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Post by Soul Requiem on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 10:27 am

beninho wrote:
Soul Requiem wrote:The far left is often dependent on where an individual themselves is on the political spectrum, for example Owen Jones may be seen as far left to someone who is centre right but to a centrist will be seen as merely left wing, personally have him down as part of the hard left.

I have him as left wing. Though is hard left not the same as far left because I dont have him as far left. I get tge views based on your own spectrum though. Which is why I hare labour supporters calling Starmer and others right wing.  Left of centre is not right wing.

I would say that hard left is within the standard left wing myself, thinking of someone like Tony Benn being hard left as opposed to Ed Milliband who was soft left, will say however that is possibly closer to far left than it is the centre.

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Post by superflyweight on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 10:46 am

Even then, someone like Benn would be seen as soft left by Communists. Which I guess reinforces your point that it depends where you sit on the political spectrum.

With someone like Hopkins though, you only have to be a human to realise that she's an @rsehole.

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Post by McLaren on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 10:55 am

What you also have to consider is the harm peoples ideas would cause. What policy that Owen Jones champions would actually cause anyone any harm? Contrast that with Hopkins or Farage?
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Post by Soul Requiem on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 10:56 am

It is also depends on how somebody holds themselves in public; Tony Benn whilst opposed politically to myself was to me the most honest politician in my lifetime and that in itself leads you to respect somebody something that isn't true of Owen Jones who often seems on the verge of a breakdown. If there's no respect your more inclined to create hyperbole.

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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 11:07 am

Laugh Jesus wept. You lot should read this back...
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Post by McLaren on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 11:23 am

Navy, I assume you have. So why not make a more useful comment?
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Post by superflyweight on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 1:02 pm

Maybe he just really likes Katie Hopkins? Or Owen Jones? Or both?

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Post by McLaren on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 1:13 pm

I think Navy just likes to think he is superior to the rest of us.
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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 3:21 pm

McLaren wrote:Navy, I assume you have. So why not make a more useful comment?
Sorry. There's no useful comments that can be made. It's that bad.
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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 3:22 pm

McLaren wrote:I think Navy just likes to think he is superior to the rest of us.
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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 3:23 pm

superflyweight wrote:Maybe he just really likes Katie Hopkins?  Or Owen Jones?  Or both?  
No; definitely not. The World wouldn't lose a lot if they had never existed.
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Post by superflyweight on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 3:34 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
McLaren wrote:Navy, I assume you have. So why not make a more useful comment?
Sorry. There's no useful comments that can be made. It's that bad.

How so?

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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 4:39 pm

superflyweight wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
McLaren wrote:Navy, I assume you have. So why not make a more useful comment?
Sorry. There's no useful comments that can be made. It's that bad.

How so?  
Sorry; not biting.

It's a pedantic 'discussion' about who's worse - some on the 'left' or some on the 'right'. It's utterly subjective, not black/white and no-one involved here is going to change their extant opinions. You're welcome to it.
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Post by JuliusHMarx on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 5:31 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:It's utterly subjective, not black/white and no-one involved here is going to change their extant opinions.

Doesn't that describe pretty much every thread on the whole site?

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Post by beninho on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 6:34 pm

I don't think anyone woukd expect people to change their minds. You can read back through lots of it and take it however you want, but I also doubt it us a serious as it may read. Its all a bit overreactionary, I would guess on purpose. We had a period when no bugger said owt, so some back and forth is good, and a bit of fun.

It woukd be very dull if we all just said, good point to everything.

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Post by JuliusHMarx on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 9:06 pm

beninho wrote:I don't think anyone woukd expect people to change their minds. You can read back through lots of it and take it however you want, but I also doubt it us a serious as it may read. Its all a bit overreactionary, I would guess on purpose.  We had a period when no bugger said owt, so some back and forth is good, and a bit of fun.

It woukd be very dull if we all just said, good point to everything.

Good point.

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Post by incontinentia on Wed 26 Aug 2020, 11:19 pm

beninho wrote:I don't think anyone woukd expect people to change their minds. You can read back through lots of it and take it however you want, but I also doubt it us a serious as it may read. Its all a bit overreactionary, I would guess on purpose.  We had a period when no bugger said owt, so some back and forth is good, and a bit of fun.

It woukd be very dull if we all just said, good point to everything.
Yes, it woukd
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Post by Soul Requiem on Thu 27 Aug 2020, 10:28 am

Aside from a little bit of pedantry I thought it was quite an amiable conversation for a change.

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Post by McLaren on Thu 27 Aug 2020, 10:44 am

Navy hasn't been the friendliest character of late, just ignore him.

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Post by McLaren on Thu 27 Aug 2020, 10:45 am

I am surprised that super realist hasn't commented on the sackings at sky yet. I hear that one of the shows producers follows Owen Jones on twitter., the SJW must have rubbed off.
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Post by McLaren on Thu 27 Aug 2020, 10:47 am

He has also held his tongue on Celtic's exit from the CL at hands of the mighty Ferencvaros.
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Post by navyblueshorts on Thu 27 Aug 2020, 12:39 pm

McLaren wrote:Navy hasn't been the friendliest character of late, just ignore him.

Probably for the best OK.
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Post by JAS on Thu 27 Aug 2020, 1:07 pm

McLaren wrote:He has also held his tongue on Celtic's exit from the CL at hands of the mighty Ferencvaros.

That surprises me more. I was just waiting for the diatribe of doom and gloom of Scottish football's perma-decline. :-p

Around this time last year I did say that now that Rangers are "back in the room" as it were concerning European participation that the Scottish co-efficient would more than likely rise back to the mid teens, possibly giving a 2nd Champions League slot by 2021/22. At that point Super could only see a further decline. Since then, against all of Super's logic the Jocks have rose from 22nd to 14th.

Make no mistake though, last night's effort was poor and both the ugly sisters will need another decent run in the Europa League to maintain that coefficient position (in a season where the league will most definitely take priority). I suppose there's always the potential for the 3rd & 4th placed teams not to get a first hurdle humping for a change.


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Post by westisbest on Thu 27 Aug 2020, 7:04 pm

Won’t miss Thompson or Le Tissier on soccer Saturday.

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Post by McLaren on Thu 27 Aug 2020, 9:24 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
McLaren wrote:Navy hasn't been the friendliest character of late, just ignore him.

Probably for the best :OK:.

Navy, do you not fancy coming back into the fold?
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Post by navyblueshorts on Fri 28 Aug 2020, 9:25 am

McLaren wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
McLaren wrote:Navy hasn't been the friendliest character of late, just ignore him.

Probably for the best OK.

Navy, do you not fancy coming back into the fold?
Headscratch I've not left the fold. Have to admit, not quite sure what you mean.
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Post by McLaren on Fri 28 Aug 2020, 3:48 pm

Just meant get involved in the "banter" (terrible word) and the debate a bit more like the old days.
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Post by incontinentia on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 8:56 am

Adele guilty of cultural appropriation.

https://amp.independent.ie/world-news/adele-accused-of-cultural-appropriation-over-instagram-picture-39490584.html
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Post by super_realist on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 9:06 am

There isn't much that is more stupid, more wet and pathetic than a bunch of twitter c***s accusing someone of cultural appropriation.

I think Adele is one of the most over rated singers of all time but this is laughable critisicm.

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Post by incontinentia on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 9:30 am

But super, she wore her hair in the same style as those of another race. As one of those twitter users said, the proper punishment in this case is prison without parole.

How long before Eminem and other culture thieves are brought to justice?
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Post by super_realist on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 9:33 am

Surely it works both ways? Should we stop black people driving cars and wearing suits? It's just ludicrous and I know that the likes of Ben will just say it's a "lunatic fringe" but it seems to be getting more vocal and more common.

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Post by superflyweight on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 9:42 am

super_realist wrote:Surely it works both ways? Should we stop black people driving cars and wearing suits? It's just ludicrous and I know that the likes of Ben will just say it's a "lunatic fringe" but it seems to be getting more vocal and more common.

Only really on social media and usually only by those who are hard of thinking. Vast majority of people probably thinks she looks a bit like an idiot and is trying too hard but moved on without passing comment.


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Post by Pal Joey on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 10:20 am

Don't like Jamaica....... oh no...... I love her!
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Post by super_realist on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 10:31 am

superflyweight wrote:
super_realist wrote:Surely it works both ways? Should we stop black people driving cars and wearing suits? It's just ludicrous and I know that the likes of Ben will just say it's a "lunatic fringe" but it seems to be getting more vocal and more common.

Only really on social media and usually only by those who are hard of thinking.  Vast majority of people probably thinks she looks a bit like an idiot and is trying too hard but moved on without passing comment.  


It was in The Independent. If it was only social media, then it should remain there, but mainstream media are picking up on this crap now and companies are apologising for this sort of thing, so it's a bit more than a few morons on twitter.

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Post by beninho on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 10:41 am

It seems to be Americans not understanding The Notting Hill Carnival. Nothing qrong with Adele. Buts its another sign of the media twisting things for people. Minority say something outlandish. This is picked up and reported as a bigger thing then it is, people then think its a big issue. See the proms.

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Post by incontinentia on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 10:56 am

super_realist wrote:Surely it works both ways? Should we stop black people driving cars and wearing suits? It's just ludicrous and I know that the likes of Ben will just say it's a "lunatic fringe" but it seems to be getting more vocal and more common.
No the offence is only allowed to work one way, hence why blackface is unacceptable but whiteface in the film White Chicks is not problematic (apart from how terrible it is as a film).
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Post by incontinentia on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 11:03 am

beninho wrote:It seems to be Americans not understanding The Notting Hill Carnival. Nothing qrong with Adele. Buts its another sign of the media twisting things for people. Minority say something outlandish. This is picked up and reported as a bigger thing then it is, people then think its a big issue. See the proms.
I dont know if it is the minority, I imagine it must have been trending on social media (and therefore popular) if the mainstream news picked up on it. This kind of crap only serves to drive the races further apart imo. Its like cultural protectionism.
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Post by beninho on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 11:30 am

It does drive people apart, and you are playing right into it!!!

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Post by super_realist on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 11:43 am

beninho wrote:It does drive people apart, and you are playing right into it!!!

Well it was The Independent wasn't it? Not Inco.
Why are they reporting it?

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Post by superflyweight on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:00 pm

super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:It does drive people apart, and you are playing right into it!!!

Well it was The Independent wasn't it? Not Inco.
Why are they reporting it?

Slow news day and it's clickbait.

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Post by super_realist on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:08 pm

superflyweight wrote:
super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:It does drive people apart, and you are playing right into it!!!

Well it was The Independent wasn't it? Not Inco.
Why are they reporting it?

Slow news day and it's clickbait.  

And they wonder why newspaper circulation is dead.

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Post by beninho on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:09 pm

The indy article I read says she had mixed responses. Why focus on the negative part of the story?

But its what I have already said, media report a little story and people go well over the top. Unfortunately incont fell straight into it.

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Post by super_realist on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:12 pm

beninho wrote:The indy article I read says she had mixed responses. Why focus on the negative part of the story?

But its what I have already said, media report a little story and people go well over the top. Unfortunately incont fell straight into it.

The people who went well over the top were the people tweeting about her in the first place. Cultural appropriation just isn't a thing to most people other than race baiters.
Why does anyone care if a white person cooks a Jamaican meal, has dreads, makes Hip Hop or whatever. It's not hijacking a culture and nothing belongs to or is reserved to any culture.

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Post by incontinentia on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:16 pm

superflyweight wrote:
super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:It does drive people apart, and you are playing right into it!!!

Well it was The Independent wasn't it? Not Inco.
Why are they reporting it?

Slow news day and it's clickbait.  
Its not actually, it has received widespread coverage in many many mainstream media sources.
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Post by beninho on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:21 pm

super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:The indy article I read says she had mixed responses. Why focus on the negative part of the story?

But its what I have already said, media report a little story and people go well over the top. Unfortunately incont fell straight into it.

The people who went well over the top were the people tweeting about her in the first place. Cultural appropriation just isn't a thing to most people other than race baiters.
Why does anyone care if a white person cooks a Jamaican meal, has dreads, makes Hip Hop or whatever. It's not hijacking a culture and nothing belongs to or is reserved to any culture.

Its a nonsense take from people, mainly Americans with no knowledge of the NH Carnival.  But, its a pretty small group of people.  The fact that the news papers reported it brings it to a wider audience l, such as you and incont who then rally against the issues. When in reality its nothing.

Some people have issues with Adeles hair, a lot more people are outraged.

I'm unsure whats worse, the people annoyed in the first instance or the people annoyed about the people being annoyed. Or, me, the person annoyed by the people annoyed by the people being annoyed.

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Post by super_realist on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:29 pm

Was it Americans outraged at tw@t Jamie Oliver for making a West Indian dish?
Is it Americans outraged at actors who aren't gay portraying a gay person?

Each individual incident is ridiculous, but the point is that it is creeping into our society through the back door.
Look at the latest free speech law in Scotland which aims to punish those whose speech might simply be taken as hate speech because someone like these twitter idiots takes "offence"

The whole offence culture needs nipped in the bud because nothing actually happens when you're offended.

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Post by incontinentia on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:42 pm

beninho wrote:
super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:The indy article I read says she had mixed responses. Why focus on the negative part of the story?

But its what I have already said, media report a little story and people go well over the top. Unfortunately incont fell straight into it.

The people who went well over the top were the people tweeting about her in the first place. Cultural appropriation just isn't a thing to most people other than race baiters.
Why does anyone care if a white person cooks a Jamaican meal, has dreads, makes Hip Hop or whatever. It's not hijacking a culture and nothing belongs to or is reserved to any culture.

Its a nonsense take from people, mainly Americans with no knowledge of the NH Carnival.  But, its a pretty small group of people.  The fact that the news papers reported it brings it to a wider audience l, such as you and incont who then rally against the issues. When in reality its nothing.

Some people have issues with Adeles hair, a lot more people are outraged.

I'm unsure whats worse, the people annoyed in the first instance or the people annoyed about the people being annoyed.  Or, me, the person annoyed by the people annoyed by the people being annoyed.
Stop pretending you know what size the group is. Even if it is only a small minority, myself and super still have the right to mock them as idiots.
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Post by beninho on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:44 pm

Offence culture?

People have always found things offensive, we just live in a world where people are now able to make their views widely known. And of course things happen if when you are offended. We don't have racist comedians on tv or shows that we're on in the 70s.

Nothing wrong witb finding things offensive and saying so. Whatever happens after that is usually down to other people.

Would you call a black person the n word? Or an Asian the P word? Do you call people a c word to their face?

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Post by beninho on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:46 pm

incontinentia wrote:
beninho wrote:
super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:The indy article I read says she had mixed responses. Why focus on the negative part of the story?

But its what I have already said, media report a little story and people go well over the top. Unfortunately incont fell straight into it.

The people who went well over the top were the people tweeting about her in the first place. Cultural appropriation just isn't a thing to most people other than race baiters.
Why does anyone care if a white person cooks a Jamaican meal, has dreads, makes Hip Hop or whatever. It's not hijacking a culture and nothing belongs to or is reserved to any culture.

Its a nonsense take from people, mainly Americans with no knowledge of the NH Carnival.  But, its a pretty small group of people.  The fact that the news papers reported it brings it to a wider audience l, such as you and incont who then rally against the issues. When in reality its nothing.

Some people have issues with Adeles hair, a lot more people are outraged.

I'm unsure whats worse, the people annoyed in the first instance or the people annoyed about the people being annoyed.  Or, me, the person annoyed by the people annoyed by the people being annoyed.
Stop pretending you know what size the group is. Even if it is only a small minority, myself and super still have the right to mock them as idiots.

And I have a right to mock your own views about the views of a minority of people. I think the initial views are laughably daft, but I think the follow up views as probably more dangerous as it shows the power of manipulation by the media.

beninho

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Post by super_realist on Mon 31 Aug 2020, 12:47 pm

beninho wrote:Offence culture?

People have always found things offensive, we just live in a world where people are now able to make their views widely known.  And of course things happen if when you are offended. We don't have racist comedians on tv or shows that we're on in the 70s.

Nothing wrong witb finding things offensive and saying so. Whatever happens after that is usually down to other people.  

Would you call a black person the n word? Or an Asian the P word? Do you call people a c word to their face?

Of course I wouldn't call a black person an N or a Pakistani a P, why would want to?
You can't compare that to someone having a bloody hairstyle.

We've always had offence, yes, but now those ninnies who are offended are starting to dictate how we react to it and policy is being designed to placate them. That's the problem.

Yes, I have called people a "cu*t" plenty of times haven't you?

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