World Cup

I'll header it world cup but start with England as, well I'm English. The World cup is nearly upon us. Hope this does as much for rugby as it did for football with the Lionesses win. It could bring some much needed positivity to the sport here following the highlighted risks from head injury cases and the decline of Worcester (and Wasps).

The first lineup is here, and England remain the favourties having won their last 25 matches (which takes over Cyprus' record):

England: Kildunne; Thompson, Scarratt, Rowland, MacDonald; Harrison, Infante; Cornborough, Cokayne, Bern, Aldcroft, Ward, Matthews, Kabeya, Hunter (capt).

Replacements: Powell, Botterman, Muir, O'Donnell, Cleall, L Packer, Aitchison, Dow.

Bit of info from the Beeb.

'Fiji are already proving to be a popular side at the tournament and England head coach Middleton says "we're going to be the bad guys on Saturday".

"They're probably going to want an open, flowing game based around a bit of carnage," he added.

"We want to try and bring them under control."

Dow may well help England match fire with fire, with Middleton suggesting the wing is nearly back to her best.

"She scored a couple of tries in training yesterday and she puts the fear of god into defenders in front of her," he said.

"Before she got injured she was the best finisher in world rugby. To get back from where she's been is incredible - enjoying it is the most important thing."

England's match at 04:45 BST will be the second of three on the opening day at Auckland's Eden Park, where a record attendance is expected with fewer than 1,800 tickets left for the 50,000 capacity venue.

France and New Zealand - England's main contenders for the trophy - will also play at Eden Park on Saturday.

France face South Africa in the tournament opener at 02:15, with hosts New Zealand taking on Australia in the final game of the day at 07:15.

Wales and Scotland play each other in Whangarei at 05:45 on Sunday, 9 October.'

Well I'm a big fan of England, men and women so I'll be watching. Fiji bit of unknown in 15s, be interesting to see what the game plan is.
I think NZ be a very different challenge compared to last games against England. A raft of mens players in to give advice, new head coach in Wayne Smith and of course it's their home tournament.

Wales v Scotland key match which will likely decide who goes through from those two.

As an aside I wonder how many here also post on the BBC HYSs as the sexist, misogynist and frankly abusive posts on there about women in sport are a disgrace. I suspect a few but on here we would see who posts what so no doubt hiding away. Tragic really in this age but I guess that's what the anonymity of the internet does.

I'm still as argumentative on there, but you know I post as Academy. Alot of that stuff is just under the surface but I do think the tide is turning and there's so much to love about sport in general if bias and insecurity can be overcome.

No 7&1/2 wrote:I'm still as argumentative on there, but you know I post as Academy. Alot of that stuff is just under the surface but I do think the tide is turning and there's so much to love about sport in general if bias and insecurity can be overcome.

I know you are not one of them, being argumentative is perfectly fine but I'm sure you've seen the ridiculous posts some write. A lot of course are the ABE brigade just looking for a reaction but some are just plain sexist and inflammatory. Shame the moderation is so random there.

Other than that there are too many mis-matches (especially because of full time pro v amateur), I enjoy watching women's international rugby - the way the game is played seems to echo back a bit to the later days of amateurism in the men's game, with certain individual players capable of physically dominating an opponent and creating opportunities that are then exploited through good team work. To me, individual defence generally seems very good (i.e. one on one tackling etc), but the organisation is less effective than in the men's game - maybe that lack of a yard of pace (relative to the men, many of whom are borderline elite level athletes) means the defensive cover can't quite stretch from wing to wing as effectively, making for a few more gaps?

I am looking forward to this week ends games i think the England v Fiji wil be a big win for England.
I am also looking forward to see how much NZ have change since  last time England played them and put 50 odd points on them.

That's a really strong side England have put out here. It looks like they've rested Jess Breach and Marlie Packer - otherwise it's pretty much full strength. They aren't taking Fiji lightly and as stated above, it's likely we'll get a hatful of tries.

Looking forward to the game.

Packer is I think still recovering from a grade 2 MCL injury done in training - my guess is that they will use her sparingly for the pool stages. Breach doesn’t appear to be first choice at the moment, partly because she’s had a long injury break herself, but also because the other wingers are seen as even better - which is astonishing when you consider her scoring record (and even more astonishing when you’ve seen how rarely she actually gets the ball. Her “carries to tries” ratio is better than many wingers’ “matches to tries”)

Marlie Packer best backrow, arguably best player in world. She is awesome. Surprised Breach not in 23 but I think for perceived tougher matches be a different team. I'm not sure Hunter is player she was, Poppy Cleall better imo. Dow on bench after 6 months out as well.
However, England have such strength in depth they could put out 2 x 15 teams.

I'd tend to agree that Poppy Cleall is the better 8 than Hunter now but I do think there's some merit in England perhaps being the better team across 80 minutes with Cleall's impact on the bench.

A bit like I think LCD is a slightly better player than George these days but I think England benefit more from the big gain of LCD's impact in the second half when he's on the bench with George starting. LCD's dynamism and George's consistency lend themselves to each role.

I feel somewhat similar there with Hunter and Cleall. Hunter is still a very good number 8 and extremely consistent. Whilst a fresh Cleall offers that physicality and carrying in the second half against a tiring defence.

I'm so happy for Emily Scarratt being back and playing well after that horrible injury. A truly exceptional player and great ambassador for the game.

There's a long list of England players who are back after serious injuries - the ITV doco showed the x-ray of Dow's leg (and the incident itself, which I could have lived without seeing -- or hearing -- again) and it's amazing she's back playing again so quickly.

26 minutes in and England seem to be just starting to hit their stride. That second try was right out of training.

Wow, great try by Fiji (their first) right off a kick, almost length of the pitch.

24-14 seems a fair halftime score. The Fiji team want to run from anywhere. They are fun to watch and are so skilled.

England are in a real game here. to be honest i thought England would be further a head. Fiji scored two cracking try's.

But now at the 60 minute mark England has run away having scored 36 points so far in the second half.  England getting into it now.  First half was probably working off the first match jitters. When they get going they are really good.

Now 65 points in 65 minutes...

Gee, 60 points in the second half with a few minutes to go. I feel bad for the Fiji team. They started very well. But England are looking dangerously good.

What a cracking game, England breaking records all over26 test win 14 try's well done England.

They were great and put down a marker they are for real.  Their maul is excellent. Almost worth staying up to 1;30am!  Time to finish my beer and hit the sack.

Just watching on catch up (and by no means saying it would any difference at all) but Fiji were not getting the benefit of the doubt. Deliberate knock on at about 11:14 into the game by the England 14? Nothing from the ref

Great to see Abby Dow back after the horror injury in the 6N, incredibly quick for such an injury. Scored as well.

The officiating was not that good, the potential deliberate knock forward was not even looked at, a couple of Fiji lineouts were so screwed they looked like they were aimed at the 10. One big cross field pass went forward at least 5m and was not pulled up. Fiji could have had a lot more yellows for pulling down or trying to deliberately pull down that England maul. I also thought that some of the tackling from both sides was border line cardable.

Roll on France.

I wrote earlier in the thread and unfortunately my fears have come true. Take a look at the absolute "£$%holes posting on the BBC HYSs about the womens RWC.
How sad and tragic are these men - we can safely assume they are men - who are writing this garbage.

Moaning that England only win because pro, moaning that attendance was only 34000. Moaning ticket prices are low! Yes really, complaining tickets are cheap, no doubt inference is therefore quality must be. Rather than rejoicing it's possible to take a whole family to watch a RWC match and buy food for price of a single mens match ticket.
Basically anything and everything listed, no matter how ridiculous.

I don't find it annoying, just really tragic.

mountain man wrote:I wrote earlier in the thread and unfortunately my fears have come true. Take a look at the absolute "£$%holes posting on the BBC HYSs about the womens RWC.
How sad and tragic are these men - we can safely assume they are men - who are writing this garbage.

Moaning that England only win because pro, moaning that attendance was only 34000. Moaning ticket prices are low! Yes really, complaining tickets are cheap, no doubt inference is therefore quality must be. Rather than rejoicing it's possible to take a whole family to watch a RWC match and buy food for price of a single mens match ticket.
Basically anything and everything listed, no matter how ridiculous.

I don't find it annoying, just really tragic.

Probably taking a break from telling us all how brilliant Truss's speech was at the party conference, how Labour would mess up our finances and why Brexit was a great idea.

lostinwales wrote:

mountain man wrote:I wrote earlier in the thread and unfortunately my fears have come true. Take a look at the absolute "£$%holes posting on the BBC HYSs about the womens RWC.
How sad and tragic are these men - we can safely assume they are men - who are writing this garbage.

Moaning that England only win because pro, moaning that attendance was only 34000. Moaning ticket prices are low! Yes really, complaining tickets are cheap, no doubt inference is therefore quality must be. Rather than rejoicing it's possible to take a whole family to watch a RWC match and buy food for price of a single mens match ticket.
Basically anything and everything listed, no matter how ridiculous.

I don't find it annoying, just really tragic.

Probably taking a break from telling us all how brilliant Truss's speech was at the party conference, how Labour would mess up our finances and why Brexit was a great idea.

I thought it was the people who like that great new invention:  The internal combustion engine.

lostinwales wrote:

mountain man wrote:I wrote earlier in the thread and unfortunately my fears have come true. Take a look at the absolute "£$%holes posting on the BBC HYSs about the womens RWC.
How sad and tragic are these men - we can safely assume they are men - who are writing this garbage.

Moaning that England only win because pro, moaning that attendance was only 34000. Moaning ticket prices are low! Yes really, complaining tickets are cheap, no doubt inference is therefore quality must be. Rather than rejoicing it's possible to take a whole family to watch a RWC match and buy food for price of a single mens match ticket.
Basically anything and everything listed, no matter how ridiculous.

I don't find it annoying, just really tragic.

Probably taking a break from telling us all how brilliant Truss's speech was at the party conference, how Labour would mess up our finances and why Brexit was a great idea.

Eh? What's this got to do with anything?

Just a thought if it is a draw at the end of the game, do they play extra ten minutes each way?

What, in the groups? It’s a new one on me Madge.

England team announced, no Jess Breach which is a big surprise. No heard if she's injured as she is a class player. Massive competition for places of course. M Packer back in at 7, unfortunately Kabeya picked up injury so she's not on bench which is shame as she had a fantastic game against Fiji.

I expect that Jess is carrying a small knock from training. Thompson and McDonald played so well in the Fiji game (as did Ellie Kildunne and Abbie Dow) that it's no surprise they're unchanged if the Breach rumours are true.

I reckon there'll be a back 3 of Breach/Dow/McKenna for the South Africa game. Hardly a drop in class is it?!

Sad for Sadia - she's some player. However, so is Marlie. It's not as if the back row just took a big hit. Surprised that Rosie Galligan isn't on the bench though. I think she's a class player.

If I were in Simon Middleton's shoes, I'd be wanting to give Packer a run out after injury as early in the tournament as possible. She and Kabeya will both get plenty of game time, I'm sure.

England's whole philosophy is based on being able to field two players of equal quality in each position - and given the quality of their best players it's really impressive how close in quality the backups are. It's at the point where you have several former World Players of the Year who have genuine competition for their shirts.

mountain man wrote:

lostinwales wrote:

mountain man wrote:I wrote earlier in the thread and unfortunately my fears have come true. Take a look at the absolute "£$%holes posting on the BBC HYSs about the womens RWC.
How sad and tragic are these men - we can safely assume they are men - who are writing this garbage.

Moaning that England only win because pro, moaning that attendance was only 34000. Moaning ticket prices are low! Yes really, complaining tickets are cheap, no doubt inference is therefore quality must be. Rather than rejoicing it's possible to take a whole family to watch a RWC match and buy food for price of a single mens match ticket.
Basically anything and everything listed, no matter how ridiculous.

I don't find it annoying, just really tragic.

Probably taking a break from telling us all how brilliant Truss's speech was at the party conference, how Labour would mess up our finances and why Brexit was a great idea.

Eh? What's this got to do with anything?

The posters you refer to on HYS are probably the same types that also post the rubbish I mentioned above. I do apologise for bringing politics into the Rugby forum though.

If anyone is up early enough on Saturday, please give a look at the USA Women's team playing Japan (05:30 k/o?). Their starting left wing, Tess Feury, is from my Rugby club here in New Jersey and I have known her since she was in our flag program. We could not be more proud of her....

doctor_grey wrote:If anyone is up early enough on Saturday, please give a look at the USA Women's team playing Japan (05:30 k/o?).  Their starting left wing, Tess Feury, is from my Rugby club here in New Jersey and I have known her since she was in our flag program.  We could not be more proud of her....  

Well done Tess - that's great to hear. I'll try to catch it if I'm not too tired. And if our wifi, which has been down all week, is working.

Poorfour wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:If anyone is up early enough on Saturday, please give a look at the USA Women's team playing Japan (05:30 k/o?).  Their starting left wing, Tess Feury, is from my Rugby club here in New Jersey and I have known her since she was in our flag program.  We could not be more proud of her....  

Well done Tess - that's great to hear. I'll try to catch it if I'm not too tired. And if our wifi, which has been down all week, is working.

That would be great!  And Tess is the sweetest person on earth.  

Her two brothers are quite good as well.  The oldest was the 10 who took our club to the national division 2 national semi-finals a few years ago.  The next brother has been in-and-around the Rugby NY team in MLR, though he might not have started a league match for them.  A lot of good old-fashioned rugby ball shaped DNA in that family.

Well Tess had a quiet game on the left wing, but played the full 80.  The USA team came back from a 3-5 deficit with four tries in the 2nd half for a tough 30-17 win.  Very proud of Tess.   Also happy her parents had their 5 seconds on air being shown in the stands for a moment.

Frances defence has been class so far.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Frances defence has been class so far.

It has. They have the muscle to match England up front too, but it is costing them. There have been the two injuries and they are making an increasing number of mistakes when they get chances to attack.

It is a good game, if low scoring so far.

Really tight game, I'm glad they made call to go for points at end of first half. France been awesome in defence so maybe all the tackling will tell later. Couple key injuries as well which won't help French cause. Think Eng subs have big impact in second half when they get on

England should be taking points now when in front of posts. Game too tight to not kick easy pens

Brilliant french try! Game definitely on

Aaaand breathe

England just about clung on to win. Deserved overall but toughest match they've had for a long time. Next time take the points!

What a cracker of a game France v England France really put England under the cosh today,
A real tester for England but they eld out and got the win. Well done England.

England were the better team. Other than the try France were fairly hopeless in attack. Their defense was just fantastic though. They may have provided a template to finally bring England down, and will approach playing England again with some confidence.

Sansus confirmed as having ruptured her ACL; she was retiring after this comp. Must be absolutely gutting.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Sansus confirmed as having ruptured her ACL; she was retiring after this comp. Must be absolutely gutting.

Yes just notice she is to re tire after he RWC.
such a shame at 28 she will be missed.

The injury toll so far has been a bit worrying - I wonder if it's a function of having more professional teams so more power in the impacts, or of the lack of matches meaning players aren't full ready for the intensity.

Very sad to see the end of Sansus' career; the injury toll that France took in the England match may cost them dearly later in the tournament.

McKenna; Dow, Aitchison, Heard, Breach; Harrison, L Packer; Botterman, Powell, Muir, Galligan, O'Donnell, Talling, M Packer (capt), Cleall.

Replacements: Cokayne, Cornborough, Bern, Aldcroft, Kabeya, Scarratt, Rowland, MacDonald

Just the 13 changes to the starting line up.

But all quality, and look at that bench. England could put out 2 x 15 sides and probably beat everyone.