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Rest of the World

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Post by KP_fan Fri 27 Sep 2024, 8:46 am

First topic message reminder :

wisden wrote:Another hundred for Kamindu Mendis! Averages 83 now in tests, 922 runs in 8 test matches!

amazing
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Post by Duty281 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:16 am

Good, busy start from Jaiswal and Gill, but these field settings from NZ have been utterly awful. Three, four men on the boundary from the off. Long off/on in place right away, instead of mid on/off, gifting numerous easy singles and allowing India to rotate.

India have just taken five runs off a Phillips over and all they had to do was tap the ball down to long on with zero risk. Like the middle overs of an ODI. Dreadful from NZ.

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Post by msp83 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:20 am

Yashasvi Jaiswal, the most assured looking of India's batters, perishes to an absolutely unnecessary reverse-sweep. Missed the left stump offering from Patel altogether, and got bowled. Why on earth! This late in the day!

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Post by Duty281 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:21 am

Now Siraj has thrown away a review for absolutely no reason.

Two in two, classic subcontinental stuff. Do India throw out another nightwatchman?

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Post by msp83 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:25 am

And now the nightwatchman! Siraj goes without troubling the scorers.
Again why on earth was Siraj send out, he is never one who can hang around. Perhaps can connect with a slog or 2 on a good day, but pretty poor lower order bat. Akash would have been a better option. Or Kohli should have taken the responsibility and came out. And to make matters worse, Siraj takes a review with him! Awful, absolutely awful!

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Post by Duty281 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:27 am

Kohli runs himself out with three minutes left in the day. Laugh Laugh Laugh

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Post by msp83 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:30 am

Kohli ran himself out! Beyond awful! Becoming laughable now!

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Post by msp83 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:32 am

So 3-0 very much on cards... And even in such a situation where the innings is lurching, no Jadeja up the order.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:37 am

When does Kohli get the Old Yeller treatment?
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Post by Duty281 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 11:45 am

Kohli's had one good year in the 2020s so far, but that's it. Averages 32 since the start of 2020, just two tons in 59 innings, and even averages below 30 in sub continent tests in that time! Loyalty taken too far.

Anyway, that late burst, 78/1 to 86/4, gives advantage to NZ after day one. India still trailing by 149 and they have to bat last.

Shaping up to be 3-0 NZ, which would be the most astonishing/surprising test series result I can ever think of. As far as I can see, India have never played a home series of three games or more where they've lost every game. They did lose 0-3 to the Windies in the 80s, but that was a six game series.

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Post by sirfredperry Fri 01 Nov 2024, 12:44 pm

Dare I predict an NZ clean sweep of this series? Early days in this Test, but India hardly in a good position so 3-0 looks a real possibility.


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Post by KP_fan Fri 01 Nov 2024, 12:48 pm

India restricted NZ to what's par for the pitch and Indian bowling.

The score card is deceptive.......2.5 of India's wickets were Siraj, & Kohli dead-weights of whom nothing was expected....and from Rohit, half a dead weight I expected a max 30 odd
Now every one can bat down to no. 11 and they need a reasonable lead of 120 odd....which would be par for Indian batting against visitor's bowling. That's how India wins home games inspite of losing toss...that their par is higher.

Gill, Pant, Sarfaraz, Jadeja, Washington  all are expected to score 30s and 40 and one of them should convert to a 100 & another oen to a big 50
Ashwin expected to do a 20dd and 10 odd runs expected from Deep. Siraj a wasted selection.....as msp said Rana would have been good as he can bat and is always better to ease a youngster in a home game in a support role.
alternatively KL should have been played

I have a feeling we will get thru this one.......but problems are for all to see...That Kohli & Rohit are totally out of form & you can't carry two dead weights in Aus.
Given that KL is being made to sit out Paddikal has cracked 120 odd run in 2 innings vs Aus A and still going and Sudarshan 96* should convert to a 100 in Aus tomm
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Post by Duty281 Fri 01 Nov 2024, 2:14 pm

I think 250 is the limit of India's hopes on this, barring a very unlikely century from someone (Pant probably most likely to deliver).

It's difficult to bat out there. Like a late day three/early day four pitch. Horrible variable bounce and plenty of sharp turn. If India can turn this game into a one innings shootout, they'll have done well. A lead of 50 would be stupendous.

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Post by KP_fan Sat 02 Nov 2024, 6:06 am

Woke up expecting the worst, quick look at scorecard was a relief...close to 200 with only a wicket lost in the session.
All 3 young guys scored...Gill, Pant and jaiswal.
Now batting all the way down

Jadeja, Gill, Washington, Sarfarz, ashwin and even Deep can score 15 runs. India will get a reasonable lead.
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Post by KP_fan Sat 02 Nov 2024, 7:54 am

Pitch turned into half a minefield.
Washington was playing a gem of a rear guard blinder cut short by brainless tail ender Deep's r.o
Slender lead of 22....could well have been a handy 40 had Washington gotten to bat 2 more overs
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Post by KP_fan Sat 02 Nov 2024, 8:04 am

As I see more of Sarfaraz a disturbing realization dawns up me..
He is a FTB needs slow, low bounce pitches and Mediocre bowling to score his runs.
Because he doesn't come behind line of ball but gets besides it ie leg-sidish of ball....and then tries to steer, late cut , nudge it behind point.
It works sometimes and doesn't work most times especially when ball is spinning, seaming or bouncing

This is now a lottery pitch already and it doesn't matter whether you bat 3rd or 4th.
Batter has to attack to survive and the braver luckier team will.win
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Post by Duty281 Sat 02 Nov 2024, 9:10 am

Innings kinda mirrored each other. NZ were 159/3 and bowled out for 235. India were 180/4 and bowled out for 263. Both left arm spinners got five.

If NZ can bat this evening session and the morning session tomorrow, they should win.


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Post by Duty281 Sat 02 Nov 2024, 9:24 am

...But looks as though NZ will find even getting through this session to be tough.

Conway out first, then a stupid dismissal of Ravindra. Net 17/3 and India well on top.

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Post by KP_fan Sat 02 Nov 2024, 11:03 am

Pitch seems eased when batters play strokes and then you get unplayable deliveries, and then a wicket brings 2 or 3.
It's frenetic like lottery games are .....highly engrossing and joyous too if your side emerges winner.
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Post by KP_fan Sat 02 Nov 2024, 11:08 am

A very good inning from Young ends when Ashwin made him look like a rabbit.
Ashwin's carrom balls at at best straighten are spinning like Warne's leg breaks
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Post by KP_fan Sat 02 Nov 2024, 11:33 am

143 ahead with 1 wkt in hand NZ as umpire called stumps.
Half an hour extra if 9 wkts down did not apply here ....dunno why?
Cracking game Set-Up that India will win I think because they have too many stroke players who can do 12 ball 20s and 20 ball 30s
That's what they have to aim for to connect 4 boundaries each and knock off a few singles while they last.
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Post by Duty281 Sat 02 Nov 2024, 11:35 am

171/9 at stumps, a lead of 143.

A chase of around 150 would be no picnic. India would be favourites, but the ball is doing all sorts out there and it's pretty much minefield territory. The last 67 overs of the day saw 15 wickets fall, and India lost their last six wickets for just 83. That Gill and Pant partnership might prove to be match winning.

If the last wicket pair for NZ can somehow squeeze another 25 runs, the game would be close to 50-50.

NZ's odds of 15/2 in this position is silly.

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Post by alfie Sat 02 Nov 2024, 11:47 am

KP_fan wrote:143 ahead with 1 wkt in hand NZ as umpire called stumps.
Half an hour extra if 9 wkts down did not apply here ....dunno why?
Cracking game Set-Up that India will win I think because they have too many stroke players who can do 12 ball 20s and 20 ball 30s
That's what they have to aim for to connect 4 boundaries each and knock off a few singles while they last.

You only get to claim the extra half hour if taking that last wicket would end the match... Don't think India could run down 140 odd in twenty minutes Smile

Could easily go either way tomorrow.

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Post by KP_fan Sat 02 Nov 2024, 11:54 am

Paddikal score 124 runs against Aus A on a difficult pitch across 2 innings and Sudarshan cracked a 100 and Mukesh Kumar  was hooping the ball at medium pace in a well competed game where Aus still needs 86 to win with 7 in hand
Nathan Mcsweeny  has scored 39 and 47* from no.4 and tipped by Ponting to be the opener for T1 against India.
Doggett  and O'Neil were fast bowlers who were in wickets.
Todd Murphy reportedly bowled well in secodn innings
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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 5:51 am

New Zealand getting ever so closer to that 3-0. India 6 down, and not even half-way to their target of 147.
The pitch is difficult, but the Indian batters have made it look even worse. They really can't play spin these days. Getting closer to being the worst batting lineup against spin! Who'd have thought of even thinking of that possibility about an Indian batting lineup? Rohit, Gill, Sarfaraz, didn't help their or the team's cause with some mindless batting. Should Kohli even go to Australia?
At this rate, KPF will soon get his wish, KL will be back, yet again!
Ravindra Jadeja was the 6th man out and he made only 6, but again, I strongly feel he should be up the order particularly when you need some solidity in that middle order. While he was there, the innings achieved a sense of calm, even though Rishabh Pant is batting out there!

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 6:33 am

At lunch, India are just about alive thanks to Rishabh Pant's single-handed defiance. They go into the 2nd session with still needing 55 more to win, with just 4 wickets remaining. Washington Sundar is giving Pant company, and there is Ravichandran Ashwin to come.

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:00 am

Pant given out caught behind of Ajaz, to almost snuf out India's remaining hopes. Not sure umpire Paul Reiffel got that right. He suggested there is a gap between bat and ball, Pant seemed to believe he hit his pad rather than the ball. The 3rd umpire then changed his mind and gave Pant out.


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Post by Duty281 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:02 am

A superb innings from Pant in a superb game for him. Unsure there was enough to overturn that call however.

39 away, 3 wickets left. India need a 20 from one of Washington/Ashwin. Not sure Deep or Siraj can be relied on much!

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:04 am

After Pant's gone, every ball seems to be a wicket delivery. Ashwin not looking comfortable, not looking solid with his defense. Might be better off trying to play a few more shots.

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Post by Duty281 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:15 am

Just awful captaincy to burn the last review like that.

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Post by Duty281 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:28 am

Two away. Ashwin gloving behind. Never got going in that knock.

Think Washington just needs to try and play some shots to win this. Very unlikely to get the 26 by scratching away for 12 overs.

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:28 am

Just when he was beginning to settle down just a bit, R Ashwin plays a needless reverse sweep and perishes. India 26 away, Think that's too far for Akash and Deep to bridge along with Sundar.

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:29 am

Akash gone first ball, just one away.

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Post by Duty281 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:29 am

Oh, Akash Deep bowled first ball. Nice from Phillips.

3-0 with a hattrick?

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:30 am

3-0 is ever so closer!

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:30 am

Can Phillips finish it with a hattrick?

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:32 am

No king pair for Siraj! Washington gets at least an opportunity to try something miraculous.

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:34 am

India whitewashed! In a home series! First time they got whitewashed in a home series 3-0! Ajaz Patel finishing it off!

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Post by Duty281 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:38 am

Duty281 wrote:NZ's odds of 15/2 in this position is silly.

Yeah. thumbsup

Absolutely unbelievable stuff. India lose a three test series 0-3 at home for the first time. The fortress not breached, but comprehensively demolished. The most astonishing test series result I've ever seen. No one will have predicted this.

And it wasn't even three close games. This game was close, but the first two NZ comprehensively outplayed India. It was seam in the first test, Santner in the second and Ajaz Patel in this one. Some top batting contributions all over the order as well.

Where on earth do India go from here? Apart from Aus, obviously! A WTC final looks very unlikely now. And the greatest ever result in NZ's history.

Also, just as a reminder, NZ lost 2-0 in SL immediately before this series, including one game where they lost by an innings! Bizarre turnaround.


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Post by Pal Joey Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:41 am

They did it! A fantastic series whitewash win for the Black Caps. OK

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Post by sirfredperry Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:51 am

Arguably, well probably definitely, NZ's greatest triumph, and all without their best batsman. Terrific decision by the umpire to give Ashwin at the end, with NZ out of reviews.

Ajaz was getting amazing turn but as long as Pant was there you felt India would creep home.

Good to see an away win given the shortness of tours, the lack of climatisation and the cooking of wickets. It could be that India will actually find it easier in Australia where they won't be tormented by SLA spin.

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Post by KP_fan Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:53 am

India's home record fell off the cliff.
congrats to NZ for being the team to achieve the first ever white wash in a 3 or more match series.

Pitch wasn't a minefield ...just pressure and general incompetence inspite of the brilliance of Pant.

Rohit & kohli are deadweights that have declined irreversibly and Sarfaraz is a Big, fat FTB who stands besides the line of balls and tries to steer it behind and is always gonna struggle if ball seams, spins or bounces.
Sarafaraz is the biggest looser from this series.

Siraj was a wasted selection.
After losing the toss and with 7 effective players it is hard and made worse by general despondency and panic that emanates in the little we have seen in Gambhir era.
Team lacks patience and clarity of approach.

Dark tour of Aus awaits India where you need your best 11 guys and clear headed approach to merely be competitive.

KL Rahul will not end up as a great in Indian cricket but is one of the most competent guys especially overseas.
He Will play for sure and will deliver a healthy 30+ average.

The only silverlining is public and media pressure in a passionate cricketing nation in the wake of 3-0 will lead to drastic measures like in Pak.
And hopefully India can get rid of dead weights and play with clarity of mind.
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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:56 am

Where on earth does indeed? They have nowhere to hide. Though the BCCI made life easier for the players by selecting the Australia squad so early. Can get the usual nonsense about 'don't think we need major changes', 'will follow the processes' and all that. Nothing much may happen in actuality. BCCI is busy getting ready for the IPL mega auction. the Australia squad is leaving in a week or so. So no chance of a bit of domestic cricket either. Unless someone like Kohli decides to retire after this, or Rohit does a Southee before the Australia series and give up captaincy. From the consistently selectable players, only Rishabh Pant can be considered captaincy material, though Jasprit Bumrah might actually be a very good choice. Provided he's an all format asset with need for workload management, it may be tough on Bumrah. Yashasvi Jaiswal is too inexperienced at the top level, and Ravindra Jadeja isn't quite a captaincy material himself, though he can be a captain's delight as a bowler.
But all that is academic, nothing is going to happen, hopefully playing Australia will bring the best out of these same bunch of players, and Rohit can also be on his A Game as skipper. Hopefully, there will be something to hope for, rather than engage in wishful thinking. Could end up being one of those never-ending nightmare tour downunder!

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Post by Pal Joey Sun 03 Nov 2024, 7:58 am

Yes, we'll probably bear the brunt of this heavy Indian defeat on home turf.
Still, it's a headache for their selectors and the players will do some soul searching and no doubt regroup... and come out firing on the 22nd in Perth.

Aus A managed to comfortably knock off the 86 runs need earlier today. Must say, both McSweeney and Big Beau looked well in control. Wicket seemed to become much easier to bat on though as the match progressed. Australia selectors need to get things right too especially with the opening pair.

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Post by msp83 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 8:01 am

Between all that, a big congratulation to New Zealand. Has to be right up there in their set of cricketing achievements. And they did it without their best batter. They did it with their best quick missing in action for the 2nd test with injury. They did it without the likes of Kyle Jamieson who wasn't even available for selection. They did it with a set of at best steady spinners none of whom had a creditable test record. They did it through solid contributions from multiple batters. Latham, Conway, Young, Rachin, Mitchell, all of the top 5 had at least a good, decisive innings in the series. Even old man Southee stepped up with the bat at a decisive juncture.

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Post by alfie Sun 03 Nov 2024, 8:03 am

A really exciting finish to a quite astonishing series ! Thought for a while Pant was going to get India their consolation win ... Can see why people might question that third umpire decision (Pant certainly wasn't happy) ; but there was what looked awfully like evidence of a little bat on ball touch at precisely the right moment ...I think Paul Reiffel got it right. In any case Pant can count himself fortunate NZ didn't review that lbw before lunch or the game would have been over long ago...

NZ can go home and bask in the glory of this achievement - and then plan how they want to deal with England ; but I think they deserve a celebratory drink or two first Smile

As to what it means for India - ? Does it signal the end of a period of sustained home dominance (and plenty of success away ) ; or is it a blip ? They've tried to replace Pujara and Rahane ... starting to look as if Kohli might follow sooner rather than later... And a 0-3 home defeat isn't exactly a morale booster immediately before embarking on a tour of Australia .

Not going to go overboard yet though. Even very good teams have bad series sometimes - though this was more spectacularly so than most. Will wait and see what they do in Australia.

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Post by Duty281 Sun 03 Nov 2024, 8:06 am

sirfredperry wrote:Arguably, well probably definitely, NZ's greatest triumph, and all without their best batsman. Terrific decision by the umpire to give Ashwin at the end, with NZ out of reviews.

Ajaz was getting amazing turn but as long as Pant was there you felt India would creep home.

Good to see an away win given the shortness of tours, the lack of climatisation and the cooking of wickets. It could be that India will actually find it easier in Australia where they won't be tormented by SLA spin.

Cummins on the phone to Hauritz, trying to drag him out of retirement for this series.

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Post by VTR Sun 03 Nov 2024, 8:14 am

I think that's the greatest series result I've seen in my years of following cricket. India almost impossible to beat at home, whitewashed by a NZ team deploying an array of journeyman and part time spinners. Seems like this could be the end of an era for India, with the likes of Rohit, Kohli, Jadeja and Ashwin failing to step up when needed

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Post by KP_fan Sun 03 Nov 2024, 8:30 am

Pal Joey wrote:Yes, we'll probably bear the brunt of this heavy Indian defeat on home turf.
Still, it's a headache for their selectors and the players will do some soul searching and no doubt regroup... and come out firing on the 22nd in Perth.

Aus A managed to comfortably knock off the 86 runs need earlier today. Must say, both McSweeney and Big Beau looked well in control. Wicket seemed to become much easier to bat on though as the match progressed. Australia selectors need to get things right too especially with the opening pair.1
I heard Aussie side conspired with umpire to change the wicket taking ball overnight.Smile
In protest Indians started bowling part time spin
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Post by Pal Joey Sun 03 Nov 2024, 8:32 am

Duty281 wrote:
sirfredperry wrote:Arguably, well probably definitely, NZ's greatest triumph, and all without their best batsman. Terrific decision by the umpire to give Ashwin at the end, with NZ out of reviews.

Ajaz was getting amazing turn but as long as Pant was there you felt India would creep home.

Good to see an away win given the shortness of tours, the lack of climatisation and the cooking of wickets. It could be that India will actually find it easier in Australia where they won't be tormented by SLA spin.

Cummins on the phone to Hauritz, trying to drag him out of retirement for this series.

Cooper Connolly... come on down! Laugh

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Post by KP_fan Sun 03 Nov 2024, 8:38 am

India was so strong at home that about 5 or 6 players were carrying load of 11 notably Bumrah with ball in a couple of tests.vs Eng, Axar with bat against Aus and Pant with bat in the series against Eng before that and Ashwin Jadeja were at their peak prowess with ball.
The latter two declined , Kuldeep unfit , Rohit went from full to quarter and Kohli from quarter to zilch as batters.
And the Titanic sank.

India could have elongated batting with KL for Siraj and axar for Deep...but there can be many iffs and buts

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