Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

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Post by dynamark on Thu 26 Mar 2020, 8:14 pm

First topic message reminder :

I suppose it sort of makes sense with the Dyson effort because they just have to switch to blow.
Hope it works.
The self employed will have to adjust in future and get a bit closer to the NI and paye system.It has always been a bit unwritten that you can limit your contributions somewhat as self employed in the building trade and others but a big part of the economy. Again this may close a few gaps

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Post by Soul Requiem on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 3:58 pm

Branson is rightly getting a lot of stick for furloughing staff whilst Mike Ashley gets a weekly beating for being a general clown.

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Post by beninho on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:09 pm

Who here has donated a weeks income to the cause?

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Post by Davie on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:13 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:
Hancock should deliver the same message universally. Which he won't do.

To be fair to Hancock (which I'm not usually inclined to be) he was asked the question about professional footballers by one of the media at the press conference. I know the questions are supposedly vetted beforehand but it did seem a bit of a stitch up to me

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Post by beninho on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:14 pm

Anyway, the premier clubs have given £125mil to efl and national league clubs and £20m to the nhs

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Post by beninho on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:16 pm

It also seems Jordan Henderson is setting up some sort of fund for NHS workers which he was keeping quietuntil it was finalised. .

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Post by kwinigolfer on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:30 pm

A one-time 10% wealth tax (which I'd not usually be in favour of) would help much more than going after a few random sportsman. And, yes, that wealth tax could hit some of them too, but they wouldn't be unilaterally singled out.

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Post by super_realist on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:36 pm

beninho wrote:Anyway, the premier clubs have given £125mil to efl and national league clubs and £20m to the nhs  

They haven't given them it, they intend to, (Gary's told them it takes two weeks)
Seems a sensible and obvious thing to do, although I don't think it's their responsibility to donate to the NHS.

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Post by super_realist on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:37 pm

beninho wrote:Who here has donated a weeks income to the cause?

You aren't getting it are you? No one here is on 100k a week whilst people are being laid off in their industry and in their very clubs. It's not that hard to grasp.

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Post by super_realist on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:40 pm

beninho wrote:Some players in all walks of football may be able to, some may not. Its the same in all walks of life. Some rich people will donate, some will not. I dont think footballers need to be singled out.


He was specifically asked about footballers so he answered in regards to them . If he'd been asked about Jim Radcliffe, James Dyson, The Queen or Branson I'm sure his answer would have been the same.

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Post by beninho on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:47 pm

super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:Who here has donated a weeks income to the cause?

You aren't getting it are you? No one here is on 100k a week whilst people are being laid off in their industry and in their very clubs. It's not that hard to grasp.

It's all relative. Really. Your income usually matches your outgoing or general lifestyle. And, 100k is probably a gross figure anyway.

I haven't donated money either.

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Post by Soul Requiem on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 4:54 pm

beninho wrote:
super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:Who here has donated a weeks income to the cause?

You aren't getting it are you? No one here is on 100k a week whilst people are being laid off in their industry and in their very clubs. It's not that hard to grasp.

It's all relative. Really. Your income usually matches your outgoing or general lifestyle. And, 100k is probably a gross figure anyway.

I haven't donated money either.

We can do away with tax brackets then.

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Post by navyblueshorts on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 5:10 pm

beninho wrote:"I wish I was a player for 10 more mins.The PL players are more than likely working on a proposal to help clubs , communities and The NHS. It takes longer than 2 weeks to put together. Matt Hancock calling them out when he can’t get tests in place for NHS staff is a f@@@@@g cheek!"

On another note, I don't think Gary Neville is an idiot.

Yes, he is. Hancock is dealing w/ a global shortage of kit and Trump almost certainly using PDA to demand kit we have be sent back to U.S.
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Post by beninho on Fri 03 Apr 2020, 7:05 pm

Guardiola donates 960k to spanish fight.

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Post by beninho on Sat 04 Apr 2020, 9:58 am

https://twitter.com/BBCBreakfast/status/1246325377447768065?s=09

Southampton chiefs cooking and feeding local families and people in need.

I have also seen similar from my team and port vale preparing food baskets and delivering to people in need.

Remember, just because you don't know what is going on, it doesn't mean nothing is being done.

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Post by dynamark on Sat 04 Apr 2020, 7:10 pm

Ben have we got Indians down Southampton way ?
Just had the law pull up outside the flat full on proper police not the local boys.Next door house is to let and the owners have been round today cleaning out and doing the garden two kids have been messing about outside on scooters which I thought bit silly bit not in contact with anyone essentially with their own family so some one has called the law by the sound of it several times.Dont know what to think really but the cops are sitting as a pair side by side in the car and getting a bit heavy handed with the neighbour.
Port vale it would be oat cakes.

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Post by beninho on Sat 04 Apr 2020, 7:38 pm

Found North Staffs oatcakes in a local sainsbury's. Great product with cheese and bacon!

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Post by Soul Requiem on Sat 04 Apr 2020, 8:00 pm

Looks like America and Trump in particular are p1ss1ng off the whole world right now, does highlight the difficulty that everyone is having sourcing and distributing the relevant PPE.

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Post by I'm never wrong on Sat 04 Apr 2020, 8:28 pm

Just read on the BBC website that the Premier League would face a £762 million penalty if the season doesn't finish. This penalty is from the broadcasters if they so demanded it. Why doesn't all the parties sit round a (virtual) table and agree, nothing is going to happen until it's all sorted and no money to change hands. Clubs then sort themsleves out in the meantime.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 7:26 am

Disgraceful and cynical of Liverpool to be furloughing staff. Any club or business with as much money as Premiership Football clubs should not be leaning on the government at this time. There is more than enough strain on the system without businesses like them taking the p!ss.

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Post by beninho on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 9:15 am

Its absolutely disgraceful from Liverpool and any other club to furlough staff. It's easy to bash the players, but it's the owners this is all on.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 9:26 am

It's both really. The players ought to be showing solidarity with their colleagues on minimum wage and supporting them if their clubs are not.
The clubs wouldn't even notice the money to keep these people employed and the players, if they had a decent bone in their body would be making contributions and set a good example that they support the community and the club which has made them richer than Croesus. (I realise Henderson has started something, but it should have been done long before Liverpool and other clubs made plans to furlough players)

Well done to Jamie Carragher for giving Liverpool clog on this. Utter disgrace and embarrassing for a club which was doing great things this season in appealing to a neutral audience have now shot themselves in the face.

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Post by beninho on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 9:56 am

I suppose with clubs, they are banking on getting the payments for finishing and the tv money. Burnley have already said they could be close to bust by august and down 50m. Why I can accept, Norwich furloughing, just. But liverpool, spurs is just wrong.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 10:13 am

beninho wrote:I suppose with clubs, they are banking on getting the payments for finishing and the tv money. Burnley have already said they could be close to bust by august and down 50m. Why I can accept, Norwich furloughing, just. But liverpool, spurs is just wrong.

I get the point with clubs like Burnley and Norwich, although it represents incredibly poor management that they've budgeted to spend everything in their projected income. Who is in charge of these clubs that money isn't put by? Not very business savvy. Of course it is hard to predict something like this, but football fortunes turn very quickly especially for lowly yo yo clubs like Norwich and Burnley and it is stupid to spend everything you earn because you never know when you'll need it.

It's still disgraceful for any club to be furloughing the staff who earn the least. Cleaners, Ticket Sellers, Club shop workers, Cooks, Stewards, Hospitality staff, Turnstile attendants, kit staff, coach drivers, etc all make virtually nothing, so why are clubs thinking they can save money doing this when it's a drop in the ocean compared to the ludicrous salaries of their playing staff?

Liverpool, Spurs, Newcastle etc should be thoroughly ashamed, and Liverpool especially considering what they have gone through as a city over the years and being the definition of the working class club of which the club professes to be such a part of. Good of Levy at Spurs to award himself a rise though even though his club are stinking the league out this year whilst simultaneously furloughing staff.

I've always thought that football might eat itself at some point, this could very well be the start of it.

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Post by Soul Requiem on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 12:17 pm

Wow footballers really do live in a bubble; the comments from Rooney are laughable.

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Post by I'm never wrong on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 12:18 pm

What has it come to when the Chief Medical Officer for Scotland ignores her own advice and goes to her second home a hour away?

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Post by super_realist on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 12:30 pm

Soul Requiem wrote:Wow footballers really do live in a bubble; the comments from Rooney are laughable.

The PFA are also being disingenuous by using an annual figure of how much it might cost the exchequer rather than just for a month or two. They've always been pretty despicable though with the awful Gordon Taylor

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Post by beninho on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 1:59 pm

Kyle Walker not big on social distancing

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 2:39 pm

I agree with Lineker: "Why not call on all the wealthy" etc, etc. Still think a one-off wealth tax would have been the way to go, no Cayman Island nonsense permitted.

Liverpool's Fenway SG, and probably most others, just treat footballers (or baseball players) as commodities and apparently all employees the same, that's who they are, just assets or liabilities on a balance sheet.

But the PFA and football in general should have got out in front of this instead of being sitting ducks for criticism.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 3:23 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:I agree with Lineker: "Why not call on all the wealthy" etc, etc. Still think a one-off wealth tax would have been the way to go, no Cayman Island nonsense permitted.

Liverpool's Fenway SG, and probably most others, just treat footballers (or baseball players) as commodities and apparently all employees the same, that's who they are, just assets or liabilities on a balance sheet.

But the PFA and football in general should have got out in front of this instead of being sitting ducks for criticism.

What Lineker and the thick as a brick Rooney are failing to notice is that this whole discussion came out of Hancock being asked specifically about footballers, so it's not saying the super rich shouldn't also be paying or supporting their less well off staff, but made the point that it's not really on for a club to furlough staff on what I imagine to be minimum wage, whilst continuing to pay players exorbitant salaries. It's the imbalance of the pay structure that Hancock was getting at, not picking out footballers as the only members of society who could be paying .

Do Liverpool really require government help in the shape of furlough payments? , of course they don't, and that the double standards Hancock was talking about.

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Post by beninho on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 3:37 pm

At what level do you think a company shouldn't furlough staff? In 2018/19 Liverpool made a profit of £42m. Would you have the cut off at lower then this?

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 3:46 pm

super,
But no need for Hancock to jump on the bandwagon. Especially without adding oil company executives to the list . . . . . . .

Definitely double standards by the clubs, no arguing that.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 3:53 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:super,
But no need for Hancock to jump on the bandwagon. Especially without adding oil company executives to the list . . . . . . .

Definitely double standards by the clubs, no arguing that.

He was answering a question put to him, he wasn't jumping on the bandwagon. The discussion about footballers came directly from this question, and it's completely relevant because football clubs are basically defrauding the government.

As for Liverpool, if they spunk more than 60% of their income on player wages it stands to reason that if they really are so poor they can't afford not to furlough staff then reducing player salaries or delaying them is good management and would put them in better stead in their city don't you think?

Let's imagine that Liverpool are furloughing 250 staff who earn 25k each (that's being generous because more will be on nothing like that), that would be just £1.5m for three months. Liverpool can easily afford that and should be paying that.


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Post by Davie on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 4:00 pm

As I said previously here or maybe on the COVID thread, Hancock was done up like a kipper by the question, even though I thought they were meant to be pre-approved.

I'm a supporter of the way the govt are handling this so far, but sadly Matt Hancock appears out of his depth in front of the camera. He may be doing a good job behind the scenes but he's not up to media scrutiny. Only this morning he floundered very badly in an interview being unable to discern between people sunbathing in public places or in their own garden. He was pushed repeatedly to clarify if "sunbathing was illegal" and couldn't form a coherent reply

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 4:10 pm

Re: Liverpool.
Yup super, no doubt, thought I'd expressed that sentiment earlier; Fenway runs their sports enterprises purely as cut-throat businesses (which is essential to a large extent) but never seem to get the community asset part of what most would see as a prime aspect of their stewardship.
This is not Wall Street after all.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 4:42 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:Re: Liverpool.
Yup super, no doubt, thought I'd expressed that sentiment earlier; Fenway runs their sports enterprises purely as cut-throat businesses (which is essential to a large extent) but never seem to get the community asset part of what most would see as a prime aspect of their stewardship.
This is not Wall Street after all.

The bottom part was for Beninho's benefit as he seems to think that making 42 million profit wasn't that much.

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Post by I'm never wrong on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 5:18 pm

Mac - you can get your F1 fix tonight as they are doing one of those "Virtual" GPs. Albert Park circuit. some F1 and has been F1 drivers taking part. 8pm Sky sports F1 channel or sky Sports Mix.

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Post by beninho on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 6:20 pm

I've not said a thing about whether it's a good profit or not. I am curious, to what some people think the profit cutoff should be. And why is no one talking about other businesses on here as much as liverpool. Norwich City reported losses of £39m up to 2019. So you would expect them to furlough the staff.

5 clubs are furloughing staff, 2 posted losses. I just think the focus could be on other things.

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Post by beninho on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 6:47 pm

I'd like to know what Rees Mogg is putting in.

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Post by dynamark on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 7:41 pm

please do not start taking lineker as the oracle cos he is not .twitter was invented for him.The clubs have to make their own arrangements with all staff and if the pfa want to come up with something then fair enough.theres an awful lot of wealthy folk who will not be quite so wealthy in a few weeks time from all walks of life.

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Post by super_realist on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 8:02 pm

beninho wrote:I've not said a thing about whether it's a good profit or not. I am curious, to what some people think the profit cutoff should be. And why is no one talking about other businesses on here as much as liverpool. Norwich City reported losses of £39m up to 2019. So you would expect them to furlough the staff.

5 clubs are furloughing staff, 2 posted losses. I just think the focus could be on other things.

In regards to Norwich I would expect them to live within their means. If they are making losses like that they have no place in the Premier League.
In regards to businesses that have profit, I don't think it's unreasonable to use a % of that profit to keep their employees in work for a period of time before they simply burden the tax payer with it.
For example if Liverpool have 42 million of profit, I don't think it is at all unreasonable to expect them to use at least 25% of that to support their own employees. Should this go on long enough and should they go past such a mark, then they are eligible for government support. Surely that is reasonable?

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 8:37 pm

I see an uncle of Dominic Cummings has died in of COVID-19, at the age of 74.

Possibly exacerbated by an underlying health condition.
Possibly ashamed about the alleged utterances of his nephew.
Possibly doing his bit for the country.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Sun 05 Apr 2020, 9:19 pm

BoJo in hospital - he looked terrible on Thursday when he was doing his twilight clap.

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Post by I'm never wrong on Mon 06 Apr 2020, 7:56 am

I'm never wrong wrote:What has it come to when the Chief Medical  Officer for Scotland ignores her own advice and goes to her second home a hour away?
......and she's gone.

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Post by super_realist on Mon 06 Apr 2020, 8:05 am

I'm never wrong wrote:
I'm never wrong wrote:What has it come to when the Chief Medical  Officer for Scotland ignores her own advice and goes to her second home a hour away?
......and she's gone.

I wish Sturgeon had a second home that she was frequenting, that voice is grating.

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Post by McLaren on Mon 06 Apr 2020, 11:27 am

I am obviously the kind of person who thinks all testimonies of abuse should be believed but this is taking the pish. Former pop star duffy has mad some quite astonishing claims.

https://www.bbc.co.-arts-52177265
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Post by super_realist on Mon 06 Apr 2020, 11:37 am

McLaren wrote:I am obviously the kind of person who thinks all testimonies of abuse should be believed but this is taking the pish. Former pop star duffy has mad some quite astonishing claims.

https://www.bbc.co.-arts-52177265

Certainly sounded fishy. How could someone be put on a plane whilst unconscious?

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Post by beninho on Mon 06 Apr 2020, 12:20 pm

Bit wild to make up, suppose you could get anywhere on a private jet I'm sure.

But, weirdly, some girls do make things up, look at poor old Salmond.

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Post by super_realist on Mon 06 Apr 2020, 12:25 pm

beninho wrote:Bit wild to make up, suppose you could get anywhere on a private jet I'm sure.

But, weirdly, some girls do make things up, look at poor old Salmond.

Which would mean that the pilot and other staff were complicit, definitely fishy.

As per Salmond, the fact he was found not guilty does not mean that he is innocent, nor does it mean that the stories were made up.
He was found not guilty, which means the prosecution didn't present evidence sufficient enough to find him guilty.
No one who is found not guilty of any crime is deemed to have not done it or that the accusations against them were.
fabricated. Not quilty does not equal innocent.

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Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread - Page 6 Empty Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by McLaren on Mon 06 Apr 2020, 1:04 pm

Super

Thank you for explaining the basics of court cases. I wasn't aware of that? thumbsup


But good that you recognise salmond is a grimy character.
McLaren
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Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread - Page 6 Empty Re: Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

Post by super_realist on Mon 06 Apr 2020, 1:07 pm

McLaren wrote:Super

Thank you for explaining the basics of court cases. I wasn't aware of that? thumbsup


But good that you recognise salmond is a grimy character.

I wasn't trying to be patronising, just sorting out Beninho's rather naive comment.

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