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Dragons Season Thread 21/22

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Old Man
LeinsterFan4life
Luckless Pedestrian
PhilBB
Welshmushroom
LordDowlais
formerly known as Sam
mikey_dragon
RiscaGame
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Post by The Oracle Thu 26 Aug - 17:43

First topic message reminder :

James Benjamin has been turned into a hooker! We do have too many back rowers so this might be good for him from a personal point of view in terms of getting game time, but will be interesting to see if he's able to become a top level player in that position.

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/19540310.james-benjamin-moves-flanker-hooker-dragons/
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 21 Oct - 11:58

We have Luke Yendle, but he's gone out on loan, or is he a loosehead in any case?

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Post by RiscaGame Thu 21 Oct - 13:20

He's a tighthead, apparently.

Just saw the Argus say Keddie, Jack Dixon and Jordan Williams are available. They also mentioned Dan Baker as an option. That's another signing like Ioan Davies, that I wonder are we really going to use effectively.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 21 Oct - 14:55

I'd forgotten all about Dan Baker, to be honest!

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Post by mikey_dragon Thu 21 Oct - 15:41

Baker should probably have had more game times by now, if he was available. We play with two or three open-sides and then usually put another one on the bench - I think it would be better to have Baker there.

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Post by PhilBB Fri 22 Oct - 14:01

Whitehouse reffing his colleagues for this game at CAP, between two understrength teams because of URC idiocy.

What could possibly go wrong?
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Post by PhilBB Fri 22 Oct - 14:02

RiscaGame wrote:I would be surprised to see them look at Dylan Bartlett, tbh. As much as I would love to see a Risca boy come through.

I think we will be relying on Coleman and Jarvis. Not sure who we could look at from the Prem, if anybody. I guess Garrett at Ebbw and Suter at the Port have experience, but there never seems to be much conversation that we are missing out on anybody.

Just to confirm, the players available from the Premiership can be from any team in the Premiership.

Try Olly Drake.....
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Post by mikey_dragon Mon 25 Oct - 12:43

PhilBB wrote:Whitehouse reffing his colleagues for this game at CAP, between two understrength teams because of URC idiocy.

What could possibly go wrong?

Haven't had a chance to re-watch it yet to see what Whitehouse got wrong, but it was a decent game from both teams.

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Post by PhilBB Mon 25 Oct - 15:35

mikey_dragon wrote:
PhilBB wrote:Whitehouse reffing his colleagues for this game at CAP, between two understrength teams because of URC idiocy.

What could possibly go wrong?

Haven't had a chance to re-watch it yet to see what Whitehouse got wrong, but it was a decent game from both teams.

He got a fair bit wrong, especially doubling down on a mistake following a penalty he awarded TO Sam Davies for being over the ball on his elbows. He should also have carded at least one Dragons prop and he should have carded a Dragons forward after the penalty try.

I thought Cardiff were poor, but the Dragons being unable to beat that Cardiff team when they played basically half the match as 14 v 15 was really shocking.
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Post by mikey_dragon Tue 26 Oct - 9:36

PhilBB wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
PhilBB wrote:Whitehouse reffing his colleagues for this game at CAP, between two understrength teams because of URC idiocy.

What could possibly go wrong?

Haven't had a chance to re-watch it yet to see what Whitehouse got wrong, but it was a decent game from both teams.

He got a fair bit wrong, especially doubling down on a mistake following a penalty he awarded TO Sam Davies for being over the ball on his elbows. He should also have carded at least one Dragons prop and he should have carded a Dragons forward after the penalty try.

I thought Cardiff were poor, but the Dragons being unable to beat that Cardiff team when they played basically half the match as 14 v 15 was really shocking.

Yeah he also got the first scrum penalty to Cardiff wrong, and I don't know a lot about the scrum but it was so blatant what Arhip did under his nose, that bad call just seemed to set the precedent going forward. I think it is fair to say that Cardiff had the edge in the scrum though.

You're right, Cardiff were poor for large parts of the game, just like every other game over the last few seasons. The forwards still look too soft. The lineout and maul has improved, but very often they are second in the collisions, both in attack and defence. Our forwards scored three tries by powering through, so that says a lot about how soft Cardiff are up front.

I think our new props are great players, and Taylor Davies has been good whenever I've seen him. Joe M featuring well again and could probably be a starter even when the internationals return. Now that our front 5 has improved it means our back-row don't have to carry the entire pack, so they tend to play well whichever combo we put out.

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Post by Welshmushroom Wed 27 Oct - 11:06

Think this match just caught us on the unlucky side. Losing 6 international forwards is one thing but some of our injuries didn't help. We really missed Brown, although had he been fit there's a good chance he may as well have been involved with Wales. We just don't have the budget outside of starting 15.

It was a good effort though. It's a tricky situation to be honest but given we have the biggest representation of forwards of any region that just goes to show how far we have come. Rowlands and Basham have been so good they simply have to start for Wales vs New Zealand.

I'd rather have been in Cardiff's position having mostly backs called up. After all forwards tend to influence if a side wins or not. Backs only determine by how much.

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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 27 Oct - 12:00

It's good seeing us kick less and move the ball around, but we need a few extra backs to execute it better. We've got good wingers so it's good that they are often involved in back-play - that's what us and Wales have been missing in recent years. Dare I say it, it's more of a NZ blueprint when you consider how heavily involved the back-row and wingers are in everything good. Our improvements in defence and in front 5 personnel have allowed this.

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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 27 Oct - 12:02

Welshmushroom wrote:Honestly I'd be after Garyn Smith - I dont know what he did in the off season but he came back a beast.  Was gaining meters for fun in pre season. Totally wasted at Cardiff at the moment.

Are you sure? I noticed Keddie sit him down on more than one occassion Very Happy.

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Post by PhilBB Mon 1 Nov - 15:09

mikey_dragon wrote:
Yeah he also got the first scrum penalty to Cardiff wrong, and I don't know a lot about the scrum but it was so blatant what Arhip did under his nose, that bad call just seemed to set the precedent going forward. I think it is fair to say that Cardiff had the edge in the scrum though.

You're right, Cardiff were poor for large parts of the game, just like every other game over the last few seasons. The forwards still look too soft. The lineout and maul has improved, but very often they are second in the collisions, both in attack and defence. Our forwards scored three tries by powering through, so that says a lot about how soft Cardiff are up front.

I think our new props are great players, and Taylor Davies has been good whenever I've seen him. Joe M featuring well again and could probably be a starter even when the internationals return. Now that our front 5 has improved it means our back-row don't have to carry the entire pack, so they tend to play well whichever combo we put out.

I think yours is the first view to claim that Arhip was the one who should have been penalised or that Cardiff just 'had the edge'. In reality, the Dragons non-Welsh props were annihilated, yet you think they are "great players".

In reality, that was a Dragons pack smashed off the park by a very average Cardiff pack.
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Post by PhilBB Mon 1 Nov - 15:10

mikey_dragon wrote:
Welshmushroom wrote:Honestly I'd be after Garyn Smith - I dont know what he did in the off season but he came back a beast.  Was gaining meters for fun in pre season. Totally wasted at Cardiff at the moment.

Are you sure? I noticed Keddie sit him down on more than one occassion Very Happy.

A club employing Cory Allen and Jamie Roberts should definitely be looking at Garyn Smith, yes.
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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 3 Nov - 9:00

PhilBB wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
Yeah he also got the first scrum penalty to Cardiff wrong, and I don't know a lot about the scrum but it was so blatant what Arhip did under his nose, that bad call just seemed to set the precedent going forward. I think it is fair to say that Cardiff had the edge in the scrum though.

You're right, Cardiff were poor for large parts of the game, just like every other game over the last few seasons. The forwards still look too soft. The lineout and maul has improved, but very often they are second in the collisions, both in attack and defence. Our forwards scored three tries by powering through, so that says a lot about how soft Cardiff are up front.

I think our new props are great players, and Taylor Davies has been good whenever I've seen him. Joe M featuring well again and could probably be a starter even when the internationals return. Now that our front 5 has improved it means our back-row don't have to carry the entire pack, so they tend to play well whichever combo we put out.

I think yours is the first view to claim that Arhip was the one who should have been penalised or that Cardiff just 'had the edge'. In reality, the Dragons non-Welsh props were annihilated, yet you think they are "great players".

In reality, that was a Dragons pack smashed off the park by a very average Cardiff pack.

No, at least not outside of the CF10 bubble that you never leave. You should probably try watching the game with both eyes open next time.

Yes I rate our new props as good players, they each have a good all-round game. I certainly rate them better than Dillon Lewis. Our pack made yours look very average around the field and if with another ref I imagine the scrums would have been even.

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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 3 Nov - 9:00

PhilBB wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
Welshmushroom wrote:Honestly I'd be after Garyn Smith - I dont know what he did in the off season but he came back a beast.  Was gaining meters for fun in pre season. Totally wasted at Cardiff at the moment.

Are you sure? I noticed Keddie sit him down on more than one occassion Very Happy.

A club employing Cory Allen and Jamie Roberts should definitely be looking at Garyn Smith, yes.

They should not be looking at him Smile.

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Post by PhilBB Wed 3 Nov - 16:10

mikey_dragon wrote:
No, at least not outside of the CF10 bubble that you never leave. You should probably try watching the game with both eyes open next time.

Yes I rate our new props as good players, they each have a good all-round game. I certainly rate them better than Dillon Lewis. Our pack made yours look very average around the field and if with another ref I imagine the scrums would have been even.

Yes, Twitter is solely the CF10 bubble. That's right. Well played. As attempted slurs go, that's one of the dumbest I've ever read.

Your imagination clearly more active than your knowledge of the game, judging by that post.

Here's Dean Ryan, famously of the CF10 bubble: "“We came second at scrum time – nobody is going to hide from that and it would be foolish to......They wanted to be in a scrum and we didn’t. Was that (scrum struggles) a surprise? Not really." From here: https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/19669129.dragons-pay-price-scrum-struggles-cardiff-says-ryan/?ref=rss


So, Dean Ryan. Part of the CF10 bubble or the bloke who just underlined that you don't know what you're writing about?
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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 3 Nov - 20:51

So, me and Dean Ryan think that Cardiff had the edge in the scrum so to speak? I thought I had said that days ago, so I don't really get your point but you do have a way of confuddling things. Did I say the CF10 Bubble? Silly me. I meant Phil's head! Smile

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Post by PhilBB Thu 4 Nov - 9:04

mikey_dragon wrote:So, me and Dean Ryan think that Cardiff had the edge in the scrum so to speak? I thought I had said that days ago, so I don't really get your point but you do have a way of confuddling things. Did I say the CF10 Bubble? Silly me. I meant Phil's head! Smile

"Yes I rate our new props as good players, they each have a good all-round game"

Apart from scrummaging against Cardiff's second choice front row, a good "ALL ROUND GAME". So, can't scrummage. So can't have a good all round game, by definition.
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Post by PhilBB Thu 4 Nov - 9:05

p.s. Dean Ryan didn't moan about Whitehouse's reffing of the scrum. Did anybody, other than Mikey, moan about the reffing?

That was an annihilation at scrum time that had nothing to do with refereeing.
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Post by mikey_dragon Thu 4 Nov - 9:50

PhilBB wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:So, me and Dean Ryan think that Cardiff had the edge in the scrum so to speak? I thought I had said that days ago, so I don't really get your point but you do have a way of confuddling things. Did I say the CF10 Bubble? Silly me. I meant Phil's head! Smile

"Yes I rate our new props as good players, they each have a good all-round game"

Apart from scrummaging against Cardiff's second choice front row, a good "ALL ROUND GAME". So, can't scrummage. So can't have a good all round game, by definition.

It's still a good all-round game, depsite not scrummaging as well as they could during this match, and the ref getting the first call clearly wrong and allowing the wrong call to be the precednt. I don't see what you're struggling with really. 3 tries conceded as our forwards went through yours, you're not a good team so you need to stop being so delusional.

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Thu 4 Nov - 10:00

Oh....another thread with you two going at it! I'm on alert now....as mentioned in one of the other "Mikey & Phil bickering threads", the next attack kops a ban.

Play nice boys Very Happy

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Post by PhilBB Thu 4 Nov - 15:26

mikey_dragon wrote:

It's still a good all-round game, depsite not scrummaging as well as they could during this match, and the ref getting the first call clearly wrong and allowing the wrong call to be the precednt. I don't see what you're struggling with really. 3 tries conceded as our forwards went through yours, you're not a good team so you need to stop being so delusional.

Just a reminder that it's only you who 'thinks' the issue at the scrum was refereeing. Not even Ryan thinks that.

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Post by PhilBB Thu 4 Nov - 15:28

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Oh....another thread with you two going at it! I'm on alert now....as mentioned in one of the other "Mikey & Phil bickering threads", the next attack kops a ban.

Play nice boys Very Happy

I don't think I'll ever understand how this board is supposed to work
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Post by No 7&1/2 Thu 4 Nov - 15:49

Stop thinking it's Twitter.

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Post by PhilBB Thu 4 Nov - 16:01

No 7&1/2 wrote:Stop thinking it's Twitter.

If it were twitter, Mikey would have closed his account based on naughty things that he'd written.

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Post by RiscaGame Fri 12 Nov - 11:56

Dragons A: Ioan Davies, Oli Andrew, Jared Rosser, Adam Warren (c), Rio Dyer, Josh Lewis, Dan Babos; Greg Bateman, Elliot Dee, Chris Coleman, Joe Davies, Joe Maksymiw, Huw Taylor, Ben Fry, Dan Baker

Replacements: Ellis Shipp, Josh Reynolds, Luke Yendle, Aaron Jarvis, Max Williams, Ryan Woodman, Ben Moa, Che Hope, Will Reed, Tom Griffiths, Joe Westwood

Scarlets Development: 15 Tom Rogers; 14 Ryan Conbeer, 13 Tyler Morgan, 12 Joe Roberts, 11 Callum Williams; 10 Rhys Patchell, 9 Archie Hughes; 1 Kemsley Mathias 2 Shaun Evans (capt), 3 Alex Jeffries, 4 Morgan Jones, 5 Jac Price, 6 Caleb Salmon, 7 Iestyn Rees, 8 Carwyn Tuipulotu.

Replacements: 16 Daf Hughes, 17 Steff Thomas, 18 Harri O’Connor, 19 Osian Davies, 20 Morgan Macrae, 21 Griff Evans, 22 Dane Blacker, 23 Josh Phillips, 24 Eddie James, 25 Steff Hughes

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Fri 12 Nov - 12:53

Didn't Alex Jeffries used to play for us, or am I thinking of someone else?

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Post by mikey_dragon Fri 12 Nov - 13:07

Yes.

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Post by mikey_dragon Fri 12 Nov - 13:11

Can we watch this?

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Fri 12 Nov - 13:39

Yes.

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Post by mikey_dragon Fri 12 Nov - 15:37

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Yes.

Is it on TV, or Facebook?

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Post by RiscaGame Fri 19 Nov - 20:19

Just saw Jon Evans has signed for Ebbw. I did wonder if it was him, when they announced their team. He will be ridiculously good at that level.

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Post by Welshmushroom Thu 25 Nov - 13:51

Any news on Edinburgh's player availability. Wondering how good our chances are based on what they are bringing down to Wales.

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Post by RiscaGame Fri 26 Nov - 20:48

I thought they don’t look as strong as they could, but I bet we no show at home again. Feel for Basham a bit, bring straight in, but if Taylor is the backup, I get it.

Hell of a backrow for Dragons mind.

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Post by The Oracle Fri 26 Nov - 21:50

Very mobile back row for us but a bit lightweight? Hopefully won’t be an issue but not sure what sort of size the Edinburgh boys are. Overall the pack looks a little weak to me. Which is a shame as I think it’s pretty much our strongest backs starting, give or take a player or two (perhaps Ashton Hewitt and Aneurin Owen over Dyer and Dixon, but not much in it). Just hope the forwards can give the backs a good platform. Will be great to see Leon Brown back. I’m a big fan and think he still has loads of potential. Hopefully he can come off the bench and add something. The other bench forwards and not great. Not exactly the bomb squad!

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Post by Hazel Sapling Sat 27 Nov - 10:49

For Edinburgh, the sub props were flatmates playing Super Six together last year. Both impressed and, for the LH, this will be his debut. Starters and sub-hooker are decent. The locks are both starting their careers but got capped against Tonga. Hodgson is the beanpole, whilst Sykes appears to be as broad as Schoeman. Hodgson also got on against Australia and did not look terrible though Dragons could try to target the lineout.

Back-row, Haining and Bradbury have a bunch of caps and Crosbie is not far behind getting a few after a good 2-3 seasons. The smallest is Crosbie at 6'5, 108kg. It is a big, heavy carrying back row with Bradbury covering lock. Off the bench, Boyle is a small 6.5 who has done well and Muncaster has impressed as a future Scotland no.8 every time he has played. Muncaster, for me, is potentially a bolter for the 2023 RWC. Both are 20-21.

Kinghorn at 10 is an experiment that is not particularly loved by anyone, but Vellacott was unlucky not to be in the AI's. Pyrgos will be slow and ponderous off the bench to look after Savala, a developing 10. Lang has caps and did well for Quins. View him as Peter Horne mark 2 as a good club 12 who can cover 10 in a pinch but internationals is a step too far. Currie is highly rated as a youngster whilst bench option Hutchison is a strong, direct 12/13. The back three includes two Argentinian internationals and Hoyland who should all be pretty good.

Looking at Dragons, I think you will be able to make hay at the breakdown if the ref rewards it and the 7's don't get blown off the ball. Brown will have a good shot at making an impact at scrum time against Courtney as well. Every first phase ball from set piece should be Roberts running hard at Kinghorn who is a weak tackler.

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Post by The Oracle Sat 27 Nov - 16:14

Thanks for the preview Hazel Sapling. Sounds like some inexperience in both sides then. Looking forward to the game. Dragons seem to be improving, even if a lot of that is close losses so far this season. But playing at home against a side missing some players…..we really need to be targeting a win if we are to have any ambitions of getting up off the bottom few in the table. Won’t be easy though as everyone else also improves season on season!
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Post by RiscaGame Sat 27 Nov - 17:22

Terrible start, but a nice score for the Edinburgh 15.

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Post by RiscaGame Sat 27 Nov - 17:23

I know it’s allowed now, but I think it looks wrong with our players wearing skins on their legs.

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Post by RiscaGame Sat 27 Nov - 17:26

Basham off too.

Have to wonder why there is a Scottish ref mind.

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Post by RiscaGame Sat 27 Nov - 17:33

Twice Dyer has been done defensively. Dragons in a lot of trouble and are not in favour with Adamson either.

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Post by The Oracle Sat 27 Nov - 17:52

It’s like all of the good work and momentum (of sorts) from the start of the season has been undone by the last few weeks off.
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Post by RiscaGame Sat 27 Nov - 18:51

Dragons record at home is shocking. The whole season has been poor, but we have to do better at home.

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Post by The Oracle Sat 27 Nov - 19:08

Crying or Very sad
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Post by RiscaGame Mon 29 Nov - 14:34

On the upside though, Keddie did say he wanted us to shake the plucky losers tag. At least we managed that, this weekend Wink

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Post by The Oracle Mon 29 Nov - 15:12

Yep, nothing plucky about losing at home by a score difference of more than 2 converted tries, and 4 tries conceded overall! Sad Laugh
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Post by jimbopip Tue 30 Nov - 18:09

How are you guys feeling about your upcoming trip to Scotstoun?

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Post by The Oracle Tue 30 Nov - 18:26

jimbopip wrote:How are you guys feeling about your upcoming trip to Scotstoun?

Terrible!
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Post by RiscaGame Tue 30 Nov - 20:43

Worse than terrible.

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