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Gallagher Premiership 2020/21

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Post by LondonTiger Sun 15 Nov 2020, 10:01 pm

First topic message reminder :

The new season starts next weekend. What are people's hopes and expectations?

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Post by lostinwales Wed 03 Mar 2021, 2:56 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Wheres our new Simon Shaw...the 6'9 powerhouse...


One of the three best English locks of the professional era (alongside Itoje and Johnson). Guys like him don't come along very often.

Kpoku is a big guy who carries well, or at least did at U20 level, so he'd be my guess for that particular role.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Wed 03 Mar 2021, 3:57 pm

I'm not sure many come tas freakishly big as Shaw and retain the ability to play at a high level. We've got the taller brother of Ollie Chessum in the academy at Tigers. If he fills like his brother is filling out then he'll be a monster but not likely to be seen in senior rugby for at least two more years and you never know which ones will make it.

Kpoku still isn't the same size as Shaw despite the serious frame. For modern day equivalent you'd be looking at someone like Lavanini. Johnny Hill is probably the closest to a full second row monster at the minute but he hasn't quite stepped up to international standards yet.

I mean I'm bias but I'd prefer to have the next Johnno if we're picking second rows, he was surprisingly mobile considering his billing as an old school enforcer. If he'd emerged in the modern game I think his skill levels would have been higher as well as that would have been more of a focus than his need to be up for the physical confrontation. Some optimists have compared George Martin to Johnno but that's really unfair on a 19 year old kid breaking through, we'll revisit that in a couple of years.

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Post by doctor_grey Thu 04 Mar 2021, 8:15 am

formerly known as Sam wrote:I'm not sure many come tas freakishly big as Shaw and retain the ability to play at a high level. We've got the taller brother of Ollie Chessum in the academy at Tigers. If he fills like his brother is filling out then he'll be a monster but not likely to be seen in senior rugby for at least two more years and you never know which ones will make it.

Kpoku still isn't the same size as Shaw despite the serious frame. For modern day equivalent you'd be looking at someone like Lavanini. Johnny Hill is probably the closest to a full second row monster at the minute but he hasn't quite stepped up to international standards yet.

I mean I'm bias but I'd prefer to have the next Johnno if we're picking second rows, he was surprisingly mobile considering his billing as an old school enforcer. If he'd emerged in the modern game I think his skill levels would have been higher as well as that would have been more of a focus than his need to be up for the physical confrontation. Some optimists have compared George Martin to Johnno but that's really unfair on a 19 year old kid breaking through, we'll revisit that in a couple of years.
Nah, Eddie Jones would have converted him to blindside flank, confused his role, and then never pick him again. And likely come back to Tigers worse for wear.

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Post by mikey_dragon Thu 04 Mar 2021, 9:16 am

David Ribbans is probably the next Simon Shaw.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Thu 04 Mar 2021, 10:53 am

mikey_dragon wrote:David Ribbans is probably the next Simon Shaw.

6ft8 and 19 stone. Yeah not far off. He's a good mobile lock. Been a while since we've gone for someone on residency, I thought we'd gone away from that though as we've found there's not many locks in their mid twenties available to England of the required quality.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Thu 04 Mar 2021, 1:14 pm

Leicester Tigers (v London Irish, home, Friday 7.45pm)

[club appearances in brackets]

15 Freddie Steward [21]

14 Kobus Van Wyk [7]

13 Matías Moroni [6]

12 Matt Scott [14]

11 Guy Porter [11]

10 Zack Henry [16]

9 Richard Wigglesworth [6]

1 Luan de Bruin [5]

2 Tom Youngs [204]

3 Dan Cole [252]

4 Calum Green [51]

5 Tomás Lavanini [26]

6 Harry Wells [110]

7 Tommy Reffell [36]

8 Cyle Brink [9]

Replacements

16 Charlie Clare [20]

17 Nephi Leatigaga [39]

18 Joe Heyes [57]

19 Ollie Chessum [5]

20 Luke Wallace [11]

21 Jack Van Poortvliet [12]

22 Johnny McPhillips [13]

23 Kini Murimurivalu [10]

[size=32]London Irish:[/size]

[size=32]15 Tom Parton, 14 Ben Loader, 13 Curtis Rona, 12 Terrence Hepetema, 11 Ollie Hassell-Collins, 10 Paddy Jackson, 9 Nick Phipps, 1 Will Goodrick-Clarke, 2 Agustin Creevy, 3 Lovejoy Chawatama, 4 Steve Mafi, 5 Rob Simmons, 6 Matt Rogerson ©, 7 Blair Cowan, 8 Albert Tuisue[/size]

[size=32]Replacements:[/size]

[size=32]16 Matt Cornish, 17 Allan Dell, 18 Ollie Hoskins, 19 Chunya Munga, 20 George Nott, 21 Ben Donnell, 22 Ben Meehan, 23 Will Joseph[/size]


[size=32]An injury to Montoya means we are sadly deprived of Montoya Vs Creevy. Few notable absentees on the left wing and backrow for both sides. Few young English lads on show as well. Tigers EQ 15 in the 23 with 10 from the Tigers academy (Steward, Youngs, Cole, Green, Wells, Reffell, Clare, Heyes, Chessum, JVP).[/size]

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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 04 Mar 2021, 1:17 pm

Falcons for the game v Sale

15 Tom Penny
14 Mateo Carreras
13 Matias Orlando
12 Luther Burrell
11 Ben Stevenson
10 Brett Connon
9 Louis Schreuder

1 Trevor Davison
2 George McGuigan
3 Logovi’i Mulipola
4 Greg Peterson
5 Marco Fuser
6 Rob Farrar
7 John Hardie
8 Callum Chick (captain)

Replacements

16 Jamie Blamire
17 Adam Brocklebank
18 Mark Tampin
19 Darren Barry
20 Connor Collett
21 Michael Young
22 Joel Matavesi
23 Alex Tait

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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 04 Mar 2021, 1:18 pm

Sale Team

15 Luke James,
14 Byron McGuigan,
13 Sam James,
12 Sam Hill,
11 Marland Yarde,
10 AJ MacGinty,
9 Faf de Klerk (captain);

1 Bevan Rodd,
2 Curtis Langdon,
3 Will Griff John,
4 Josh Beaumont,
5 Lood De Jager,
6 Cobus Wiese,
7 Sam Dugdale,
8 Daniel du Preez.

Replacements: 16 Akker van der Merwe, 17 Ross Harrison, 18 Coenie Oosthuizen, 19 Jean-Pierre du Preez, 20 Cameron Neild, 21 Raffi Quirke, 22 Robert du Preez, 23 Simon Hammersley.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Thu 04 Mar 2021, 1:53 pm

I do very much rate that Sale second row. Should be two good games for Friday night entertainment.

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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 04 Mar 2021, 2:02 pm

I fancy our chances...i guess it depends on our back row.

Chick was good last week in his first game back, looks bigger after his long lay off.
Hardie is hit and miss...needs to really put a marker down of how good he can be...and young Farrar is 6'3 and seems to have sheer brute strength as he has played lock for us already. A young bigger Mark Wilson if you like..and hes from Cumbria. But he's inexperienced..

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Post by Ozzy3213 Fri 05 Mar 2021, 12:47 am

formerly known as Sam wrote:Leicester Tigers (v London Irish, home, Friday 7.45pm)

[club appearances in brackets]

15 Freddie Steward [21]

14 Kobus Van Wyk [7]

13 Matías Moroni [6]

12 Matt Scott [14]

11 Guy Porter [11]

10 Zack Henry [16]

9 Richard Wigglesworth [6]

1 Luan de Bruin [5]

2 Tom Youngs [204]

3 Dan Cole [252]

4 Calum Green [51]

5 Tomás Lavanini [26]

6 Harry Wells [110]

7 Tommy Reffell [36]

8 Cyle Brink [9]

Replacements

16 Charlie Clare [20]

17 Nephi Leatigaga [39]

18 Joe Heyes [57]

19 Ollie Chessum [5]

20 Luke Wallace [11]

21 Jack Van Poortvliet [12]

22 Johnny McPhillips [13]

23 Kini Murimurivalu [10]

London Irish:

15 Tom Parton, 14 Ben Loader, 13 Curtis Rona, 12 Terrence Hepetema, 11 Ollie Hassell-Collins, 10 Paddy Jackson, 9 Nick Phipps, 1 Will Goodrick-Clarke, 2 Agustin Creevy, 3 Lovejoy Chawatama, 4 Steve Mafi, 5 Rob Simmons, 6 Matt Rogerson ©, 7 Blair Cowan, 8 Albert Tuisue

Replacements

16 Matt Cornish, 17 Allan Dell, 18 Ollie Hoskins, 19 Chunya Munga, 20 George Nott, 21 Ben Donnell, 22 Ben Meehan, 23 Will Joseph


An injury to Montoya means we are sadly deprived of Montoya Vs Creevy. Few notable absentees on the left wing and backrow for both sides. Few young English lads on show as well. Tigers EQ 15 in the 23 with 10 from the Tigers academy (Steward, Youngs, Cole, Green, Wells, Reffell, Clare, Heyes, Chessum, JVP).

This is a really fascinating match up.  I suspect both sides will be going in fancying their chances having put in some decent enough performances recently.  For us, we're not as strong overall as in recent weeks, but that's probably as close to our starting pack as we are going to get, so they definitely need to put in a performance.  I'm intrigued by how the set piece will go.  We have been excellent in the scrum in recent weeks, but our lineout has been at best a shambles.  Will Goodrick-Clarke has been the revelation of the season for us, having started the season as 3rd choice loosehead, he is nailed on number 1 right now and has been dominating at scrum time.  Big test of just where he is at though, as Cole is definite scrummaging step up from the tightheads he's come up against recently.  Can't wait to see how it pans out.
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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 05 Mar 2021, 7:39 am

Cole is definitely still a scrimmaging monster at scrum time though possibly not quite as much as he was in his prime. Luan de Bruin on the loosehead maybe doesn't help this as he's solid and doesn't give things away but doesn't go after the tighthead quite so much as Genge would. Cole is benefitting from Borthwick's policy of subbing the props on 45 mins or however, long the post half time warm up takes. Young Joe Heyes off the bench is a handy player so more game time and a fresher Cole certainly helps.

Looking forward to the game, Parton Vs Steward at the back should be a good face off with both impressing this season. The outside centres are contrasting styles as well with defensive lynchpin Moroni up against explosive runner Rona.

LI's lineout has no excuse for being poor with that hooker and second row combination. If they could fail to contest Tigers throws and allow the Tigers rolling maul some purchase that would help though. The Tigers attack isn't up to much at the minute with the structure still under construction. Earlier in the season Mafi came off the bench and spoiled the rolling maul really well, I'm not hoping for a repeat. Bristol spoiled the rolling maul last weekend and it left us applying a lot of pressure without really looking like scoring. LI don't seem to have the same attacking issues.

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Post by MichaelT Fri 05 Mar 2021, 8:52 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Falcons for the game v Sale


20 Connor Collett


Geordie, how is Connor Collett doing? He came with a bit of a reputation a few years ago from New Zealand, but seems to not have gone anywhere with it. Injuries? Selection policy?

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Post by GeordieFalcon Fri 05 Mar 2021, 8:56 am

Barely been seen for about 2 seasons...he's been on loan etc, but this season he started the first 3-4 games and was very impressive indeed. Probably one of our best players. But then was just dropped when the bigger names came back, which annoyed many of the falcons fans.

An irritating habit Dean has.

However he's on the bench again so maybe will get that shirt back.

Our back row competition is pretty good.

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Post by MichaelT Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:10 am

Thanks OK

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Post by TightHEAD Fri 05 Mar 2021, 10:40 am

Hooper out.
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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 05 Mar 2021, 11:01 am

TightHEAD wrote:Hooper out.

Generally or he done something specific?

Please keep him in.

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Post by Fluxy Fri 05 Mar 2021, 12:33 pm

TightHEAD wrote:Hooper out

It's really aged well...

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Mar 2021, 7:46 pm

Wayne Barnes seems to like Smoke on the Water....
(if you are not watching Irish-Tigers, never mind)

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Post by Duty281 Fri 05 Mar 2021, 7:52 pm

Oh good, a whole five minutes before we get a TMO review for foul play!

An attacking player gets pushed into a defender's shoulder by another attacker...yellow card? Seemed harsh.

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Post by chris_501 Fri 05 Mar 2021, 7:55 pm

Regardless of the yellow, I’d like to see the tackled player be assessed.

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Post by Heaf Fri 05 Mar 2021, 7:55 pm

Poor call for me - the Irish player wasn't even moving forwards and was low - the only reason for the contact there was the player being pushed into it by his own player.

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Post by Heaf Fri 05 Mar 2021, 8:22 pm

Possible obstruction for the Tiger's try missed according to Austin - he has a point ...

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Post by GeordieFalcon Fri 05 Mar 2021, 8:33 pm

All the possession yet sale 12-0 up..... sums us up this season

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Post by king_carlos Fri 05 Mar 2021, 8:34 pm

I continue to be so impressed with Moroni in defense for Tigers. Our organisation in the outside backs has completely changed since he came into the side.

I missed the first 20, turned on for Tigers kicking to the corner before the van Wyk try.

Seems a very tight game so far. I'm far from convinced that Tigers are clinical enough at the lineout to go for the corner so often from kickable pens though.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 05 Mar 2021, 8:44 pm

Heaf wrote:Poor call for me - the Irish player wasn't even moving forwards and was low - the only reason for the contact there was the player being pushed into it by his own player.

It was a soft yellow card. He was always shaping to tackle high and if that's the case you are in trouble under the current laws. 

Slightly late switching on and missed the first try, can anyone catch me up?

Both sides have pretty poor discipline in this one. Tigers conceding penalties all over the field and LI dishing them out liberally when in their own 22. Could easily see another yellow or two in this one.

Moroni's defence has been outstanding but how LI aren't ahead at the break I don't know. Applied a lot of pressure to Tigers during that half but seemed a bit to willing to cough the ball up on the attack. Fingers crossed that continues. Tigers just playing for position and hoping to get the chance to launch the rolling maul.

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Post by GeordieFalcon Fri 05 Mar 2021, 8:47 pm

We are working hard for points then gift sale them back immediately every time

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Post by king_carlos Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:04 pm

Tigers doing their best effort to defeat themselves. 13 points up, LI on a final warning with a 5m lineout and Tigers go for a front peal, get turned over and 2 minutes later are defending their line. So frustrating.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:06 pm

Absolutely moronic call from Tigers. LI on a warning and they try a showy lineout move get bundled into touch and then concede and offside penalty for LI to go down the other end. Just maul the damn thing.

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Post by king_carlos Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:07 pm

So stupid. Well taken try by LI though.

Creevy has been excellent for them. A shame Montoya is injured as that would've been fun.

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:08 pm

Really don't like these matches on tv at the same time.

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Post by GeordieFalcon Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:09 pm

2 clear forward passes (1 as part of a try) and one blatant knock on which ended up a penalty against us...

I wish we had some consistency in the refereeing in the prem...

Ps Lood de jager is just a class player...

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Post by king_carlos Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:13 pm

That's a clear red for Hepetema. Tucked arm and contact with the head.

Other than the unnecessary blocking penalty that cost LI a try and now this Hepetema had been playing well too. Two moments of terrible discipline hurting his team badly though.

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:16 pm

king_carlos wrote:That's a clear red for Hepetema. Tucked arm and contact with the head.

Other than the unnecessary blocking penalty that cost LI a try and now this Hepetema had been playing well too. Two moments of terrible discipline hurting his team badly though.
But he was already warned by Barnes about his language at the tiime of his blocking penalty. He should absolutely know he was going to be run if he did anything. And that was an obvious red. He did seem to be playing pretty well. Maybe he is not too bright?

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Post by king_carlos Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:18 pm

Hepetema was with Tigers at the start of his career but I can't say I ever heard anything about him being dim or not. Just poor play, sadly.

Henry makes up (somewhat) for the pish penalty miss by nailing the next one. He's been having his best game yet for Tigers to be fair.

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Post by Heaf Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:22 pm

Well this has gone completely pair-shaped

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Post by king_carlos Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:23 pm

I'm biased as I've watched Jack van Poortvliet since he was an U18 with Tigers but he's got a huge future.

Murimurivalu once again running great lines of 9 as well. Reminds me of Goneva with his running lines in those areas.

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Post by GeordieFalcon Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:29 pm

This game is boring....we cant score tries and sale cantering in second gear...

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Post by king_carlos Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:31 pm

I think Tigers might be allergic to try bonus points.

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Post by Heaf Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:38 pm

I've only been able to watch in fits and starts as I'm meant to be on a zoom call ... just caught the end of an Irish try being scrubbed off - what happened there?

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Post by king_carlos Fri 05 Mar 2021, 9:44 pm

Tigers throw away the TBP and end up letting LI get a TBP and LBP. Basically a 3 point swing in the table given Tigers will be competing with them around the 6th place in the table for Champions Cup rugby. I'll take the win but infuriating lack of ruthlessness.

-------

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