

Boris might still manage to not go down as the worst PM in history

Could be worse. Could be Chris Grayling.

At least Boris knows what he is doing, even if it is illegal and dishonest

Actually he doesn't know what he is doing. He doesn't have a scooby. We saw that in the leadership debate when an underling like Rory Stewart embarrassed him. He pressed him for what BJ would do about the Irish Border and, finally, after much squirming, said they'd use technology and a deal that is in place. Rory reminded him, much to his stunned embarrassment, for that to happen Boris would need to agree a deal with the EU.

Schooled.
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Post by Soul Requiem on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 6:32 pm

Rory Stewart an underling? I'm guessing you've seen he was a backbencher at the time and ignored his whole professional career. A highly intelligent and very competent man is Rory who would likely embarrassed most in a debate.

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Post by Afro on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 6:33 pm

He does. He’s doing what ever Dominic Cummings tells him too.

He just doesn’t know what Cummings is going to get him to do.
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Post by CaledonianCraig on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 6:35 pm

Soul Requiem wrote:Rory Stewart an underling? I'm guessing you've seen he was a backbencher at the time and ignored his whole professional career. A highly intelligent and very competent man is Rory who would likely embarrassed most in a debate.

Compared to Boris he was seen as an underling by your average everyday Tory or else Rory would be PM now. And like I say BJ was schooled. What an embarrassment that the man Tories sees as the man to deliver Brexit makes such a gaffe over the Irish Border issue.
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Post by CaledonianCraig on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 6:37 pm

Afro wrote:He does. He’s doing what ever Dominic Cummings tells him too.

He just doesn’t know what Cummings is going to get him to do.

I've just given one prime example how he doesn't know what he is doing. And the second is that he's listening to a total fud.
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Post by Duty281 on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 6:39 pm

Evens with Ladbrokes that Johnson gets replaced as PM this year, which would be quite extraordinary. A snap YouGov poll narrowly holds the view that Johnson should resign - 43% to 39%.

I genuinely wouldn't be surprised if he did resign this week as the internal pressure on him could be too great.

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Post by Soul Requiem on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 6:45 pm

CaledonianCraig wrote:
Soul Requiem wrote:Rory Stewart an underling? I'm guessing you've seen he was a backbencher at the time and ignored his whole professional career. A highly intelligent and very competent man is Rory who would likely embarrassed most in a debate.

Compared to Boris he was seen as an underling by your average everyday Tory or else Rory would be PM now. And like I say BJ was schooled. What an embarrassment that the man Tories sees as the man to deliver Brexit makes such a gaffe over the Irish Border issue.

Let's talk reality for a second, Stewart isn't PM because his views are at odds with the wider party at the moment, nothing to do with his competency. It would be a gaffe if Johnson had ever publicly backed no deal which he has not so his statement was consistent with his stance.

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Post by It Must Be Love on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 6:46 pm

Given whoever is PM on Oct 31st will have to delay Brexit anyway, I think it would suit him to be ‘forced out’ before that date so another PM has to extend.
Then in Nov/Dec play the people vs establishment card, certainty of leave vs delay card, and win the election.

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Post by CaledonianCraig on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 6:48 pm

Soul Requiem wrote:
CaledonianCraig wrote:
Soul Requiem wrote:Rory Stewart an underling? I'm guessing you've seen he was a backbencher at the time and ignored his whole professional career. A highly intelligent and very competent man is Rory who would likely embarrassed most in a debate.

Compared to Boris he was seen as an underling by your average everyday Tory or else Rory would be PM now. And like I say BJ was schooled. What an embarrassment that the man Tories sees as the man to deliver Brexit makes such a gaffe over the Irish Border issue.

Let's talk reality for a second, Stewart isn't PM because his views are at odds with the wider party at the moment, nothing to do with his competency. It would be a gaffe if Johnson had ever publicly backed no deal which he has not so his statement was consistent with his stance.

There is no escaping the fact BJ made an embarrassing gaffe and it shows he is clueless about the ins and outs of the Irish Border and this is the man the Tories chose to fashion out a Brexit. Hilarious.
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Post by Soul Requiem on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 7:04 pm

So he said he wants a deal but a different deal and someone pointing out a non contradictory statement is embarrassing?

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Post by GSC on Tue 24 Sep 2019, 7:28 pm

can we not pretend that anything Boris says is credible. Even the courts agree on that.

His actions indicate he wants to run down the clock to no deal
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Post by CaledonianCraig on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 5:39 am

Soul Requiem wrote:So he said he wants a deal but a different deal and someone pointing out a non contradictory statement is embarrassing?

No he was at a stand point at that time of No Deal and leave at all costs. When Stewart pulled him up about it he came up with a solution that would see the UK attempting to use a trade law that exists in a world where the UK has a deal with the EU. It was an embarrassing gaffe.
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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 8:51 am

lostinwales wrote:
Samo wrote:Johnson on Sky News saying “there are people who just want to frustrate Brexit”

But I thought prorogation had nothing to do with Brexit? His bumhole is getting jealous from the amount of Poopie that comes out his mouth.

The no.10 statement complaining about the supreme court getting involved with Brexit is just... odd.

They seem to be saying that the judiciary should not have got involved because the prorogation was about Brexit.
Sensible people might think it odd. They're just trying to drive the narrative over this with Brexiteers. They'll likely do it too; more's the pity.
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Post by Pr4wn on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 8:53 am

Indeed, some of the front pages this morning are truly depressing.

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Post by GSC on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 9:17 am

fairly predictable depending on who the target audience is.
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Post by SecretFly on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 9:30 am

The little rosey chuff chap will be in tip top form this morning at breakfast with the wife:  "I shall be late home this evening, m'Lady.  I shall be ensconced in m'chair for proceedings.  What say you, Right Honorable, Missis?  Will ye miss me?  'Aye', for affirmative and 'Nay', if you're delighted to see the back of me again."

Yes siree, Bercow back to his blatantly public, often queasy love affair with yonder chair in olde Westminster.  Jonathan Swift should have still been around for all the pompous fun to come.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 9:40 am

Comres
Lab 27
Con 27
Lib 20

No chance of any coalition Govt with those figures..

Yougov...Do you support a four day week ??

Yes 63%
No..19%

Do you support abolishing private schools.

Yes 22%
No..50%

Like I said not a good policy...Always be choice.

Get rid of the charitable status instead.

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Post by Samo on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 9:44 am

PMQ’s is going to be must see TV. I cant wait.

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Post by Soul Requiem on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 9:59 am

Samo wrote:PMQ’s is going to be must see TV. I cant wait.

You'll be waiting about a week for that.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 10:37 am

Not sure which is going to be harder for Johnson....Navigating Brexit or trying to explain his financial dealings with this tasty chick..

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Post by lostinwales on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 12:13 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Not sure which is going to be harder for Johnson....Navigating Brexit or trying to explain his financial dealings with this tasty chick..

Well he can always focus on some white lines to help him across the red ones

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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 12:56 pm

Here we go. Geoffrey Cox suggesting politicians should have a say over Supreme Court Justices appointments. How's that working in the US, eh Geoff? I think not...
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Post by lostinwales on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 1:36 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:Here we go. Geoffrey Cox suggesting politicians should have a say over Supreme Court Justices appointments. How's that working in the US, eh Geoff? I think not...

Oh somebody doesn't agree with you. A huge problem with the current debate is that Brexit has so normalised extreme arguments that arguments for the status quo are themselves listed as extreme. And what I really really hate is this expectation from a baying minority that no opinion or ruling is valid unless it is produced by a leaver.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 1:42 pm

lostinwales wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:Here we go. Geoffrey Cox suggesting politicians should have a say over Supreme Court Justices appointments. How's that working in the US, eh Geoff? I think not...

Oh somebody doesn't agree with you. A huge problem with the current debate is that Brexit has so normalised extreme arguments that arguments for the status quo are themselves listed as extreme. And what I really really hate is this expectation from a baying minority that no opinion or ruling is valid unless it is produced by a leaver.

Any opinion which is pushed forward entirely because someone is throwing a paddy about Brexit not happening is basically an invalid argument

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Post by lostinwales on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 1:50 pm

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:
lostinwales wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:Here we go. Geoffrey Cox suggesting politicians should have a say over Supreme Court Justices appointments. How's that working in the US, eh Geoff? I think not...

Oh somebody doesn't agree with you. A huge problem with the current debate is that Brexit has so normalised extreme arguments that arguments for the status quo are themselves listed as extreme. And what I really really hate is this expectation from a baying minority that no opinion or ruling is valid unless it is produced by a leaver.

Any opinion which is pushed forward entirely because someone is throwing a paddy about Brexit not happening is basically an invalid argument

Yes. Unfortunately it is one that a significant part of the media* seem to buy into. At one time the collapse of print media seemed like a tragedy. Right now its a blessing.

* The bits owned by proud 'Brits' that are not actually British, do not live here, and seem awfully keen to gain more influence over us

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 2:36 pm

Rupert's not particularly popular over here either

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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 3:41 pm

lostinwales wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:Here we go. Geoffrey Cox suggesting politicians should have a say over Supreme Court Justices appointments. How's that working in the US, eh Geoff? I think not...

Oh somebody doesn't agree with you. A huge problem with the current debate is that Brexit has so normalised extreme arguments that arguments for the status quo are themselves listed as extreme. And what I really really hate is this expectation from a baying minority that no opinion or ruling is valid unless it is produced by a leaver.
Headscratch Are you referring to me?
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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 3:43 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:Here we go. Geoffrey Cox suggesting politicians should have a say over Supreme Court Justices appointments. How's that working in the US, eh Geoff? I think not...
Will the person who down-voted this comment stick their head above the parapet, please, and explain why they think that political appointees to our (or US) Supreme Court can be anything other an horrendous idea at worst, or at best, open to charges of bias whenever that Court rules on anything?

Go on, I dare you....
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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 4:16 pm

It happens all over the forum, I really wouldn't worry about it (It's a bloody awful feature)

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Post by GSC on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 4:24 pm

like and subscribe
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Post by dummy_half on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 4:35 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:Here we go. Geoffrey Cox suggesting politicians should have a say over Supreme Court Justices appointments. How's that working in the US, eh Geoff? I think not...
Will the person who down-voted this comment stick their head above the parapet, please, and explain why they think that political appointees to our (or US) Supreme Court can be anything other an horrendous idea at worst, or at best, open to charges of bias whenever that Court rules on anything?

Go on, I dare you....

Obviously wouldn't be anyone who has followed the recent shenanigans over Brett Kavanagh and his nomination to the US Supreme Court.

Has anyone else actually read the Supreme Court Judgement? For once, a legal document that is remarkably readable and free of legalese. It makes very clear that the judgement was on the 'over-reach' of the Executive in relation to the powers of Parliament, and did not address wider issues of Brexit beyond the legal necessity of Parliament being able to scrutinise the Government's actions.

One significant technical issue was that Boris and his advisors seemed to have (or wilfully) ignored the difference between prorogation and Parliament being in recess, as is usually the case for the party conferences. While the Commons does not sit during recess, all other functions of the Parliament (e.g. Parliamentary committees, drafting of legislation) proceed as normal, whereas these are terminated by prorogation. As such, the argument put forward by the Government that the length of prorogation was not excessive as very few 'sitting' days were being lost was poorly founded. It also appears that the Judges put quite a lot of weight on John Major's evidence that the preparations for a new Parliamentary session typically require between about 4 to 6 days, and so the prorogation for about 5 weeks was excessive and clearly for purposes other than those stated.

It also seems that the Government probably made a major strategic mistake in not providing any signed witness statements regarding the reason for prorogation, and the justification for this being of an unusually extended duration. Oh, and Boris's annotation on one of the presented memos that the September session of Parliament was a rigmarole probably didn't do him any favours.

Really, the only way the judgement could have been more damaging to Boris is if it had explicitly stated that he lied to Her Maj.

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Post by GSC on Wed 25 Sep 2019, 10:02 pm

if this performance cant persuade all opposition parties to unite, nothing will. what a complete pr!ck
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Post by Samo on Thu 26 Sep 2019, 1:25 am

GSC wrote:if this performance cant persuade all opposition parties to unite, nothing will. what a complete pr!ck

Just when you think he cant go any lower.

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Political round up............. - Page 17 Empty Re: Political round up.............

Post by Pr4wn on Thu 26 Sep 2019, 2:18 am

Absolutely appalling behaviour.

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Political round up............. - Page 17 Empty Re: Political round up.............

Post by CaledonianCraig on Thu 26 Sep 2019, 6:45 am

And people question why Scots want independence.
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Post by Soul Requiem on Thu 26 Sep 2019, 9:08 am

If the opposition lacks the integrity to accept a general election then this is what you get.

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Political round up............. - Page 17 Empty Re: Political round up.............

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