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PGATour Running Commentary January 2022

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pedro
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Post by GPB Sat 01 Jan 2022, 2:32 pm

First topic message reminder :

Happy New Year.  After a nearly a year and half, its time for a new thread.

39 ofthe 40 Players eligible to play Sentry ToC are playing.  Only one missing is Rory McIlroy.

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Post by Shotrock Thu 21 Apr 2022, 6:40 pm

Speaking of Greg Norman ... there was a pretty interesting show on ESPN about him earlier this week.

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/greg-norman-espn-30-for-30-shark-review

Highly recommended. Sure, he had some last hole or extra hole bad beats (Tway, Mize, Gamez) but two things stood out to me from that show:

1 - He put himself in positions to at least win those tournaments

2 - In many cases, he played pretty poorly on the final day of many of those "close" majors

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Post by I'm never wrong Sun 24 Apr 2022, 7:29 am

I've just looked at the PGA Tour leaderboard (HERE) after the third round.
I like to see what Ian Poulter is up to. After the third round he is [with Shane Lowry] shown as tied 9th. But then I look to the right hand side and look at the columns which show projected FedEx position against starting position. Poulter is staring at 156 and projected to be at 148, a rise of eight places. But players either side of him - all tied 9th - are projected to rise more spots in the FedEx table.
So my question is, why isn't Poulter going to move as much as the other players? Is it based on the expectation that he and Lowry are not going to do as well as the others? (Players either side of him are both higher and lower in their current FedEx positions)

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Post by GPB Sun 24 Apr 2022, 2:35 pm

https://www.pgatour.com/fedexcup/projected-standings.html

INW, here is the 'live' projected standings. Everyone that is T9 is getting 42.15 pts going into Round 4.

I don't really have the time, but I would say that FEDEX Standings are more congested in the #60-#111 range than they are at the tail end. akin to a normal distribution.

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Post by I'm never wrong Sun 24 Apr 2022, 3:34 pm

GPB wrote:https://www.pgatour.com/fedexcup/projected-standings.html

INW, here is the 'live' projected standings.  Everyone that is T9 is getting 42.15 pts going into Round 4.

I don't really have the time, but I would say that FEDEX Standings are more congested in the #60-#111 range than they are at the tail end.  akin to a normal distribution.
GPB - that's a useful link, thanks. I tried to find something like that before I wrote my post but was unsuccessful. I also see what you mean about the standings. Doc Redman is in a similar position to Poulter (both in FedEx standings and the tournament), and he moves exactly the same places. So now I'm clear. Cheers.

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Post by incontinentia Tue 26 Apr 2022, 8:45 am

Philip Mickelson has asked the PGA tour for permission to play in the 1st Saudi event!
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Post by McLaren Tue 26 Apr 2022, 1:06 pm

And he is in the PGA champs field? So playing Saudi events doesn't get you kicked out of anything.


The claim in some news outlets is that 15 of the worlds top 100 have registered to play in the first LIV golf event in London. With 70 in total registering to play.

What isn't clear to me is what sort of player makes up those 15. How many are PGAT, ET, double dippers etc? Something makes me think they might be predominantly European players because the gulf in cash available between the ET and LIV will be that much higher. And PGAT players will need a release from the tour.



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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Tue 26 Apr 2022, 1:55 pm

These LIV golf events are basically just similar to what PGAT players do when they play the Saudi open in February no?

LIV scrapped the whole league thing for a bit when DJ/Bryson et al pulled out...so are just putting on a few random events with ludicrous price money until they can come back to the table with a better league offering. PGAT isn't going to stop folk playing the odd random event with them I don't fancy
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Post by incontinentia Tue 26 Apr 2022, 2:31 pm

McLaren wrote:And he is in the PGA champs field? So playing Saudi events doesn't get you kicked out of anything.


The claim in some news outlets is that 15 of the worlds top 100 have registered to play in the first LIV golf event in London. With 70 in total registering to play.

What isn't clear to me is what sort of player makes up those 15. How many are PGAT, ET, double dippers etc? Something makes me think they might be predominantly European players because the gulf in cash available between the ET and LIV will be that much higher. And PGAT players will need a release from the tour.

I'm thinking that he has entered the PGA and US Open in the hope of being allowed play, but surely he'll be given an ultimatum to pledge his allegiance to the American events and if he refuses he'll be axed from the majors?


Last edited by incontinentia on Tue 26 Apr 2022, 2:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by I'm never wrong Tue 26 Apr 2022, 2:33 pm

McLaren wrote: And PGAT players will need a release from the tour.

....and also DPWorld Tour players will as well, as its up against The Volvo Car Scandanavian Mixed Tournament

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Post by GPB Wed 27 Apr 2022, 1:12 pm

Remember that the PGA Championship and US Open are not run by the PGA-Tour.

Even he is (allegedly?) suspended from the PGATour, that doesn't prevent him from playing the PGA or the US Open. With respect to LIV Golf, Phil is at loggerheads with the PGATour, not the PGA of America or the USGA.

and yes, FWIW, a suspension from the PGA-Tour would not have kept him from playing the Masters either. Which he did not play.

and yes, Phil is a big critic of the USGA, but those are different issues.

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Post by McLaren Thu 28 Apr 2022, 1:02 pm

GPB

Phil must be mighty short of cash if he is trashing his legacy for £24m. And does it even matter what organization he has a beef with (PGAT, PGAofA, USGA) he is yesterdays news.
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Post by McLaren Wed 04 May 2022, 2:55 pm

So Westwood, Bland and possibly Sergio to join Mickelson in playing the bone saw tour.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/golf/61322651

https://www.golfmonthly.com/news/ryder-cup-legend-sergio-garcia-linked-with-saudi-golf-league-opener

Westwood is not a smart man is he? His analysis of the Saudi situation is that of a daily express reader.
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Post by super_realist Wed 04 May 2022, 3:11 pm

McLaren wrote:So Westwood, Bland and possibly Sergio to join Mickelson in playing the bone saw tour.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/golf/61322651

https://www.golfmonthly.com/news/ryder-cup-legend-sergio-garcia-linked-with-saudi-golf-league-opener

Westwood is not a smart man is he? His analysis of the Saudi situation is that of a daily express reader.

When golf tours already play in Saudi Arabia, Qatar, UAE, China, USA etc where there are well documented human rights issues, why are people bothered about this Saudi backed tour?

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Post by beninho Wed 04 May 2022, 6:52 pm

Got myself into a twitter soat with some idiot who doesn't think Ricky Fowler was one of tge best in the world, mainly between 2014 -2018 ×when he won some big events, had good major finishes amd never finished below 12 in the world rankings by year end.

People really are daft.

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Post by GPB Thu 05 May 2022, 2:18 am

beninho wrote:Got myself into a twitter soat with some idiot who doesn't think Ricky Fowler was one of tge best in the world, mainly between 2014 -2018 ×when he won some big events, had good major finishes amd never finished below 12 in the world rankings by year end.

People really are daft.

or he(she) has a very narrow definition of "best in the World".

some of the opinions expressed on this board are very daft in my opinion.

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Post by super_realist Thu 05 May 2022, 7:34 am

GPB wrote:
beninho wrote:Got myself into a twitter soat with some idiot who doesn't think Ricky Fowler was one of tge best in the world, mainly between 2014 -2018 ×when he won some big events, had good major finishes amd never finished below 12 in the world rankings by year end.

People really are daft.

or he(she) has a very narrow definition of "best in the World".

some of the opinions expressed on this board are very daft in my opinion.  

Seem to recall some really stupid defence of the World Golf Hall of Fame.

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Post by McLaren Thu 05 May 2022, 2:15 pm

super_realist wrote:
McLaren wrote:So Westwood, Bland and possibly Sergio to join Mickelson in playing the bone saw tour.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/golf/61322651

https://www.golfmonthly.com/news/ryder-cup-legend-sergio-garcia-linked-with-saudi-golf-league-opener

Westwood is not a smart man is he? His analysis of the Saudi situation is that of a daily express reader.

When golf tours already play in Saudi Arabia, Qatar, UAE, China, USA etc where there are well documented human rights issues, why are people bothered about this Saudi backed tour?

This is the same piss poor reasoning Westwood used. Since when did someone else doing something awful make it ok for you to do it? As he said he is an independent contractor. So he has the freedom to operate as a decent human being.
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Post by super_realist Thu 05 May 2022, 2:29 pm

You're missing the point Mac.
If you are against the Saudi Tour, you should have similar disdain for DP Tour and WGC tournaments, as well as F1 races, Diamond League Athletics, Olympics, Winter Olympics, World Cups etc.

Do you?

The Saudi Tour is just another questionable tour, but I dont see the same justified outrage for those other events, the way this tour is derided.
Selective outrage?

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Post by beninho Thu 05 May 2022, 4:49 pm

Sportswashing is bad. Using examples of sportswashing to try and defend your decision to get involved in sportswashing is also bad.

The only real forum I read is an F1 one, and that had plenty of people against racing in Saudi.


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Post by super_realist Thu 05 May 2022, 4:54 pm

beninho wrote:Sportswashing is bad. Using examples of sportswashing to try and defend your decision to get involved in sportswashing is also bad.

The only real forum I read is an F1 one, and that had plenty of people against racing in Saudi.


Jesus, if the status quo isnt complained about (and it isnt in general), why is this new tour treated differently?
Its not defending the SA tour, its posing the question why one tour is considered acceptable and another isnt.

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Post by beninho Thu 05 May 2022, 5:32 pm

super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:Sportswashing is bad. Using examples of sportswashing to try and defend your decision to get involved in sportswashing is also bad.

The only real forum I read is an F1 one, and that had plenty of people against racing in Saudi.


Jesus, if the status quo isnt complained about (and it isnt in general), why is this new tour treated differently?
Its not defending the SA tour, its posing the question why one tour is considered acceptable and another isnt.

Treated differently to what?

Saudi sportsmanship is bad. People shouldn't defend it, or in your case it seems downplaying it. But, if you are fine with ir, that's also ok.

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Post by super_realist Thu 05 May 2022, 7:19 pm

beninho wrote:
super_realist wrote:
beninho wrote:Sportswashing is bad. Using examples of sportswashing to try and defend your decision to get involved in sportswashing is also bad.

The only real forum I read is an F1 one, and that had plenty of people against racing in Saudi.


Jesus, if the status quo isnt complained about (and it isnt in general), why is this new tour treated differently?
Its not defending the SA tour, its posing the question why one tour is considered acceptable and another isnt.

Treated differently to what?

Saudi sportsmanship is bad. People shouldn't defend it, or in your case it seems downplaying it.  But, if you are fine with ir, that's also ok.

Tje point is that people dont currently boycott or refuse to watch sports events in Qatar, Saudi Arabia, UAE, China, USA and other countries with appalling human rights, but somehow this tour is seen as worse.
Im just asking for consistency amd I amnt downplaying a fcking thing. Im asking why some tours are given special treatment and excused whilst others are seen as a pariah. Nor did I say I was fine with it, im questioning the double standards and hypocrisy on show.

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Post by GPB Fri 06 May 2022, 1:31 pm

"If you throw a stone into a kennel of dogs, that one that yelps is the one that got hit."

Re World Golf Hall of Fame? You want to pick that scab again? The Players are honored, the media covers it, tourists go to it. Seems like you don't have much company on the island.

If anyone can't see the difference between the Human Rights abuses in Saudi Arabia and "civilized" countries then there really isn't much anyone cite to convince them otherwise. Just 2 months ago, 81 people were executed.

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/03/saudi-arabia-mass-execution-of-81-men-shows-urgent-need-to-abolish-the-death-penalty/


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Post by super_realist Fri 06 May 2022, 1:36 pm

GPB wrote:"If you throw a stone into a kennel of dogs, that one that yelps is the one that got hit."

Re World Golf Hall of Fame?  You want to pick that scab again?  The Players are honored, the media covers it, tourists go to it.  Seems like you don't have much company on the island.

If anyone can't see the difference between the Human Rights abuses in Saudi Arabia and "civilized" countries then there really isn't much anyone cite to convince them otherwise.  Just 2 months ago, 81 people were executed.

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/03/saudi-arabia-mass-execution-of-81-men-shows-urgent-need-to-abolish-the-death-penalty/


You come from a backward country that also executes people,  has an appalling health system, truly terrible employment laws and is about to give states autonomy over a womans right to choose, so to return a trite clich to you "let those who are without sin, cast the first stone"

No one seemingly cares when the European Tour or WGC goes to China, Qatar, UAE, Turkey etc, but they foam at the mouth about Saudi Arabia? Hardly a consistent rhetoric is it?

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Post by McLaren Fri 06 May 2022, 1:58 pm

Super

To continue the theme, two wrongs don't make a right.


But actually you raise a good point about the USA. If they do remove the right to an abortion they are sailing very close to being a country that you would hope major sporting events would avoid. As you say they already execute people so I certainly wouldn't complain if they lost sporting events over their lack of humanity.
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Post by super_realist Fri 06 May 2022, 2:07 pm

McLaren wrote:Super

To continue the theme, two wrongs don't make a right.


But actually you raise a good point about the USA. If they do remove the right to an abortion they are sailing very close to being a country that you would hope major sporting events would avoid. As you say they already execute people so I certainly wouldn't complain if they lost sporting events over their lack of humanity.

Jesus F"ck Mac, I'm not saying it does Mac, im pointing out the lack of consistency in peoples condemnation.
Personally id rather see no sport in these backwards theocratic despotic regimes, but there seems to be special treatment for countries that are established tour stops, but condemnation ONLY for Saudi Arabia. Why arent they condemning ALL these countries?
Do you boycott the Qatar, UAE, Chinese, Russian F1 races? Doubt it.

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Post by McLaren Fri 06 May 2022, 2:45 pm

super_realist wrote:
Do you boycott the Qatar, UAE, Chinese, Russian F1 races? Doubt it.

I don't, but I actually think in an ideal world sports fans would boycott events in problematic regimes.

However, even if the fans won't switch off the governing bodies and the more established competitors need to make a stand, eg Westwood. It certainly doesn't encourage the fans to turn off when the sports governing bodies can be bought by dodgy regimes and stars like Westwood make public proclamations about how well these countries are doing. It is for those further up the food chain to make a stance, not just the fan just sticking some sport on to fill some time on a Sunday.


As for why Saudi/Norman is getting so much flack I think it is to do with just how bad the Saudis are and the fact that they don't give a shit about blowing up the existing tours. A lot of the articles written about this are from a tour golf perspective rather than a more general political one. But I will come back to the point that even if the treatment of other nations like Qatar, China, Russia, USA in respect to holding sports events has been disappointing it doesn't mean we should discourage the correct response to Saudis now.
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Post by beninho Fri 06 May 2022, 3:04 pm

You can still not like sportswashing even if you still watch the sport. Every new attempt at sportswashing can still be called out, even if you watch it. Players shouldn't defend it with other claims.

I wish it wasn't as prevalent as it is, and I wish state backed events didn't take place or own football clubs.

But I think the difference with America for instance, is the American government isn't backing the events, the American government doesn't have shares in football clubs.

But still, sportswashing and defending it, its pretty Poopie

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Post by super_realist Fri 06 May 2022, 3:13 pm

McLaren wrote:
super_realist wrote:
Do you boycott the Qatar, UAE, Chinese, Russian F1 races? Doubt it.

I don't, but I actually think in an ideal world sports fans would boycott events in problematic regimes.

However, even if the fans won't switch off the governing bodies and the more established competitors need to make a stand, eg Westwood. It certainly doesn't encourage the fans to turn off when the sports governing bodies can be bought by dodgy regimes and stars like Westwood make public proclamations about how well these countries are doing. It is for those further up the food chain to make a stance, not just the fan just sticking some sport on to fill some time on a Sunday.


As for why Saudi/Norman is getting so much flack I think it is to do with just how bad the Saudis are and the fact that they don't give a Poopie about blowing up the existing tours. A lot of the articles written about this are from a tour golf perspective rather than a more general political one. But I will come back to the point that even if the treatment of other nations like Qatar, China, Russia, USA in respect to holding sports events has been disappointing it doesn't mean we should discourage the correct response to Saudis now.

Thats all fine Mac, but there should be consistency and people flounce about it now and rush to excuse it, but apparently this is the worst thing in the history of golf, when in reality it is comparable with other sports tours and events.

By the way, if you dont think UAE, Turkish, Qatari governments arent involved in getting tours and events into their country Ive got swamp land in New Jersey to sell you. Even Salmond (when in office) got involved to get an event in Scotland.

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Post by GPB Sat 07 May 2022, 12:13 am

FWIW, There was a lot of USA protests about going to China for the Olympics this past year. Mostly from the conservative point of view. I didn't watch any of the Chinese Olympics and try not to buy anything that is linked to China.

Apparently there is no grey area for executions. I can shades of grey between the justice in USa vs Saudi Arabia

Saudi Arabia has public executions of beheadings and Hangings for crimes such as adultery, homosexuality and apostasy. 81 in March. very little due process.

USA had 11 executions in all of 2021 all by non-public lethal injection At an avg of 24 years after the crime. All after they murdered at least one person.

If you can't see shades of grey, perhaps a trip to an Optometrist should be scheduled.

FTR, I boycott all Formula One events, doesn't matter where they are.

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Post by super_realist Sat 07 May 2022, 12:19 pm

GPB wrote:FWIW, There was a lot of USA protests about going to China for the Olympics this past year.  Mostly from the conservative point of view. I didn't watch any of the Chinese Olympics and try not to buy anything that is linked to China.

Apparently there is no grey area for executions.  I can shades of grey between the justice in USa vs Saudi Arabia

Saudi Arabia has public executions of beheadings and Hangings for crimes such as adultery, homosexuality and apostasy.  81 in March.  very little due process.

USA had 11 executions in all of 2021 all by non-public lethal injection  At an avg of 24 years after the crime.  All after they murdered at least one person.

If you can't see shades of grey, perhaps a trip to an Optometrist should be scheduled.

FTR, I boycott all Formula One events, doesn't matter where they are.

Not even Russia execute prisoners now, only country in Europe that does is Belarus, so youre in great company.
The majority of Saudi executions at that event were for Terrorism, exactly the same offence as your country executed Timothy McVeigh for.
Nice skirting around of the abortion issue. You cant change the fact that America is backwards for a first world country. You dont even have paid maternity enshrined in law.

As for avoiding things from China, sure all your apple and pc components are all from Pricksville, Kentucky arent they?

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Wed 11 May 2022, 9:29 am

https://golfweek.usatoday.com/2022/05/10/pga-tour-denies-permission-to-play-saudi-event/

PGA Tour seems to be confident in their stance, and is taking a hard line from the start with this new Saudi league/tour.
They seem to rather (cleverly?) be careful in saying to players you "can't play in this tour/league" but more, "if you play in this tour/league, you can't then play on our tour". I'd imagine the lawyers on both sides are ready and raring to go though...
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Post by McLaren Wed 11 May 2022, 9:39 am

Players who want to play the LIV have an easy solution. Just leave the PGAT. The fact they won't shows they accept there is an entity there that is worth preserving.
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Post by beninho Wed 11 May 2022, 9:58 am

I think its ridiculous that they can't play whatever event they fancy. They are not employed by the PGA tour, so can't see how it can restrict them.

I'm fact it seems to be a bit of a racket, you can't play top level golf without being on the PGA tour, who them restrict what you can do.

It's pretty crazy.

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Post by McLaren Wed 11 May 2022, 10:06 am

beninho wrote:I think its ridiculous that they can't play whatever event they fancy. They are not employed by the PGA tour, so can't see how it can restrict them.

I'm fact it seems to be a bit of a racket, you can't play top level golf without being on the PGA tour, who them restrict what you can do.

It's pretty crazy.

But the players are the tour in effect. It is a member run organisation so they have essentially agreed the rules that now prevent them from playing the Saudi events. Any player who claims "the tour" are stopping them doesn't understand the situation. Obviously a day to day decision like issuing the refusal to grant a release is done be the commissioner or other admin but they are only going be the rules ok'ed be the players.
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Post by beninho Wed 11 May 2022, 10:18 am

If the players are the tour, the players should be able to pick and choose what they do and where they play. It's not working in a players interest if the tour then refuses the same player an opportunity to play golf elsewhere.

How can it be fair, or even legal to dictate what people can and can't do if that person isn't employed by the tour. Even worse if as youvsay the player is the tour.

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Post by McLaren Wed 11 May 2022, 10:27 am

beninho wrote:If the players are the tour, the players should be able to pick and choose what they do and where they play.  

Why? They have set the PGAT up to protect itself and by extension those that are members of it. Part of getting all the benefits of tour membership is excepting you don't work against it.
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Post by beninho Wed 11 May 2022, 10:38 am

But when the collective doesn't benefit all involved then the collective doesn't work.

The option then, as now, us basically forcing people to abide by the rules, and it would appear to be some sort of restraint of trade. Especially when, employer/employee relationship.

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Post by McLaren Wed 11 May 2022, 10:52 am

beninho wrote:it would appear to be some sort of restraint of trade

Yes. You restrict your trade and in return you get to play on the best golf tour and get the sweetest pension deal imaginable. Probably a fair trade off?
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Post by beninho Wed 11 May 2022, 10:56 am

McLaren wrote:
beninho wrote:it would appear to be some sort of restraint of trade

Yes. You restrict your trade and in return you get to play on the best golf tour and get the sweetest pension deal imaginable. Probably a fair trade off?

Well it was a fair trade, until the markets change. Now, not so much for some. I cant see how any legal challenge wouldn't find that the PGA tour restricting trade is lawful.

But I'm not up on American legislation.

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Post by Shotrock Wed 11 May 2022, 11:58 am

Does the PGA tour have the right to defend their product? Of course they do. Do independent contractors have the right to play where they want? Of course they do. BUT, there may be consequences ... and the PGA is clear on what those consequences will be. Just leave the tour.

I'm 100% certain the PGA legal teams have their arguments at the ready for any challenges. Will Greg Norman and team fund the players that want to challenge the rulings. TBD.

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Post by beninho Wed 11 May 2022, 2:14 pm

Shotrock wrote:Does the PGA tour have the right to defend their product? Of course they do. Do independent contractors have the right to play where they want? Of course they do. BUT, there may be consequences ... and the PGA is clear on what those consequences will be. Just leave the tour.

I'm 100% certain the PGA legal teams have their arguments at the ready for any challenges. Will Greg Norman and team fund the players that want to challenge the rulings. TBD.

But under what grounds, can an organisation bar someone from their organisation if they don't like other things they do. A golfer isn't employed by the pga tour.

I still don't understand the legal implications.

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Post by super_realist Wed 11 May 2022, 2:49 pm

beninho wrote:
Shotrock wrote:Does the PGA tour have the right to defend their product? Of course they do. Do independent contractors have the right to play where they want? Of course they do. BUT, there may be consequences ... and the PGA is clear on what those consequences will be. Just leave the tour.

I'm 100% certain the PGA legal teams have their arguments at the ready for any challenges. Will Greg Norman and team fund the players that want to challenge the rulings. TBD.

But under what grounds, can an organisation bar someone from their organisation if they don't like other things they do. A golfer isn't employed by the pga tour.

I still don't understand the legal implications.

Unless you know the contractual obligations that each PGA member is under its impossible to say.
These guys sign contracts to be on the tour, im sure there will be sonething in there to protect the PGA from being usurped.

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Post by beninho Wed 11 May 2022, 3:26 pm

But, just because something is in a contract doesn't mean its legal or binding. Saying you can only play golf for me and no other person without my express say so, seems pretty restrictive to be in a legally binding contract, especially when not employed.

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Post by super_realist Wed 11 May 2022, 3:31 pm

beninho wrote:But, just because something is in a contract doesn't mean its legal or binding.  Saying you can only play golf for me and no other person without my express say so, seems pretty restrictive to be in a legally binding contract, especially when not employed.


They arent saying that though. The implication that if a player wants to play on this new tour, they have to make a choice as to what tour they play on. Basically, if you play on LIV tour, youll no longer be welcome on PGA, didnt you once say cancel culture doesnt exist? 😂

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Post by beninho Wed 11 May 2022, 3:47 pm

But I dont get how, one place can dictate what soneone else can do. Especially when that person is not and never has been employed by that place.

Is there a legal basis to refuse soneone entry into a competition, because they entered another competition?

It just seems madness. I get protecting the brand, but It just seems like a racket

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Post by superflyweight Wed 11 May 2022, 3:47 pm

beninho wrote:But, just because something is in a contract doesn't mean its legal or binding.  Saying you can only play golf for me and no other person without my express say so, seems pretty restrictive to be in a legally binding contract, especially when not employed.

Exclusivity provisions aren't particularly rare in contracts. Difficult to give an opinion on this with any degree of certainty without seeing the terms which players sign up to, but preventing someone playing on another tour without consent from the PGA would probably only have a chance of being deemed to be unduly restrictive if the player was also prevented from playing on the PGA Tour at the same time (which isn't happening).

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Wed 11 May 2022, 3:49 pm

beninho wrote:I think its ridiculous that they can't play whatever event they fancy. They are not employed by the PGA tour, so can't see how it can restrict them.

I'm fact it seems to be a bit of a racket, you can't play top level golf without being on the PGA tour, who them restrict what you can do.

It's pretty crazy.

The PGA Tour isn't restricting them from playing in this new LIV golf - they're simply giving the players a choice, of which what decision they choose will have consequences.
While I am not the biggest PGAT fan going out there, I would trust they have their ducks in a row more than Greg Norman and Phil Mickelson when it comes to the legality of them doing this (might be proven totally wrong!).

And I think it is pretty telling that the players reportedly "signed up" for this LIV golf stuff...are the over the hill golfers looking for one final pay day, without a care for how it will effect their fellow golfers/golf fans, when the majority already have obscene wealth, mainly derived from playing PGAT events!
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Post by super_realist Wed 11 May 2022, 3:50 pm

beninho wrote:But I dont get how, one place can dictate what soneone else can do. Especially when that person is not and never has been employed by that place.

Is there a legal basis to refuse soneone entry into a competition, because they entered another competition?

It just seems madness. I get protecting the brand, but It just seems like a racket

Its simple, its their tour, and if you want to be part of it, you follow their rules, just like all those Premiership and European teams backtracked on the breakaway league.

It doesnt matter if they aren't employed by that tour, the rules are a contingent part of their membership.


Last edited by super_realist on Wed 11 May 2022, 3:51 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by beninho Wed 11 May 2022, 3:51 pm

superflyweight wrote:
beninho wrote:But, just because something is in a contract doesn't mean its legal or binding.  Saying you can only play golf for me and no other person without my express say so, seems pretty restrictive to be in a legally binding contract, especially when not employed.

Exclusivity provisions aren't particularly rare in contracts.  Difficult to give an opinion on this with any degree of certainty without seeing the terms which players sign up to, but preventing someone playing on another tour without consent from the PGA would probably only have a chance of being deemed to be unduly restrictive if the player was also prevented from playing on the PGA Tour at the same time (which isn't happening).  

But isn't it something to do with employment? No player is employed by the pga tour, they aren't paid for working on the pga tour. They are paid winnings? So it's saying you are only allowed to enter competitions with us, no one else. Which seems restrictive?

I'm sure there is some sort of safeguard, it just seems overly harsh.

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