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Scotland AI thread

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Post by Highland Shaun Wed 28 Sep 2022, 10:54 pm

First topic message reminder :

Results in aggregate this year for the national team were:

5 February 2022 - Scotland 20–17 England
12 February 2022 - Wales 20–17 Scotland
26 February 2022 - Scotland 17–36 France
12 March 2022 - Italy 22–33 Scotland
19 March 2022 - Ireland 26–5 Scotland
2 July 2022 - Argentina 26–18 Scotland
9 July 2022 - Argentina 6–29 Scotland
16 July 2022 - Argentina 34–31 Scotland
29 October 2022 - Scotland 15–16 Australia
5 November 2022 - Scotland 28–12 Fiji
13 November 2022 - Scotland 23–31 New Zealand
19 November 2022 - Scotland 52–29 Argentina

P 12 W 5 L 7
Erm

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Post by sensisball Thu 27 Oct 2022, 8:21 pm

Tramptastic wrote:I hate this whole converting of props business - it was the same with Welsh and Low, they came through the system as a very good loosehead and a good tighthead, got recognition there at international level, got told to swap and then they faded in to obscurity.

It didn't help Welsh that he was an old school prop. He probably reminded Toonie of the front row at Brive who allegedly uses to give him a bit of a shooing before home games to get him to tackle more robustly!

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Post by funnyExiledScot Thu 27 Oct 2022, 9:28 pm

No big issues with this selection from Toonie. Personally I'd have put Ritchie Gray on the bench on form ahead of Glen Young (who hasn't really done anything this season), and given Gray a taste of Murrayfield again, but not much in it.

Similarly I'd have had Cherry on the bench and started Turner, but very little between them (big shame McInally got injured after such a strong start this season).

Hoyland on the bench is a slight concern. I'd have preferred a more versatile option such as Steyn, however Steyn hasn't done much this season.

Still, a solid team selection.

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Post by BigGee Thu 27 Oct 2022, 9:37 pm

I suspect he has gone for the Edinburgh players over the Glasgow ones on these marginal calls to allow them to get over the truppeny bits that they were all sufferring from down there.

Gray had a concussion as well i beleive, so may have had to sit out some of this week training. I expect we will see him at sone stage, especially now that Cummings is out of the squad.

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Post by RDW Thu 27 Oct 2022, 10:00 pm

BigGee wrote:Australian team is out

Quite a few there I am not that familiar with and surely Jock Campbell should be playing for us!




Australia (vs Scotland, Saturday)
1. James Slipper (c) (123 Tests)
2. David Porecki (7 Tests)
3. Allan Alaalatoa (60 Tests)
4. Nick Frost (5 Tests)
5. Cadeyrn Neville (3 Tests)
6. Jed Holloway (6 Tests)
7. Michael Hooper (121 Tests)
8. Rob Valetini (27 Tests)
9. Tate McDermott (18 Tests)
10. Bernard Foley (73 Tests)
11. Tom Wright (18 Tests)
12. Hunter Paisami (20 Tests)
13. Len Ikitau (21 Tests)
14. Andrew Kellaway (18 Tests)
15. Tom Banks (20 Tests)

Replacements:
16. Folau Fainga’a (33 Tests)
17. Matt Gibbon (2 Tests)
18. Taniela Tupou (43 Tests)
19. Ned Hanigan (25 Tests)
20. Pete Samu (28 Tests)
21. Nic White (56 Tests)
22. Noah Lolesio (14 Tests)
23. Jock Campbell*

Front row - Slipper is the old warhorse, will probably play 70+ as his replacement is very inexperienced - they've been hit by injury at LH. Porecki is a good all rounder, similar to cherry. Fainga'a is a real impact sub with an incredible try scoring record. Alaalatoa is a very solid TH, with Taupo an absolute freak of nature off the bench - he takes a lot of stopping.

Locks - probably the weakest part of the team, a lot due to injuries. We should attack their lineout is it plays a massive part in launching their intelligent backline plays

Back row - an absolute barnstorming backrow with more to come on the bench. Holloway is a lock/6 type player. Hooper is Hooper (although he'll be rusty). Bobby V is the kind of barnstorming number 8 we'd absolutely love to have - he's on great form too. Should be in the running for world player of the year given the season he's had.

Half backs - McDermott is a classic livewire 9 who will be all action. Foley has come out of the woodwork and seems to be starting 10 after a number of injuries - we know him well unfortunately.

Centres - a lot of their plays goes through these two. Paisami is a pocket rocket he will hit the line hard. Ikitau is a good runner and ball player. Both have good kicking games - in our 22 we need to watch out for one of them doing a grubber behind into the dead ball area.

Back 3 - all  classy players, good under the high ball and know how to score tries. Lacking X factor though - thank feck Koroibete isn't playing. Our wingers have the ability to create something from nothing - this lot not so much.

A very strong team and they really should win this - Rennie will be under huge pressure if they don't.


Last edited by RDW on Fri 28 Oct 2022, 3:48 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by funnyExiledScot Thu 27 Oct 2022, 10:34 pm

BigGee wrote:I suspect he has gone for the Edinburgh players over the Glasgow ones on these marginal calls to allow them to get over the truppeny bits that they were all sufferring from down there.

That's a fair point. I'd forgotten that the weegies all had the trots. Best segregate until they adopt better hygiene standards....

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Post by funnyExiledScot Thu 27 Oct 2022, 10:40 pm

Thanks for the Aussie run down RDW. Quite a few players I'm not familiar with. Sounds like stopping those gargantuan props getting a rumble on is going to be key here. I'm not wholly convinced by Nel and Bhatti as impact subs, so big games for Fagerson and Shoe. Hopefully Hooper will be as underpar as Watson has been this season. I actually wondered whether Dempsey may start with Fagerson at 6 and Ritchie at 7, and use Hamish as impact.

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Post by RDW Thu 27 Oct 2022, 11:08 pm

If we can stop the Wallabies big runners (easier said and done) then they don't often have a plan B. If we let the likes of Bobby V, Paisama and Taupo get fromt foot ball then we'll be in for a long afternoon.

We definitely need to expect the unexpected - the Wallabies have a lot of variety to their plays and have scored some fantastic tries.

I've said this before on here but I see a lot of similarities between Scotland and the Wallabies. We can play some great rugby at times and look like world beaters (although in Scotland's case not much recently). But we both lack consistency and the ability to really ground out wins when it really matters. Worth noting that Wallabies have had a horrendous run of injuries.

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Post by TJ Fri 28 Oct 2022, 3:46 am

I feel really uninterested in these AIs. Until Townsend goes then Scotland are going to continue to underperfom

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 28 Oct 2022, 8:28 am

I'm intrigued to know what a par performance is for Scotland over the next 18 months and who would lead you there if available.

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Post by TJ Fri 28 Oct 2022, 9:30 am

par would be winning 2 AIs and 3 or 4 6N games. Coach? Plenty of candidates

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Post by Oakdene Fri 28 Oct 2022, 9:36 am

As a neutral I'm looking forward to this match! Got some lagers in the fridge chilling in readiness.

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Post by Hazel Sapling Fri 28 Oct 2022, 11:27 am

TJ wrote:par would be winning 2 AIs and 3 or 4 6N games.  Coach?  Plenty of candidates

Par is probably 3 AIs (Argentina, Fiji, ?) and 3 of the 6N games (Italy, ?). I think I would be pretty okay with that and we have the ability. Four wins in the Six Nations would mean 1st or 2nd which would be a great performance for us considering where we are at the minute.

Don't think there are too many candidates to take over Scotland unless Toonie really falls apart. What that looks like is 1 AI and a wooden spoon in the 6N.

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Post by George Carlin Fri 28 Oct 2022, 11:38 am

I hate seeing a team without Russell and Hogg in it because you know automatically that means it's not our best team. I am over it with Toonie - pick your best players and that's it. That's your bloody job.

Don't get me wrong. Smith is good and Hogg has played far too much rugby in the past year. I get it. Everyone in the Scotland camp seems to think that Blarehorn is a Phil Bennett in hiding so I'm willing to indulge that for a couple of scrumpings longer (but no more). Hastings deserves to start - he's been consistently excellent for Glaws all season.

The Russell thing is an absolute soap opera and I'm tired just thinking about how silly it is that a coach cannot control individual players. To drop someone because you're worried they'll be disruptive and then say that the official reason is you're 'picking on form' with your third choice in the position having played 30 minutes all season makes it look like you're just a weak coach and/or pulling the collective plonker of the Scottish rugby press. Absolutely nobody is fooled. I also don't agree that the coach is more important to the national interest than the players.

Hooper coming back is massive for the Wallabies. He'll be undercooked which probably makes him only the 3rd best in the world at his position.

I have absolutely no idea how we'll play and so I will take the familiar asbestos underpants out of the fridge 10 minutes before kick off as usual. Hoyland must realise that they've just called last orders at the Last Chance Saloon.
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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 28 Oct 2022, 11:40 am

TJ wrote:par would be winning 2 AIs and 3 or 4 6N games.  Coach?  Plenty of candidates

Well you should do the AIs aim. Dean Ryan is available I think.

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Post by NeilyBroon Fri 28 Oct 2022, 12:06 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:
TJ wrote:par would be winning 2 AIs and 3 or 4 6N games.  Coach?  Plenty of candidates

Well you should do the AIs aim. Dean Ryan is available I think.

The only option worse than our current! That or Scott Johnson turns up at Murrayfield to be back with the lads:
"Mate I introduced these boys to international rugby, and I heard things are a bit rough in camp so thought someone has to stick up for the lads! Coup? Nah mate that's not what I'm about."

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Post by NeilyBroon Fri 28 Oct 2022, 12:08 pm

Also agree wholeheartedly GC but they're not available this match unfortunately, even I can't blame Toonie for that one.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Fri 28 Oct 2022, 12:23 pm

Yeh, I think Toonie is rubbish as well, but given the silly player access rules I think he's got this selection about right. It's the squad for the main games in the international window that's wrong in my view.

Having Ollie Smith start a game for Scotland is no bad thing. It's a position in which we need to develop some depth. Edinburgh's foreign legion (pushing out Blain as a prospect, albeit he's benching on Sunday) coupled with Kinghorn moving to 10 means Glasgow need to keep developing Smith.

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Post by NeilyBroon Fri 28 Oct 2022, 12:39 pm

Aye Smith is a player who, after seeing him at U20s then Glasgow, I think could be a staple for Scotland for the foreseeable. His star is definitely on the rise and for my money he is a better fullback than kinghorn was at the same stage.

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Post by tigertattie Fri 28 Oct 2022, 1:22 pm

Jock Campbell though!!!!

Revenge for Dempsey?
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Post by NeilyBroon Fri 28 Oct 2022, 1:31 pm

Sounds like it should be a brand of tinned haggis!

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Post by sensisball Fri 28 Oct 2022, 5:02 pm

tigertattie wrote:Jock Campbell though!!!!

Revenge for Dempsey?

I wonder if Oz's Jock will be better than Scotland's Bok Jocks?

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Post by mikey_dragon Fri 28 Oct 2022, 8:06 pm

Just wondering if Magnus Bradbury and Blade Thomson simply weren’t picked, or are they unavailable through injury.

That’s a good Scotland team considering there’s some top players not included due to it being outside the international window. I’ve predicted Aus to put 50 on you, but I hope I’m wrong Wink.

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Post by RDW Fri 28 Oct 2022, 9:11 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Just wondering if Magnus Bradbury and Blade Thomson simply weren’t picked, or are they unavailable through injury.  

That’s a good Scotland team considering there’s some top players not included due to it being outside the international window. I’ve predicted Aus to put 50 on you, but I hope I’m wrong Wink.

Bradbury just not picked. He's been on great form for Bristol this season but just never really reaches his potential for Scotland. He's frustrating as on paper he's everything we're crying out for at number 8, but he just hasn't taken his chances often enough for Scotland.

No idea on Thomson - he's will down the Scotland pecking order now

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Post by Highland Shaun Fri 28 Oct 2022, 11:23 pm

After what I witnessed at Cappielow tonight 😡 I DEMAND that Scotland turn up and put up a fight because ICTFC certainly didn't and due to that I am an angry guy right now!

All I ask for is heart and desire etc so SURELY Scotland can give me that, SURELY!?

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Post by TJ Sat 29 Oct 2022, 2:02 pm

All I ask for is heart and desire etc so SURELY Scotland can give me that, SURELY!?

Not with townsend in charge. Clearly many of the team simply do not like the way he wants them to play

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 29 Oct 2022, 5:52 pm

Good game so far. Not sure how it's only 5 3!

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Post by tigertattie Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:00 pm

Bring back the 5m scrum from held up I say
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Post by bsando Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:13 pm

Bit boring for the neutral but I'm really enjoying this one. Shame we still seem to love giving away brainless penalties, that's gifting Aus a lot of territory and possession.

Deserved lead for the Wallabies despite the encouraging play by Scotland.

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Post by Old Man Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:17 pm

In a low scoring match like this, not taking the kicks at goal can cost you.

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Post by tigertattie Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:30 pm

Finn who?
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Post by bsando Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:41 pm

Toonie vindicated?

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Post by bsando Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:42 pm

I think Wallabies need to sub Foley

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Post by Duty281 Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:48 pm

Very lucky boy not to be seeing red for that.

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Post by tigertattie Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:53 pm

bsando wrote:Toonie vindicated?

We’re some lot for yo-yoing lol

Bit of a flat game for judging. All I know so far is bring on Cam Redpath. We need a 12 that can get the ball to 13, 14 and 15.

Duhan and Darcy are dangerous players but they aren’t getting the ball bar the occasional kick chase from Duhan.
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Post by bsando Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:56 pm

tigertattie wrote:
bsando wrote:Toonie vindicated?

We’re some lot for yo-yoing lol

Bit of a flat game for judging. All I know so far is bring on Cam Redpath. We need a 12 that can get the ball to 13, 14 and 15.

Duhan and Darcy are dangerous players but they aren’t getting the ball bar the occasional kick chase from Duhan.

Couldn't care less if Scotland win more games haha. Seems the forwards have been the main culprits today with some loose decision making. kinghorn's best game for Scotland probably!

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Post by tigertattie Sat 29 Oct 2022, 6:58 pm

bsando wrote:
tigertattie wrote:
bsando wrote:Toonie vindicated?

We’re some lot for yo-yoing lol

Bit of a flat game for judging. All I know so far is bring on Cam Redpath. We need a 12 that can get the ball to 13, 14 and 15.

Duhan and Darcy are dangerous players but they aren’t getting the ball bar the occasional kick chase from Duhan.

Couldn't care less if Scotland win more games haha. Seems the forwards have been the main culprits today with some loose decision making. kinghorn's best game for Scotland probably!

And then blairhorn chucks a stinker lol

He has been good other than that. Not just with the scores but his kicking has been good today
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Post by bsando Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:02 pm

Feels a lot like Aus will sneak this one. Scotland falling to pieces

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Post by tigertattie Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:06 pm

Tuipilotu not having a good game. Not passing and now running into blind alleys getting turned over

Surely this is the series for Redpath to get a run of games and make the 12 shirt his own
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Post by bsando Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:08 pm

Yep he's a bit limited in what he can do as a player. Done very well to gain international honours really and a good option for depth for us but he's not going to be nearly as good as Redpath.

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Post by bsando Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:14 pm

Oh wow! match winning penalty opportunity for Kinghorn. MOM if he nails it haha.

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Post by bsando Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:18 pm

Shanks it.

Oh well, some good stuff but a lot of bad stuff too. Getting the more experienced players back in camp will hopefully make Scotland a bit more tidy and bring the penalty count down. Felt like a big missed opportunity though, just couldn't keep that penalty count down again.

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:19 pm

Really frustrating game, we really made no effort to use our dangerous back line whatsoever, the furthest the ball got was Tuipilotu who wasn’t great. Then add on all the errors and poor discipline, feels like a real missed opportunity. Blairhorn good though, kicking boots aside.

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Post by alive555 Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:19 pm

this game was directly lost by 1 person

GREGOR TOWNSEND

Get rid of him now

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Post by sensisball Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:21 pm

Looks like Toonie has been playing the final quarter of the third Argentina test in the summer for the team to watch
Right lads get into a winning lead then choke, cough up a load of penalties and then lose it around 75 minutes. Job done. Bring on the Fijians!

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Post by tigertattie Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:21 pm

alive555 wrote:this game was directly lost by 1 person

GREGOR TOWNSEND

Get rid of him now

Give me two changes you would have made to that team tonight.

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:23 pm

We like to talk about the strength of the options we have at centre, but truth is the tactics are so woeful they really isn’t any point in picking anyone but Harris and someone similarly solid but unspectacular at 12 (SJ)

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Post by sensisball Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:26 pm

TheMildlyFranticLlama wrote:Really frustrating game, we really made no effort to use our dangerous back line whatsoever, the furthest the ball got was Tuipilotu who wasn’t great. Then add on all the errors and poor discipline, feels like a real missed opportunity. Blairhorn good though, kicking boots aside.

Blairhorn scored a great try that had nothing to do with being a 10. The reason why our back line did little? Almost every pass he made outside Tuiploloto went 10 yards behind him, making defending really easy. Then he tries the floaty wide passes leading to knock ons

He simply doesn't know how to control a game at this level.

And his goal kicking isn't up to the required standard

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Post by alive555 Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:36 pm

If Russel had played it would have been a 10 plus point gane

The coach directly lost that gane


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Scotland AI thread - Page 5 Empty Re: Scotland AI thread

Post by alive555 Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:45 pm

tigertattie wrote:
alive555 wrote:this game was directly lost by 1 person

GREGOR TOWNSEND

Get rid of him now

Give me two changes you would have made to that team tonight.


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Scotland AI thread - Page 5 Empty Re: Scotland AI thread

Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sat 29 Oct 2022, 7:45 pm

Surely Finn would never have been playing in this game even if he was in the squad, since it’s outside the international window? Seems a bit rough to give Toonie pelters over not playing someone who isn’t eligible! (Coming from something who thinks he’s an utter pish coach!)

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