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PGA Tour: The Players: Notes from the Ballwasher

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Post by kwinigolfer Wed 11 Mar 2020, 6:17 pm

First topic message reminder :

1).Well done to Tyrrell Hatton, great win at Bay Hill which continued the run of non-American winners - Day, Leishman, McIlroy, Molinari, Hatton.
This was also an Open Championship qualifier and Keith Mitchell (for the second year running), Danny Lee and Dahmen get to battle the traffic at Royal St.George's in July.

2).For the second week running, the course set-up seemed to make scoring unnecessarily tricky given the prevailing weather conditions. A war of attrition, but not necessarily the most attractive golf for the TV viewer to enjoy.
Hopefully the set-up at TPC Sawgrass will enable the world's best to play their shots.

3).Scott Piercy made news for all the wrong reasons last week and now Tour Commish Monahan has expressed disappointment "in the lack of judgment used" and "that it has been addressed with Scott directly". Good thing Monahan didn't say "he knows better" because Piercy clearly doesn't. But his sponsors do, thankfully, tho' any Tour punishment will be kept unpublished - unless he starts missing tournaments, from which we might draw our own conclusions.
Personally, I'd like to have seen his "invitation" to Bay Hill revoked, but no such disapproval reported from the API.

4).Interesting graph from princedrac's twitter account this week showing the top ten owgr points-getters at The Players:
Four Americans: Woods, DLIII, Furyk, Couples
Three Aussies: Elk, Scott, Shark
Nick Price
Sergio & Langer
A good week, of which there haven't been many recently, will see Garcia can jump from 2nd to 1st, ahead of Tiger.

5).That's reflective of an international honours board with eight of the last twelve winners being "overseas" players.
And first-timers at TPC have a tough time too - after Jerry Pate won on the course's debut in 1982, only Hal Sutton and Craig Perks have won trophy on their first trip. Leading "rookie" last year was Eddie Pepperell who stormed home in 3rd place - but he's busy trying to figure out how you get dq'd three times in less than 2 years.

6).This week looks like the exact halfway point of the pre-Play-Off PGA Tour season, the 23rd event out of a total of 46. About 50 pros have already won enough FedEx Points to assure them a tee-time at the Northern Trust, Round 1 of the FedEx Cup Play-Offs.
Not many are Europeans: McIlroy, Hatton, Rahm, Hovland.

7).And only Fleetwood among other Europeans is comfortably placed, for now.
Those who have struggled this season so far, but are exempt at least through next year, include McDowell (79th), Casey (93rd), Lowry (140th), Molinari (168th), Donald (assuming he takes another earnings exemption - 172nd), Garcia (179th), Willett (181st), Stenson (197th), Wallace (202nd), Rose (205th),
While this lot, all not yet exempt for 2020/21 have it all to do: Straka (82nd), Norlander (84th), Knox (90th), Fitzpatrick (100th), Noren (107th), Rafa C-B (120th), Poulter (128th), Cappelen (130th), Laird (158th), Ventura (175th), Power (201st), Bjerregard (224th), Lewis (227th), plus 3 or 4 others on more tenuous status.

8).But one or two American "faces" are also struggling, with these three less than half-way to a Play-Off goal about 400 pts:
110th: Spieth
111th: D.Johnson
213th: Koepka

9).The Florida "Swing" has a musical chairs of dates next year, starting with Bay Hill, then The Players, followed by "Honda". No word yet on how Valspar fits in, but hopefully retains its fourth slot in Florida.

10).Finally, the Top 64 in the owgr's after The Players will qualify for the WGC-MatchPlay in Austin in a fortnight's time.

Any Valspar Notes will be added here next week.

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Post by GPB Sat 20 Jun 2020, 8:00 pm

We have bloggers who dislike players mostly because religion is part of their lives.

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Post by McLaren Sat 20 Jun 2020, 8:48 pm

GPB

I have no doubt super will take issue with Rahm. He is carrying a few extra pounds and now we find out he is religious.
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Post by pedro Sat 20 Jun 2020, 11:19 pm

Catholicism and ignorance go hand in hand. No excuse for the rest.

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Post by pedro Sat 20 Jun 2020, 11:25 pm

Embarrassing to say the least about this Watney thing. How could a multi billion dollar business - which has just come back from lockdown, and living on public goodwill - allow someone inside the ropes who couldn’t show a negative test?

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Post by GPB Sat 20 Jun 2020, 11:30 pm

Guilty until proven Innocent?


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Post by robopz Mon 22 Jun 2020, 8:53 am

Nice win for Webb Simpson... Now that's golfing your ball down the stretch. I assume he won it just to piss off Super. Good enough reason I guess. 

You DO NOT hit 65/72 greens at Harbour Town. Can't be done. But Abraham Ancer did. What a ball striking display. Wow.

Tyrell Hatton: That guy is ready for prime time. He's a legitimate threat any week now... IF... he continues to keep his emotions in check.

Sunday's still not agreeing with Rory much. Not that he had much of a chance anyway.  Fleetwood still not agreeing with Rory much either. And with more justification after this week. (Not that he needed it IMO)

Spieth...  Looked credible last week despite Sunday troubles and gave plenty of justification for optimism going forward... Undid all that this week.  Made the cut, but otherwise he was a hot mess.

They get a lot of deserved criticism, but this was the best job by CBS I can remember in a long time. I was hoping they would focus more on player audio, and they did. ("Blue" though it may have been at times).  Shocked  (not that any of it offends me)

Poorly made point of the week goes to: Sergio Garcia. I get what he was trying to say, but since he's Sergio, nobody else did or wants to.

Dear PGAT Players and caddies,
Coronavirus iS REAL. You are not bulletproof. Take me seriously or I'll shut your Tour down.  Signed-Covid19

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Post by McLaren Mon 22 Jun 2020, 10:57 am

I was never a fan of the world golf league idea but one thing the were right about, not that it was rocket science, is that having all the best players every week makes for better events. 70+ OWGR rated events are apparently where it's at.

robo

I agree with your assessment of Webb's performance. To come out ahead of so many players who had a good chance of getting to -20 or -21 was impressive.
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Post by robopz Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:35 am

Mac... The top events with the best fields have always been special. It doesn't take a PGL to make that happen. It happens a lot already.

My objections to the PGL are two numerous to list... But one of the main ones... When you try to make everything special, it runs the risk of making it all ordinary.  That's already somewhat happening now to the WGC's.  They are still big, but now we have between 10 and 14 "chalk" events, but only 6 or 7 of them really stand out. 

And if you take the PGL concept... a lot of guys who drove the action this week wouldn't even have been in the field... Berger, Niemann, Palmer, Conners, Frittelli...

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Post by Shotrock Mon 22 Jun 2020, 2:20 pm

Thanks Robo - Didn't see the peabrain comment until this morning.

Cart paths, housing developments lining holes, and loads of trees (with one in the fairway) ... things lots of golf course architects loathe. But I thought it made for great theater.

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Post by I'm never wrong Mon 22 Jun 2020, 2:38 pm

robopz wrote:Dear PGAT Players and caddies,
Coronavirus iS REAL. You are not bulletproof. Take me seriously or I'll shut your Tour down.  Signed-Covid19

Saw a post 3rd round interview - can't remember who it was - but he was wanting more testing. Also said that attitudes of golfers would have to change when they are off the course, eg socialising and eating at restaurants.

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Post by robopz Mon 22 Jun 2020, 4:19 pm

Shotrock wrote:Thanks Robo - Didn't see the peabrain comment until this morning.

Cart paths, housing developments lining holes, and loads of trees (with one in the fairway) ... things lots of golf course architects loathe. But I thought it made for great theater.
Harbour Town is so good you just have to see it to believe it. You don't get that "subdivision golf" feel at all, The houses are so far back you almost forget they are there. 

But the TREES are an entirely different matter. It's definitely claustrophobic and forces you to hit the right shot. Back when the course was built, and even through the 90s, there were options off the tee. But with the length guys are hitting it today there's very few choices there anymore. With few exceptions, everybody has to hit it to pretty much the same place. 

My impressions this week... granted, they didn't have the wind they usually have in the spring...  But it is still incredible just how freaking good SO MANY of these guys are. The depth of talent out there today is just ridiculous. There are one and two shot mistakes on virtually every shot getting to the greens at that course. These guys just avoid them like it's no big thing, and get up and down or even chip in when they make a mistake. Just amazing.

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Post by robopz Mon 22 Jun 2020, 4:28 pm

I'm never wrong wrote:
robopz wrote:Dear PGAT Players and caddies,
Coronavirus iS REAL. You are not bulletproof. Take me seriously or I'll shut your Tour down.  Signed-Covid19

Saw a post 3rd round interview - can't remember who it was - but he was wanting more testing. Also said that attitudes of golfers would have to change when they are off the course, eg socialising and eating at restaurants.
Yeah... There were lots of comments from players and media about some having lax attitudes going back to Colonial last week.  If nothing else, maybe the Watney situation reminds them that this is something to be taken seriously. 

The tour dodged a bullet (well maybe they did, we don't know for sure yet). Watney did not have symptoms. If he had not been wearing that Whoop monitor thing, he would have had no idea he might need to get retested, and would have been out there among them until his next test. That is scary, cuz it could happen again to some player not wearing one of those things.

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Post by Shotrock Mon 22 Jun 2020, 5:01 pm

I can't imagine that there will not be players with the virus playing in events the rest of the year. Test aggressively to be sure ... but it's not perfect technology and there are plenty of asymptomatic people out there.

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Post by I'm never wrong Mon 22 Jun 2020, 5:11 pm

A doctor in the UK was tested and didn't show any symptoms. Carried on working. Had the antibody test which showed he had had the virus. Possibly tested too soon after he caught it? Story HERE

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Post by robopz Mon 22 Jun 2020, 10:25 pm

Where's Kwini and our "Notes from the Ballwasher"...  I Wouldn't mind filling in for a week and doing them myself if he's not able to do them for some reason, but I don't want to take them over or step on his toes or anything...

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Post by pedro Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:21 pm

Webb has really resurfaced the last couple of years. Seems like a nice guy (for you super: despite his affection for bronze age fairy tales). Think Europe should be happy to see him on the US RC team though.

Wouldn’t mind to see the RC being pushed back to 2021. The golfing season is already a bit meh now and qualification is a mess. It also gives Europe an extra year to familiarise with the Marco Simone GC, something that has proven important in the past.

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Post by pedro Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:24 pm

robopz wrote:Where's Kwini and our "Notes from the Ballwasher"...  I Wouldn't mind filling in for a week and doing them myself if he's not able to do them for some reason, but I don't want to take them over or step on his toes or anything...
Think GPB p!ssed him off so he probably self-quaratained from this board.

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Post by pedro Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:27 pm

Shotrock wrote:I can't imagine that there will not be players with the virus playing in events the rest of the year. Test aggressively to be sure ... but it's not perfect technology and there are plenty of asymptomatic people out there.
Don’t think it’s a big issue as such if one or two players catch it. But the PR effect can be catastrophic. That’s why Watney incidents can’t happen too often.

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Post by pedro Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:38 pm

Shotrock wrote:Thanks Robo - Didn't see the peabrain comment until this morning.
That other people deserved it so much more than Watney? Now, wouldn’t it be fun if he mentioned some names?

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Post by McLaren Mon 22 Jun 2020, 11:52 pm

pedro wrote:
Shotrock wrote:Thanks Robo - Didn't see the peabrain comment until this morning.
That other people deserved it so much more than Watney? Now, wouldn’t it be fun if he mentioned some names?

Harrington
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Post by GPB Tue 23 Jun 2020, 12:48 am

pedro wrote:
robopz wrote:Where's Kwini and our "Notes from the Ballwasher"...  I Wouldn't mind filling in for a week and doing them myself if he's not able to do them for some reason, but I don't want to take them over or step on his toes or anything...
Think GPB p!ssed him off so he probably self-quaratained from this board.

Yes I guess I did. Can't imagine Shane Lowry (and not getting into a featured group) was the sword that he was going to fall on. But I guess that is what he did.





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Post by beninho Tue 23 Jun 2020, 6:05 am

Did people have issues with what Garcia said? Are people that stupid?

Who many times, have you said, so and so didn't deserve what happened or they were the last person you would want something to happen to. Its just normal use of words isn't it?

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Post by incontinentia Tue 23 Jun 2020, 8:48 am

beninho wrote:Did people have issues with what Garcia said?  Are people that stupid?

Who many times, have you said, so and so didn't deserve what happened or they were the last person you would want something to happen to. Its just normal use of words isn't it?
That's not the same as saying other people deserved to get the disease. It was a sh!tty thing to say, but anyone familiar with Garcia won't be surprised.
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 23 Jun 2020, 9:43 am

incontinentia wrote:
beninho wrote:Did people have issues with what Garcia said?  Are people that stupid?

Who many times, have you said, so and so didn't deserve what happened or they were the last person you would want something to happen to. Its just normal use of words isn't it?
That's not the same as saying other people deserved to get the disease. It was a sh!tty thing to say, but anyone familiar with Garcia won't be surprised.
Good grief. Is that what he said? He said there were others more deserving (in his view, presumably) than Watney i.e. if someone has to get it, there are others more 'deserving'.

I get it - you think Garcia is scum and you view everything he says and does through that prism. No more that you need to say.
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Post by beninho Tue 23 Jun 2020, 9:49 am

I felt terrible for Nick because he’s probably one of the nicest guys on Tour,” Garcia said. “Unfortunately, it had to happen to him. So there’s a lot of other people that probably deserved it a lot more than him, and he’s the one that got it.”
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/golf.com/news/sergio-garcia-others-probably-deserved-covid-19-more-than-nick-watney/amp/
I honestly don't see that as any worse then saying, "he's the last person who deserves what happened to him" that kind of thing. We all say that sort of phrase usually about a friend or relative.  Really is a fuss over very little.

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Post by incontinentia Tue 23 Jun 2020, 9:57 am

navyblueshorts wrote:
incontinentia wrote:
beninho wrote:Did people have issues with what Garcia said?  Are people that stupid?

Who many times, have you said, so and so didn't deserve what happened or they were the last person you would want something to happen to. Its just normal use of words isn't it?
That's not the same as saying other people deserved to get the disease. It was a sh!tty thing to say, but anyone familiar with Garcia won't be surprised.
Good grief. Is that what he said? He said there were others more deserving (in his view, presumably) than Watney i.e. if someone has to get it, there are others more 'deserving'.

I get it - you think Garcia is scum and you view everything he says and does through that prism. No more that you need to say.
Navy you're really weird, I don't know why you needed to include that 2nd part in your reply. Plus its not accurate.

Anyone who follows golf knows Sergio's form, and any opinion I have of him is informed by his actions. Sadly most of these have been pretty lowlife activities like spitting in the cup during a round, attacking bunkers or making racist or disparaging comments about his fellow players.
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 23 Jun 2020, 10:44 am

incontinentia wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
incontinentia wrote:
beninho wrote:Did people have issues with what Garcia said?  Are people that stupid?

Who many times, have you said, so and so didn't deserve what happened or they were the last person you would want something to happen to. Its just normal use of words isn't it?
That's not the same as saying other people deserved to get the disease. It was a sh!tty thing to say, but anyone familiar with Garcia won't be surprised.
Good grief. Is that what he said? He said there were others more deserving (in his view, presumably) than Watney i.e. if someone has to get it, there are others more 'deserving'.

I get it - you think Garcia is scum and you view everything he says and does through that prism. No more that you need to say.
Navy you're really weird, I don't know why you needed to include that 2nd part in your reply. Plus its not accurate.

Anyone who follows golf knows Sergio's form, and any opinion I have of him is informed by his actions. Sadly most of these have been pretty lowlife activities like spitting in the cup during a round, attacking bunkers or making racist or disparaging comments about his fellow players.
OK. Ignore the second para and its tone; probably OTT. However, I suggest your opinion on his comment re. Covid is influenced by what you think of other things he may have done/said. Not so? It doesn't really matter as your opinion is what it is and nothing I say will alter it.
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Post by incontinentia Tue 23 Jun 2020, 11:27 am

navyblueshorts wrote:
I suggest your opinion on his comment re. Covid is influenced by what you think of other things he may have done/said. Not so?
I'll admit that's possible. But objectively speaking, suggesting there are people who deserve to get a potentially deadly disease is pretty classless and something no professional sportsperson should do.

I'm always open to changing opinions on things in light of new evidence or convincing arguments.
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Post by McLaren Tue 23 Jun 2020, 12:29 pm

Navy

Are you suggesting you shouldn't use someones past actions as a part of how you judge them in the present? Sergio making a vindictive comment wouldn't be unusual given his past.
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Post by McLaren Tue 23 Jun 2020, 12:30 pm

Getting a bit worried about Kwini, hope he is ok. Hopefully just a Super_realist style self imposed hiatus.
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Post by incontinentia Tue 23 Jun 2020, 12:44 pm

McLaren wrote:Navy

Are you suggesting you shouldn't use someones past actions as a part of how you judge them in the present? Sergio making a vindictive comment wouldn't be unusual given his past.
I think navy was suggesting I interpreted the comments as being worse than they really are cos Sergio said them.
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Post by Shotrock Tue 23 Jun 2020, 1:17 pm

Here's how I interpret it: yet another stupid comment from peabrain.

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Post by McLaren Tue 23 Jun 2020, 1:27 pm

incontinentia wrote:
McLaren wrote:Navy

Are you suggesting you shouldn't use someones past actions as a part of how you judge them in the present? Sergio making a vindictive comment wouldn't be unusual given his past.
I think navy was suggesting I interpreted the comments as being worse than they really are cos Sergio said them.

That is essentially what I am saying. It is reasonable to assume Sergio's comments are worse because he has a history of making peabrained comments.

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Post by incontinentia Tue 23 Jun 2020, 2:20 pm

McLaren wrote:
incontinentia wrote:
McLaren wrote:Navy

Are you suggesting you shouldn't use someones past actions as a part of how you judge them in the present? Sergio making a vindictive comment wouldn't be unusual given his past.
I think navy was suggesting I interpreted the comments as being worse than they really are cos Sergio said them.

That is essentially what I am saying. It is reasonable to assume Sergio's comments are worse because he has a history of making peabrained comments.

I see Navy's point, we're assessing the badness of a comment. That shouldnt really be biased by opinions on the character of who said it
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 23 Jun 2020, 2:35 pm

McLaren wrote:Navy

Are you suggesting you shouldn't use someones past actions as a part of how you judge them in the present? Sergio making a vindictive comment wouldn't be unusual given his past.
No, but I expect that sort of thing to apply equally across the board. Never mind. Let's move on. I know where you stand.
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 23 Jun 2020, 2:36 pm

Shotrock wrote:Here's how I interpret it: yet another stupid comment from peabrain.
Yet another unnecessary daft insult from you. Necessary?
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 23 Jun 2020, 2:39 pm

McLaren wrote:
incontinentia wrote:
McLaren wrote:Navy

Are you suggesting you shouldn't use someones past actions as a part of how you judge them in the present? Sergio making a vindictive comment wouldn't be unusual given his past.
I think navy was suggesting I interpreted the comments as being worse than they really are cos Sergio said them.

That is essentially what I am saying. It is reasonable to assume Sergio's comments are worse because he has a history of making peabrained comments.

picard If he's a 'peabrain', why would you assume he's said what he said in anything but a 'thick' fashion? Surely worse if he knew what he was saying, which your rather childish moniker for him suggests you think he doesn't.
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 23 Jun 2020, 2:39 pm

incontinentia wrote:
McLaren wrote:
incontinentia wrote:
McLaren wrote:Navy

Are you suggesting you shouldn't use someones past actions as a part of how you judge them in the present? Sergio making a vindictive comment wouldn't be unusual given his past.
I think navy was suggesting I interpreted the comments as being worse than they really are cos Sergio said them.

That is essentially what I am saying. It is reasonable to assume Sergio's comments are worse because he has a history of making peabrained comments.

I see Navy's point, we're assessing the badness of a comment. That shouldnt really be biased by opinions on the character of who said it
I'm sure mac would make a fabulous juror. Not.
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Post by Shotrock Tue 23 Jun 2020, 2:45 pm

Navy - Not as daft as your constant defense of a childish, racist, peabrain.

If my comments really bother you PLEASE feel free to delete me from your forum.




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Post by McLaren Tue 23 Jun 2020, 2:47 pm

I think the problem, as is often the case, is how out of kilter this boards opinions are compared to the golf mainstream. Outside this board most people just accept Sergio is childish and petulant.
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Post by beninho Tue 23 Jun 2020, 3:02 pm

I have no issues with SG, and no issues with his comments. And, still can't see whats wrong with them. Maybe, its just me.

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Post by incontinentia Tue 23 Jun 2020, 3:16 pm

I always felt sorry for Sergio, he's been crushed time and again in majors, I was pretty happy for him when he finally broke through and won the Masters. His talent deserves way more than one major.
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 23 Jun 2020, 3:22 pm

Shotrock wrote:Navy - Not as daft as your constant defense of a childish, racist, peabrain.

If my comments really bother you PLEASE feel free to delete me from your forum.



That would be childish. As is your constant use of 'peabrain' re. Garcia.
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Post by navyblueshorts Tue 23 Jun 2020, 3:31 pm

McLaren wrote:I think the problem, as is often the case, is how out of kilter this boards opinions are compared to the golf mainstream. Outside this board most people just accept Sergio is childish and petulant.
He can be exactly that, Mac. You are, however, not the arbiter of all that's good and right in the Universe though. Must be nice to be perfect.

Garcia said one thing (as far as I'm aware) that was racist - you can't accept his explanation, whereas I might give him the benefit of the doubt. Why don't you accept that people aren't perfect as you define it? The spitting in the cup - yep, that's pretty gross, but hardly the end of the World. I don't see people having a go at those that, for example, don't protect the field by, say, leaving their ball near the hole when playing partner is splashing out of a bunker. As to the petulance, who gives a ****? Like Woods never did it? Like none of the others ever do it? Like none of those recently mic'd up didn't cuss? Like too many (mainly Americans?) can't stop spitting - period?

Give me a break. I don't doubt many others think he's a jerk. I'm not going to damn him to Eternity for what, in the main, is trivial.
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Post by incontinentia Tue 23 Jun 2020, 3:48 pm



Navy, can you really watch footage of Sergio's behaviour and call it trivial? And that video doesnt even contain his deliberate destruction of the greens at last years saudi arabia open.
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Post by robopz Tue 23 Jun 2020, 8:29 pm

I'm no big fan of Sergio, but I don't believe the way the words came out was what he meant.

His comments were in the backdrop of there being a lot of criticism player to player and from the media about PGA tour players not taking the virus serious. And from multiple reports more than a few weren't living up to their responsibility to socially distance and do the things necessary when off property.

So I think what Sergio and essence was referring to... Was the people who were out there taking stupid unnecessary risks should have been the ones to get it, instead of someone like Watney, who was trying to do all the right things (but got it anyway)

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Tue 23 Jun 2020, 8:38 pm

Murmurings of a second positive test on tour
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Post by GPB Tue 23 Jun 2020, 9:55 pm

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Murmurings of a second positive test on tour

Confirmed.

Cam Champ.

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Post by McLaren Tue 23 Jun 2020, 10:00 pm

GPB wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Murmurings of a second positive test on tour

Confirmed.

Cam Champ.

Who deserved it more than him?
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Post by pedro Tue 23 Jun 2020, 10:54 pm

I can give Sergio the benefit of the doubt. Plus English is his second language. Doesn’t help much being married to a Texan in this respect. (Sorry robo)

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